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The AIH Transcript for March 17, 2021

Hosts: Carol Off and Chris Howden

Prologue

CAROL OFF: Hello, I'm Carol Off.

CHRIS HOWDEN: Good evening, I'm Chris Howden. This is As It Happens.

[Music: Theme]

CH: Tonight:

CO: Pain and progress. As we continue our series on the war in Syria, 10 years on. A woman who fled the country with her young family reflects on grief, growth and gratitude. And her new life in St. John, New Brunswick.

CH: The defenceless and the indefensible. A gunman targets three spas in the Atlanta area, killing eight people, including six Asian women. A Vietnamese American politician in Georgia tells us what she's doing to support the victims' families.

CO: Questioning authorities. As U.S. senators debate whether to protect LGBTQ people under the Equality Act. A 16 year old trans teen asks why she should even have to worry about her rights being protected.

CH: Short of shocked. It may have taken the resignation of an elite officer for Canada's military to realise it has a problem with sexual misconduct. But our guest says it's no surprise to her or the thousands who joined her class action suit.

CO: Daydream Believer. A new study of people's brains finds they don't just identify with fictional characters. They connect so deeply that they almost think they are those characters.

CH: And many happy returns and one that's really been stressing her out. After being wracked with guilt for decades, a Wisconsin woman finally returns a library book that's 63 years overdue. As It Happens, the Wednesday edition. Radio that's glad she didn't keep that shameful secret to her-shelf.

[Music: Theme]

Part 1: She survived the Syrian war, came to Canada, then taught herself English at Tim Hortons

Syria 10 Years: Refugee

Guest: Reham Abazid

CH: When Syrian authorities fired bullets, protesters ran for cover, when they dropped bombs, civilians hid. It didn't take long before there was no safe place to hide. Getting out of Syria was the only option. As you've been hearing this week, As It Happens, is marking 10 years since the Arab Spring arrived in Syria. The ensuing war sparked the largest exodus of refugees since the Second World War. As we heard many times, Syrians risked it all to get to Europe.

FEMALE VOICE: On the morning, we went down to the harbour where sometimes we support rescues. And there was boat after boat of people who had been sunken in the sea, who were freezing, who were cold, who were sick, and people came off the first boat and there were children who were, one child had died. One child was gravely ill. And that was the start of the day of the constant, constant stream of people who got into trouble trying to make this journey.

MALE VOICE: The conditions there are not even terrible, but I would call it insane. It's absolutely inhuman how the people are treated there. They are starving, they are freezing, children not having shoes, running around on muddy soil and sleeping on muddy soil with 10 degrees outside. No shelter, no roof, no tents.

CH: From the Mediterranean Sea to the Hungarian border. Those are just some of the voices we heard during Syria's refugee crisis. People here began to wonder what Canada was doing to help. You may remember a testy interview in 2014 with then Immigration Minister Chris Alexander. Carol pressed him about how many Syrians had actually landed in Canada. The answers and the eventual hang up didn't clear things up.

CO: How many of the 1150 refugees have you brought to Canada? How many? What's the number?

CHRIS ALEXANDER: 1150 refugees are in Canada, were on their way here. A much larger number have applied and have applications in process.

CO: OK, but [Carol is interrupted] But you must tell me, please, before you go, how many of the 200 government sponsored refugees that you committed, have been brought to Canada are here in Canada now?

CA: We have referrals for well over that number.

CO: How many of the 200 sponsored refugees have you brought to Canada?

CA: Why is that the only question that interests you?

CO: Because you won't answer it, because you're not going to tell me how many you brought to Canada.

CA: I'll phone you back and talk to you more about it but i find your line of questioning...

CO: No, no. Would you just please call us back and tell us how many of these 1150 refugees are in Canada?

CH: Fast forward to September 2015, the moment everything changed, it was the middle of a federal election campaign in Canada, and one photograph made its way around the world. A photo of the body of a young Syrian boy washed up on a beach in Turkey. His name was Alan Kurdi. And as his aunt, Tima Kurdi told reporters from Coquitlam, B.C., his family wanted to come to Canada.

TIMA KURDI: They didn't deserve to die. They didn't. They were going for a better life. To be honest, I don't want to just blame the Canadian government and blame the whole world for this, not helping enough the refugees. It's a wake up call. My brother said to me, it's my kids. It has to be the wake up call for the whole world. And he said to me, my message to the world, please help those people crossing that water.

MALE VOICE: Prime Minister, something happened yesterday in the hearts of people around the world when they saw that picture. In the context of looking in that photo, is it really enough for Canada to say we're doing our part?

STEPHEN HARPER: We had the same reaction, Laureen and I, as everybody else. When we see the photo. It's heart wrenching. It brings you right to your own family. Our view has been that on refugees, we should do what we're doing and we need to do more. And I've announced that.

JUSTIN TRUDEAU: This is a wonderful night where we get to show not just a planeload of new Canadians what Canada's all about, but we get to show the world how to open our hearts and welcome in people who are fleeing extraordinarily difficult situations. Tonight, they step off the plane as refugees, but they walk out of this terminal as permanent residents of Canada.

CH: You just heard the voices of Tima Kurdi, then Prime Minister Stephen Harper, and Prime Minister Justin Trudeau at Toronto's International Airport, months after his party won the federal election and committed to bringing in 50,000 Syrians. Reham Abazid and her family arrived on one of those planes as government sponsored refugees. Mrs. Abazid Her husband and her three children ended up settling in St. John, New Brunswick. That's where we reached her. And, a warning parts of Mrs. Abazid's Story contain graphic details.

CO: Reham, what memories come back to you when you hear the prime minister Trudeau welcoming Syrian refugees to Canada?

REHAM ABAZID: It reminds me, absolutely, when the United Nation choose my family to travel to this amazing country, you know, I will never forget this moment when I was jumping beside my husband, when they were talking to him, like, if you would like to have this chance, it's open for you if you would like to go to Canada. I was jumping beside him and said, like, yes, say yes. He said, like, we don't have anyone there. We don't speak the language. I don't care. Like, it's a very bright future. That's what I know. Like, let's do it.

CO: And you did.

RA: Oh, yeah, I did. I did.

CO: Could you have imagined back in March 2011, 10 years ago when you were living in Syria, that you would be living in St. John, New Brunswick?

RA: Never, never. Like, you know, I, I have never think about to leave my city, not my country. But, you know, sometimes lots of different circumstances take you away from many, many things you love.

CO: Your husband, you said, was saying at the time, we don't know anybody there. How can we go there? How difficult were the early days and months when you did arrive in Canada? What were the hardest parts for you and your family?

RA: That was the language more than, we don't have anyone. The language was the big step for us because when we arrived, we doesn't speak any English except like, thank you, you know. And yeah.

CO: But your English is great. Now, how did you manage it?

RA: Like me and my husband, both of us. We decided not to stay on like social assistance, never. And we decided to find a job and work because, like, Canada gave us a chance to have a better future than many, many millions of people. And we need to build a future for our kids also to like to help other people. We improve our English by volunteering, attending English classes. And for myself, I used to stay in Tim Hortons for three hours every day.

CO: Tim Hortons, what were you getting in Tim Hortons besides coffee and doughnuts?

RA: You know, it's a very popular place in Canada. And I know, like, they love to talk and always like I used to have my pen and a sheet of paper and write that the word. They repeat many times I have to write it in Arabic and when I get home, I have to use Google Translate to say this word and know the meaning and how I can write the English that's how.

CO: It can be some pretty bad words spoken in Tim Hortons.

RA: [laughter] I know.

CO: what vocabulary did you pick up there?

RA: You know, Canadians. They are so famous and like say sorry and apologise. Thank you. They are... love to talk about whether too.

CO: So true, you've nailed us. And so you said you spend three hours a day picking up language in Tim Hortons. And so it was helpful then?

RA: Oh, it was very helpful because when you are with the community, you learn many things. You know.

CO: You did find work, you and your husband, how important was that for you?

RA: Oh, it's very important because we improve our English more than other people and more doors were open for us. We need a job too, you know, and we felt very welcoming because when we arrived the first like, couple of months, St. Johner's, let's say they saw us at the Tim Horton's staying in the table. They are offering a free coffee and that's like feels more welcoming, you know, and that's lovely.

CO: But it was important for you to get work that you were passionate about. Did that happen?

RA: Oh, yes. Through my one of my friends had that he finds a job for my husband. My husband's a mechanic and he's working with Ford. And I found a job through the YMCA of Greater St. John. That's where I used to learn English. And I used to be volunteering with them for one year before I started work.

CO: And did you feel that the St. Johner's have embraced you and your family?

RA: Oh, yeah, absolutely. Yes. Yes, they opened their arms and their hearts for us. So much like I appreciate each one of them, you know, like I wish if I can give them anything they need, you know, they are so sweet.

CO: You came with two children. You had another one while you were in Canada. You're Canadian, baby, and how have they fared?

RA: Oh, you know, when we left Syria, when we left sorry, Jordan, we left the rest of the family still there. And it's very important for them to have somebody to take care or to say like grammy to anyone. And they found that here. And I'm so thankful for a couple of my friends who opened their heart for them. They are in a good school. They are learning English and French. They are settling so good, like more than me, to be honest. You know, like they don't kids is very important. But at the same time, they don't care about many, many things. They are always taking care of their snacks, that's their life, and they are so happy here.

CO: You are listening to As It Happens. And today I'm speaking with Reham Abazid. She is a refugee. She is a Saint Johner. She lives in St. John, New Brunswick. She is reflecting, we are reflecting on 10 years since the Arab Spring reached Syria and sparked the exodus of six million people. A third of the population left their country.

CO: Reham, 10 years ago. Your home was Daraa, Syria, where the first protests we covered the story for the first time out of Daraa when these young people wrote graffiti on the wall criticising the regime. Did you feel the spirit of revolution? Did you get caught up in that?

RA: Oh, yes, because the first thing happening in Daraa, it's my city. And I was so close to them when the kids, a couple of them, they are from my family and their cousin to my sister's husband. That was terrible. Terrible because they are kids in the end, you know, and it was crazy and like, unacceptable,.

CO: Unacceptable, because the reaction on the part of the regime of Bashir al Assad was to crush that revolution.

RA: Oh, yeah. Like they bombed and they abused people a lot, especially these kids. Like, I saw one kid in Jordan when I used to be there. I met one of them. But he is in a very bad situation. Like if the door is knocked, he will screaming and scared so much his injuries and his face or his legs, it's still there. It's crazy. Like, I can't find any words to explain this, this little one.

CO: People were arrested. They disappeared. They were tortured to death. They were bombed, barrel bombed, chemical bombs in January of 2013. You went back home to the neighbourhood you'd left in order to get some things. You were pregnant with twins. What happened?

RA: Yeah, I went there like I used to sleep with my family in a different house than ours because our area was so dangerous, especially at night. We received lots of bombs. We used to sleep over in somebody's house. He gave it to us for free. And around five thirty in the morning, my husband received a call from his cousins. It says, like you, if you have something very important at your house, you have to grab it right now because the soldiers are in the front of the streets. You have to go right now, pick your stuff and run away from them. My husband, when he stand up, I told him, no, no, you're not going there. I will go with my father, alone, because if they found him alone at home, they will kill him or they will take him and he will never get back home. I went with my dad, around five, 30. And we have to take all the documents like passports or certificates of birth or something like that. But only five minutes after we saw the tank in the street and we were stuck home, we see a lot of bombs around our homes and we can like hear the screams of people around us. But around twelve thirty, everything was quiet. I went with my dad like I told him. Let's see if there is no one outside. We went, but we saw the tank on the corner of our house and you can't imagine what they did. I told my dad like, let's run, go back. When we run, we run like around twenty maybe or twenty five metres. They bombed where we used to stand.

CO: They were firing on you, targeting you.

RA: Yes. Yeah.

CO: Were you visibly pregnant?

RA: Oh yes. They know and they don't care. Even if I have a child like. One day old, they don't care.

CO: They targeted you for that?

RA: Yeah, after an hour, we received a bomb in our homes. It was only two metres away from me. And I am bleeding so much. And I ran with him. And after we left, we received also five bombs from a helicopter. It was, like we saw the helicopter when they bombed our house.

CO: You were eight months pregnant after this. This attack, the two attacks, you were bleeding and you went to hospital. What happened at the hospital?

RA: We went there and my husband was with me. They did an emergency C-section for me. The doctor was my friend and she came with the baby girl. Her name is Rose. She said, like, here you go. Here's the first one. This is a girl. She's in good health. I took her and said OK, where is the other one? Like, I know I'm expecting a boy and girl. She said, like, I'm sorry we lost the boy. And in the same time that the army came with a sheet of paper, it says like they said we have to sign it. The papers, says it's not the government who killed this baby, it's ISIS. And that's not true because I saw like who did that?

CO: The government people came to the hospital and told you you had to sign a document saying that your baby was not killed by the government, was killed by ISIS?

RA: Exactly.

CO: You refused?

RA: Yeah, I refused. I refused to sign it. And they said, OK, if you refuse to sign it, you are not allowed to bury him. And that time, my friend, the doctor, she said, Reham, you have to go right now from the hospital. You have to run away. I don't like how. She said, like, OK, I will take you from, like, the employment door. We run there.

CO: So you went out, the doctor, helped you escape from the hospital. You had your girl with you, Rose. And the baby that was dead was with you, too?

RA: Yeah. Yeah.

CO: This is just after you gave birth?

RA: Yes, exactly. After maybe half an hour. The boy's name was Hamsa, right?

RA: Yeah, Hamsa.

CO: Were you able to bury him.

RA: I decide to bury him in my home under a lemon tree in my house. And it was a very hard moment in my life. You know, it's hard. Like, I can't explain how hard it is.

CO: Reham, You don't have to. It's just I'm so sorry.

RA: Yeah, thank you. Thank you so much.

CO: But you were able to bury him under this lemon tree in your neighbourhood.

RA: Yeah. Yeah, exactly. And 18 like after 18 days I told my husband like I can't stay here anymore. Never, I can't because I can see like my other twin playing and her brother, you know, under the tree. And no, I can't. I decide in that time to leave to Jordan.

CO: You and many others. Just hundreds of thousands. Millions. We're leaving your country and many of them going into Jordan. You already had another child, a young son. You had this baby girl. What was life like in Jordan for you?

RA: Oh, it was very hard. You know, as a refugee, I am not allowed to work. And I used to work under the table, me and my husband, and they took my husband two or three times to the jail because he's working. And with eighteen days, baby, it was difficult because she was in formula, like she has to take milk and she used to drink water with sugar because I don't have money to buy her milk. And that was hard.

CO: And she was only, she was eighteen days old when I left for Jordan.

RA: Exactly.

CO: Then came this call. As you just told us at the beginning, a call came from the Canadian embassy.

RA: Yeah, exactly. Even if I don't have any idea where I am going, but I know, like something good coming up.

CO: What gave you that feeling?

RA: You know, I know like I feel human in the end. Like somebody will communicate to me as a human, not as an animal, you know? And of course, for my kids, I need to build a future for my kids. That's not their fault.

CO: Do you remember that moment when you crossed into Canada through the gate at the airport? Do you recall that moment?

RA: Oh, of course. Yeah, I thought, hey, can you imagine we are here? He said like, oh, I think so. I told him, Yes, yes, yes. We are here and I met many, many people at the airport waiting for us. We don't know them. That's like that's kind of people I have never met in my life. We cried a lot at the hotel. On the first day we cried a lot. But my kids, they don't have any idea why, you know, but someday someday they will know.

CO: You're listening to As It Happens. And I'm speaking with Reham Abazid, a woman with her family who came to Canada from Syria. Now settled, lives in St. John, New Brunswick. And we're talking about that moment when she came. And there are approximately... There are more than 80,000 people from Syria who settled in Canada. You came as a government sponsored refugee, many of them sponsored refugees, brought people in, did everything they could to help them settle. So lots of people listening to this are thinking about their own Syrian friends now here.

RA: Absolutely.

CO: But as you know, refugees don't choose to leave home. They are forced to. And for many, it's hard to make the transition, isn't it? Hard to...For many people, Syria remains home. What is home for you?

RA: Oh, Syria was my home before 10 years ago, but after not. Because home means safe, means love. But I can't find right now anything in Syria like I find it here in Canada. And of course, it's home for my kids more than me because I grew up in a different country. But they are growing here. And like I am so proud to say, I am a Canadian Syrian, not a refugee anymore, and so thankful for that.

CO: Are you all citizens now?

RA: Not yet.

CO: That's coming.

RA: I don't have time to apply. I wish.

CO: But what do you say to others who came as refugees who are now? They're not refugees anymore. They live here. What do you say to others who are having a more difficult time seeing Canada as their home?

RA: You know, for myself, to them, they have only to reach back to babe. Like, no... How I can say that. To be back like one time and see the reaction from people and they can see Canada from a different way because some people, they are here alone. They don't have anybody from their family. It's hard for them. But if they worked so hard some day they can see one of their family here as many programmes the government is offering, like a private sponsorship or something. And please find a job. Like Canada needs more people and there is lots of job chance around, but they need some people to fill this opportunity. If they can focus, they can, they can get the job. They can improve their English. They can feel welcoming.

CO: You have your life that you left back in Syria. You have a baby buried under a lemon tree. Is there anything else of your life still there in Syria?

RA: Maybe half of my soul. Yes. Also, I have my sister in law and my brother in law still in Syria.

CO: Can you see yourself going back someday?

RA: No, never. Where? No, no, I'm like, I am happy here, and it's my home now and no I can't.

CO: And what about your children? Do you want them to have a connection with Syria?

RA: Maybe in the future? I wish someday to take them there, to tell them where I grew up and to show them here, used to be our home here, like for, especially for my oldest son. He used to stay in that house. I would love to show him where he used to play or there is lots of memory. He has to know.

CO: And what are your dreams? What do you hope to do in Canada and St. John?

RA: I would love to have my own house. That's my plan for next year. I am trying to save some money to buy a house and absolutely to open my own business maybe this summer. What business? Convenience store. That's what I'm thinking about.

CO: Why that. What attracts you to that?

RA: I live in a neighbourhood. There's nothing like there's no store. And if I need to buy anything, I have to drive around fifteen minutes away from my house to grab my stuff. And that's going to be helpful for me and for other people.

CO: And so you want to start a store in your neighbourhood.

RA: Yeah.

CO: And what do you think your kids will do? What dreams do you have for them?

RA: I'm always asking them. My oldest son, he would love to be a fireman and my daughter, she would love to be a pharmacist. And hopefully they will get that someday.

CO: Reham, I am so happy to have you in this country. I'm so sorry for the reasons why you had to leave. But you say at the beginning that you wish you could give back to Canada what they've given you. I think you are.

RA: Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

CO: Bye bye.

RA: Bye bye.

CH: Reham Abazid is a permanent resident of Canada living in St. John, New Brunswick. To hear her remarkable story again, go to our website. That's CBC.ca/aih.

[Music: calm, meditative music]

Part 2: Atlanta Spa Shooting

Atlanta Spa Shooting

Guest: Bee Nguyen

CH: Over the span of about an hour, he went to three spas in the Atlanta area and opened fire. Now eight people are dead. All but one of the victims were women and six were Asian women. Today, police charged that suspect with murder. They haven't determined a motive yet. They say the man in custody blamed what he calls a sexual addiction. But many strongly suspect anti-asian racism. Bee Nguyen is Georgia's first Vietnamese American state representative. We reached her in Atlanta.

CO: Representative Nguyen, how did you find out about this attack?

BEE NGUYEN: I started getting a lot of messages from my friends and family members checking in on me last night. And then once they started coming in, you know, I tuned into the news to see what was happening. You know, it's been non-stop since last night and just trying to get through and figure out what has happened, how we can support the victims and their family and how we can support the Asian-American community as a whole.

CO: What have you learnt about the victims?

BN: You know, I knew that there were six Asian women who were killed. I knew that, you know, the targeting of these three businesses that are owned by Asian people in Georgia. You know, it is alleged that one business owner is a Vietnamese business owner. We know four of the Asian people killed were Korean. And we are, you know, trying to determine what their needs are at this current time.

CO: Korean citizens or of Korean descent, Americans.

BN: Of Korean descent.

CO: And the locations, these are they're 30 miles apart, according to what the police have told us. Why these... Why specifically these businesses, do you think?

BN: Well, from what I've heard, the person in custody right now, he was familiar with these particular businesses. They are all three Asian businesses that offer some sort of massage services, but one in Cherokee County and then the one in Atlanta, they were two businesses that were right across the street from each other.

CO: So have you had a chance to meet with any of the families of these victims?

BN: No, I have not been able to do that. We just learnt some of their names from news reporting and their ages. And we have, you know, community leaders that are currently working right now to reach families and find out how we can best support the family.

CO: We have been covering this story of attacks on Asian-Americans. And the initial presumptions were that this was also these attacks, they were targeted because they are Asian-Americans. What have you heard?

BN: From what I've heard, the way that it is currently being framed right now is that the suspect in custody has stated this is not a hate crime, but I do not think that merits us framing it as not being a hate crime. We have the facts that it was a targeted killing. He went to three Asian owned businesses, killed six Asian women. And we know that there is a history of the sexualization of Asian women in America and across the country. And so we cannot take it based on his words. We have to put it into context. From everything that I have seen and everything that I've read, I still believe that this is a hate crime.

CO: The police and the press conference they gave today, they said that he claimed that he had no racial motivations and that he had some kind of a sexual addiction and that he was, quote, removing temptation. He had temptations he wanted to get rid of. What do you make of that?

BN: Let me first say this. You cannot really talk about, you know, racism and misogyny and how Asian women are viewed and separate those as different issues. They all intersect with each other. So the idea that it is not race based, you know, is not reflective in what we know about sexualization of Asian women. And it does not change the fact that these were targeted killings. And quite frankly, you know, we have seen in the past when these mass shootings occur, there's a tendency to provide excuses for those who commit these atrocities. And those excuses are always to somehow justify that they're not hate crimes and it humanises the suspect instead of humanising the victim.

CO: Well, there's been a fair bit of criticism today because it seems the police went even further than suggesting that he was suffering from some kind of a sexual addiction. At the press conference, the captain of the Cherokee County Sheriff's Office said, and this is a quote that the suspect was, quote, pretty much fed up and had been kind of at the end of his rope. And yesterday was a really bad day for him. And this is what he did. How do you respond to that?

BN: Well, you know, it is the centring, again, of the prototypical white, disaffected young man who somehow feels aggrieved in one way or the other and his response to that is to go and purchase a firearm and commit a mass shooting. I mean, we have seen this before and then his actions are justified by mental health issues or by some other narrative that the media chooses to prop up. But, you know, the reality is he is somebody who went out and bought a weapon. He went to three different locations. One of them is 40 miles apart, and he killed six Asian women. And, you know, if he wants to talk about his sex addiction, then perhaps he needs to address it with himself rather than try to dehumanise and eliminate, you know, women who have nothing to do with whatever demons he's facing.

CO: Authorities in other cities, other jurisdictions are saying that they are looking out for copycat crimes, that this might inspire others to do something similar. You said at the beginning that your people were calling you to see if you're OK. What worries, what concerns now move through communities after a crime like this?

BN: You know, I think that there was always some fear and some concern, beginning with the acceleration of hate crimes that we've seen over the last year because, you know, we had the most powerful leader in our country assigning blame to China and therefore Asians living in America, you know, had a target on our backs. And so, you know, the feeling of fear has been pervasive in the community for at least this past year. But, you know, we obviously know that the treatment of Asians in America historically also we've seen acts of violence towards our communities. So that fear has increased over time, increased when we started seeing, you know, the targets at our elderly Asian folks on the West Coast that have resulted in the death of some. But now with something that is just so close to home, that is so horrifically violent, I do think that all of us are thinking about our parents, our siblings. And we are very concerned and worried about, you know, just that the continued target against Asians.

CO: Representative Nguyen, I appreciate you coming on the program. Thank you.

BN: Thank you so much.

CH: Bee Nguyen is a member of the Georgia House of Representatives, we reached her in Atlanta.

[Music: percussion and guitar instrumental]

Equality Rights

CH: When 16 year old Stella Keating spoke to the US Senate Judiciary Committee today, she told the politicians a little bit about herself. She just got her driver's licence. She loves hiking and her parents think she spends too much time on the phone. Oh, and in more than half of the United States, her rights are not protected. The committee was debating the Equality Act. If passed, it would add sexual orientation and gender identity to civil rights legislation protecting LGBTQ people from discrimination. But there is considerable pushback. The senators heard testimony that, amongst other things, claimed trans girls should be banned from school sports and bathrooms to protect other students, then Stella Keating introduced herself.

STELLA KEATING: Hi, I'm Stella and I'm transgender. I'm here before you today representing the hundreds of thousands of kids just like me, who are supported and loved by their family, friends and communities across the country. Now, I want to share with you why the Equality Act is so important. Right now, I live in a state where I have equal protection under the law and as a high school sophomore, I'm starting to look at colleges and all I can think about is this. Less than half of the states in our country provide equal protection for me under the law. What happens if I want to attend a college in a state that doesn't protect me? Right now, I could be denied medical care or be evicted for simply being transgender in many states. How is that even right? How is that even American? What if I'm offered a dream job in a state where I can be discriminated against? Even if my employer is supportive, I still have to live somewhere and you have to eat in a restaurant and I have to have a doctor. And why am I having to worry about all this at the age of 16? This is the United States of America, the country that I love, every young person, every person, regardless of who they are or who they love, should be able to be excited about their future. I have big goals for mine. In addition to becoming a civil rights attorney. I'm determined to run for public office. I represent America's future. We are the next generation of small business owners, software engineers, scientists, teachers, nurses, [inaudible]. And for my generation to achieve all that, we will, we just need to be able to live our lives. In closing, you just spent some time with me. You've learned about my dreams, my values, my dedication to hard work, to respecting others, even those who don't believe I should have the same rights as all young people. I hope that our time together has helped show you why passing the Equality Act will have such a significant positive impact, not only on the lives of kids like me, but on the future of our country.

CH: That was 16 year old Stella Keating from Tacoma, Washington, speaking of the U.S. Senate Judiciary Committee today about why her rights should be protected under the Equality Act.

[Music: electronic music]

Queens Library Return

Guest: Betty Diamond

CH: Big or small, we probably all have a secret or a regret that we wish we could make amends for. For Betty Diamond, it was a library book she signed out of a Queens, New York, public library when she was 10 years old. Now she's in her 70s. And after decades of remorse, Ms. Diamond decided it was finally time to fess up and return the book she had borrowed so many years earlier. We reached her in Madison, Wisconsin.

CO: Betty, what is the title of this book that you held onto for so long?

BETTY DIAMOND: Ol' Paul, that's OL' with an apostrophe. Ol' Paul.

CO: The mighty logger.

BD: Yes, it's about Paul Bunyan and Babe the Blue Ox.

CO: OK, now, was this a special book to you? Is it something you cherished?

BD: No, but, you know, I just, I ended up not returning it as far as I can recall, because it was a long time ago. I didn't return it because I had let it get overdue. And, you know, as a 10 year old, that was like a terrible thing. And so I was too embarrassed to return it. And again, my 10 year old solution was to just pretend that it never happened.

CO: Right now, this is a hardcover book, right?

BD: It's, yes. It's a lovely hardcover book. It's a red cover. And there were pen and ink illustrations of things like Paul Bunyan combing his beard with a pine tree, you know, things like that. [laughter]

CO: OK, well, what was the original due date for Ol' Paul?

BD: As far as I can read the card. It was July 10th, 1957.

CO: OK, so this is like almost 64 years ago.

BD: Yeah.

CO: And so, rough calculations about 23000 days late.

BD: Sure. [laughter]

CO: So has it been haunting you for twenty three thousand days?

BD: On and off. I had it on one of my bookcases and I would look at it and I go, huh, I really should return that book.

CO: So it's travelled with you. You just moved with it. You took this book with you. You never felt tempted just to leave it behind and try to forget it.

BD: Oh, no. Yeah, I guess I must have had some positive associations with it. My childhood, childhood reading, going to the library. Books were pretty important to me and the library was a wonderful, wonderful place. Yeah. Where you could go and roam around. It was like going to a candy store, you know, you just like all these books that you could take out for free. What a cool thing.

CO: You can take them out for free, but you have to return them.

BD: You do. And I have to say, this is the only book that this has happened with.

CO: OK, so it's been gnawing away at your conscience for 63 years.

BD: On and off. On and off. Yes.

CO: And what sort of then pushed you over to say, I have to do this?

BD: Yeah. You know, people keep asking me that and I just keep saying, I don't know. It's just one of those things. I mean, I was having a conversation with some friends about making amends, and it was just like that book, it's time I'm finally going to do it.

CO: But OK, so it actually came to mind that quick? Like you're in your 70s now. This happened when you were 10 and you think I'm making amends? Yes, that book. That book. I have to get it back. [laughter]

BD: Yeah. What can I say?

CO: But clearly this... what has taken you so long? If it's clearly been lurking there in your subconscious?

BD: Again, I don't have any answer to that question, but I do know that after it had gotten to be, you know, so overdue, I really wanted to make sure that they weren't going to just throw it out.

CO: Oh.

BD: You know, because, you know, with old books, sometimes they just, you know, throw it out or put it into recycling and stuff. So I wanted to make sure that if I returned it, they would not be just shipping it off into recycling. And I was assured that they wouldn't do that. I was like, OK, I will return it.

CO: I think it should be put into a museum as testimony to people like yourself everywhere. All right. So how did it feel when you finally bundled it up, you put it into an envelope and you didn't just send Ol' Paul back to the library on its own? What did you do?

BD: Well, the librarian that I spoke to said that I should send a note with the story, which I did. And then I also sent a donation because, you know, I wanted to thank them for letting me keep the book for 63 years.

CO: But now you're saying that you made a donation. There are late fees here. So, did you contribute your late fees?

BD: Well, you know, with books, there usually is a maximum amount. So they'll say, you know, maybe thirty dollars or something for a book or something like that, you know, in other words, the fees don't keep going. Right.

CO: Unlike your mortgage or the bank or something. Right.

BD: Right. Right, but I just gave a donation because I again, as a thank you for the librarian, and I know that libraries these days, you know, are going through hard times like so many other institutions. And I just, again, wanted to make a little thank you contribution.

CO: Will you tell us how much you wrote the check for?

BD: Sure. Five hundred dollars.

CO: Wow. Good for you. And when they got it, how did the Queens Public Library respond?

BD: Well, with great appreciation. I sent it first to the Auburndale Public Library, which was my local library. And so I got a call, a thank you call from the librarian because they were surprised by the amount of the donation. And then I got a call from the Queens Public Library Foundation itself as a thank you. And also they wanted to know if I would be willing to do any interviews about it. And I thought, well, this would be another good deed because it would be, you know, perhaps a fundraising opportunity for the library. So I said, yes.

CO: And part of your penance.

BD: Yes, part of my making amends.

CO: Now, do you imagine, do you imagine that there's a 10 year old who's going to go into the library, Queen's Library, and sign out Ol' Paul?

BD: Gosh, I hope so, because tall tales are, you know, sort of eternal. I think.

CO: They sure are. And thanks for telling us this one, Betty.

BD: Oh, sure.

CO: Take care of yourself.

BD: OK, bye bye.

CO: Bye.

CH: We reached Betty Diamond in Madison, Wisconsin.

[Music: piano instrumental]

Fictional friends

CH: Was it Peter Dinklage who was so evil or good, both I, I don't know, or maybe you connected with one of the dragons, the funny one, or perhaps you found yourself identifying with one of the thrones who were, you know, playing the game. OK, look, I. I haven't caught up on my Game of Thrones, so I know nothing about it, except winter was coming and everyone died all the time, violently. So I was definitely not one of the subjects in a new study on what happens in our brains when we think about fictional characters. A study that concentrated on Game of Thrones. The show researchers at Ohio State University found 19 people who were really into the show. They scanned their brains while they asked them questions about themselves, their friends and characters from Game of Thrones. They were particularly monitoring the ventral medial prefrontal cortex, which responds most actively. When we think about ourselves and our friends, what they found was that subjects with the strongest ability to connect with fictional characters had the highest activity in that cortex thing when they thought about their favourite Game of Thrones character, which proves from a neurological perspective that some people sort of become the fictional characters they most identify with. So when some of us watched Game of Thrones, we feel we are Geoff Snow. What? Oh, sorry, apparently it's Jon Snow. I really have to watch this show. I mean, it'll take forever, but I'm sure the finale is really satisfying.

[Music: guitar instrumental]

MONA SEIF: My sister is in prison this time because during the lockdown they stopped the visits to all prisons as a precautionary measure against covid-19. And with Alaa, they decided not to allow us letters and we couldn't get proper news of how he's doing, especially under the Corona. After, like months of struggle, we ended up staying in front of the prison and spending the night with my mother, demanding a letter to know how he's doing. And we were violently assaulted on June 22nd and Sanaa was abducted the next morning when we were going to the general prosecutor to file a complaint. And she was detained just like thousands of other activists and opposition figures here in Egypt and youth who are being charged with the compiled list of ready-Made charges of terrorism and supporting terrorism and a new face state security prosecution. And then you go into an endless loop of renewal of detentions.

CO: Mona, what gives you hope at this point, then? What helps you to carry on?

MS: OK, if you had asked me this three days ago, I would have said that I no longer operate on hope and it's quite frankly, what I've been feeling for more than a year now. But yesterday, because I was in court, she asked if she could speak to the judges and she spoke. And all of a sudden I was filled with immense love and pride and hope or not, maybe hope isn't the right word, but gratitude. For me, it was such an empowering thing to see that my younger sister was 27 years old, was speaking very bravely and very openly, and anyone who knows her or doesn't know her would know for sure that she's telling the truth in the same court, that witness, the false testimonies of officers and policemen a couple of weeks before against her.

CH: Egyptian activist Mona Seif speaking with Carol in February about the detention of her sister Sanaa, today, a court sentenced Sanaa Seif to a year and a half in prison.

[Music: guitar instrumental]

Dino Egg Fossils

Guest: Matt Lamanna

CH: A 70 million year old dinosaur fossil is pretty exciting in itself, but what if, in addition to that, the fossilised dinosaur appeared to be sitting on a nest of eggs and there were also preserved embryos. No offence to regular fossils without the nest, but that's more exciting. A group of international researchers have just described the discovery in a paper published recently in the journal Science Bulletin. Matt Lamanna is one of the authors. He's a palaeontologist in Pittsburgh and that is where we reached him.

CO: Matt, how rare is a find like this one?

MATT LAMANNA: Well, this is as rare as they come. So people have found dinosaurs, a few dinosaurs sitting on nests of their own eggs before, and they've found plenty of nests that contain embryos. But this is the first time the two have been combined in one single spectacular fossil.

CO: This is called an Oviraptorsaur, right?

ML: Correct. Yeah.

CO: What does it look like? What would it have looked like?

ML: I guess probably the most familiar animal I could compare it to would be something like a small ostrich. So imagine a big ground bird, like an ostrich, or especially if you're familiar with something like a cassowary. Cassowary's, an ostrich relative that lives in Australia and New Guinea, that has a crust on his skull. This animal would look something like a cassowary or an ostrich, except with long, well-developed four limbs that were tipped with three big claws.

CO: Wow. And so this, it has feathers, had feathers, but it didn't fly, right?

ML: Absolutely. Both, correct on both counts.

CO: What was this Oviraptorosaur’s actually doing at the moment? That it was fossilised.

ML: It was fossilised in what we think is an incubating position. So unfortunately, at some point, and we think this is probably just due to erosion, potentially modern excavation, but more probably erosion. The head and neck were lost as was part of the back in the end of the tail. But the rest of the animal is there. And so it includes the forelimbs, the high limbs, part of the torso, part of the tail, part of the neck. And what's there is crouched in the middle of a nest with its arms wrapped around the outer edge of the nest. You know, a position very, very similar to what you see many modern birds do when they're sitting on their nest. So because the animal was fossilised in this position atop a nest of eggs that contain Oviraptorosaur embryos, presumably its own, we think that this animal perished in the act of incubating its nest.

CO: We presume it was female. Right?

ML: You know, that's an interesting point. And we don't know for sure. We actually tried to test this in our study, but the results were inconclusive. The reason why I say it's uncertain is that some modern birds, such as ostriches, take turns with the male and female incubating the eggs. You know, although it's quite possible that this was a female. It's also possible that this was the dad.

CO: If the embryos are fairly well developed, how close were they to actually hatching?

ML: We think quite, very close. Although another interesting feature of this is that it seems that the embryos are at slightly different developmental stages. So all the embryos, all seven of the embryos that we observed out of the twenty four eggs, there may be more embryos inside some of those eggs or maybe all of them. All of those embryos are at relatively advanced developmental stages, but they're slightly apart from one another. And so that suggests that maybe the eggs in the top layer of the nest, the layer that was closest to the adult may have hatched a little bit before the eggs in the next layer and so on and so forth. So we think that they were close to hatching, but they might not have all hatched at the same time.

CO: And this Oviraptorsaur had twenty four eggs?

ML: Yeah. Twenty four eggs in the nest, at least twenty four. And that, that's an interesting thing too. We don't really go into the reasons for this in the paper, but I sometimes wonder whether these animals may have nested communally like the way, the way ostriches do for instance.

CO: Wow. And so does it change any assumptions, does it change any theories about Oviraptorosaurs and they're young?

ML: I would say it doesn't change all that much, but it provides some of the best evidence yet. The Oviraptorosaurs and presumably many, many what we call non avium dinosaurs. In other words, non bird dinosaurs did probably nurture their young. So, for instance, a few Oviraptorosaur have been found sitting on nests before. But some people have claimed that in those cases, the animal perished while it was in the act of laying its eggs or maybe the animal was guarding its nest in the fashion that, say, alligators and crocodiles do today. You know, in other words, hanging around and protecting the eggs, but not incubating them. We think the combination of circumstances preserved here, an adult sitting in very close proximity to. The eggs are very well developed, close to hatching, we think that all of these circumstances combined provide some of the best evidence yet that Oviraptorosaurs and potentially other dinosaurs incubated their nests.

CO: To find this creature frozen in this moment. What's your theories as to how he or she died?

ML: Yeah, an excellent question. And we didn't really... I'll confess we didn't really explore this question all that much in our study. But the rocks in which this fossil is preserved are mudstone. So in other words, it's rock that's formed from ancient mud and so and seemingly quite a significant quantity of mud at that. And so I sometimes wonder about, you know, something like a flash flood potentially killing this individual. And if that's the case or actually individuals, when you count the embryos as well. And if so, if that's the case, if this animal hung around on top of its nest, you know, trying to protect its eggs to the very last as this flood was bearing down on it, starting to, you know, starting to bury it in mud, I mean, that to me is devotion. That's a devoted parent that's going, you know, doing everything it can to protect its offspring, even to the very end.

CO: What other questions do you have about this creature?

ML: Well, I mean, first of all, we would like to know what specific Oviraptorosaur saw it belongs to. Unfortunately, we can't tell that because we're missing its head. We found gastroliths or what appear to be gastroliths. These are stones that are in the abdominal cavity of the dinosaur. These are often associated with orbivery and modern birds. So eating plants or dietary eating different things throughout the year. And so I'm personally curious about the dietary implications of finding these stones in the belly of this creature, which are the first time that's ever been found in this particular group of dinosaurs, the oviraptors.

CO: Matt, I really appreciate you telling us this story. Thank you.

ML: Oh, my pleasure. Carol, thanks so much for having me.

CO: Bye bye.

ML: Take care.

CH: Matt Lamanna is a palaeontologist and principal dinosaur researcher at the Carnegie Museum of Natural History in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. That's where we reached him. And you can find more on that story on our Web page at CBC.ca/aih.

[Music: percussion instrumental]

Sound of the day

CH: The results are in and they sound like nothing we've ever heard before. On Friday, the winners of the 2021 Guthman Musical Instrument Competition were announced. The annual competition is organised by the Georgia Institute of Technology, and it challenges inventors from around the world to create new instruments. Here are the top three finalists in third place, the electromagnetic piano, an instrument that uses magnets to make acoustic piano strings resonate.

[Sound Clip: electromagnetic piano]

CH: Haunting. In second place, we have the Synescope, an instrument that converts visual art into sound.

[Sound Clip: Synescope].

CH: And finally, in first place, we've got the Segulharpa, an electroacoustic instrument made out of walnut that holds 25 steel strings which are bowed by magnetic fields.

[Sound Clip: The Segulharpa].

CH: There you have them, the winners of the 2021 Guthman Musical Instrument Competition our sounds of the day.

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March 17, 2021 Episode Transcript

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