Anastasia: Here's the first thing you need to know about Summer Mcintosh. She is not very interested in talking about her many, many wins on the world stage. The youngest Olympian on the Canadian team in Tokyo, the youngest swimming world champion in decades…ranked third best swimmer in the world at the age of just 16...

I am delighted to say that Summer is as nice and normal a high schooler as you'll ever meet… and her not- so secret formula? Good old- fashioned hard work.

Summer, you're in Florida right now. Unfortunately, horrific news coming from all the hurricane destruction. What do you see outside your window right now? How's it been for you?

Summer McIntosh: Yes, in my area, we got pretty lucky. It wasn't hit as bad as it was projected to. But I know that there are a lot of the swimmers on deck are still helping clean up around because there is some damage, but it's mostly just trees falling down. But we're I think as communities, we're ll working together to make sure it's all cleaned up. But we got pretty lucky with compared to some other areas in Florida.

Anastasia: Gosh, that is scary. Do you train down in Florida a lot?

Summer McIntosh: Yeah, I'm full time here now. I go back to Canada as much as I can to visit family and things like that. But I am training in Florida right now and I have been for about a month or so.

Anastasia: Last time I saw you, we were in the mix zone for Commonwealth Games. When we talked last you were like, "I'm so ready for off season." How did it go? What did you get up to?

Summer McIntosh: Yeah, it was great to have some time out with swimming, just to hang out with my friends and chillax and rest. I was basically at my cottage the entire two weeks that I had off and just chilled and had fun with my friends and just kind of rested and rejuvenated for the next season.

Anastasia: Two weeks doesn't seem like a long time though. To me? I want a month.

Summer McIntosh: Yeah, two weeks actually out of the water can feel like a lot just because we're in the water so much during the season. And just to have a full two weeks of no exercise, no nothing, no swimming is really nice. And I feel like that's the perfect amount for me to take off every year. So I know some people take off even less, some people take off a lot more, but for me it's what works. So yeah, it was definitely a nice time off.

Anastasia: But if you're playing in the water, you have to be swimming a little bit. I mean, I creeped your gram! Were you in the water a lot?

Summer McIntosh: Yeah, well, I was in my lake a lot with my friends. Sometimes we would like fake race and stuff, but nothing serious or anything like that. I was more just for fun.

Anastasia: When your friends fake race you, do you allow them to win or No..

Summer McIntosh: No. I actually was trying to beat some of my guy friends and they still beat me.

Anastasia: oooh brutal! A little birdie told me that you're a big fan of the Kardashians. Is that true?

Summer McIntosh: Yeah, I followed them for a while. I don't know what it is that just, amazes me about them. I just think I really liked their show when I was quite little and just what they've been able to achieve off of like where they started is pretty interesting to me. So I've always kind of followed their show and now their new show.

Anastasia: Do you have like all of Kylie's skincare products or what?

Summer McIntosh: I have a lot of Kim's perfumes, and I had a few of her makeup products as well. But she's redoing the brand right now, so I don't have the new stuff yet because it hasn't come out. But I do have a few of these products as well. Yeah.

Anastasia: Who's your favourite Kardashian?

Summer McIntosh: I'd probably just say Kim. She's like the OG.

Anastasia: The OG. I like Kris. I like Kris Jenner because she's like the mastermind behind it all. But just what she's been able to do. Yeah.

[music]

So yeah, you're back in school. Are you physically back in school or are you doing online?

Summer McIntosh: Yeah. So I've been online since the start of COVID because everyone kind of was online for a bit there. But then I continued to stay online and it's just gives me a lot more freedom with training and things like that. So I'm really grateful that I have that balance and I can really do school at my own pace and take my time with it and not feel like I'm like cramming to go to morning practise and then go straight to school and then right back to practise. So it's been really nice to have some more rest time.

Anastasia: Are you starting to think about what you might want to do after high school?

Summer McIntosh: Yeah, I haven't given it much thought to be honest, because I feel like I'm still in grade 11. Like I am quite young and I have a lot of time to figure it out, kind of those kind of things out. So right now I'm just focussing on getting good grades and finishing my assignments on time and things like that.

Anastasia: The most interesting people that I know still don't know what they want to do, so no stress with that. How do you balance, though, being Summer McIntosh the swimmer with just being Summer? Has that been tough? Are your friends just chill with everything.

Summer McIntosh: Yeah. I think I maybe from the outsider looking in, it would look different. Like I remember when I was a little kid, like, how do people, like, deal with all that? With swimming and things like that. But honestly, it's nothing's really changed from inside. Like my day to day life is the exact same, and I think it'll continue to be that way. But when it comes to when I'm at competitions and meets, that's where it can get a little bit harder to deal with because there's a lot of media and things like that and there's just… you're constantly under videos and that's when you're competing, that's when you're going to get the most exposure. So that's when you have to really kind of tune out the rest of the world and just focus on your competition. But that's probably the hardest it's been. But mastering that is a really important skill to have once you get to the top level.

Anastasia: Oh, 100%. Not to give you too many compliments, but when we were chatting at Commonwealth Games, I thought Wow, you very eloquent. You're very good with the media. I think back, you know, even when I started thinking I was so mature at 22 and let me tell you, you're more mature at 15 than I ever was at 22.

What I love about Gen Z is that you guys seem to be obsessed with the nineties. It's all come back. And you know, I obviously grew up in the nineties. I got to warn you that those big pants, they do get really crusty with salt in the winter. Have you experienced that yet? You know this?

Summer McIntosh: No, I haven't, actually.

Anastasia: That's why everyone my age wears skinny jeans. But that's just my little wisdom I'll pass on. Yeah.

[music]

When you get nostalgic for the good old days, what does that timeframe look like for you?

Summer McIntosh: It's probably around when I first started swimming. That time period was like a very magical experience for me. So I really found, like, Something I'm really passionate about in life. And I always think back to the earliest swimming memories and my first festivals, or my first time that I got a cup for festivals and things like that, and first time I got my first medal or ribbon and things like that. It's mostly a lot of my childhood was based around swimming and that was some of my core memories from it.

Anastasia: When did you think, Hey, I actually want to go to the Olympics? Do you remember when that was?

Summer McIntosh: I think since I started swimming, it's always been a big dream. I didn't think I would ever actually achieve it. I thought maybe one day, but I didn't even know, what steps you had to take to get there. But I'd say when dreams became more of a reality and it was an actual goal to achieve with the next couple of years was when I was around 13. That was supposed to be an Olympic year, but due to COVID, it was pushed back. But that's when I really sat down with my coach and was like, I think I will be able to do this. I know it's a long shot, but I think I need to just push myself as hard I can every day and see where that takes me. So, think since I was around 13.

Anastasia: So how did 2016 sit with you then? Because that really was such a pivotal moment for swimming in Canada. What did it feel like to watch Penny Oleksiak, did that start any daydreams or big dreams?

Summer McIntosh: Yeah, for sure. Around that time I remember I was actually on deck when she made the big team and when everyone was nominated because my mom was a part of the alumni, so I was able to high five everyone and things like that. And that was a really cool moment for me and I never thought that four years or five years later that I would be on that same Olympic team. So yeah, that was a moment for Canadian swimming. There are so many new people coming up and that are continuing the momentum heading into the next Olympics.

Anastasia: How was it to be her team-mate in 2020, 2021?

Summer McIntosh: I've always looked up to her when I was a little kid. I think she was some of the main people in Canada's hero when it came to swimming. So to be on the same team as her was really cool experience.

Anastasia: Has she given you any big sisterly advice?

Summer McIntosh: I think like everyone on the team has given me some sort of advice and I really appreciate that in one way or another. And she does too, because she's obviously been to the Olympics before and she's a lot more experienced than I have been. And she was just always really kind to me. And I think everyone, just as a swimming team-mates, you just have to lean on each other in those moments if you're overwhelmed or things like that, because they can we can keep each other grounded.

Anastasia: So you came fourth in Tokyo in the 400 free.

CBC Sports sound up from Tokyo Olympics> Summer Mackintosh is in a battle for Bronze. She might have slipped a little bit in the fourth…. Ten metres to go. Ariarne Titmuss from Australia is going to take that gold. Ledecky silver… Canadian mackintosh is trying to get there. She is just behind the chines swimmer. what a race. The Canadian record again for Summer Mackintosh.

Anastasia: What did your conversation with your coach sound like after that first Olympic experience?

Summer McIntosh: Honestly, I don't really remember much from it. I don't even really remember the race. So to remember the talk afterwards. I think she probably just said good job to me and like go warm down cause I had more races to go after that. But overall I was really happy with the result. it still hasn't sunk in that I came fourth, I was top four in the world and to see how far I've come from that is also really exciting and motivating.

I think after missing the podium that just made me more motivated heading into the next season to push even harder to see if I can get on the podium at a big meet like that again. So yeah, it was a very motivating experience, but I never thought in my wildest dreams that I would even make a final. So to come fourth was a big achievement for me.

CBC Sports sound up from Tokyo Olympics> A year ago, only people in the swimming circles like Byron McDonald had ever heard of Summer Mackintosh. But now she is making noise in the pool and we'll see her in a moment.

Anastasia: How was your first Olympic experience? You were only 14. Again, I don't mean to bring it back to myself, but I think about Vancouver. I was 20 years old there and I was overwhelmed. How did you feel?

Summer McIntosh: Honestly, I don't think I was that overwhelmed. That was my first big competition when it had like a village and things like that. And I think that since I was surrounded by so many people that have done it before in one way or another, that I was just I kind of knew what I was doing. I kind of tried to use their experiences to understand what I should be doing as well. And I had a lot of people surrounding me that just knew what to do and how to keep me grounded and how to keep me recovering properly and how to deal with all the outside and just kind of block that out. So I was not as overwhelmed as I thought it would be.

I didn't really know what to expect going into it, but overall I was really happy with how I managed my emotions because that's one of the main things that I don't think people realise is you have to deal with a lot of things that are going on mentally. So to be able to turn that on and off when it comes to race day, you want to have as much emotion as possible. When you're trying to sleep in between races, you want to have no emotion, you just want to be able to be very on task. So it's definitely a balancing act that I continue to try to improve on every time I go to a big meet because it is a lot to deal with.

Anastasia: What was the most surprising aspect of the Olympics for you?

Summer McIntosh: I just think the village was like, so cool. I don't really know what other villages looked like, but that one was amazing. And Tokyo with their self automated, driving cars around the village. And then the gift shop was obviously great. And then the dining hall there is like three dining halls. The main one was huge and it was great food that was really accommodating to everyone all around the world. They had all different kinds of cuisines there. Just, just see the whole village. And to see people from literally all over the world come together for sports is just something that's really cool to me.

Anastasia: Self-driving cars. Do you have your driver's licence?

Summer McIntosh: No, actually. So when I turned 16 on August 18, I left for Florida the next day, so I wasn't able to get mine. So I'm working on that. Hopefully I can get it soon when I go back, but I really want to get my driver's licence.

Anastasia: Did you at least visualise in these self-driving cars: this is my future baby.

Summer McIntosh: Yeah, they were pretty slow just because I get to be super careful, obviously. But yeah, I definitely am really excited for when I can drive around and just be really nice to have more freedom and just kind of because I've always dreamed about driving since I was a little girl.

Anastasia: So do you think you'll have road rage? Let me tell you, a lot of people in Toronto honk. I'm from Calgary. I'm like, oh my, everyone honks here.

Summer McIntosh: Yeah, I feel like I'm going to be very nervous my first couple times when I'm driving on my own because I feel like I'll forget everything that I was learning. So I'm probably going to be like the slower one. I'm probably going to be the one that's going to hear that, to be honest.

Anastasia: Yeah. Anyone that made you super star struck in the village?

Summer McIntosh: Since there was still COVID was really prominent during that time. No one, wasn really able to, like, hang out together as much as maybe they were able to. Like, I didn't really even see any other Canadian athletes other than just the swimmers, so I don't really get to interact with anyone.

But obviously when I was at the swimming pool to see all of like Caleb Dressel and all those really top swimmers, they're from all over the world and idols that I've looked up to for so long and watched from previous Olympics, that was really cool to see in real life. I didn't really get to talk to any of them or see them like up close or anything. I just saw them from afar, but just to see how they conduct themselves was really inspiring for me to do the same.

Anastasia: How about Cody Simpson? I was even..Oh my gosh, there he is right there.

Summer McIntosh: Yeah, I saw him a few times at Commonwealth Games. It was it's crazy to me that like he's like he does it all basically. And to know that he does swimming and he has the same passion that we all share. It was really cool to see him on deck. I didn't get to talk to him, but I should have.

Anastasia: Oh, my gosh. Yeah, that should be. That should be one of your goals for next season?

Summer McIntosh: Yeah. My friends, before I went to Commonwealth were asking me like, you have to talk to him,you have to get my his autograph for me. And I was like….

Anastasia: No, no, you can't. Your sister, Brooke, is also an athlete. She's a figure skater. Very good figure skater. You also figure skated. What is it about your personality that drew you to racing?

Summer McIntosh: I think I obviously did figure skating as well. And I really liked it, but I just didn't I didn't have the same passion as for the swimming. And what I really like about swimming is it's all just about the stopwatch. It's all very clean cut and you get the time and if you do have the fastest time, then you win. If you touch the wall first, you win. And that's what I really liked about it rather than something like figure skating. There's a lot more aspects when it comes to judges and things like that, like you don't go a certain time, you have to get a certain point score. And although I really like to watch the sport, I just don't like to do it myself because I feel like I just like a lot more like the simple aspect when it comes to swimming.

Anastasia: Now you're speaking to a speed skater. So, Amen. Were you pairs or singles?

Summer McIntosh: I was singles, but I did also did a little bit of dance. But I was very, very young, like I was seven or eight, so I didn't really get into any major competitions or anything like that.

Anastasia: You're a big fan of Tessa and Scott, though?

Summer McIntosh: Yes. And I remember watching their show so many times over and over again when it first came out. I was obsessed with them.

Anastasia: Well, I don't know Cody Simpson, but I do know them. So if you want, I can get their autograph for you.[laughs] But what role does Brooke play in your life? It's pretty special, special bond that you're both high performance athletes.

Summer McIntosh: From a very young age, we both have been super competitive and just been able to kind of motivate each other to do better as well. And I think we hold an extra strong bond because we're both high performance athletes and we really understand where each other's coming from. And on competition day, we always try to make sure if we're even halfway across the world to text each other and say good luck. And I think that's what's really special about the two of us.

Anastasia: Your mom, Jill's also an Olympian in swimming. How did that shape you? Did she does she give you advice all the time or is she hands off? Like, what's that like?

Summer McIntosh: Yeah. I remember from a very young age, I didn't really I understood the how special it is to be an Olympian and to look back. And like I remember watching her race the 200m fly at the 1984 Olympics and like, oh my God, that was so long ago.

But it kind of inspired me like, she can she can do it, then I can do it, too. And she's an amazing mother. And she gives me so much and she gives up so much for me to be able to do what I do. And she just really understands where I'm coming from, just like Brooke, because she's been there too and she knows hard days and things like that.

Anastasia: What's the big competition in Toronto this October or November?

Summer McIntosh: World Cup.

Anastasia: I think that there's a World Cup for you in Toronto and I think Skate Canada is the same weekend. How are your parents going to see both of you compete? That's my question. You're going to have to go out on the road on tobacco.

Summer McIntosh: Yeah, that's funny. I didn't know about that.

Anastasia: Yeah, unfortunate scheduling, but a good problem to have. What is her outlook, an approach to sport that you have adopted?

Summer McIntosh: I just think she's an incredibly hard worker. She just knows how to put in the work get her head down and just kind of really just continue momentum from each day. She is so hyper focussed on all her smaller skills and things that she can work on. So I kind of adopted that from her even when I was still in skating. She's always been such a big inspiration to me and she's also very naturally talented. But she also, most of her results come from how hard she's worked for them, and that's always been really inspiring to me to do the same.

Anastasia: What does that look like for you?

Summer McIntosh: So I had practise this morning at four in the morning and we had a really early swim and then I had a really long nap and I'll probably do some school now and then I head back to practise later around 3:00 .

Anastasia: 4 am! That's why I'll never make it as a swimmer. My mother was a lifeguard once upon a time, and she was like, Honey, just don't go in the water. I'm useless. I cannot float to save my life. But four am. does that ever get easier?

Summer McIntosh: I actually think it's so early that, like, you can't even really think about what's going on. You're very delusional at that time, so you just kind of get through it. But as long as I have the nap, I'm totally fine afterwards.

Anastasia: You must feel like physically sick at 4 a.m.. I know I would.

Summer McIntosh: Yeah, I actually get pretty awake. I feel like you just have to get up out of your bed. Act like it's like ten, even though it's four in the morning.

Anastasia: Okay, I'll think about that the next time I have an early morning flight. This is what Summer does. Go, go do practise and then go watch some Kardashians, my friend.

Summer McIntosh: I'll do that. Thank you so much.

Anastasia: Cheers.

Summer McIntosh: Bye!.

[music]

Summer McIntosh connected with us from her training base in Florida … Craig Austen recorded our chat in the CBC sports digital studio in Toronto.

There's a video of this on youtube too.

Players Own Voice podcast is a cbc sports production.

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Social media? Hashtag players own voice... and I'm Anastasure.

Olivia Pasquarelli edits our audio. David Giddens is our producer.

Thanks for listening.