The House: Feds likely to hold onto pipeline past 2019 election

The federal government is likely to own the Trans Mountain pipeline until the political risks facing the project are safely past — certainly until after the coming election, Finance Minister Bill Morneau told CBC News.

Meanwhile, Indigenous groups in Canada say they are serious about buying the pipeline and they want Ottawa to start getting serious about it too.

"We still need some love from the minister of finance, but I'm certain we'll get it through cooperation and communication," said Chief Mike LeBourdais in an interview airing Saturday on CBC Radio's The House.

"If you want to talk truth and reconciliation, I mean, this is a good way to start that thing."

Morneau has made no secret of the government's plan to be a pipeline owner only in the short term. At the time of the feds' purchase, Morneau said the government would work with investors to transfer the project to new ownership at an appropriate time.

In a separate interview airing on The House on Saturday, the finance minister said that time hasn't arrived yet.  

"We're going to remain open to talking to Indigenous peoples ... but it's not time yet where we can conclude on them."

Morneau said the immediate focus for the feds is on addressing the Federal Court of Appeal's ruling in August that halted the project. The court said Canada had not adequately consulted First Nations and that the National Energy Board's review didn't address the potential impact of the pipeline on marine life.

"We need to deal with the Federal Court of Appeal decision, and then think about the long term," Morneau said. 

Indigenous groups want in

LeBourdais said Morneau seemed taken aback when he was approached back in June by the First Nation over their interest in buying the pipeline.

"He was kind of surprised that we put this idea together and presented it to him so quickly," LeBourdais told host Chris Hall. 

LeBourdais, who heads the Whispering Pines First Nation north of Kamloops, B.C., said his community has met with banks, industry and other potential equity partners, and it's prepared to make a pitch for a 51 per cent share of the pipeline, which the federal government purchased in April 2018 for $4.5 billion.

If LeBourdais is moving fast, it's because he's not the only one interested in a piece of the pipeline.

Other Indigenous groups also have discussed buying into the project, including the Indian Resource Council of Canada representing 134 member First Nations, which met with its membership this week in Calgary to discuss possible ownership models.

There's also Project Reconciliation, a new company in Saskatchewan created by former Thunderchild First Nation Chief Delbert Wapass to put a bid forward.

The various groups aren't necessarily competing for a slice of the energy project, but LeBourdais made it clear that his community and those along the proposed expansion pipeline route need to be a part of any future deal between Ottawa and Indigenous peoples.

"We're not opposed to the [Indian Resource Council] buying a piece of it, but if they think they're going to purchase it without our cooperation that's probably a non-starter," he said.

"They're going to have to come and talk to us. There's 45 First Nations along the pipeline that have yet to hear from the Indian Resource Council. What we would like to do is include them in our bid. Now we need to have that conversation."

Pipeline comes with hefty pricetag 

Those looking to buy in will need to collaborate, said LeBourdais.

Not only is the pricetag for the pipeline and related infrastructure a steep $4.5 billion, constructing the expansion itself from Edmonton to Burnaby, B.C. could cost more than $7 billion.

"We're not under any illusion that we're going to pay the whole $4.5 billion," he said. "First Nations don't have that kind of cash. What we're getting are partners to put that money up and to get that 51 per cent stake in this pipeline. 

"In an ideal situation, we would like British Columbia, Alberta and maybe a bit of Canada [as partners], and a lot of private money in this as well."

LeBourdais said one of the chief factors motivating his community's interest in the pipeline is the opportunity for environmental oversight. Concerns over adequate consultation with Indigenous peoples, as well as the potential impact on the marine environment, stalled the project last year. LeBourdais said he sees Indigenous ownership as a solution to both concerns.

"[Protecting] waterways and moose and deer fawning grounds are things that are of importance to the First Nations along the line," he said. "The second concern First Nations have is that they don't have any money to do that kind of [environmental] monitoring. Having a piece of the pipeline would address both of those things."

For now, LeBourdais said he is working on a bid to put to the federal government in the coming months.

"I'd like to have the i's dotted and t's crossed in late May, and have it in front of the [finance] minister shortly thereafter so they can chew on it over the summer and get to some kind of decision in the fall," he said.

That timeline would land the decision in the middle of a federal election campaign. LeBourdais said he isn't concerned the timing could interfere with his plans.

"Thankfully [it's an election year] because if there was no election they probably wouldn't pay attention to us," he said. 

"I believe in what we're trying to accomplish, and I think it makes a lot of sense for First Nations, it makes a lot of sense for Canada, and I think it will be good for both of us."

Morneau agreed that having a stake in the pipeline could be positive for Indigneous communities.

"The project can be advantageous for those groups, it can be advantageous for them to be engaged from the standpoint of the long term of the pipeline, and it can also be advantageous for Canadians," he said.

However, he said he doesn't share LeBourdais' optimism about getting anything settled before the fall election.

"I think it would be difficult for me to imagine a scenario where we can deal with [the court decision] appropriately and at the same time be considering a change in the ownership," Morneau said.

"So that process, by definition, likely takes us past the next election."

MPs want Trudeau to call China's president

Canada's top diplomat in Beijing briefed MPs this week on the developing deterioration in relations with China, calling on government, media and business to continue pressure on the country.

But members of the foreign affairs committee said they weren't satisfied with the briefing, which took place behind closed doors after the Liberals amended the motion so it would be held entirely in camera.

"We wanted to hear if there's a plan to get these people back, to get this relationship back on track," said Conservative foreign affairs critic Erin O'Toole in an interview with CBC's The House following the Friday briefing.

"It was clear there was no plan and there is no plan now."

Ambassador John McCallum told the committee the government is taking steps on "many fronts" to garner support from world leaders and foreign ministers, but that's "just the beginning." 

The NDP's Hélène Laverdière said the government's outreach to allies for support makes sense, but she would like to see something more now, as relations continue to spiral downward with Chinese ambassador Lu Shaye warning of further repercussions this week if Canada moves to ban Huawei from a 5G network.

"I think we have to start thinking about a way out for China if Mrs. Meng is extradited so they could come down on what they're doing to Canadian citizens without losing face," she said.

Both O'Toole and Laverdière want Prime Minister Justin Trudeau to personally intervene and call Chinese President Xi Jinping.

"If the Prime Minister were to call the president that could be presented as a nice gesture," said Laverdière.

O'Toole echoed the call.

"[Trudeau] needs to take a personal role and if he shows he's seized with the matter, that will allow them to respond in kind," he told host Chris Hall. "The Chinese want to see that this is considered seriously in Canada, and only the Prime Minister can project that."

According to McCallum, when asked by reporters if it's time for Trudeau to make direct contact with Xi, the ambassador said: "I think the time will come when it's most appropriate."

O'Toole said Canada can't afford to wait much longer. "The crisis is deepening," he said.

Rural issues given spotlight with creation of new ministry

It's been a whirlwind week for Bernadette Jordan, Justin Trudeau's newest cabinet minister and Nova Scotia MP. After being sworn in as minister for rural development Monday, Jordan has quickly found herself sitting around the table at the cabinet retreat in Sherbrooke, Quebec.

But despite being in her new role for less than a week, Jordan is ready to hit the ground running, she told Chris Hall in an interview on CBC's The House airing Saturday. 

"One of the big issues we'll be facing is connectivity," she said. "We need to really step up and make sure rural Canada is not at a disadvantage because it doesn't have the connectivity. It's not just broadband, it's cell phone coverage as well. Those are going to be priorities for me going forward in developing a rural economic strategy."

Jordan will be working out of the infrastructure department, but she doesn't see that as a limitation on her ministerial sway. 

"We're housed in Infrastructure because Infrastructure and Innovation are two departments I'm going to have to work closely with," she said, adding that she will have separate staff. 

"Pretty much every ministry touches rural Canada, and we need to make sure we have that voice at the table."

Although Jordan acknowledged there are other issues concerning rural Canada, her focus will be on connectivity, she repeated throughout the interview.

"In 2019, if you want to grow your business overseas or even within Canada, you have to have the connectivity to do it. That is going to be a top priority."

Jordan may not have her official mandate letter yet, but she said she's "already in discussions" with the Minister of Finance about what piece of the pie Rural Economic Development can expect in the 2019 federal budget.

In the 2016 budget, the Liberals committed to investing $500 million by 2021 to bring high-speed Internet to 300 rural and remote communities in Canada, under the Connect to Innovate program. 

Jordan said the creation of her new portfolio highlights the government's commitment to following through on that program. 

"We recognize how important it is to connect rural Canadians," she said. "This is one of those things that just moves us that next step further."