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The Dose Transcript for October 5, 2023

Host: Brian Goldman

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BRIAN GOLDMAN: Hi, I'm Dr. Brian Goldman. Welcome to The Dose. When work is busy and you feel like there aren't enough hours in the day, it can sometimes be hard to force yourself to stop and take a break. I've certainly been on that treadmill more than once. I'm known far and wide as a bit of a workaholic. I also know that a break can and does help me come back to work feeling refreshed. But it turns out that it's all in how you do it. And so this week, we're asking how can I take an effective break from work? Hi, Katharine. Welcome to The Dose.

KATHARINE COONS: Hi, Brian. Thanks for having me.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: Katharine, do you practice what you preach? Do you take a break?

KATHARINE COONS: I do. I think the pandemic really pushed me to kind of refocus and reprioritize. And I'm really intentional about my breaks. I schedule them into my calendars. I really protect them and advocate for other people. So definitely, I’m practicing what I'm preaching for sure.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: Oh, I'm going to want to hear about that. One of the things that I've noticed working from home a lot is that there's a lot more opportunities to do things which I gather are good, nice distractions that take you away from your work. So I'm going to want to hear about those. But before we begin our discussion, can you give us a hi, my name is? Tell us what you do and where you do it. Just adlib.

KATHARINE COONS: Hi, my name is Katharine Coons. I work at the Canadian Mental Health Association, the National Office. I'm a national senior manager of our Workplace Mental Health Program. So at CMHA National, we have a number of different workplace mental health and wellbeing solutions, and I help to kind of oversee and run those programs.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: Perfect. So what do we know about how to take an effective break from work or study? I know that's a broad question, but start us off. How do we do that?

KATHARINE COONS: You know, I think a lot of the time, we just want to focus on spending that time recovering and recharging, which means very different things to different people. Sometimes, we want to use that break to recover and make ourselves feel calm or relax. So we want to do things that make us feel calm and relaxed. That could be stretching, that could be meditation, that could be having a nap, reading a book or even watching a TV show. Sometimes, we just need that space to just kind of get away from that hustle and bustle and give ourselves some space to kind of breathe. On the other hand, sometimes, we need that break to kind of recharge ourselves. So we might want to spend some time doing something that's a bit more challenging, a bit more of kind of an active break, something that really recharges us. This could be things like, you know, doing a workout, practicing a new skill, doing something social. So, you know, talking to somebody in your household or in your workplace. It could even be experimenting with a new recipe in the kitchen. So there's two different types of breaks, I would say, is the first being that kind of relaxation where you're kind of more Zen and you're doing things to kind of bring yourself to a level of calm, or there's the other type of break that's kind of more active. You're doing things to make yourself feel more recharged and you're feeling much more energized and kind of confident after that break. We both, you know, need both those breaks at different times. So it really depends on what you're feeling in that moment and what you're going to need to feel good on that break.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: Is there a common denominator for the short and long breaks that you're disengaging from whatever work or study that you've been doing?

KATHARINE COONS: Absolutely. I think it's something that you need to be switching out of your normal routine even, you know, for short periods of time. So sometimes, we think the kind of longer breaks, so I’m just going to push through and then I'll take that hour break for lunch or I'm just going to push through my work day and then I'm going to have the night off. But really, we need to be disconnecting and recharging and breaking throughout the day, doing something different from our workday to kind of make ourselves feel recharged. So on our breaks, making sure that we're also not just checking our emails, turning notifications off, doing something that's different to make sure we can come back to our work with kind of a different renewed sense of energy and kind of more creativity to kind of tackle that task that we left before the break.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: So what does research tell us about how a break can affect our mental and physical health to the positive?

KATHARINE COONS: I think on a fundamental level, you know, most people could agree that taking a break from work or from study is going to be a good thing. But there's been loads of research and especially coming out through the pandemic, is that taking breaks increase our ability to be more creative. We're more productive, we're more focussed and we feel less stressed, which ultimately leads to greater job satisfaction. So of course, on an individual level, taking breaks for ourselves is good for our own kind of wellbeing and our own mental health and productivity, but it's also great for the organization. And as organizations, we need to be promoting it and supporting employees to take those breaks throughout the day as well.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: We'll get into that advocacy part of it a little bit later on. But, you know, you've mentioned now this tendency that I have, which is to push through. So what are the damaging effects of pushing through instead of taking that break?

KATHARINE COONS: Yeah, I mean, you're definitely not alone. I think a lot of the times, when we're kind of stuck in a problem or we just want to finish something, we just think, you know, just a couple more hours and I'm just going to get it done. And if I work, you know, I put that time in, then I'll be able to kind of relax later. But as we work and as we don't take breaks, our productivity and our decision making abilities decline. We just naturally fatigue. And we know that. And so it's a marathon, not a sprint. We can't be sprinting throughout the day and just powering through. We're not going to be as productive. So making sure that we are taking those breaks throughout will help us be better employees, be better students, get the job done in a more effective way, in a more efficient way, and actually less time spent doing that task. So it's really kind of reframing our thinking to see that taking breaks and time off isn't necessarily a selfish thing. It doesn't mean you're a bad employee or a bad student. It's investing in your well-being. And when we take care of our well-being, we're better employees, we're more productive employees, we make better decisions, and ultimately, our work is better.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: So you've made the case. Something that is really intriguing about what you have to say and what I've seen from the research is that this doesn't have to be a lengthy break. 10 minutes is enough. So what is it about 10 minutes?

KATHARINE COONS: You know, that's absolutely right. You know, sometimes, again, we think that the longer vacation or if we take a month off or, you know, we're making sure we're taking that hour lunch break, we're going to feel better. But really, the research has shown that the frequency is more important than the duration. So the research has shown that the frequency and duration does vary a little bit on the ideal. But really, you know, every hour to an hour and a half, we really need that ten or 15 minute break. So instead of that kind of one long break or that one long kind of summer holiday, making sure we're scheduling those breaks, you know, fewer but throughout the day more frequently is allowing us to disconnect. And it just gives us that sense of energy. Pulling yourself out of that task for 10 minutes every hour or hour and a half allows us to feel more recharged and again, you know, have a more sustainable approach to our workday as opposed to kind of that one big block of break.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: What are the kinds of things that you can do during that 10 minute break that would constitute a break?

KATHARINE COONS: It'll be different things with different people. You know, it can be things like doing a walk. It can be things like doing a couple chores. If you work from home, making yourself a nice recipe, being active. You could do a workout, you could do some stretching, you could read a book. It really depends on what works for you. And, you know, there's not one kind of golden rule of what the best break is. We just want to make sure that we're disconnecting from our work or from our study. So whatever's accessible to that person in that moment. It will also change day by day. You know, some days, maybe, you know, you really like that walk or you really like that meditation practice, and then some days, you can't even sit still. So it depends on how you're feeling. And, you know, I really encourage people to take that time to kind of brainstorm some ideas and try something new, because some things work for some people and some things make somebody else more stressed. The kind of bottom line is doing something that's engaging our brain in a different way, separate from our work or our study as well.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: Let's look at it from the opposite point of view. Are there any kinds of activities that you should avoid in order for the break to have a good impact and not have a bad one?

KATHARINE COONS: I would say generally, we want to stay off our phones. You know, I think checking the news and social media sometimes can give us that quick kind of dopamine hit, but ultimately, it doesn't leave us feeling recharged. So if we can put our devices down, step away from our phones, avoid kind of doomscrolling on TikTok or Instagram or the news, because that won't leave us feeling recharged. So one of the main things is for sure to kind of stay away from, you know, technology, if you can, and making sure that we're doing something to kind of take care of ourselves or practice some self-care, whatever that means for the individual.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: Got it. If you work at a desk, and a lot of us do, how important is it to go outside if all of the work that you do is indoors?

KATHARINE COONS: Incredibly important. I think especially as the days get shorter, we want to make sure that we are getting outside, getting as much sun as we can. Even if it's for a five minute walk around the block, that can increase and boost your mood. There's lots of research coming out around the mental health benefits of spending time in nature. If you live in a city, that doesn't mean you have to kind of go on a massive hike. That can mean going to the local park, doing something where you're just spending time getting some fresh air. Moving your body in whatever is accessible to you can really, really boost our mood and help kind of alleviate some of that stress that we might be experiencing just kind of staring at a screen.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: I know that some people who work in office settings and indeed at home have switched to standing desks. That's the topic for another day. But the point I'm making is that most of us, a lot of us are going to be sitting for too many hours a day and that that can be detrimental to our health. So how important is it to get up and move around if you have a sedentary job and you're sitting all day?

KATHARINE COONS: Yeah, very important as well. You know, you could stretch, you could stand, you could… if you have any meetings, sometimes, I do actually. If you have any meetings where you don't have to be on camera and you're just kind of listening in, put on some ear pods or some headphones and kind of walk around. You know, do some movement if you just have to listen to a meeting, making sure that we are moving and getting up out of our chairs. Again, programming it into our calendar is an easy way to kind of remind yourself to do that. If you end a meeting early and you're still, you know, you've got that 10 minutes back, get up and move as best you can. Stretch as best you can. Getting up and moving is really, really important for, you know, that break time as well.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: So Katharine, are you telling me that you can have your cake and eat it? You can actually be working by attending a meeting and taking a break at the same time?

KATHARINE COONS: I would say you don't want to necessarily confuse those two things. I think if you can, taking your breaks is separate from working. I would say you don't want to be, you know, classifying being in a meeting and walking as your break. You still need time away from that. But if you can do a bonus break where you are able to kind of walk around or stretch while you're listening to something, then I would recommend doing that. But that's not in replacement of an actual break as well because you are still working. You are still thinking about work. Just that, you know, if you're off camera and you could do a couple of lunges or some stretches, you know, why not? But making sure we still are taking those breaks as well on top of that.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: Forgive me, that was the workaholic in me talking, trying to multitask, finagle a break and work at the same time. I promise to do better. Now, I'm recovering from my first bout of COVID. And it reminds me that people, and it took me a while, it took me weeks to kind of get back to kind of 100% physically. You know, lots of us who are listening to this conversation are recovering from colds and flus. It kind of makes me wonder, should I approach taking breaks differently because I'm recovering from an illness?

KATHARINE COONS: I would say yeah. I think, you know, any sort of, you know, recovery process or return to work process needs to be taken with consideration and care. In general, whether you're off for a longer period of time or even back on vacation or you’re off being sick, is being much more mindful of that transition. So if you have been feeling unwell or you've been taking time off work, making sure you are much more mindful of that so it's not that jarring of a transition, that we're, you know, taking care of our well-being and taking care of our mental health as we kind of go back in to that typical routine. Otherwise, you might just kind of fall back into that cycle and need to take time off again.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: We're asking this question this week about breaks because so many of us, so many Canadians don't take the breaks that they are permitted to take. Do we have any sense of how pervasive that is, the push through mentality?

KATHARINE COONS: Yes, for sure. You know, there are a lot of folks who aren't taking breaks throughout the workday. They're not taking their full paid time off. You know, a recent study showed that more than one third of employees occasionally, rarely or never take their lunch breaks. And add to that, you know, more than 80% of workers do some work while they're on their vacation. So for sure, it's prevalent. You know, it's people are kind of doing that push through mentality. Sometimes, it's fueled by heavy workloads or, you know, a desire to kind of keep that momentum going. This kind of maybe older school thinking mentality of just pushing through is better for us. You're trying to meet a deadline. Sometimes, folks are also scared that they might be looked down upon if they're taking too many breaks or more breaks than their colleagues. So it's, you know, there's a number of reasons that kind of lead to that. So not only do we need to be taking our breaks throughout our workday, we really need to be setting those boundaries on our paid time off, on our nights, on our weekends, to not be continuing to kind of check our email as much we can. If you don't have to be available 24 seven, then don't. We need to disconnect. Otherwise, we're not able to recharge in the same way as if we were trying to work through our time off and our breaks.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: How much of a stigma exists surrounding taking breaks out there in your average workplace?

KATHARINE COONS: You know, I think it still exists. I think there's a lot of, you know, responsibility on the organization and on leadership to demonstrate and kind of change that mentality. I would say there's been a shift in thinking around taking care of your mental health and well-being throughout the workday as a result of the pandemic. But of course, it's still there. You know, the research shows it. People aren't taking their full breaks or they're rarely taking lunch breaks or working through lunch. So I think it depends on the organization, It depends on the industry, it depends on the location of the organization, but it still exists. So we all, you know, play a role in changing that mentality and changing that stigma. And of course, it starts with leadership in organizations. But, you know, it can also be changed through kind of culturally in an organization from colleague to colleague as well.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: I want to ask you about the serious side of this subject. What's the health risk on an ongoing basis or a chronic basis of not taking enough or even any breaks throughout your work day? This is a serious topic, isn't it?

KATHARINE COONS: It absolutely is. You know, I think it's not sustainable for people. Maybe we can push through for a week. We have a really tough deadline and we can just, you know, we have to just do it every so often. But if we are repeatedly not taking our breaks, not taking our paid time off, and we are under an immense amount of stress and aren't able to kind of recharge or disconnect or recover, it will ultimately lead to burnout, which, you know, is a very serious thing. And I think if we're not taking care of our mental health, if we're not taking care of ourselves, we're not taking those breaks, it is not sustainable for anybody. There will come a point for most people that will kind of hit a breaking point and will have knock on effects. So it's easier to kind of, you know, treat mental health challenges or intervene earlier and, you know, spend some time taking care of your mental health on a long term scale as opposed to kind of treating it down the line when maybe you hit that level of kind of burnout or you need that kind of care because you haven't been able to take your breaks throughout the, you know, the past couple of months. That being said, the responsibility is largely on the organization and on managers and leaders to kind of lead the way and set the tone. You know, we can only do so much to take care of ourselves. If our workplace isn’t a positive workplace, if we're not taking care of psychological health and well-being, that's also a recipe for disaster. So as individuals, we need to be taking care of ourselves. We need to be taking those breaks to avoid some of those kind of worst case scenarios. But as organizations and as leadership and managers, we need to be setting the tone. We need to make people feel like it's okay, they can bring their whole selves to work, and that it's okay to take that time off and those breaks as well.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: So what is your advice to managers?

KATHARINE COONS: You know, I would say lead by example, first and foremost. I think if an employee sees their manager taking the time off and disconnecting and taking their lunch break or taking their breaks throughout the day, they're not accessible on their vacation or their paid time off, that really shows a message to an employee that it's okay for them to do that themselves as well. So first and foremost, we want to lead by example. I think it's the way we talk about mental health in the workplace is the way that we support our employees and encourage our employees to take those breaks. As much as we can, we want to lead by example. We want to make people feel comfortable. Support them on their time off, make sure that, you know, as managers, we're not trying to contact our employees when they are on their time off or if they've said they're on their break. We're not trying to access them during their own time off is respecting those boundaries. So leading by example, you know, supporting your employees to kind of promote that time off, and then also making sure that we are protecting their boundaries and setting our own boundaries as well.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: So that's your advice for managers. What about employees?

KATHARINE COONS: I think sometimes, if we're kind of that one third of the population where we're rarely taking our breaks, it can feel a bit overwhelming to think about how do I fix, you know, how do I integrate that into my workday? But they are really small changes. There are little kind of things we can integrate throughout our workday. This might mean actually putting in your calendar every hour and a half, a 10 minute break. It might mean reconsidering how long we are meeting for. You know, if we have an hour meeting, can that be done in 45 minutes? And can I use that last 15 minutes to take my break? So really just rethinking about how we're spending our workday and actually programming it into your calendar and protecting that time. You know, you want to make sure that you're programming that time for when it makes the most sense for you. So sometimes, it can be when you've completed a task, between meetings, making sure that we're not on back to back Zoom calls or Teams calls or whatever it may be, to give yourself that space to recharge and reenergize, doing something on that break that makes you feel recovered and energized. If you're feeling a bit overwhelmed about where to even start or what you should be doing on your break, take some time to brainstorm. Before you go on that break, write down five things that you might enjoy for doing 15 minutes a day. And then when you go to that break, look at that list and try something new. You just got to keep trying something to figure out what works best for you.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: Last question I'm going to ask you. We've been talking about short breaks. How do you know that you might need a longer break and you've reached that point at which a short break or a series of short breaks may not do the trick?

KATHARINE COONS: If you're feeling completely exhausted, you're feeling completely overwhelmed, you're feeling like things are unmanageable for you, that's when I would consider talking to your manager. That being said, I would always kind of consider and suggest talking to managers and your HR team or whoever you know you have that relationship within your workplace or in your studies with about how things are going all the time. We always kind of say that, you know, we shouldn't just be talking about mental health or feelings of exhaustion or burnout when somebody has reached those levels. We want to make sure we're checking in with ourselves throughout the week, throughout the month, so that we're able to kind of understand what's actually happening. We don't realize how stressed out we are or how burnt out we might be until we really reach those kind of severe, more clinical levels. So we want to make sure that we're checking in with ourselves routinely, we're checking in as a team or understanding what's going on so that we don't have to always reach that point when we kind of all of a sudden realize, oh wait, I'm really not doing well, I need help. But I would say, you know, I think everybody can use a bit of help sometimes too. So if you're generally feeling overwhelmed or you’re generally feeling like you're not able to kind of get the things done that you need to be getting done or you're feeling overworked, start to have that conversation sooner than later. It starts with kind of checking in with yourself, understanding how you're doing on a daily basis, to kind of access that care when you might need it, to kind of avoid having to take those maybe longer periods of time off down the road if you aren't able to kind of intervene earlier on.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: So some short breaks now might save you the need for a longer break later on. Katharine Coons, thank you so much for sharing tips on how to take effective breaks and for coming on to The Dose.

KATHARINE COONS: Thanks for having me, Brian.

BRIAN GOLDMAN: Katharine Coons is a national senior manager at the Canadian Mental Health Association. She oversees the organization's workplace mental health program. Here's your dose of smart advice. There's growing scientific evidence that regular breaks make you more productive than powering through without stopping. Effective breaks reduce stress levels and enable you to resume work quickly. Taking breaks while studying actually improves memory and recall. If you don't normally take breaks, start small by taking a 10 minute break every two hours. What you do during a break is less important than how often you take them. Do something that takes your mind off work. Walk. Stretch. Read a few pages of a book. Look at nature or chat with a co-worker about non-work stuff. It need not be ambitious. Just getting up and moving around can be quite effective. If you work from home, do a load of laundry, walk the dog or put out the recycling and the garbage. During breaks, stay off electronic devices and social media. Breaks work best when you incorporate them into your daily routine by scheduling them into your work calendar and by creating visual reminders like placing your walking shoes by the door. Managers and employees should model good behaviour by taking a lot of breaks. Avoid back to back meetings. Making short breaks a regular part of your day can help prevent burnout or feeling overwhelmed. If you have topics you'd like discussed or questions answered, our email address is thedose@cbc.ca. If you like this episode, please give us a rating and review wherever you listen. This edition of The Dose was produced by Isabelle Gallant. Our senior producer is Colleen Ross. The Dose wants you to be better informed about your health. If you're looking for medical advice, see your health care provider. I'm Dr. Brian Goldman. Until your next dose.

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How can I take an effective break from work? - Transcript

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