Police ask 'why' in Raymond interrogation, but get little in response

At the end of a two-hour interview with the man who fatally shot four people, RCMP officers turned up the pressure.

"I've gotta put it to you, why? Why did they die? Like, is it something that just got out of control?" asked RCMP Cpl. Annika Faa.

"No idea," said Matthew Raymond.

Raymond, 50, has admitted to shooting Bobbie Lee Wright and Donnie Robichaud, then Fredericton police constables Sara Burns and Robb Costello at 237 Brookside Dr. in Fredericton on Aug. 10, 2018.

He has pleaded not guilty to four counts of first-degree murder, and his defence lawyers are arguing he was not criminally responsible for the crime on account of a mental illness.

In two interviews in his hospital room, RCMP officers talked to Raymond about bikes, guns and the media in hopes of building a rapport. Raymond asked for his lawyer during both interviews, saying he wanted to remain silent. Raymond answered some questions about his family, about wanting to help his mother as she grew older, and biking.

But when the officers asked for details about what happened, or why he was in hospital to begin with, he invoked his right to silence.

After Raymond said he had "no idea" why the four people died, Faa continued to push him.

"What do you mean?" she said.

"I think this stuff has to stay for another day and ... I just wanna remain silent ... on the main topic," Raymond said.

Faa continued: "When you say you don't know why they died, what does that mean?"

"Don't know why, why it happened. I'm just gonna stick with that just ... Have to say I wanna remain silent so I can actually get to bed."

The court previously heard Raymond was shot in the abdomen before he was arrested.

Cpl. Mark Blakely with the RCMP major crimes unit testified Tuesday he and Faa, who is with the British Columbia RCMP, interviewed Raymond at the Dr. Everett Chalmers Regional Hospital on Aug. 19 and Aug. 20.

Near the end of the Aug. 20 interview, after Faa finished her questions, Blakely asked Raymond if he did shoot the four people.

"I wanna remain silent until I speak to my lawyer," Raymond said.

'Attempt to generate conversation'

Before the interview, Blakely testified he reviewed what the investigation found. He said Raymond's family told them he had a mistrust in media, government and police.

Faa spoke to Raymond about how she doesn't believe what the media says and that the information shared could be "fake," and that makes it more important for Raymond to set the record straight. Blakely spoke about how people can be "sensitive" about bilingualism in New Brunswick, and how he was passed for promotions because he was unilingual.

Blakely says bringing up media and government "was an attempt to generate conversation."

Canadian law allows police to lie during an interrogation.

You had that chance to speak to your lawyer. And so this conversation ... This is going to happen.- Cpl. Annika Faa, RCMP

The first interview was about an hour long, and ended after Raymond said he will speak to his lawyer the next day.

The next interview lasted about two hours. Faa brought Raymond a magazine and they spoke about mountain biking. Then she said since Raymond has spoken to his lawyer, she can continue asking questions even if he doesn't want to answer.

"You had that chance to speak to your lawyer. And so this conversation ... This is going to happen," she said.

Faa showed Raymond a video found on his cell phone. In the video Raymond was in the woods, speaking to the camera, and holding a shotgun. Faa asked him who the video was intended for and what message he was trying to send. Raymond did not explain.

She also asked him about a YouTube conspiracy theorist who goes by the name Rob Lee. Raymond said he couldn't remember who he was.

"Blocked out, I don't know," he said.

Court previously heard Raymond had thousands of images and hundreds of videos related to conspiracy theories and the occult, including videos made by Rob Lee.

Before Blakely was excused as a witness, Crown prosecutor Darlene Blunston put up photos of the four victims and asked Blakely to identify them. He does, ending with Bobbie Lee Wright. Her picture lingers on the screens for a few more seconds before it's minimized.

On Friday, in an agreed statement of facts, the Crown admitted Raymond had a mental illness at the time of the shooting. It means to get a not-guilty verdict, the defence needs to prove Raymond didn't appreciate the nature and consequences of his actions, or that he didn't know what he was doing was wrong.

Defence begins its case

Blakely was the 36th and final witness in the Crown's case. 

Late Tuesday, the defence began its case by calling its first witness. Alex Pate, a member of the defence team, testified he reviewed "tens of thousands" of videos and photos found on Raymond's devices.

He said he also reviewed a YouTube channel, the name of which is under a publication ban imposed by Justice Larry Landry.

Pate described one video posted on the channel as "very strange." It was a collection of still images with blue arrows pointing at different parts of people's bodies, and whimsical royalty-free music on a loop.

Under the video was a long comment pinned by the owner of the channel.

A excerpt from the comment reads: "We were all taught that the beings were all around.

"It takes seconds not minutes or hours to find them ... This isn't me doing it, it's God The Father allowing me to do this work."

Pate testified he also found the same video on one of Raymond's hard drives.

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