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The Current Transcript for January 15, 2024

Host: Matt Galloway

Prologue

SOUNDCLIP

STUDENT: That's half the reason I've failed half of my classes. So, if I was in grade eight and like throughout all of high school, I wasn't allowed to on my phone. I'd probably like find it way easier.

MATT GALLOWAY: They are the bane of teachers and apparently some students, cell phones in the classroom. Quebec schools have now banned the devices in class. The B.C. opposition is promising to do the same. Ontario tried and largely failed. In an hour, what happened when a school district in Florida managed to keep phones out of students’ hands? Also, this morning. Do you like rugged coastlines? Working with your hands and lots of time by yourself? Have I got a job for you.

SOUNDCLIP

CAROLINE WOODWARD: I was in my middle age and so was my husband. And I thought, we need to have an adventure. This is wilderness again. And I can write again too.

MG: British Columbia is looking for lighthouse keepers. In 30 minutes, wild weather, isolation and saving lives. What it's like to work "on the lights". But we begin with what a Canadian doctor saw while volunteering in Gaza. Good morning, I'm Matt Galloway and this is The Current.

[Music: Theme]

What a Canadian doctor saw in Gaza

Guest: Dr. Yasser Khan

SOUNDCLIP

YASSER KHAN: [sound of bombs falling] I think it's just back there right, it's over there.

MG: The sound you just heard came from a hospital in Khan Younis, Gaza. And the voice was Doctor Yasser Khan, a Canadian ophthalmologist. He was volunteering there and recording what he saw and heard around him.

SOUNDCLIP

YASSER KHAN: You say next time, what? [woman's voice] Next time, if I stay... [banging sound] Is that? That's a tank, right? That's bombs?... Not tank. What is the tank sound like? [more loud bangs].

MG: Doctor Khan got back from Gaza last week and has joined me in our studio. Just a warning. We'll be talking about some graphic details of what he saw there, Doctor Yasser Khan. Good morning.

YASSER KHAN: Good morning.

MG: Thanks for being here.

YK: Thank you for having me here I appreciate it.

MG: Where were you when you recorded what we just heard?

YK: I was right in Khan Younis, at the European Gaza Hospital in the Gaza Strip.

MG: How close to you were those explosions?

YK: They're less than a kilometre away, actually. They were actually very loud and, uh, and constant. Uh, it almost became just part of the background. Uh, especially for the... I mean, it took me a little while to get used to, but for the Palestinians that were there, it was almost in the background and it was almost constant every hour, sometimes more than every hour. Yeah.

MG: Would you hear it or would you feel it...

YK: You would feel it in your body?

MG: So, what did it feel like?

YK: It felt like basically thunder. It sounded like thunder. But, uh, unlike thunder, everything shook. So, the, uh, building shook. You could feel it in your body. And it was unsettling at first. But then, as sad as it may, may seem, I got used to it because it would just happen. And sometimes it would startled me. But yeah, it just you could feel in your body and it was only less than a kilometre away. So, you always had that worry. Well, what if it just falls and you know, the aim is off and whatever, but that's a worry that they, they live with on a daily basis.

MG: So, the other doctors, as you said, it's a bit unsettling because you're just getting there. But the other doctors who are around, and I want to talk about the work that you're doing with them, but how are they responding to what we just heard?

YK: They could tell whether it's an F-16 bomb, whether it's a tank bomb, whether it's a missile that is fired, whether it's a, uh... a quadcopter, which is a drone that fires missiles... It's a weaponized drone. They could tell the difference between all those fires, which is kind of, um. You know, you don't usually live like that here in Canada, where we can tell them, you know, the just from the sound of the blast, what kind of weapon was used for this bomb, you know.

MG: And as it's happening, they're just continuing to go about their work.

YK: They're just continuing to go. Actually, when I was there, they were just the most generous people. They were. There's no food. But these doctors, these surgeons I was working with, uh, they would cook food for me. And because everybody's lost their homes, about 80 per cent of people have lost their homes. They've been destroyed by missile or bomb attacks. So, they're all displaced, and they're living in these small dorm rooms, which are, you know, with two beds in them and within which they have like a portable cooker. And so, they would make the meals in their room. So, while the bombs are in the background getting closer, they're cooking, uh, falafel because, uh, they got... they're able to get some kind of mix for, for falafel, which is an unusual, uh, hard to get. And that's what they're making for me while this is going on. Yeah.

MG: Why did you go to Gaza?

YK: Well, I've been a lifelong humanitarian. I've been to about 40 different countries in Africa, Asia, South America doing work like this, teaching and things like that. I must admit, this was my first active war zone that I've been to. I've been to a lot of places in Africa, for example, where conditions have been really poor, but not a war zone. I mean, I wanted to go and see how I can help, listen to them, do an exploratory visit on how I can support them in the future as, as they rebuild. And that's why I went. I've been given skills and knowledge that I'm very blessed with. I live a very privileged life here, and I've always been a firm believer that if you've been given knowledge and skills, you should use it. And this is one of the areas that is really in need of skill sets that I have. So, if I have an opportunity to go in and connect with them, share ideas and just be there, just, just even if I didn't do anything and I did a lot of surgeries when I was there, but even if I didn't do anything, just me being there was actually supportive for them and they appreciated that.

MG: As I mentioned, you recorded some sounds while you were there and I want to play something else. This is you, um, getting a tour of the hospital that you were working in.

SOUNDCLIP

[lots of voices talking, while guide shows Doctor the living area]

YASSER KHAN: And now they've over a thousand, I think. Right.

GUIDE: Well, the hospital has a capacity of 250 bits, and it's something like 1000 patients who needs to be admitted.

MG: Capacity of 250 patients but more than a thousand who need admittance. I watched a bit of this video. Um, describe what it looks like... There's people everywhere.

YK: Well, there's been, you know, a lot of military assault on the hospital systems in Gaza. I think there's only about a few hospitals left now. This was their premier tertiary care hospital, the European Gaza Hospital, funded by the European Union many years ago. It was like their premier tertiary care level hospital that had a 250 bed capacity. Okay. Now what's happened is that because people relatively perceive the hospital to be relatively, um, safer than being outside. And so, what's happening is it's become a mini refugee city of displaced people, where there's about 20 thousand people living in the hospital and outside the hospital. Patients itself they have about 2000 patients with a 250 bed capacity. So, patients are all over the floor. Uh, they're outside. Inside. Some with major head trauma, major orthopaedic injuries, major soft tissue injuries. People have set up shelters that you probably saw in the video. Um, and these aren't tents because they've not been given access to proper tents. These are makeshift shelters that they've made with blankets...

MG: These are the bed sheets that are hanging there?

YK: Exactly. Bed sheets. Uh, plastic sheets, blankets...

MG: And what are? Just described what those are.

YK: Um. It's where they live.

MG: It's where they live.

YK: They live inside. Some of them have mats on the floor. Some don't. So, some are sleeping on either bare floor or a sheet of cloth. Now, the unfortunate thing is that these people all had homes. They weren't homeless. They all at homes and many of them moved five or six times. So, families of six, seven, eight people living in this small square of an area covered by sheets for privacy and things like that. Many of them are patients. So, if you walk the hospital hallways, you can tell that the hospital was a fantastically modern, relatively speaking, hospital. But now every hallways lined with shelter. So, there's people inside and outside at Night-Time, when you, um, when you go, um, uh, when I go home and often, I'd operate from 9 a.m. to 10 p.m., people would be asleep. It'd be almost like a zombie movie where you see people in the hospital at night sleeping all over the floor.

MG: And home for you. I mean, as you said, I mean, the health workers that you're working with are essentially living in that area themselves.

YK: Well, yeah. So, what happened with the health care workers, the doctors at least, is that they used to have a call area, call rooms for, for doctors would be on call and...

MG: That's where they'd sleep overnight or something like that or just be waiting while they were on-call.

YK: Yeah, but now they're living there. So, there's families of... So, a lot of doctors have moved their families into these. So, it's families of five or six living in a small one... uh, actually not even one bedroom, like a small room with two beds and they're cooking in there. And that's where the doctors are staying. Yeah.

MG: How are they doing?

YK: Palestinians. I discovered it's my first kind of contact, first time going there, are an amazingly resilient, resilient people. I mean, they're... I mean, the suffering, there, uh, Matt is immense. I mean, I know I've been following social media the last three months, but when you go there, you experience how much the suffering is. I mean, uh, they are working 24/7, so there's no money coming, but yet they're working 24/7. They're exhausted. Most of the health care workers are not paid. Okay. Basically, patients are coming in. And I saw this for myself every hour. Uh, there are patients come in... Every time there's a bomb we say, uh, they say, well, you know what? Give it ten minutes all of the mass casualties will start coming in. And these are children, women, boys, men that have... that come in with limbs lost, um, with head trauma, with, uh, that classic shrapnel face. I don't know if you've ever seen that before. You have a face with multiple red dots all over the face, almost like red um, you know, pimples all over the place. And each red dot has either steel or wood or concrete in it. And...

MG: That's the shrapnel from the explosion?

YK: Yeah. Exactly. Right. And so, what happens with, with especially with me being an ophthalmologist is that when an explosion happens, uh, you don't cover your eyes because you don't know what's happening, right? So, the shrapnel also goes into the eyes, and that's why people are losing eyes. And when they come in, people are focussed on the immediate trauma of broken legs, of head trauma. They forget about the eyes initially, then later on, they realize, oops, the eyes also need attention, right? So, a lot of them have gone blind and you know, it's for me... uh, the hard thing was these are children who are like two, six. The ones I operate on. I took actually eyes out, so I took about ten eyes out when I was there because... And these were like two, six, uh, 13, 16, 17 year olds who are basically blind. And I mean, it's, um, I mean, the amount of amputations I saw, I've never seen. I saw 15 being done in one day, both legs, arms. There was one, uh, two boys, two brothers, uh, 16, 14 and 15 and 17 year old. And one of them had an above groin amputation. I don't know if you can kind of figure that out. That's above groin. Okay. Amputation. I don't even think they could do that, to be honest. I mean, eventually... And I had to look at them for their eyes. But both boys ended up dying. They didn't survive.

MG: You said there were a lot of children that you're working with and working on and operating on.

YK: Yeah.

MG: Um, is there one in the sweep of the patients that you saw, a story that stands out to you? I mean, that must be really hard to pick, but just to give something that will stay with you, a story that would stay with you.

YK: Yeah. I mean, there was a six year old girl, same age as my daughter. Looks like my daughter. Same body type. Um, so that really hit me. And that's the first time I broke down, actually. I was in the O.R., and I broke down. She lost her father. Her mother is injured, and she basically had a shrapnel, a stone, about three or two or three inches that went into her and shattered her eyeball. So, I have to take the eyeball out. But you saw this tiny soul who's done nothing. She actually was living in a shelter right next to a building that was bombed. So, the building that was bombed, uh, indiscriminately, uh, the whole family died there, but she was in a makeshift, uh, shelter right next to it. And she got, uh, you know, this shrapnel in her eye, shattered her eyeball. And I thought to myself, I saw this tiny soul sitting there, and I could relate. Being a father, I just said, you know, she's done nothing at all to deserve this. And I took the eye out. Um, there's a big rock, um, that I took out. Um, I've got a video of it, and, um, it was just shocking how big it was, and that's it. I mean, um, her whole life has changed, and she's only six years old, and that's just one story. There's thousands of those stories. Yeah.

MG: How difficult is it to do this work? You talked about breaking down. Um, but also, one of the things that we have heard from doctors working in the hospitals in Gaza is... The description is that the system is, you know, at the brink of collapse, that it's about to collapse, that they don't have the necessary supplies, what have you. How difficult is it to do the work that you are trying to do in that context?

YK: The system has collapsed, so it's not on the verge. It's completely collapsed. And like I said, most of the hospitals have been bombed or are gone and nothing is being allowed... So, the other thing is nothing's being allowed in. So, they don't have any painkillers or any analgesics. And what happens is that they have to economize and only use it for the big cases, uh, for analgesics. But for the other cases, people just, um, suffer. And again, I mean, I was amazed, Matt at the resiliency, I mean, such a resilient population that they're putting up with the pain. Yeah. I hear screams in the hospitals. First of all, you can't imagine the hospital you walk through, it's mass chaos. There's people everywhere. Everybody's coughing. Everybody has a respiratory illness. Most likely, everybody's lost something. Uh, antibiotics. You can't. You can't find them. They have enough anaesthetics to put people to sleep to do these major surgeries. But nothing is coming in, nothing's being allowed to come in, which, as a humanitarian, just doesn't make any sense how we as a world cannot allow medicines to come in to help these people. 70 per cent of people injured coming in are women and children.

MG: I want to play one more thing.

YK: Sure.

MG: Um, that that you recorded while you were there working in the hospital. Have a listen to this.

SOUNDCLIP

[Children singing]

MG: Can you tell me about the reaction that you just had in hearing that?

YK: Um, yeah. It just, uh, it broke me down then, it breaks me down now because there's a lot of children, a lot of children in this hospital, in the makeshift camps. There's children everywhere. And this was... And they have, they've lost their schools and their lives, and there's nothing for them to do. There's no schools. There's nothing. They're living in and on the floor outside. And so. But yet they're still smiling. Right. And it you know, they're still smiling. And this was basically... There's a man, uh, who had lost both his legs. He was in a wheelchair. Um, and he was trying to... And there's a whole big Line-Up of kids. And he was basically doing, like, a trick or treat kind of thing, right? Uh, the kids would line up, he would make them sing something and then give them a treat. Right. And, uh, this is at nighttime. And as I was walking back to my room, I filmed this and it just broke me down because I just saw the innocence of children. They're laughing, they're smiling. And I mean, you know, for them, this is normal, right?

MG: They just sound like kids...

YK: Yeah, they just sound the kids. And this is not normal. But for them, it's normal. So, that really affected me.

MG: I mean, you just heard it and you took your glasses off and kind of just you had to kind of catch yourself.

YK: Yeah.

MG: You had to leave earlier than expected. You... There was a set time that you were going to be there, but you left before that time ended. Why did you have to get out?

YK: Bombing started getting closer and closer and closer. So, I think the, um, the I think the Israeli forces were moving closer and the fighting is getting close to the hospital. And, I mean, the last night was tough. I couldn't sleep because it was constant bombing and we were really worried. And so, I was speaking to some of the U.N. Agencies there, and they said that the Israeli occupation forces were moving on the, um, on the hospital, uh, and forced the evacuation like they did with Al-Shifa early on.

MG: Another hospital in Gaza.

YK: Yeah. So, um, Gaza had three major hospitals. Al-Shifa was one of their major hospitals and that was forced evacuated. We all know about that. That was about two months ago. So, that's the... That this hospital maybe has 10 days at best. And that really worried me. I was worried for the patients. I was worried for my colleagues who have become my friends now. I don't know where they will go. And those 20 thousand people, I don't know where they will go because Matt, there's literally nowhere to go. I don't know what's going to happen. So, that's as I was leaving, which is scary leaving because, um, we left in a marked... It was six of us, uh, another NGO, and we left in a marked ambulance. Of course, we informed everybody our route and whatnot to the border, to the, uh, Rafah border, the Egyptian border. But we were scared. All six of us were tense because ambulances are getting missile attacks. And just yesterday there was an ambulance that got attacked and about six paramedics died, plus two patients. Even then, to be honest, you know, I didn't want to leave because I almost felt guilty leaving. Um...

MG: Why did you feel guilty? You'd gone there, you didn't need to go. And you went and you did this work. Why did you feel guilty in leaving?

YK: I felt guilty because I'm leaving these people that I became very close to. I'm leaving all these patients that I cared for, uh, and their follow up, uh, to somebody else. And I'm leaving to a very privileged, very blessed life where there is peace and stability and their security.

MG: What is it like for you to be back here? As you said, you said this a couple of times, you have a privileged life. What is it like walking around knowing where you were just a few days ago?

YK: It's definitely strange. Um, like I said, my heart is still there. Uh, but my body's here. Um, I'm worried. Um, I feel surreal about how we're all the same. Everybody's the same. Uh, you know, we're all... They have the same, uh, you know, same concerns, same wishes and dreams of life that we do here. Um, they are very educated. Um, they're like us. We're all the same. It saddens me. Yeah. Will you.

MG: Will you go back, do you think?

YK: Yes.

MG: You will go... I didn't even finish that question and you said you would...

YK: In a heartbeat I'd go back. Yeah.

MG: You've done humanitarian work, as you said, all over the world.

YK: I have, yeah.

MG: What's going to stay with you from what you saw?

YK: The suffering here, Matt, is unprecedented. Um, I've been to Uganda, I've been to Cameroon. I've been to, uh, Vietnam, Philippines. I've been to Ecuador and obviously working amongst, um, disadvantaged people. But the amount of suffering is, is unprecedented. Um, it's a worst I've ever seen. There are people of hope. When I was there, they're hoping, you know, I'll do this when the war ends. We want to do this. So, they actually were talking about their dreams, uh, what they want to do after the war on Gaza is over. And that struck me... I said, well, you know what? We don't know what's going to happen. It's still going on actively worse still. So, the difference it made for me was before I went, Matt, you know, you know, we all read on the news 300 people dead here or there in the world or in conflicts in the world. But when I went there, each person had a story. So, that's 300 became one times 300 and so that was tough to take is not just 300. It's each person has a story that's lost a life. Yeah.

MG: I'm glad you came in to tell us about the work that you've done. Thank you for doing that work. And thank you for being here.

YK: Thank you for having me.

MG: Doctor Yasser Khan is a Canadian ophthalmologist, an eye surgeon. He volunteered at the European Hospital in Khan Younis, in Gaza, and he returned to Canada last week. The CBC news is next. And then:

SOUNDCLIP

BARRY PORTER: Took us almost an hour to get that. Two men on, two men off. And when you jump, you know you're doing a Spider-Man jump. Pray to God the sea don't wash you away. So, it was pretty tricky.

MG: Being a lighthouse keeper gives you access to natural beauty and the ability to get a lot of reading done. But it can require some pretty deft manoeuvres just to get basic supplies. The life of a modern day lighthouse keeper and why you might want to take that job. There are openings in British Columbia. I'll tell you whether it's perhaps suited for you. Coming up in six minutes, I'm Matt Galloway, you're listening to The Current on CBC radio and the CBC listen app. Stay with us.

[Music: Theme]

The life of a modern-day lighthouse keeper

Guests: Caroline Woodward and Barry Porter

MG: Hello, I'm Matt Galloway and you're listening to The Current. Imagine living on a rocky, windswept island on less than a square kilometre of land. Maybe only 1 or 2 other people for company. That is the life of the lighthouse keeper as described in this National Film Board documentary from 1972.

SOUNDCLIP

MALE SPEAKER: A lot of people apparently grab the opportunity to have what is known as a government job, but when they find out that it means that you've got to live here, then it's not so attractive. But it's a good life. If you like this kind of a life. But are you going to be suited? And not everybody is suited?

FEMALE SPEAKER: At first, I just didn't like it at first at all. Look what the mainland... I'm going. But now we go on holidays, and I just can't wait to get back here. It's home now. After seven years as home.

MG: Since the 1970s, more than 200 lighthouses across Canada have been automated. There are now only 51 staffed lighthouses left in this country. Most are in British Columbia and Newfoundland. But if living and working at one of them sounds appealing, well, it turns out you might be in luck. The Canadian Coast Guard has just extended the deadline to apply for positions as assistant lighthouse keepers in B.C. Barry Tchir is regional vice president for the Union of Canadian Transportation Employees, and he says this job is not always an easy sell.

SOUNDCLIP

BARRY TCHIR: Pre-COVID, we were really struggling to keep two people on station. Sometimes there's stations that go down to one person per station. And then Covid hit and that sort of put a pause on everything. And now we're back out of that and looking to properly staff it. They are staffing them, but it is right now it's staffed with relief keepers, which are people that are only willing or wanting to go there for short periods of time, two weeks, a month, something like that, that. They're staffed with that because they are having trouble finding permanent people sort of thing. So, they want to create a pool I think of people that are willing to do it or wanting to do it and get them through the process.

MG: Are you intrigued by this? Joining me now are two people who know all about the life of a lighthouse keeper. Caroline Woodward spent 14 years 'on the lights', as it's called in various locations in B.C. before retiring in 2021, and Barry Porter spent 23 years at lighthouses across Newfoundland starting in the 1980s. Good morning to you both.

BARRY PORTER: Good morning.

CAROLINE WOODWARD: Good morning. Matt.

MG: Caroline, how did you end up as a lighthouse keeper? What was it that brought you to this job?

CW: Well, I was working as a publishing rep, and I was on a ferry to Alert Bay to show a curator at the U'mista Centre there beautiful First Nations art books and seafood cookbooks and so forth. When I boarded the little ferry, a little Jack Russell dog started darting in amongst the moving vehicles. And I am a dog lover. So, I scooped him up and a harried looking man came dashing around the corner. The owner, of course, and we struck up a conversation. He wanted to know what I was doing with all my books in my little Chev Tracker, and, um, he told me about being a relief lighthouse keeper on his way to Pulteney Point to relieve the light keeper there for six weeks, and I just thought that was marvellous. And I emailed my husband right away and said, I think I've found our new life.

MG: [laughs] What was the appeal? Not just even in that interaction, but in what you knew about it. What was interesting to you about it?

CW: I lived in isolation. I grew up on a homestead in the peace River country, and there was just something about big spaces and wilderness. You know, I think we sort of bond to our early environment like ducks, and I miss that. And I was so busy. I loved my publishing job. It was really challenging. And I'm all, full of all sorts of interesting people. But I was also a writer, and I was not able to write because I was so busy, you know, extolling the virtues of other people's books. So, I knew I could finally write again. And I was in my middle age, and so was my husband. And I thought, we need to have an adventure.

MG: I'm going to ask you about the adventure part of it in a moment. Barry, what about for you? How and when did you know that this was a path that you wanted to follow?

BP: Well, it came out of left field. I had no intentions or any plans to be a light keeper. I was a welder by trade and I'd worked a couple years out in Manitoba, in Alberta, and, uh, I returned to Newfoundland being homesick and looking for work. And actually, I had applied for a job on the Ocean Ranger, drilling rig that that sank, uh, and medicals. I was the next one to be called in that the next welder left.

MG: Oh, my goodness.

BP: And said, sadly, the rig went down and I said, uh, time for change of direction, change careers. And I heard through a buddy of mine that the Canadian Coast Guard were looking for lighthouse keepers, sort of just out of nowhere. I just, uh, applied for it and went through the interviews and got on the relief list and, uh, started in 1983 on Surgeon Cove Point on Exploits Island. And in '84 I went full time at, uh, beautiful Long Point and Twillingate. And once I settled at Long Point that was a land station. Once I got there, I just had the feeling that I was meant to be at this.

MG: How did it work when you started in the 80s? What was that like?

BP: It was primitive, I thought.

MG: Primitive?

BP: Yeah, well, you're out on an island. You got, uh, no computer, no internet, no cell phones. Just a black and white TV to start off with. And, uh, the only communication was the CB radio or VHF radio back to home. Uh, there was a mobile phone that we had the Canadian Coast Guard supplied, but that didn't work very well. So, uh, you're isolated, you're out on the island, 20 miles out in the Atlantic Ocean with another stranger. You got to do your job and adjust to your co-worker. And, uh, it's a unique career, that's for sure.

MG: So, your family was away from there. And as you said, you're in this lighthouse with a stranger, somebody you don't know before you get there.

BP: Yeah, totally.

MG: What was that like? That could be a recipe for disaster.

BP: Oh, yeah. You, if you start work with the wrong partner, you know, you're leaving. You're giving up. But luckily, I started with the gentleman, Kelvin Moores really sweet, sweet guy. And, uh, he showed me the ropes on that first 32 day shift. He made it easy.

MG: Caroline, what about for you? You went with your husband. But what's the living situation for most lighthouse keepers in B.C.?

CW: Uh, we live at the light station, and so we work seven days a week. Uh, unless there's a medical or a real family emergency. Uh, we have our leave once or twice a year. Sometimes, but usually once. And when I got out there, Jeff had already, my husband, had already been working relief. And then with great timing, he was, um, there was job openings for assistant keepers.

MG: So, he was trained up by the time you went out.

CW: Yes. The way it works here is that the relief keepers go out and they are trained by the, um, senior keeper or senior to them on site, on station. But you go out there with your first aid, uh, topped up, refreshed your course and your, um, VHF radio training done so that you're capable of communicating because that's one of your main jobs. And then you're shown how to do the, um, you know, the weather report, um, how to handle the equipment, because every station is slightly different. And, um, yeah, it's, um, I got out there and within weeks I was doing relief.

MG: Who's the ideal candidate for this? We heard in that NFB documentary from the 70s, not everybody is suited for this job. So, what do you do, who do you have to be. Who is the ideal candidate, Caroline, for a gig like this?

CW: Right. Um, that's a really important question. I think people who are resourceful, who are handy, you know, Barry was a welder ahead of time. You know, I grew up on a farm. You have to have a problem solving state of mind. You can't just call in the shops. The weather might not allow them to be flown in for days and weeks. You have to enjoy, um, isolation. So, if you have a hobby like woodworking or, um, so many like keepers have built, um, beautiful little, um, dories or boats, you know, row boats, sewing, uh, quilters, uh, knitters, uh, writers, photographers. My husband's a photographer as well. Um, these are all things that help you get outside every day and appreciate where you are and the wildlife and birds and marine mammals that you're looking at. And, um, and you've got to be steady because the weather reports have to be given every three hours consistently to the Coast Guard radio. And you got to keep an eye on the weather, too, because if there's a big change and there's criteria for how big that change needs to be, you need to call in, uh, a weather special, um, to alert float planes and mariners that, uh, things are going sideways.

MG: Barry, did you find that you were suited automatically, were you, did you feel like this was the place that you were meant to be?

BP: Yeah, I fell into the position, uh, pretty, uh, natural. Uh, yeah. Like, uh, Caroline said, you got to be a jack of all trades. You got to be a weatherman. Uh, radio operator, carpenter, plumber, tour guide, cook, medic, and, uh, you know, sometimes a counsellor or a shrink because, you know, you got to deal with the isolation and, uh, people deal with it in different ways, and, you know, embrace your hobbies and, uh, you know, it's... not everybody's calling out, uh, for that career, that's for sure.

MG: How did you deal with the isolation?

BP: I tried every hobby under the sun. Everything but knitting. [Matt laughs]. Woodcarving, to oil painting, to teaching myself how to play guitar and, uh, you know, photography, woodworking, hiking. Um, yeah, I done everything over to 23 years. And, uh, you know, during the winter months, that was the worst, you know, long, dark days. You gotta keep your sanity and, uh, or it's trouble, right? You know, some guys, they do one shift and they leave. They never come back. It's just, it's not worth the isolation and the pay is not sufficient enough.

MG: How would you leave? I mean, you're working in some pretty remote locations. How would you get off and on to where you were?

BP: Well, uh, [inaudible], on the northeast coast, it was by speedboat. Your own speedboat in, uh, in the spring, summer and fall. And during the winter, you'd use a Canadian Coast Guard helicopter. So, you go through some, uh, some wicked storms to get out and get back in sometimes. Right. So, it's, uh, it was tricky. Um, you know, you break, break a lot of safety rules to get out to get on station cause you got two men that's been out for a month, and they wanted to get back in.

MG: Tell me about what happened. There's one, right before Christmas, right?

BP: Yeah. Uh, it was December, like December 22nd, 1995. I think you have every second Christmas off. And, uh, this particular year, uh, we're due to get off and our changeover date was like probably December the 18th, and, uh, was bad weather was too rough for boat. Uh, the helicopter was, uh, stuck in Saint John's, uh, and the weather was tough for a storm to get worse. And, uh, so we hired, uh, local guy in Embree. Uh, and, uh, they came out in the afternoon and it was, you know, northeast wind, rain, probably 60km of wind or gusting up to 70 or 80. Uh, at the lighthouse, there's no dock, no dockies or wharfs or coves. You just come to the side of the cliff and, uh, you have to exchange your, your supplies because you bring it your monthly supplies. It took us about almost an hour. We had, uh, sea conditions, was rising and falling 20 to 25ft. And, uh, our hop, our boat operated would sneak into the rocks and toss out a few boxes, come back out, and you just had to stay in this little, little cove. Uh, so you'll see everything swirling around ya. Rising up. Down.

MG: Yikes.

BP: Uh, it took us, took us almost an hour to get, uh, two men on, two men off. And when you jump, you know, you're doing a spider man jump to the cliffs [Matt laughs] and just pray to God that the sea don't wash you away. So, it was pretty tricky.

MG: Don't try this at home.

BP: [laughs] No.

MG: Caroline, Barry mentioned food. I mean, how do you go about getting supplies? And you had a little garden that was there, right?

CW: Yes. We, uh, became great gardeners, and we had a greenhouse, that we doubled the size of. And there was a cold frame and lots of raised gardens. And of course, the wonderful wild blackberries that we corralled into, uh, a, um, uh, sort of a pen. Uh, um, but, uh, we could really eat something out of our West Coast gardens, um, every month or in the greenhouse. And I grew asparagus and globe artichokes and all sorts of leeks and winter cauliflower and things like that. But the thing that these keepers have to do as well is set up an account no matter where you are in Prince Rupert or off Victoria or on the West Coast Trail here with one of the big, uh, grocery stores where they have personal shoppers and they go out for you once a month, and then they take all these boxes down to the base and, uh, the helicopters, um, come out on the grocery tender, we call it, and, uh, once a month or once every five weeks or so. And, uh, so that's always like Christmas when, when those grocery helicopters come in and the pilots and... Yeah. So, they get extra cookies from us that day [Matt laughs] and, uh, yeah, it's wonderful.

MG: Barry, you need to make sure I suppose that I mean, given how isolated where you were was that you had enough food, right?

BP: Yes. Oh, yeah. We, uh, you go for 32 days and you have to take 16 meals, 16 suppers that you cook every second day, basically for your co-worker. And, uh, you look after your own lunch and breakfast, but, uh, you know, you always have to have, you know, try to have a couple extra meals in the deep freeze. Just keep in the kitty for, uh, for being, you know, stormed out because, uh, you know, depending on the weather, you could get stuck out there an extra four or five, six, seven days.

MG: And let me talk about the work. There is a lighthouse keeper in B.C., Spencer Wilson. He's stationed at Boat Bluff on the north coast. He has a YouTube channel where he describes his daily tasks, including tracking the weather. Have a listen.

SOUNDCLIP

SPENCER WILSON: So, when we're doing our cloud cover, we have to take a look at the celestial dome. If you look at the clouds today, what we have there are several different layers of cloud before you reach the maximum that we have to report at 2500ft. So, taking a look, we add some cloud cover around 500.

MG: Caroline, you're talking about, um, submitting the weather. That's a huge part of this job, right?

CW: Yes, it is. And you know, when you have air ambulances coming in, when your own crews are coming in, uh, by helicopter, um, you know, you want to get this right, and, um, I worked at a station at Nootka a fair bit. Uh, and we did, uh, the weather's the cloud estimates there a lot. And we would get calls from the, um, floatplane operators in Gold River asking you know, where were the clouds? And so, the keepers that we were replacing there, doing relief for them while they went off. They had a beautiful panorama, um, map in the radio room with the height of every, um, mountain and prominent feature at, uh, which level you know, the clouds were. So, you know, if I was getting a call, I could look out the window, refer to the map, and be able to say with some authority. You know, it's all clogged up that way, but it's high here. And then he would know which way to fly in.

MG: Barry, part of the job is run in the foghorn. How does the foghorn work?

BP: Uh, the fog on, uh, is hooked up to what they call a video graph. It shoots a beam of light, strobe lightheaded, uh, two miles out into the, over the ocean. And if there's a clear day, then it's just the light continues. Uh, if the light bounces back. Uh, caused by either fog or snow flurries that will set off the foghorn. It's, uh, it works pretty good, but, uh, you know, the window that this little strobe light shoots out on. Uh, we found that, uh, you get freezing rain, and then it doesn't read properly and it doesn't detect, uh, the fog or the snow. So, uh, that it would have to be turned on manually. Uh, in those cases, right.

MG: You could have days where it would be foggy, right? For days on end. Would you start to lose your mind up there?

BP: Yeah. Uh, 2 or 3 days is not too bad. But, uh, you know, I've had, I think, up to seven days with this horn blasting in the background every 30 seconds. And you're looking at the window, you're in a beautiful, uh, setting with the ocean and, you know, could be a few icebergs or whatever. And, uh, you know, when the fog rolls in, you've got zero visibility for days, and days, and days. And, uh, it tests your, uh, sanity for a few days. I must say.

MG: Caroline, would that give you a different perspective on the province and its landscape? You would see, weather and weather is incredible to see from a distance, but right up close, you'd be as close as people could be to roiling seas. And what have you. Do you have a different perspective on the province and what's around you?

CW: Definitely, definitely. You know, doing the light keeping work. It was something to document, you know, because in a way, we're documenting climate change, right? Every day with our methodical, consistent, uh, reporting and taking of measurements and so forth. And it's something that you just accept. You know how Canadians, we are obsessed by weather and but out there, you know, I mean, I really I relate to what Barry says about too many days of fog and because we felt the same about, um, rain, you know, but, um, the weather and it is something that just is. You accept it, you document it, you rejoice when it's gorgeous and you take photos and all the rest of it. And sometimes when it's really thumping and you've got huge seas and everything, it's kind of thrilling. It's not thrilling to end up in your lighthouse at 2:30 in the morning because of a tsunami warning. But, um, you know, you just, that's exceptional.

MG: Barry, a lot of as I said, the lighthouses in this country have been automated. Um, how do you feel about that? What are we losing in that?

BP: Uh, yeah, I am. I was never in favour of, uh, automation. Um, I still feel that the, uh, the certain locations around the coast that we need, uh, hands on, we need a, uh, living lightkeeper observing, uh, the coastline, whether it's fishermen or sailors or kayakers in the area, uh, you know, a solar panel or a computer chip cannot, uh, cannot replace, uh, a living light keeper's on a cliff with a set of binoculars. You know, I've saved lives. Uh, and no one knows how many lives are saved by preventing a, uh, accident from, uh, light keeper's station around the coast. Right.

MG: What do you miss most about the job, Barry?

BP: Uh, the beauty, uh, you know, uh, a nice sunset, uh, on the ocean, 20 miles. Not a person around the nice sunset. The calm evenings would be nice, but, uh, you know, I had my kick at it 23 years. I was ready for a change, when I, uh, shifted careers and, uh, you know, family life and all that. Just being away from your wife and, uh, my two kids, uh, like, uh, that's difficult, right?

MG: Caroline, what about for you? Um, what do you miss about it?

CW: Well, like Barry, I miss seeing wonders of nature. Like the whale migration of the grey whales from Mexico, uh, all the way up to Alaska and just seeing them puffing along the horizon, past, uh, Leonard Island, past Tofino, uh, and orcas, uh, charging along, you know, uh, and really after something and, uh, just, uh, the spectacular, uh, sunsets. And like, Barry, I, you know, I'm very happy to spend much more time with family. We were able to have family out, um, for special occasions, you know, Christmas, uh, and when we couldn't get off. But. Yeah, I mean, it's a wonderful chapter of our lives. Uh, we're so glad we did it. We feel it was worthy work and good work. And, um, I really hope some young people listening today will. Or some middle aged young at heart people listening today will consider it because, uh, you know, there is no substitute for eyes and ears and, um, and, uh, the human judgement, uh, to call in for people, uh, in trouble and to notice what's going on in the water.

MG: So, and maybe I'm, I don't know if I'm young at heart I'll let other people determine that or not. But in talking to you both...

BP: You are.

MG: You probably roll your eyes, but this sounds like an ideal job. I mean, I would love to do something like this. I like being by myself. I love the idea of that hands on work and being in nature. If I was thinking of applying for this, I'm not. But if I was, and maybe I will, to the surprise of my partner, what? What would I need to consider? What's something that somebody who's applying for this Barry, needs to think about?

BP: Well, you got to be... you got to be able to handle the, the remoteness. Right. Uh, there's a lot of perks, but, uh, you got to be at peace at oneself and, and just be able to occupy yourself in, uh, extreme conditions, weather conditions, and, uh, you just got to be happy with oneself. I think.

MG: Caroline, am I crazy for thinking this sounds like a dream job?

CW: Well, I don't know what your first aid, um, level is like, but you have the radio skills, Matt. [all laugh]

MG: I'm really glad to talk to you both about this. It sounds like a real adventure that you have been on. And an adventure that a lot of people may be intrigued by. Thank you very much.

BP: Thank you very much. And nice talking to you as well, Caroline.

CW: Yes. Ditto, Barry. Bye.

BP: Thank you.

MG: Caroline Woodward and Barry Porter, both former lighthouse keepers and writers. You can read about Barry's experience in Newfoundland in his memoir, "Adventures of a Lighthouse Keeper". And Caroline story from B.C. is called "Light Years: Memoir of a Modern Lighthouse Keeper". Well, coming up after your regional update.

SOUNDCLIP

STUDENT: It's just very distracting because you have your friends texting you all the time, and obviously you want to text your friends more than sitting class and listen to your teacher. So, if you just have something so easy to like, text your friends on, of course you're going to do it.

MG: Students see the problem now Quebec has banned smartphones in its classrooms. One school in Florida has gone even further. No phones ever at all, even at lunch or on breaks. A principal there tells us what's changed since that ban came into place. That's coming up in 90 seconds. I'm Matt Galloway, this is The Current stick around.

Florida school’s strict cellphone ban and airstrikes in Yemen

Guests: Marc Wasko and Iona Craig

MG: Hello again. I'm Matt Galloway and you're listening to The Current.

SOUNDCLIP

STUDENT: I get really bored in class because sometimes my teacher just won't stop talking and like, I'm not paying attention. So, it's just like a good distraction. And I don't know, it's just the best cure for boredom.

MG: For any teachers listening. Sorry. The debate over cell phones in schools is heating up again. Quebec just implemented a ban on smartphones in the classroom, in B.C. the leader of the opposition is promising to remove phones from schools if he gets elected. And it turns out students there aren't totally against that idea.

OTHER STUDENT: I'm in grade 12. To be honest, I've don't really use my phone in class, but like during the breaks, I'll be on it for like a couple five minutes. But I'm pretty good at like staying off of it cause I think I'd rather like, do my work, so I'm not, like, falling behind, you know what I mean? I think banning phones in schools might be a good idea, depending on who you are, because I feel like some people are, like, perfectly fine. And not like getting distracted by the phone in school, but like, some people really find that an issue. So, that has like a good effect and maybe like a bad effect at the same time.

ANOTHER STUDENT: I am in grade 12 and honestly, I just use my phone to cheat on like my work and stuff and to text my friends and it really distracts me. So, there's nothing really that good coming from it. I think banning cell phones in school is definitely a great idea because, like, that's half the reason I've failed half of my classes. So, if I was in grade eight and like throughout all of high school, I wasn't allowed to go on my phone. I'd probably like find it way easier because I'd pay more attention and my attention span wouldn't be so short.

MG: Ontario also has a province wide ban on phones in the classroom. It's been in place since 2019, although teachers can let students use those devices for learning purposes and in practice, students and teachers would tell you that kids in that province are on their phones a lot. One Florida school board recently went even further, bringing in one of the strictest phone bans in the United States. Last spring, Florida passed a statewide law banning cell phone use during class time, but Orange County Public Schools decided to take it another big step no phones ever at any time during the school day. Marc Wasko is a principal at Timber Creek High School in Orlando, Florida. Marc good morning.

MARC WASKO: Good morning Matt.

MG: Before we get to the details of the ban, paint me a picture of what a phone free lunch looks like at your school right now.

MW: Well, you know, Matt, we incorporated a lot of things. So, to help keep that policy in effect, um, we've now started, uh, pickleball courts in our courtyard, we have a large courtyard where students can gather. Um, we have spike ball, we have cornhole. Um, we have ladder toss. We also have on... And that's on Tuesdays and Fridays. Um, you see a lot more kids conversing with each other, you know, they're conversing with adults as well. Uh, we even have students that are sitting down reading books nowadays. Um, it's really been, it's been a surprise. It's been great. You know, it's a great lunch time. Uh, a lot less distractions for the kids, a lot less mishap that goes on. And students are starting to learn to talk to each other and people as well.

MG: How does that compare to before the band? You do sound surprised that these things, cornhole and other things that they've taken off. Uh, among the high school students, what is it, what was it like, uh, before the ban?

MW: You know, most of the time, I mean, kids were watching either, you know, TikToks or on their Instagram or creating videos. Um, you know, even sometimes, you know, chatting with just different friends at other schools and things like that. So, you didn't really see the interaction between students like you do nowadays.

MG: What about inside the classroom? What was life like in the classroom before the ban was in place, and kids could use their phones at their discretion?

MW: We had a lot of teachers, you know, always calling to us to, you know, come in and talk to a kid or get a kid from class being on their cell phone, you know, not paying attention to the lesson. You know, again, watch, you know, surfing the internet, being on TikTok, Instagram, you know, any social media outlet they can, anything, you know, that would distract them from a class versus paying attention. Uh, you know, teachers, you know, start to see kids, you know, go downhill with their grades. And not I understand the materials that were going on just because of those distractions.

MG: You've also said that there were other issues that led to this ban, things like bullying and students posting things online. Tell me a bit about that.

MW: Yeah. I mean, you know, in the social media age that we're in nowadays, you know, anything that a kid can grab on another kid, you know, if they're, you know, dislike somebody, jealousy things or whatnot. You know, kids find different ways to pick on kids. You know, I mean, it's been going on for centuries, but now with social media, it's so much easier to do. You know, they post videos of kids doing things or, you know, create drama with it and stuff like that. So, that was a big reason that our superintendent, you know, she heard from parents in town hall meetings and, you know, in students [inaudible]. And those were some of the big, big topics that that she touched on.

MG: And so how does this ban work? How do you go about making sure that kids aren't on their phones at all for an entire day?

MW: So, surprisingly, it went better than we ever could imagine. Um, you know, we sat long and hard and figured out how we were going to do all this stuff. You know, we even bought, um, cell phone lockers, to when they were confiscated to keep them locked up, you know, so that kids couldn't say that their phone was lost, stolen, destroyed. So, we basically we have some signs around the school in our courtyard letting students know that at 7:20, which is when actual class time starts, because kids usually get to school between 6:30/6:45 at 7:20 when that first bell rings to be in class, no more cell phones are allowed to be out or seen or used, and then they're lifted again at 2:20 when we dismiss.

MG: And so, they still have the phones with them. You haven't taken the phones away. They're not kind of hidden away in the office or, uh, kept out of the... They still have their phones. They're just not allowed to use them.

MW: Correct. They're in their backpacks.

MG: Are you surprised by that? I have a phone that's in front of me, and I might be, you know, not in high school anymore, but it's still really tempting to pull the phone up at all sorts of times. Are you surprised that they actually keep the phone in the bag?

MW: It is. It is surprising. I think it goes down to a lot of things. You know, the students have... You know, we have really good relationships with our students, our administration, our teachers. Um, you know, we're a fairly large community. Everybody knows each other as well. But I just think that that relationship piece is one part that's really helped it. The parents support, the school board and our superintendent supporting it. I think, you know, once you have that whole cohesive front with everything, it makes it a lot easier. But I am surprised at how well it is going. And again, as administrators, we try to model the same thing too. We try to keep our cell phones away. I mean, you know, duty calls sometimes in, you know, and business phone calls will be had at points. But most of the time during lunch's, between passing and all that stuff like that. We try to model the same thing as the students and keep our phones away as well.

MG: And so, if somebody does use their phone, if they're caught, temptation is too strong and they're caught on the phone because TikTok calls, what happens?

MW: So, first time's a warning, um, you know, they get warned by it when we do confiscate the phone. Um, and then it's put in the cell phone locker they're given a ticket with, uh, with the number that it's in, and they come and pick it up at the end of the day, about five minutes before we were dismissed or excused from class to come down and get their phone. And then, you know, it increases from there. So, you know, the next one could be a referral. Then you go on to a referral with, you know, after school detention, and then it gets up to in school to all the way to out of school suspension.

MG: Wow, how are the students responded to this?

MW: They've responded well, like I said the first day. So, it was rolled out slowly. When school first started, it was a soft rollout. Um, you mostly just warn kids about it, you know. Let me know. Hey, put your phones away. And we were shocked at how quickly they adapted to it, um, when it went into full effect, you know, when we were starting to give consequences and everything. I think the first day was probably the roughest. We had about 130 phones, and now we average about maybe 5 or 6 phones a day at the most.

MG: You told The New York Times that one of the things you've noticed in the classroom is that students are actually making eye contact and responding to the teacher. Tell me more about that, what you've heard and what you've seen in the classroom. In terms of a change in, I was gonna say in attitude, but it's about attitude and behaviour as well.

MW: It is. So, I think coming out of Covid and everything, we were so, you know, tied to our electronic devices, you know, you know, friends, family, everybody. It was the only way we could really communicate, you know, with trying to keep everybody safe and away from each other that, you know, the teachers, you know, it started feeding over into the classrooms. And teachers really have been so, so happy with this. You know, they tell us every day it's the best thing that's ever happened. The students start looking at them, they have a conversation with them. They're able to participate in class. It's not just a one way, you know, the teacher, giving all the information and their students sitting there going, I don't know what you're talking about because they're distracted. You know, they even say that, you know, when they speak, they do look at them now, where before they would always kind of look down at their desks and stuff like that. And I see it largely in the morning time, you know, we have students that come in after first period, sometimes just due to the flexibility of their schedule. And when they walk down the hallway, they're looking straight ahead. They're looking at you and saying, good morning. Before it was, you know, heads down into their phone, you know, texting and, you know, on social media.

MG: In that piece in the times, one student told the paper that the ban means that she can't learn how to use her phone responsibly. What do you say to that kind of concern? That this, figuring out that regulation is part of school in some ways?

MW: Uh, I don't think it teaches responsibility. I think, you know, in the world you have rules in place. You know, you have speed limits in place so that, you know, people are, you know, paying attention and safer in driving and stuff like that. I think it's just one more thing that's in place for students to understand that there's consequences and there's rules in the world that you have to go by. Um, you know, I don't think it's really highly punishable. As far as you know, I haven't seen anybody where we've had to, you know, kick them out of school yet to say that you're suspended for days out of school because you've broken this policy. I think everybody's learn because of the rule, responsibility from it.

MG: What about parents? Parents are used to being able to text their kids all day long, especially if the kids are teenagers and they need to check in on them, see what's going on, what have you. How have parents responded to this?

MW: They've responded well. They were one of the biggest proponents for it to begin with. Um, you know, like I said, the superintendent, she had town hall meetings all throughout her first year. And when she had those, the parents' biggest complaint was cell phone usage. And so, you know, she heard that and the school board heard that. And the parents have responded really, really well. We've had very little pushback.

MG: And just before I let you go if... I mentioned that there are school boards that are trying to do this and some have tried and failed to do this, for other boards that are considering a ban as extensive as yours, what advice would you give them?

MW: I'd say first of all, you just have to have the cohesiveness of everybody. You're one team, you all have to be together, and you have to keep that consistency with everybody in that buy in. And once you have that, I think that's what makes it really successful, especially in our part, is we have the support of our school board and our superintendent, and we understand that. And with that support and that cohesiveness, I feel like that's what's really made it sustainable in our system.

MG: And the principals, uh, and the teachers need to model that behaviour. I mean, you can't be on your phone and telling students that they can't be on their phone, right?

MW: Absolutely. Because they'll call you out. I mean, if I do have a call from my boss or something like that, they'll be like, Mr. Wasko, you're on your phone. I'm like, yeah, but it's my boss, so I have to take this. It's really important. And I'm going to go inside right now because I don't want them to see that. So, you know, it's kind of like everybody polices each other, whether it's. So, it's good that the students do call us out as administrators if we do have it, you know, and it is a business call. And I think that's really what's helped a lot with it.

MG: Glad to talk to you about this. Thank you very much.

MW: Thanks, Matt I appreciate it.

MG: All the best. Mark Wasko is principal at Timber Creek High School in Orlando, Florida. Your thoughts on this if you we're, and we've talked about this before, a teacher, a parent, a student, what do you make of this kind of ban, and would you like to see it in your school? You can email us thecurrent@cbc.ca.

[Music: techno instrumental]

MG: This is The Current on CBC radio and the CBC listen app. My name is Matt Galloway. Starting on Friday and continuing through the weekend, the United States and the United Kingdom launched dozens of airstrikes on Houthi controlled parts of Yemen. This move was supported by a coalition of countries, including Canada. The attacks have led to five deaths and tens of thousands of people protesting throughout Yemen. For weeks, the Iran backed rebel group has been disrupting trade by boarding ships in the Red Sea. The Houthis say they will not stop until Israel ends its war against Hamas. Iona Craig is an independent journalist who has covered Yemen for over a decade. Iona. Hello.

IONA CRAIG: Good morning.

MG: The Houthi's fired a missile towards an American ship yesterday, the first since these airstrikes. That missile was shot down by the U.S. jet. But the Houthis are saying that these attacks will continue, and that those who are launching attacks against the Houthis will "pay a heavy price". What do you think that retaliation might look like in future?

IC: Well, yes. The Houthis have been very defiant. Um, I think the escalation will be continued attacks in the Red Sea on commercial vessels. I think there will be a particular targeting of U.S. vessels like we saw yesterday. Um, and U.S. warships that is, uh, they could also extend to targeting tankers, oil tankers, which they haven't done before and obviously would be extremely dangerous. Um, the other issue's, uh, you know, that they could target other countries such as Bahrain. They have the ability to launch mid-range ballistic missiles over long distances. And Bahrain is one of the countries that is supporting the U.S. and the U.K. in these airstrikes. And there's also been tension on the border with Saudi Arabia, the rising tension the last few days in a period where the conflict internally in Yemen, the civil war has been relatively quiet since March 2022. But there's certainly been increased tension in northern Yemen with the Saudi border. So, that's also a thing that could flare up, is the internal conflict within Yemen reignited um, as one of the responses by the Houthi to these attacks.

MG: The Houthi, are backed by Iran. Iran is also backing Hezbollah and Hamas. U.S. President Joe Biden said over the weekend that his government delivered a private message to Iran. We don't know what that message said, but what would you expect Iran to do? How do you expect Iran to respond to what the United States, the U.K. and its supporting countries are doing?

IC: Um, well, officials in Iran have come out yesterday and along with uh, leads in Hezbollah supporting what the Houthi are doing and saying what the U.S. and the U.K. have done now is putting all vessels in the Red Sea at risk and all vessels. Um, you know, shipping vessels are now at risk at sea because of this. Uh, certainly the Houthi very much see this as effectively a declaration of war by America against them and Iran and Hezbollah have been very quick to support the Houthi, uh, and support them in any action, no doubt that they will carry out going forward as well. So, you know, this brings on the concern about escalation, obviously, uh, within the region.

MG: Can you just explain how this is possible? You've been reporting on the Houthi for, as I said, over a decade. It's been two decades since they have been fighting the government in Yemen. How do they have this kind of power? And when did they take over so much of Yemen?

IC: They did originally start as a kind of cliched, ragtag militia. Uh, that's certainly what they were in the early 2000. Uh, they fought six rounds of war with the Yemeni government, then from 2004 up until 2010. Um, but really where they got to taking the capital, Sana'a, they were able to get to that stage in 2014 because former president of Yemen, Ali Abdullah Saleh, who was in power for 30 years. He was ousted during the Arab Spring in 2011, but he was intent on trying to claw back power. So, despite having for all these wars with the Houthi previously, he teamed up with them and their loyalists in the military, and they were able to take the capital, Sana'a. But Saleh was really only able to do that because the U.S. and the international community gave him immunity from prosecution when he stepped down and allowed him to stay in Yemen. So, we're partly responsible for the Houthi being where they are today. And then really, Iran from 2014 onwards have helped them considerably in training, in weapons and capability. All the ballistic missiles and anti-ship cruise missiles they've been using the drones, the ability to hijack a ship in the Red Sea by landing a helicopter on a vessel, they would never have been able to do any of that. Um, 10 years ago. And now they have been become this sophisticated non-state actor, having started very much as a ragtag militia.

MG: The civil war in Yemen has had a catastrophic effect. Hundreds of thousands of people dead. Uh, humanitarian crisis with famine. Uh, cholera, the Houthi have been involved in recruiting child soldiers. And yet how much support is there for the Houthi within Yemen today?

IC: Well, this has been an extraordinary thing because for the Houthi this is very much about, um, supporting the Palestinian cause, trying to target Israel. And now the U.S. that has really rallied support for them, that they are the only actor, as seen in the region, to be standing up for the people of Gaza and supporting the Palestinians. So, in Yemen, internally, it's been quite extraordinary, really. As the population that have been on the anti-Houthi side in the civil war. They are really now rallying around the Houthi and supporting them in this action, at least, even if they don't support them in general over what they're doing in the Red Sea, they are really supporting them. And if you talk to people in South Yemen, which is the anti-Houthi territory, um, they're, even their attitude about these U.S. and U.K. strikes is an attitude of bring it on. This is... being bombed is part of our identity now having been under air strike from the Saudi led coalition for seven years. So, yeah, it's garnered them a huge amount of popularity at home. And they've also been able to recruit many thousands, tens of thousands of fighters as a result of this, in the belief that they will be fighters who will go on to fight, um, Israel. And this is all in support of the Palestinians. So, they've deployed those fighters to the frontlines in the civil war in Yemen, but they have yet to be actually used. And as I mentioned earlier, the kind of, uh, a reigniting of the conflict in Yemen is a huge concern. But yeah, it's hugely popular for the Houthi when they were losing a lot of popularity in the last two years, while the civil war had been quieter. So yes, it's been hugely advantageous to them.

MG: So, if there was a cease fire in Gaza, what would that mean for the Houthi attacks? Would that stop the Houthi attacks? The Houthis have said that the attacks, in part, are a respondent or largely a respondent, or sorry, response to the bombardment of Gaza?

IC: Yes, indeed. I mean, they've said that if there is a cease fire, they would stop. I mean, it's hard always to take the Houthi at their word. Um, they don't have a very good history of keeping their word. But having said that, when we saw the pause in the fighting, uh, at the end of last year, the Houthi did actually stop the attacks in the Red Sea. And certainly, their argument would be that, uh, having a cease fire would stop these attacks and would therefore be a better response than the U.S. carrying out these airstrikes. Uh, and so I think they see it is rather hypocritical, really, that the U.S. would prioritize targeting them over, uh, protecting the civilians in Gaza, which they believe they should be doing. Um, so yeah, I think it's... I mean, the argument and it's probably a valid one is that perhaps the Houthi have backed the U.S. into a corner, uh, about their activities in the Red Sea and attacking vessels. But a better way of dealing with this or another option of dealing with this would have been a ceasefire in Gaza, and then it would have been remained to be seen if the Houthi would then stop those strikes. And that would have been a different thing to deal with if they hadn't done.

MG: What impact have these attacks had on the Israeli and the global economy given the importance of the shipping lane and not just to Israel, but to the rest of the world?

IC: Yeah. So, it's having a huge impact on global shipping, but particularly vessels going from Europe to the Far East and vice versa, and to a lesser extent, the U.S. So, shipping transiting through the Red Sea is down by more than a half since early December last year and year on year, the container ships that normally go through the Red Sea. So, the first week of January this year, compared to the first week of January 2023, container shipping is down by 90 per cent. Freight rates have soared. They're up by up to 400 per cent for vessels shipping from Shanghai into the Mediterranean. Um, and 30 per cent of the vessels that are going to Europe with goods are then going on to East Coast America. So, the impact is on America as well. And so, yeah, there's companies in Europe, uh, Tesla and Volvo are already pausing vehicle production in Europe because of shortage of parts. Um, Tesla have said that they would do that from the end of January 2nd to the 11th of February. And we're expecting, really the effect of all of this to kick in, in supply chain issues in Europe, certainly in the next week or so. And obviously all of those costs that vessels are having to pass on for going this much longer route, that takes at least an extra 10 days to go round South Africa around the Cape of Good Hope when they're avoiding the Red Sea. All of those costs entailed in that which costs, uh, um, a million dollars more to do that route. It will be passed on to consumers. And then you're looking at rising prices, uh, the risk of, uh, of increased inflation. And that's all coming at a time when also it's a year for elections, uh, both for Rishi Sunak, uh, the British prime minister, uh, with the U.K. involved in these strikes and also, of course, for President Biden in the U.S. So, they've got these issues of potential rising inflation coming, um, at their backs really whilst they're going into elections.

MG: We're out of time. But just let me ask you briefly, people have been concerned since the 7th of October about this war spreading it, becoming an escalating conflict. This is an escalation in many ways. What are you most concerned about in watching this?

IC: I think it's the Houthi really do not have a concern about escalation. They are not afraid of escalation. They've always wanted to fight America, and so that even those who see the Houthis as a proxy of Iran, they're not. So, even if Iran wants to try and restrain them, they can't necessarily do that. So, the Houthis are more than happy to escalate this. I think we've already seen the spread, but the concern over escalation, I think the Houthis now, um, have... It's all in their hands and I think it's a particularly dangerous time to see really what happens next with the Houthi, because they have very little to lose. They've been bombed for seven years. They've been sanctioned, they've been repeatedly sanctioned by the U.S. and they've been blockaded. Um, and they've been hugely emboldened by these attacks now by the U.S. and the U.K. So yes, it's an incredibly dangerous time. And obviously, you know, long term, if these strikes go on in the Red Sea, it could have a devastating impact on the world economy in the same way that we saw during the Covid crisis, with the supply chain crisis.

MG: Iona, I'm grateful to talk to you. Thank you very much.

IC: Thank you.

MG: Iona Craig is an independent journalist. She's covered Yemen for a decade. She was in Leicestershire, UK. That's The Current for this Monday the 15th of January. Q is up next on CBC Radio One. We were talking earlier about being "on the lights" and working as a lighthouse keeper. Something beautiful about that idea. Lonely lighthouse standing out by the harbour. You're surrounded by nature. Sounds like I'm daydreaming, doesn't it? I might be, um. We want to send you off with this wonderful image in song. It's our friend William Prince and Lighthouse. I'm Matt Galloway. Thanks for listening to The Current, and we'll see you tomorrow.

[Music: Lighthouse by William Prince]

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Monday January 15, 2024 Full Transcript

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