Defence calls retired Police Chief Bob Herman as witness at J.P. Levesque trial

The final witness to testify at the trial for Thunder Bay Police Chief J.P. Levesque was his predecessor, Bob Herman.

Levesque served as a Deputy Chief of Police under Herman.

Levesque faces a charge of breach of trust and obstruction of justice.

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Herman took the stand on Monday morning, after being called to the city to testify. Herman said he now resides outside of the city.

Herman was asked many questions by defence counsel Brian Gover. He went through his past as a police officer, as well as his credentials.

Herman also spoke about the relationship he had with Keith Hobbs, the current mayor, and former president and vice-president of the Thunder Bay Police Association. Herman described that relationship as 'adversarial', detailing how the two ended up in litigation over comments Hobbs made regarding the interception of his communications.

Herman testified he had concerns over Hobbs when he was on the Police Services Board, as mayor, leaking confidential information to officers. Herman said Hobbs was "quite popular" among police association members.

Herman described Levesque as a person who had their, "moral compass set right," and spoke of how he was highly regarded within policing circles.

As to the relationship between the Chief of Police and the Police Services Board, Herman said it is," not a black and white relationship." He spoke of how the Police Services Act was "blurring the lines" between operations and governance of the board, allowing the Chief to give the board information when it came to important operations or investigations.

Herman testified he had briefed the board on occasion regarding high profile investigations. He said he didn't want the board to be "blindsided" by any information. Police, "wouldn't be able to function otherwise," said Herman.

Herman also said he had spoken with city administration before regarding major investigations. "I trusted them," he said. That way, administration, "would deal with it appropriately."

Defence counsel also asked Herman about note taking, to which he replied he, "didn't take a lot of notes." He said over a decade of being chief, he had perhaps only one notepad full of information.

Herman was asked at length about the discretion that Police Chiefs have when it comes to sharing information with those who are involved in an investigation. He said there is a high degree of discretion exercised by police administration, as there is not a policy for every occasion.

Herman re-iterated how the Chief of Police would create or set a specific policy, but it would be completely acceptable for them to deviate from that policy, if needed.  Herman said under cross-examination that he wouldn't see sharing information about a case with the board, or city manager as violating any police policy. 

Herman emphasized that Levesque would have had the power to order a deviation from any policy - including if he were to deviate himself.

"Optically, it may not look the best, but that's business," said Herman.

The defence rested its case after Herman got off of the stand.

The defence will wrap up its closing remarks after the lunch break on Monday, December 11. The Crown stated in court he will need an hour to conclude his remarks. That could happen Monday afternoon.