New Brunswick

Fredericton shooter communicated with YouTube 'conspiracy theorist' and tried to expose 'demons' online

Matthew Raymond's murder trial heard Tuesday that he started communicating with a YouTube conspiracy theorist by email and was exposing followers of the channel as "demons."

Cpl. Aaron Gallagher testified he recovered thousands of images and videos from Matthew Raymond's devices

A collage of four people
Victims of the shootings, from left to right: Fredericton police constables Robb Costello, 45, and Sara Burns, 43, and civilians Donnie Robichaud, 42, and Bobbie Lee Wright, 32. (CBC)

Matthew Raymond's murder trial heard Tuesday that he started communicating with a YouTube conspiracy theorist by email and was exposing followers of the channel as "demons."

Crown witness Cpl. Aaron Gallagher continued testimony under cross-examination in the quadruple murder trial in Fredericton.

Gallagher testified Monday that he recovered thousands of images and videos from Raymond's devices after he shot and killed Donnie Robichaud, Bobbie Lee Wright and Fredericton constables Robb Costello and Sara Burns on Aug. 10, 2018.

Raymond, 50, has admitted to being the shooter but pleaded not guilty. His defence lawyers are arguing he was not criminally responsible for the crime on account of a mental illness.

Gallagher told the court earlier that he found videos of Raymond firing a shotgun at a target in the woods and complaining of noise in his apartment, as well as "conspiracy theory" videos and images.

Gallagher testified he couldn't agree that Raymond went out in public and exposed or pointed out demons, but he would agree that Raymond did that on the internet.

Court was shown images of people Raymond found online. The images had titles that included the word "evil eyes" and "snake tongue" and showed dots under their eyes or around their mouth.

The court was also shown a one-hour-long video made by a YouTube conspiracy theorist who identifies himself as Rob Lee. The video begins with the narrator denying space exists. 

"If Real, why use CGI?" one caption says about images of a constellation.

Mathew Raymond being brought into the Fredericton Convention Centre for the continuation of his trial last week. (Hadeel Ibrahim/CBC)

Near the end of the video the narrator says fallen angels and demons are on earth, and they "aren't like us." 

"It may be a politician … It  may even be the woman down the street."

The video narrator identified pop-culture icons and politicians as demons, including former U.S. President Barack Obama and actor David Duchovny, by pointing at their eyes or tongues.

"These serpents and monsters are everywhere and they are out to deceive you," the narrator says in the video. "Trying to destroy you and your family." 

The narrator also says the "flood of people" and immigrants are brought on by the devil.

Exchanges with a 'conspiracy theorist'

A 33-page document of email exchanges showed conversations between Raymond and Rob Lee, Gallagher testified. In November 2017 Rob Lee asked Raymond to question someone about the occult symbols in a picture of theirs.

Rob Lee also said, "I'm aware that serpents, shills and fake Christians are on my channel ... I look forward to this list, I can not wait."

The document shows Raymond sending Rob Lee a list of usernames and names. Justice Larry Landry has imposed a publication ban on any names or usernames used on social media and YouTube, aside from Rob Lee's.

Defence lawyer Nathan Gorham presented to Gallagher a narrative of the relationship between Rob Lee and Raymond deteriorating.

A screenshot from Feb 8, 2018, had writing added in blue: "Rob Lee has back tracked against what it's all about. Showing people to be aware of demons protects them."

Another screenshot shows Raymond had written in blue under a YouTube comment by Rob Lee: "Oh really ... Can you tell a demon from a pic ANYMORE?"

The jury in the Matthew Raymond trial was shown multiple screenshots with mathematical calculations written on them using a computer program. (Submitted by Court of Queen's Bench)

After prompting from Gorham, Gallagher testified that "it appears that [Raymond] was trying to determine who would be a demon or not on the internet," but he "can't tell if he's doing it for Rob Lee or contesting Rob Lee."

Screenshots also show Raymond accusing another YouTube user of being a demon. Following that, Rob Lee sent an email to Raymond, saying "You are seeing demons every place man."

"You dove on that girls after I had said she's welcome in the channel."

In response, Raymond says, "I know they are all over as I have seen them," and calls him a "liar" and "hypocrite."

The court also saw two videos of Raymond at 237 Brookside Dr. He spoke to two people who were standing in a moving truck, and he put his arm around a boy who appears to be in his teens and smiled.

The trial will continue Thursday after a one-day break on Wednesday because one of the lawyers has a prior engagement.

ABOUT THE AUTHOR

Hadeel Ibrahim is a reporter with CBC New Brunswick based in Saint John. She reports in English and Arabic. Email: hadeel.ibrahim@cbc.ca.