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The AIH Transcript for May 11, 2020

Hosts: Carol Off and Chris Howden

Prologue

CH: An open and shut case. On Friday, a Winnipeg soft-serve spot was all set to reopen. But by Sunday, their hopes for a seamless return to normal had melted away.

CH: Meeting of minds. Taiwan's place at World Health Organization meetings has been a flashpoint during the pandemic. Taiwan's representative in Ottawa welcomes Canadian support and its apparent break with Beijing.

CH: As It Happens, the Monday edition. Radio that always has time for an awed fellow.

Quebec schools reopen

Guest: Samuel Bernard

CH: Thousands of kids in Quebec did something very unusual today. They went to school. The province has made the controversial decision to open up schools in some parts of the province. The gradual reopening is beginning with elementary grades outside the greater Montreal region. It also includes daycares. But back to school doesn't mean back to normal. Kids are being asked to follow strict physical distancing and hand-washing rules. Angie Trepanier is a nurse, and a mom, who sent her daughter back to school in Ormstown today.

[/sc]

CH: That was Angie Trepanier explaining to the CBC's Justin Hayward what it was like to send her daughter back to school in Ormstown, Quebec today. Samuel Bernard is a grade two teacher in Quebec City. That's where we reached him.

CO: Samuel, how did it feel to be back in your classroom today?

SAMUEL BERNARD: So first thing in the morning, when I was home, I was pretty worried. A bit of anxiety attacked me [chuckling]. But as soon as I saw my students this morning, and then I saw them come into class, it felt really good. I felt a lot of joy, and everyone was thrilled to be back. So it felt right. It felt great. Of course, there's still a lot of uncertainty and a bit of anxiety. I think it will follow us for the next days.

CO: But was it fairly emotional with you and the kids?

SB: It was emotional from a positive point of view, if I can say like that. Like. my kids were really happy to be back to see me again and see their friends.

CO: How many of your kids actually came?

SB: So in my classroom, I have 12 kids because I can't host any other one respecting the two metres apart. But I have 16 kids actually from my classroom that are back in school, so I had to send four of them in a new classroom with a new teacher.

CO: Wow! And this is grade two, these are seven and eight-year-olds, I guess?

SB: Yes, exactly.

CO: What are you doing? You said the physical distancing, the limited numbers, give us a sense of the day and how different it is?

SB: Yeah. So it's a lot different because, first of all, we have to wash our hands quite a lot [chuckling]. I mean, this morning, just this morning, as soon as my students came in inside the school, they had to put on some hand sanitizer. And then when there they were inside the classroom, they had to wash their hands with water and soap. And they had to do it again before eating their snack, after taking the snack, before they would be going to the bathroom, after they went to the bathroom and before they leave school. And we have to do that again this afternoon. So a lot of time is spent on that. But it's all right. We have to do it. And also, all of my desks are two metres apart from each other. And my students have to stay as much as possible on their chair and not move that much.

CO: Is that difficult to do, to stay in their places that long?

SB: Yeah. Well, this morning it was a bit difficult, but I talked to them about the importance of respecting that measure because, you know, we have to protect our older people. And we have to make sure that this virus is in control as much as possible. So they have to do their part. So I think wit a lot of practice, we’ll be pretty good at the end of the week.

CO: So how different is it? Is there much that's the same, or is it really entirely different at this point?

SB: It's a lot different because I was used to doing a lot of teamwork in my classroom. Now, I cannot I can't do this anymore. My students have to work in solo at their desks. So there's no, almost no movement in my classroom. So it's hard for a seven or eight-year-old to respect that.

CO: We spoke with a mother on Friday, who had decided she wasn't going to send her kids to school. It didn't feel right for her. She was just feeling that she has some health issues, that she was worried about herself. It was too early, she felt.

SB: Yeah.

CO: Do you think that parents like that will hear about what's going on in the classroom and be more reassured?

SB: I hope they'll be reassured. But if there is any health issues at home that the virus could make worse, I think it's best for them to stay home. And for the kids to stay home. Apart from that, if a parent is just worried about how things are going in school right now, I can tell them that we worked really hard last week to make sure that the school is prepared. And we did great, I think. Just today was supposed to be the worst day of the week about the measures and everything, but it went pretty well. So I think like in a week, we'll be really good and our students will be safe. So I hope some of them are reassured.

CO: Just interesting when you said at the beginning that as soon as you saw the kids, you knew it felt right. And when I spoke with her on Friday, she said it just doesn't feel right. There’s a lot of it that just depends on those moments. The instant when you're thinking, yeah, this is good, right?

SB: Yeah. Yeah. Overall, it was pretty positive this morning. And I think it can only get better with time. So I think it will feel right more and more during the week. So I'm pretty positive. I'm confident.

CO: Do you have any sense of what the reasons are for kids who did come back? What the background was?

SB: Yes. So I think most of the parents had some trouble at home [chuckling] with distance learning. So they're kind of glad that we're back to school. And yeah, a lot of them have been called back to work.

CO: There’s some also saying that in some schools, only about 13 per cent of the kids came back. You're not allowed to have many, but there’s not many kids coming back. And the question becomes, you know, is there any point to this? I mean, why not just have carried this on until September?

SB: That's a great question because I think they focus a lot on the importance of mental health at home, and the importance of kids going back to school for that. But, at the same time, sometimes I feel hearing them talk, I feel that the main reason why we're back is for the economy, you know? And I think if that is the real reason, it's a bad one, a truly bad one because there would be a lot of consequences for that. But I have to believe them and trust them with their decision.

CO: Just... I don't want to have you stray into politics, but do you think that it is too early to come back?

SB: I feel we are doing things a bit too quickly here in Quebec. But, you know, I know there's a lot of people working with the statistics and studying this virus. But yeah, it felt a bit quick.

CO: I think that probably lots of people are having the same reservations.

SB: [both chuckling] Yeah, yeah, I’m pretty sure.

CO: I know you got to get back into your classroom. I appreciate that you took some time for us. Thank you.

SB: You're welcome. It's been a pleasure.

CO: Take care.

SB: Bye-bye.

CH: We reached grade two teacher Samuel Bernard teacher in Quebec City. For more on this story, go to our website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

[Music: Ambient]

Taiwan WHO

Guest: Winston Chen

CH: Ottawa is crossing Beijing. At issue is the invite list for an upcoming World Health Organization meeting about COVID-19. China has made it clear that it does not want Taiwan there. That's because China doesn't recognize Taiwan as an independent state. But last week, Canada backed a U.S. bid to have Taiwan attend, as a non-state observer. Winston Chen is the Representative at the Taipei Economic and Cultural Office in Canada. We reached him in Ottawa.

CO: Representative Chen, what is Taiwan hoping to contribute to this meeting if Canada and the United States can convince the World Health Organization to let you in?

WINSTON CHEN: I think we should be humble. Not really, we want to give any experience to everyone. But we love to share our experience. And the most important part is that the virus can not recognize the national borders. So Taiwan certainly over the years have been ignored. And we think it is a very dangerous move. And so in order to protect the citizen on this planet, it require that everyone has to be included. Certainly, the people, twenty-three-point-eight-million population of Taiwan.

CO: But you know that for Canada to support Taiwan is to go against Beijing. China does not want you to be recognized at this meeting, to have any standing. So can you appreciate that Canada is possibly going to pay a price for having given you this endorsement?

WC: I think in the very beginning, the people can understand that including Taiwan as an observer in the WHO meetings is a non-political issues, and the main purpose is to protect and then safeguard the global health community. So I think if China would like to emphasize the political intention or motivation, that's a big mistake.

CO: But you know that there's a very delicate extradition case going on right now with a Chinese businesswoman who is in Canada, this is Meng Wanzhou, and two Canadians arrested in China, it appears in retaliation for that case. So there is possibly people's futures, even their lives, at stake here in keeping a balance with Beijing. So I'm just wondering if you appreciate how difficult this has been for Canada?

WC: Yes, I feel encouraged that Canada will make a very courageous move to support Taiwan. And in the way that Taiwan experienced to handle the situation across the Taiwan Strait for their case. And also, that we as a like-minded country, we try to share our experience with Canada, our friends here. And also, that we try to be balanced in our policy. So we are not going to push for that agenda. But we both fully understand that when facing the challenge like a pandemic, that people have to put the political issue aside. And they're trying to realize that now the challenge that the priorities here. So we've put our resources on this, and then we save peoples’ life. That's the number one issue.

CO: WE saw Dr. Bruce Aylward, who is the Canadian doctor who is part of the WHO study into COVID-19 and China. In February, he came back, saying that China was doing a spectacular job. Later, when he was interviewed by a Hong Kong journalist, he appears to have disconnected the phone when he was asked whether Taiwan should be part of the WHO or be recognized as an observer status.

WC: Yes.

CO: What does that tell you about the WHO relationship with China?

WC: I think the question should be put to the doctor Aylward, and maybe he can give me his explanation of why he makes that statement on that. I have no position to interpret it.

CO: But why do you think the WHO is so careful when it comes to its relationship with China? Why do you think that is?

WC: I think a big international organization like WHO shouldn't take it for granted that the country, that a big population with independent sovereignty, can be ignored. I think that's their challenge. And, I think a look at this pandemic, we didn't get any support from the WHO. But we learned a big lesson since 17 years ago when we faced a similar challenge with maybe a smaller scare for the SARS. And then we tried to fund the industry. Fund the private sector, government agency. We have our strategy when sometime later, there will be a pandemic again. That's how we properly deal with this.

CO: You say that you have no political motivation, that this is a health issue. But at the same time, Taiwan donated personal protective equipment to countries — including Canada. That's something China has done. It's been called coronavirus diplomacy. Isn't it fair to say that you are playing politics to some extent? It’s not entirely about a health issue?

WC: I think the totally different is that everything we do when we safeguard peoples’ life. And then to fight against COVID_19. Everything is open, and transparency. But what we can see in China is that you didn’t know the real story of what's happening there, even up to this moment. I think that's the main difference. And if you ask me, that's why we should support people like this friendly country like Canada and then other countries. I think that's human nature. We should help each other. But people like to put a name, the mask diplomacy or whatever. I don't care that. But I what I'm worried is that if our small and the humble contribution to some countries, we really can help lots of peoples’ life, then I think that's something my country will continue to do.

CO: We'll leave it there. Representative Chen, thank you.

WC: Well, thank you. Thank you, Carol. Thank you for having me.

CO: Bye-bye.

WC: Bye-bye.

CH: Winston Chen is the Representative at the Taipei Economic and Cultural Office in Canada. We reached him in Ottawa. And you can find more on that story on the As It Happens website.

[Music: Jazz]

Loudest

CH: Tonight, we've got a couple of literal blasts from the past. One from a woman who was on a real winning shriek. And the other from a man whose involuntary roaring had started an unfortunate chainsaw reaction. First, to Tedburn, St. Mary, England. About 197 kilometres southwest of Reading. For Grace Hall, that was shouting distance. When Barbara Frum spoke with Ms. Hall in 1976, she'd just been crowned the loudest shouter in the world. As you'll hear, the phone line wasn't great, but that wasn't really an issue.

[sc]

BARBRA FRUM: Hello, Mrs. Hall.

GRACE HALL: Hello, my dear.

BF: How are you?

GH: I’m fine, thank you.

BF: I must say, from the introduction, I wasn't prepared for such a soft voice.

GH: [chuckling] Well, this is my normal speaking voice. The other is only done for fun.

BF: How long have you been practicing for the world's loudest shout?

GH: One year.

BF: A whole year?!

GH: Just under a year.

BF: How do you practise for something like that?

GH: Well, there's a field opposite our village, and the farmer allows me to go and practise on his cows. I shout army drills at the cows.

BF: Mrs. Hall, how many hours do you work with the cows?

GH: Ten minutes. Only ten minutes a day.

BF: That's all they can take, I guess?

GH: Yes. Otherwise, you know, ten minutes is all I can give them.

BF: Where does your voice come from? Are you a diaphragm person?

GH: Well, I've learned yoga breathing, and I was a singer in my young days.

BF: Mrs. Hall, I think everyone is now ready for a trial. We'd like to hear your yell. We're all forewarned now, so people can stand back from their radios.

GH: Yes.

BF: Would you like to do one for us?

GH: All right. All right, my dear. All right, here it goes.

[Sound: A very loud, but very unclear yell.

BF: That was excellent. I can hear the training in the tone.

GH: Oh, good.

BF: It's not just screaming, is it?

GH: Oh, I don't scream at all. My voice is a baritone, you see?. I sing baritone. I couldn’t scream at all.

BF: When did you realize you had the talent?

GH: I went down to have a private [?], and the recorder let it out to the media. And they all came up, the press, radio, television, the lot, to watch me make an ass of myself. And currently, I’ve hassled them all, and they’ve all kind of bullied me into going on with this thing until I’ve got the world record. If they hadn’t come up, it would’ve never occurred to me to do it.

BF: Mrs. Hall, when you did your winning yell, how far away were you heard? Do you have any idea?

GH: Well, usually, they can hear me all over the village, which is 50 acres, about a quarter of a mile, I should say. I’d say two or three fields away.

BF: Give us a final send-off, would you, Mrs. Hall?

GH: All right, my dear. Here we go.

[Sound: This indiscernible yell has an echo!]

BF: Superb.

GH: Any casualties?

BF: You're in great form today.

GH: Oh, good.

BF: Thanks, Mrs. Hall. And congratulations.

GH: Bye, my dear.

BF: Bye.

CH: From our archives, Barbara Frum speaking with Grace Hall — world's loudest shouter — in November 1976. When Michael Enright spoke with Mark Hebbard of Richmond, BC, 13 years later, Mr. Hebbard was about to have his own loudness record certified by Guinness. But he hadn't set it on purpose. In fact, he'd done everything possible not to. Mr. Hebbard was the world's loudest snorer. As you'll hear, he does sound a bit proud of it. Whereas, as you'll also hear, his wife Carol sounds a bit homicidal about it.

MICHAEL ENRIGHT: Mark, let me start with you first, and the first question is just how loud is your snoring?

MARK HEBBARD: How loud? Ninety decibels.

ME: What does that mean in English?

MH: Equivalent to a lawnmower, a subway and a hair bit below the noise of a rock band or a power saw.

ME: You're kidding?!

MH: [CAROL HEBBARD chuckles] No, sir.

ME: Carol, is that true?

CAROL HEBBARD: Absolutely true. Oh, it’s just disgusting.

ME: [laughing] How long have you been married?

CH: For fifteen years.

ME: You've had 15 years of this snoring?!

CH: Well, it wasn't that bad, though. If it was that bad, I wouldn't have married him.

ME: Right.

CH: It started off, you know, just, I guess, your average snore. And then it just got continually worse. And before you know it, I found that I wanted to smother the guy. [CO and ME laugh] That’s how bad it was.

ME: Mark, how long have you snored like this?

MH: Well, apparently, I've snored for 25 years. But it's just been gradually getting worse as I get older.

CH: It just got really bad in the last two years.

ME: But you've been tested today, obviously?

MH: Yes. Yes, I've been tested three times before I had an operation. So in order to prove that the machinery was faulty because I registered so high.

ME: And it's the sound of a garbage truck?

MH: Not quite a garbage truck, but a motorcycle. Imagine that sucker blowing in your ear for 15 years.

ME: [laughing deeply] Yeah, have you got any kids?

MH: We do. And the kids, all the neighbourhood kids, the neighbours, everyone's aware of when I'm having a powernap.

CH: They've all heard him [chuckling].

ME: You mean they can hear him next door?

MH: Oh, sure. The kids can be outside playing in the street. And if I'm having a little nap…

CH: They know it!

MH: They say, there goes your dad again!

CH: [ME laughing] And they've all stood around laughing at him [chuckling]. They just can’t believe it that if Mark's in bed and I have a friend over in the evening, she says, is that Mark? How on earth can you tolerate that? [laughing]

ME: Mark, do you know why you snore the way you do?

MH: Yeah, well, I have a sleep disorder problem.

ME: I'll say. Is there some medical term for it?

MH: There is. It’s called sleep apnea, A-P-N-E-A.

ME: Oh yeah, I've heard of that.

MH: Uh-huh.

ME: Now you had an operation, did you?

MH: Yeah, I did have an operation this past February. Basically, what they did was when you open up your mouth and you look in the mirror and you see that funny little punching bag hanging down there, that's called a uvula.

ME: Right.

MH: When you're sleeping…

ME: It vibrates.

MH: It vibrates, and that's what makes the noise.

ME: Yeah.

MH: So I've had that little bugger removed. Oh, I purr like a kitty cat. I'm not quite the same firepower.

ME: So you don't snore quite as much as you used to?

MH: Right.

CH: I can tell it's getting worse again, though.

ME: Why? What's happening, Carol?

CH: Well, you know, after the operation, he was pretty nice and quiet. It was really great. But now, every now and then, some nights, he begins to bother me again. But I'm not complaining because I know how much worse it could be.

ME: Don't you punch him in the middle of night, or kick him out of bed, or?

CH: I have done that all right. Yeah.

MH: I know I've had a good night of snoring when my ribs hurt.

ME: Mark, what about the bylaws in the city? What are the noise bylaws?

MH: Well, the noise bylaw in the city of Vancouver is 80 decibels, so we have automatical light rapid transit here, which clocks in at 86 decibels, which is over the noise bylaw level. And if I’m clocking a 90, I'm legally not allowed to sleep in the city of Vancouver.

[ME: [laughing deeply] So you're breaking the law every time you go to bed?

MH: With all this publicity, I'm waiting for the gendarmes to come to the door and carry me out.

ME: So you are literally louder than the subway?

MH: Yes.

ME: So it's like sleeping with a subway in your bedroom, Carol?

CH: Oh, exactly. Oh, yes. Sometimes I would just get so frustrated and mad I'd leave. I’d shut the door, go to another bedroom, shut that door, and I could still hear the guy [slight chuckle]. It torments you all right.

ME: [laughing] Well, congratulations for being in the book, Mark.

MH: Thanks very much.

ME: We'll talk to you when they confirm it.

MH: Okay. Well, any tremors here in Vancouver is not me anymore.

ME [laughing] All right. Thanks for talking to us, Mark.

MH: Thank you very much.

ME: Carol, thank you. Get a good night's sleep, Carol.

CH: Oh, yeah. I am able to now.

MH: Happy holidays to you.

ME: You, too. Bye.

CH: Bye-bye.

[/sc]

CH: From our archives, Michael Enright speaking with Mark and Carol Hebbard of Richmond, BC. in December of 1989.

[Music: Indie rock]

Part two: Bridge Drive-In, South Dakota Sioux checkpoints

Bridge Drive-In

Guest: Justin Jacob

CH: As different jurisdictions examine reopening plans and possibilities, a Winnipeg institution was making plans of its own. So when Manitoba allowed some non-essential businesses to open-up again last week, the soft-serve slingers at Bridge Drive-In were ready. They opened — then came the backlash. And by Sunday, the ice cream shop was closed again. Justin Jacob is the co-owner of Bridge Drive-In. We reached him in Winnipeg.

CO: Justin, first of all, what was the plan or the vision for reopening that you had before the weekend hit?

JUSTIN JACOB: So the plan was like, we're kind of a drive-in ice cream stand. Normally, we have our patrons that walk up to one of our five serving windows and place their order and then pick up their order. But we kind of revised our parking lot to keep people within their cars for kind of a curbside pickup situation. So we know that our opening weekend is always pretty busy here. And the plan was to, like I said, keep people in their vehicles and kind of just pass through, place their order, pay with contactless payments. And then we had kind of people running in between our serving windows and their vehicles to pick up their orders.

CO: Okay. It sounds like a lot of work, but that's a vision. So how did it play out in reality?

JJ: I didn't quite play out as we'd expected. So Friday, actually, it went well. It was our opening day. We were able to keep the line of cars down to a minimum. And from backing out onto the city street. Saturday, it didn't go so well. There was probably a period of about two hours that our line of cars actually got super long. So, unfortunately, yeah, we just couldn't keep up.

CO: I mean, it’s still cold in Winnipeg. People were lining up along the road to get some ice cream?

JJ: Yeah, I think that Winnipegers are pretty resilient people [CO laughs], and we've all been kind of cooped up for a period of time now. So they're excited that we opened, I guess.

CO: So what was the reaction? What made you ultimately decide that you had to pull it all down?

JJ: I think once I couldn't see the end of the line-up of cars, and it kind of stretched all the way down the road, I think that's when I kind of knew my idea kinda didn't work as I had intended.

CO: And you also had a bit of backlash, didn't you?

JJ: Yeah. So kind of after when I got home, I think it was about 1:30 a.m., I kind of went online just to see if there is any activity online about the line and that sort of thing. And there definitely was. There's a lot of negative feedback online about, you know, the traffic blockages that we were causing. And there was even, I guess local residents were having their driveways blocked by the line.

CO: So were the complaints coming from the people seeking your ice cream, or was it from people who live in the neighbourhood?

JJ: I'm guessing it was neighbourhood residents. Like, the residents, we had actually talked to a number of neighbours prior to even doing this just to get their feedback. And we actually got their feedback after deciding to shut down on Sunday. And they actually were fine with it. So I think it is mostly just people using Jubilee Avenue, which we're located on, that because that lane was out, they weren't too thrilled about it. I'm guessing any of the residents that had driveways backing out onto Jubilee were also not throw this their driveways blocked. So they probably called in complaints as well. But I'd never actually heard those myself or seen any online.

CO: Okay. So what are you going to do? I mean, I guess you want to keep everybody safe. I understand your wife's a nurse. So you're taking this pretty seriously. How do you keep your patrons safe and get your door open?

JJ: Yeah. So that was kind of the thinking was if we keep everyone in their vehicles, we would like just manage social distancing naturally that way. The plan now, I guess we'll go back to kind of our roots as a pedestrian walk-up service and then keep like social distancing markers on the ground. The possibility is definitely there that we can't, you know, police people to a level of keeping them distanced. Because to think of bringing my own son, he'd be running around and that sort of thing. And at that point, it's very difficult to keep people in a line-up that they are distanced. So we're not throwing in the towel yet or anything like that. We just want to kind of plan things out, lay things out for pedestrian traffic and kind of see how things go.

CO: I understand the city itself kind of got involved in this and said, look, you didn't have a permit to have a drive-through. Is that right?

JJ: We never actually got word from the city. From what I did hear, I believe that a bylaw officer did comment on what did happen. I guess the city, they said the city would have worked with us to try and make the situation work, possibly with signage and that sort of thing. But we never actually had a formal drive-through, per se, with curbing end and easements and stuff like that. But just given the traffic that we've seen on Saturday, we just know that that idea is probably not feasible.

CO: Good heavens! You can get drive-through confession with a priest[laughing]. You can get drive-through almost anything. But you’d think you can get a drive-through soft ice cream, eh?

JJ: Yeah, you would think. But part of the challenge with our business is that we're located in a residential neighbourhood, like just in the heart of it. So any decisions you make, if we drive lots of traffic here, it starts creating difficulty.

CO: We know that we've been following the stories in other places, particularly in the United States, where attempts to open on the weekend in some cases got nasty, and staff tried to limit access for safety, and people didn't like it, and it got pretty ugly. I guess that's not the Winnipeg way?

JJ: No, no, I guess not. We had actually great feedback in the drive-through from everyone that passed through. They thought it was faster than our usual service even. But the traffic issue that was created was the main problem.

CO: So it's back to the drawing board?

JJ: It is. It is back to the drawing board. Yeah, COVID’s really threw us for a loop here, and we're just trying to adjust.

CO: Well, I hope you find a way to work around it, Justin. And it's good to talk to you, thank you.

JJ: For sure. Thank you so much.

CO: Bye.

CH: Justin Jacob is the co-owner of Bridge Drive-In — a soft-serve institution in Winnipeg. That's where we reached him today.

[Music: Folksy guitar]

Double Rainbow Guy obit

CH: In the video, he laughs. He sobs. And he's absolutely awe-struck.

[sc]

PAUL VASQUEZ: Ohhhhhhh, my God. Wow!!! Yeah!!! Oh my… Oh my God, look at that! It looks like a triple rainbow. Oh, my God, it's full-on double rainbow all the way across the sky. [crying] Oh my God. Oh my God.

[/sc]

CH: That's Paul Vasquez reacting to a double rainbow that he could see from his small farm at the end of Yosemite National Park in California. And his amazement at what Mother Nature brought to his doorstep went viral. Very viral. The heartfelt moment inspired an auto-tuned song, and Mr. Vasquez — who was also known as Yosemite Bear Mountain Giant — was suddenly on late-night talk shows. But fame didn't change him. He kept living on his farm and taking in the beautiful sights. Paul Vasquez died over the weekend. He was 57 years old. Shortly after that video when viral in 2010, the one-time professional cage fighter turned organic farmer spoke with As It Happens guest host Peter Armstrong. Here's part of that conversation.

[sc]

PV: Yeah, rainbows come to my front door all the time, on a regular basis. If you look through my Youtube page, I have lots and lots of the videos.

PETER ARMSTRONG: Yeah. So why then did this particular double rainbow bring you to tears?

PV: I think it was the timing and the power of it. It was just so intense and so powerful. The energy from it knocked me down and knocked me to my knees. You could feel the rays from the sun or from a heat lamp. You could feel that energy.

PA: Well, you can tell that by watching the clip. And in the clip, you're very expressive. Do you mind if I ask if you were high when you recorded the video?

PV: Yeah, I wasn't high in that one. There another video called “Giant Intense Rainbow”.

PA: Yeah, I saw that one.

PV: I was high on that one [laughing]. I had taken that one a year before. But on this particular one, I wasn't high on that. The only thing I do is I smoke pot, I have a doctor's prescription for it. And I only usually do it when there's someone here. And when this one came, I was here by myself. So, yeah, I was not high at all for that one.

PA: Now you're a former cage fighter, as I understand it. How does a former cage fighter develop such an appreciation of nature?

PV: Well, I bought this land out here in 1988. It’s on the side of a mountain, at the end of a dirt road. And I developed it myself. And it's raw land. It’s like really close to Yosemite National Park. It's really remote. I don't have a regular job, so I'm not having to go on and, you know, fight traffic and work a regular job every day. So I'm out here like gardening and farming and doing all that kind of stuff. So I'm always in nature. So I'm just connected to that stuff and disconnected from like the regular world and from regular people. So I'm real tuned in with like nature and the spirit. And so that's why I have like a pure heart. And that's kind of how I was connected to that.

PA: Why do you think people like this video so much? It's really, I mean, it's gone all over the world now.

PV: Yeah. I've been asked this question a lot. So I've had to think about the answer. And the answer is this is my reaction to the spirit of the universe, you know? Like I have very little filters. I’m someone who doesn't filter themself. I laugh out loud. I'm not embarrassed by myself. I’m kind of big guy who doesn't care what people think about him, you know? So people are seeing spirit in a mirror of someone who has a pure heart, and that is what people are responding to.

[/sc]

CH: That was Paul Vasquez speaking with As It Happens guest host Peter Armstrong in 2010. Mr. Vasquez died this past weekend. He was 57.

[Music: Lullaby]

South Dakota Sioux checkpoints

Guest: Harold Frazier

CH: Remove your highway checkpoints, or face legal action. That's the ultimatum from South Dakota's governor Kristi Noem. She sent it in two letters to the Cheyenne River Sioux Tribe and Oglala Sioux Tribe. They've set up highway checkpoints as part of their fight against COVID-19. Harold Frazier is chairman of the Cheyenne River Sioux Tribe. We reached Chairman Frazier in Eagle Butte, South Dakota.

CO: Chairman Frazier. Can you tell us why you will not remove those checkpoints?

HAROLD FRAZIER: You know, the reason, one of the main reasons why is, you know, we feel that this is necessary to try to keep our people safe and in good health. And, you know, it's a good tool for us to track. And if it was to come, we feel that by monitoring and tracking who comes into our reservation, we should isolate it as quick as we can and try to keep it contained.

CO: Have you had any cases of COVID-19 in your communities?

HF: Yes, we've had one. And that's why it's pretty awesome that through our checkpoints, we were able to monitor. We knew that individual was coming from a hotspot, and we were able to keep in daily contact with the individual. And after about five days, the patient got sick. We got her to the hospital, where she got tested. It was tested positive. We immediately knew the contacts that she had made when she come back. So, you know, it did its job that it was designed for.

CO: Right. And when you say that this is your checkpoints, you're talking about your checkpoints, right? That you know, everyone who comes in, and then you can find out what contact they've had. You can find out who they might have been with. Is that right?

HF: Yes.

CO: And we know that there are right now in South Dakota. Well, there were more than 3000 confirmed cases, more than 30 deaths so far in that state. But the issue is, is that the governor is saying that you have no right to control that highway that goes through your communities. That you can regulate your own roads, but you can't do a road that crosses through the community and through the state. Is there nothing you can work out with the governor?

HF: No, I don't see anything because, you know, with our record, with our information, I mean, the State of South Dakota don't own any roads, so I mean, there’s just really right now, there's no need for any discussion about the road.

CO: How many cars, how many actual vehicles, have you turned away at your checkpoints?

HF: You know, probably very, very few. I mean, if you're a commercial vehicle bringing in supplies, crossing our reservation to another part of the country and you're delivering supplies, I mean, it takes less than a minute and you're on your way through. Also, to if medical supplies, postal service, things like that, essential agriculture. Yeah, we don't. But the only thing that we do ask to reroute our land is someone from a hotspot. And you really have no essential business. You don't have any relatives or any family living on our reservation, we need to reroute your travel.

CO: So who would you tell to reroute? What individuals with cars would you ask them to do that?

HF: Well, if you have an individual that comes from, you know, a spot that is really high, high positive, them individuals would be the one that we will ask to reroute. And there's very, very few individuals from them areas that come through. So, I mean, I couldn't say numbers, but it would be a pretty low number.

CO: Okay, just to get straight, commercial trucks can pass through any commercial deliveries. Residents of South Dakota, people who actually need to get home and go on that highway, can they cross through?

HF: Oh, yeah. Yep. If you're a resident of a reservation or a family of a resident, you are sure welcome to come through.

CO: And if non-commercial visitors out of state, those would not be allowed in?

HF: Well, it depends on if they come from a hotspot, or from an area that has a huge community spread, then we're asking them to reroute.

CO: So I saw…. I was watching a live feed from your checkpoint. During the course of about five minutes, I saw no cars approach. How often do you actually get people who are trying to cross?

HF: On an average, little more than a thousand vehicles per day.

CO: And all of them get stopped?

HF: Yes.

CO: You said you've had one case, and now what you're doing is tracing and the controlling of anyone who comes on. But how equipped are you at the Cheyenne River Sioux tribe? How equipped are you to actually deal with an outbreak if you had one among the Lakota people?

HF: Not very well equipped. You know, we have eight beds, six ventilators, one respiratory therapist. And you've got a thousand residents.

CO: And so how many people could you take care of if they were sick?

HF: Depending on their health condition, very few.

CO: And how close is your nearest hospital?

HF: The one with critical care, which is about three hours’ drive away.

CO: Is there any way you can work things out with the governor? She seems quite, quite adamant that she's going to see you take down these barriers. Is there any way you can work that out with her?

HF: I just don't see anything. I really don't. I mean, who in their right mind would try to prevent someone doing something good?

CO: Right. So what would you say to her? What do you want to say to the governor?

HF: There is nothing that can be said. We will not take down our checkpoints. We will not. I mean, it's just as simple as that. I mean, there's no need to because we gotta do some to save our people. Because I'll guarantee you this, the state government won’t, or the federal government.

CO: Chairman Frazier, we'll leave it there. We'll be following what's happening in South Dakota. And I appreciate speaking with you. Thank you.

HF: Oh yeah, you bet. Thank you.

CO: Take care.

CH: Harold Frazier is the chairman of the Cheyenne River Sioux Tribe. We reached him in Eagle Butte, South Dakota.

[Music: Sombre light rock]

Betty Wright obit

CH: Betty Wright first sang professionally when she was two years old. Which is remarkable enough. What's more remarkable is that she was good. But given what she would go on to accomplish, maybe that's not surprising. Betty Wright died yesterday. She was 66 years old. She had her first hit single at the age of 17: "Clean Up Woman". It was 1971, and the song's funk-meets-disco rhythms would become a decade-defining sound. Over the objections of her deeply religious mother, she made a name for herself singing with honesty about love and sex and the messy reverberations of each. She also had range. Vocally and professionally. She was a phenomenal singer, but she was also an influential songwriter, producer, arranger, and collaborator. Over her career, she worked with performers as diverse as Joss Stone, David Byrne, Alice Cooper, Bob Marley, and DJ Khaled… to name a few. She was a committed mentor to singers and performers she referred to as "my babies" and who often called her "Ma" in kind. Did I mention she started her own record label? She did that too. In 2017, she told an interviewer that Usher once teased her about her bottomless thirst for all things musical, telling her: "Ma, when you die, they gonna have to pry that microphone out of your hand." To which she replied: "What makes you think they gonna get it then?'

[Music: Acoustic guitar]

Part three: Cycling report, hip hop library

Chinese research

CH: I am not a scientist. But to my layperson's ears, Peter Daszak's work sounds like exactly the kind of work that ought to be funded right now. As the president of the New York-based nonprofit, EcoHealth Alliance, Mr. Daszak and his team have spent years researching pandemics, and their ties to wildlife. And now, some other people who are not scientists have reportedly conspired to cut three-point-seven million U.S. dollars in funding to EcoHealth. According to CBS, the Trump Administration revoked the National Institutes of Health grant after Republican lawmaker Matt Gaetz characterized it as, quote, "funding Chinese research." But as Peter Daszak told Scott Pelley last night on "60 Minutes," international cooperation is critical right now -- and the support of the NIH is a critical part of making it happen.

SP: Is there a way to know that this virus, SARS-cov-2, emerged from the wild into the human population, or has that not been proven yet?

PD: Well, I'm a scientist, and what I do is I look at the evidence around a hypothesis. There is a huge amount of evidence that these viruses repeatedly emerge into people from wild animals in rural areas through things like hunting and eating wildlife. There is zero evidence that this virus came out of a lab in China.

SP: Does the Wunan Institute of Virology, to your knowledge, have this virus in its inventory?

PD: No.

SP: Why do you say so?

PD: The closest known relative is one that's different enough that it is not SARS-cov-2. So there's just no evidence that anybody had it in the lab anywhere in the world prior to the outbreak. This politicization of science is really damaging. You know, the conspiracy theories out there have essentially closed down communication between scientists in China and scientists in the U.S. We need that communication in an outbreak to learn from them how they controlled it so we can control it better. It's sad to say, but it will probably cost lives.

[/sc]

CH: Peter Daszak is the president of EcoHealth Alliance in New York. He spoke with Scott Pelley last night, on "60 Minutes." In a tweet addressing that interview, President Trump said CBS is, quote "doing everything within their power ... to defend China and the horrible Virus pandemic that was inflicted on the USA and the rest of the World." Unquote.

[Music: Spanish guitar]

FOA: ‘Deadpool’ stunt driver death

CH: It was her first big break in the movie industry. In 2017, Joi "SJ" Harris was working in Vancouver as a stunt performer on the set of the movie "Deadpool 2". But during one of her stunts, she was thrown from her motorcycle and killed. The production company on that film has now been fined nearly 290 thousand dollars for violating multiple safety rules. A report by WorkSafeBC found that TCF Vancouver Productions Ltd. failed to do a risk assessment — and instructed Ms. Harris not to wear safety headgear while operating her motorcycle. In 2017, As It Happens guest host Mike Finnerty spoke with Ms. Harris's manager, Porsche Taylor. Here's part of that conversation.

[sc]

PT: This was SJ's first stuntwoman job, but she was more than capable of doing any types of stunts. She's a professional road racer and has extensive experience.

MF: Was it something that she had been wanting to do?

PT: Yes. When approached with the opportunity, she was excited and ready to go and just head-over-heels. She was very, very, very happy to do this.

MF: Why did she want to get into stunt performing?

PT: She thought that it would be a great avenue for her to advance her career into a new direction. She loved being a road racer and was super excited about trailblazing in another direction. That’s what she was all about.

MF: Can you tell us a little bit about her path to road racing because she's quoted in your magazine, in 2015, saying, “I'm everything people never saw in this sport.”

PT: Absolutely. SJ began road racing when she took classes because she wanted to get to enhance her skill level on the streets of New York City. For her, whenever there was something she was interested in, she would always do a ton of research and learn everything she could about it. And once she got on the track, she fell in love with it. And she was surprised that there weren't very many women who were racing. And no women of colour, no African-American women in particular. And she was excited about being able to break some new ground in that way.

MF: Why weren't there?

PT: You know, I don't know why in particular there might not have been? I know that road racing itself is a sport that doesn't have very many folks in it of any colour. I know that it's expensive to be a road racer. SJ’s races were all self-funded. So she would work her day job and then save her money for track days and parts and everything that you would need to be a road racer. So it's not something that's super affordable to participate in. So you know I'm sure that that might be a deterrent for some.

[/sc]

CH: From our archives, that was Porsche Taylor speaking with As It Happens guest host Mike Finnerty about Joi "SJ" Harris. In 2017, Ms. Harris died performing a stunt on the set of "Deadpool 2" in Vancouver. The production company behind that film has now been fined nearly $290,000 for violating multiple safety rules.

Cycling report

Guest: Gloria Liu

CH: In this period of physical distancing, a lot of people have taken up cycling as a way to avoid mass transit and to get some exercise. But now, journalists at Outside Magazine have started a project that tracks every cycling death in the U.S. And if the numbers they've gathered are anything to go by, it's not a great time to be a cyclist in the States. According to Outside, nearly 50 people have been killed in cycling accidents since lockdowns began in U.S. cities. Gloria Liu is the features editor at Outside Magazine. We reached her in Boulder, Colorado.

CO: Gloria, just how dangerous are roads in the United States for cyclists right now?

GLORIA LIU: Well, in short, Carol, they haven't been this dangerous for pedestrians or cyclists in 30 years. So in 1990, we saw sort of an all-time high in traffic fatalities for pedestrians and cyclists. And that was going down until about 2010, at which point it began to ratchet back up. And yeah, we saw 857 people on bikes killed by drivers in the U.S. in 2018, which is again, right back up to levels from three decades ago.

CO: It's interesting that in your in the feature you have put together for Outside Magazine, you show the fatalities in 2020. And this is a time when, for the most part, there have been fewer cars on the road because of lockdowns and restrictions, more people cycling. How does it strike you that it seems to be even more deadly since there are fewer cars out there?

GL: Yeah. Well, so the striking thing is actually that nearly 50 people have been killed on bicycles since the United States went into lockdown, which is pretty crazy if you consider the fact that, as you said, there's almost no cars on the road. People aren't driving to work. And yet, you know, we've seen 47 deaths — people on bikes were hit and killed by drivers in just the last, you know, weeks.

CO: What have you been able to find out the reasons why so many people, more people are being killed on their bikes?

GL: There's a few things at play here, but one of the biggest is just an increase in distracted driving, which, you know, we obviously hear about a lot in the news. But when we dug into it, we found that apretty alarming percentage of people are engaged in some sort of technology-based distraction when they're driving. It was 98 per cent, according to one study. Another factor is that Americans are buying and driving larger cars like SUV's and trucks. Those kinds of vehicles are making up an increasing share of new cars sold. I think it's about 70 per cent in the last year. And those cars are 50 per cent more likely to kill pedestrians or people on bikes when they do hit them. Finally, Americans are driving more than ever. We are spending more time on the road and that's going to you know, when combined with distracted driving in bigger vehicles, be the recipe for more fatalities for vulnerable road users.

CO: Your feature and all the statistics you have, a couple of the people in those numbers are actually people who worked at your magazine who died in those collisions, in those road crashes. Is that what inspired you or provoked you, I guess, to track these deaths and get started on this project?

GL: Yeah, exactly. So in February 2018, Andrew Tiilin who is a longtime contributor and former editor at Outside, was struck and killed by a driver when he was fixing a flat tire in Austin, Texas. And he was a very close friend of many of the senior editors at Outside. And it was obviously a great tragedy. So that was the, you know, tragedy that you said provokes this project. But strangely, in July, when I started with Outside, three weeks after my start date, my own fiancee, Andrew Bernstein, was struck by a driver in a van in a hit and run collision in Boulder, Colorado, and left to die. He was really severely injured and ended up in the hospital for three months, suffered a spinal cord injury and now has partial paralysis below the waist. And so this is definitely a topic that hits home for the staff here. And obviously, many of the editors at Outside are cyclists ourselves, or we have family members who are cyclists and is kind of just like, you know, we've seen enough of it. And we wanted to do our part to raise awareness for everyone that we should all be treating driving like the life or death responsibility that it is.

CO: In your feature, you mention of the bike lanes make a difference, designated bike lanes with dividers that we see in Europe that seems to be in most places the one safe way to share the roads. Is that something that you feel is is is lacking in American cities?

GL: Yeah. I do think that dedicated bicycle infrastructure is one of the biggest things that we can do to, one, increase ridership at all. And, two, improve safety for cyclists. One of the top reasons that people say they don't ride a bike more often is that they don't feel safe on our roads. So, unfortunately, though, as we're talking about, car culture is so so king in America that a lot of times, bike infrastructure projects will meet with opposition. You know, Los Angeles is a really great example. Some of the bigger bike lane projects they've proposed there have met with really organized and strongly-voiced opposition from drivers who again, don't believe that they should share the road with anybody else and have a lot of misconceptions in their mind, too, about how much bike lanes would slow down traffic.

CO: Well, Gloria, we'll leave it there. And thank you for speaking with us.

GL: Okay, thank you so much, Carol.

GL: Bye.

Gloria.

CH: Gloria Liu is a features editor at Outside Magazine. We reached her in Boulder, Colorado.

Jerry Stiller obit

[sc]

JERRY STILLER: The tradition of Festivus begins with the airing of grievances. I got a lot of problems with your people. [laugh track] Now, you're going to hear about it. You, Kroger, my son tells me your company stinks.

JASON ALEXANDER: Oh, God. [laugh track]

JS: Quiet. You’ll get yours in a minute. [laugh track] Kroger, you couldn't smooth a silk sheet if you had a hot date with a… I lost my train of thought.

[/sc]

CH: An unforgettable scene from "Seinfeld": Frank Costanza yelling at his son George's boss, as part of a celebration he made up called "Festivus". One of the weirdest characters in TV history, played with total conviction by the great Jerry Stiller. Mr. Stiller died this morning. He was 92. Playing Frank Costanza was the start of an unexpected third act in Mr. Stiller's life. in the '70s, he'd been a New York stage actor — doing drama and farce on and off-Broadway. He'd also been half of a successful comedy duo with his wife, Anne Meara, who'd been a staple on "The Ed Sullivan Show". After a decade, they stopped working together — although they stayed married. Jerry Stiller didn't have another regular gig until the early '90s, when he got a call to audition for some show about nothing. He'd just finished a play, and he wasn't keen. In 2011, in an interview with the Television Academy Foundation, he explained how he got a part he didn't initially want.

[/sc]

CH: That was Jerry Stiller, explaining to the Television Academy Foundation how he got the part of Frank Costanza on "Seinfeld". Mr. Stiller died today, at the age of 92.

[Music: Eerie ambience]

Hip Hop Library

Guest: Brian Foo

CH: The snap, crackle, and pop of a dusty old record used to be a common sound in hip hop music. Some producers digging through crates of records for samples even welcomed the sound — because it showed the lengths they'd gone to to find that perfect, obscure record. But lately, that Golden Era sound is hard to find. Copyright law has made sampling a legal nightmare, and a polished digital sound has taken over the airwaves. Brian Foo is nostalgic for sample-based music. And he has a plan to bring it back. The artist and computer scientist is currently an Innovator-in-Residence at the U.S. Library of Congress. He's created an open-source software project called "Citizen DJ" that allows musicians to sample from the library's massive collection. We reached Brian Foo in New York City.

CO: Brian, why did you want to create this Citizen DJ project?

BRIAN FOO: I like to think it started like a really long time ago, like in the ‘90s and 2000s when, you know, when I was a teenager, like listening to hip hop, you know, got really into like the culture and the history of hip hop. And, you know, I became a B-boy or a breakdancer in the ‘90s and 2000s. And I've always been fascinated with the idea of, like the DJ, you know, somebody who, especially in the early days of hip hop, would be, you know, this collector of sounds. They would be, you know, in the backs of, you know, thrift shops and record stores, you know, digging through crates of old records and vinyl and, you know, looking for the most obscure sounds they could find.

CO: And so just to tell us how someone can be a Citizen DJ, how can they work this program?

BF: Yes. So the idea is that we're providing online tools that allow really anybody with an Internet connection to access as much free-to-use audio and video material from the Library of Congress. And use it in a way in which it's completely unrestricted. So they can, you know, remix it, make a new beat, and then that new creation is theirs. And they can share it. They can give it away for free. They can sell it.

CO: Wow! [chuckling] I mean, the Library of Congress, that must be quite an archive. I mean, just give us a brief kind of a range of what sounds they could actually access for this?

BF: Yeah. So, I mean, it's been a real privilege working with the staff at the Library of Congress. You know, they're so knowledgeable and there's just so much there. So they really gave me a diversity of different types of sounds. So, you know, for example, like some of the older sounds of, you know, the Thomas Edison collection, with the wax cylinders from the early 20th century. All the way through to, you know, more contemporary music in the past decades, spoken word, oral histories, government film, radio broadcasts. It really spans the range of sonic material.

CO: We want to give people a little sample. What we'll do is we’ll play a bit of an original recording from the Library of what you've described there in the archive. And then we will play how it can be you. So here's the recording from the library.

[Music: An old violin and piano recording]

CO: All right. That does not sound like hip hop. So why don’t you tell us what that is and what you did with it?

BF: Yes. So that's an item in the Thomas Edison collection I mentioned. It's one of the items on wax cylinders. This is a very old item, I think, from the early ‘20s. And yeah, the idea is that I wanted to take like one of the older sounds and just flip it and make it into like a more contemporary sound. So hopefully that was successful.

CO: Okay, so that was a recording, “Old Pal, Why Don't You Answer Me?” And so here's how you answer. Here's what you created, using this program that you put together.

[Music: Now this is much funkier! It’s kind of an electronic sample]

CO: Okay, that’s great. I was just thinking back to whoever recorded that wax cylinder in 1921, “Old Pal, Why Don't You Answer Me?” Never could have imagined what you would be doing with it in 2020 [both chuckle]. So that's available for other people to actually do now?

BF: Yeah. Yeah. So all this material. You know, I'm really excited to hear, you know, what can be done from it. And I hope that it's music that would just be really surprising and would otherwise be impossible to make. You know, given that it's currently rather challenging to make new music using sampled material.

CO: We know that the ‘80s and ‘90s, the hip hop, using audio material borrowed and stolen, making these audio collages, that was very much part of that whole art movement of the ‘90s, wasn't it, all the collage and visual arts as well.

BF: Yes.

CO: And it all stopped because the copyright police arrived and shut it all down. So is this a kind of way of being able to return to that without having those restrictions?

BF: Absolutely. I mean, part of this project stemmed from me, you know, wanting to make music myself, sample-based music myself and doing it in a responsible way. I'm not as much as a rebel as like, you know, Public Enemy or something. But, you know, I wanted to like honestly ask, you know, what is the sonic material like in our shared culture that we have access to really just freely imagine what can be made with them.

CO: Brian, it's great to talk to you. Thank you.

BF: All right. Great. Thank you.

CO: Bye.

BF: Bye.

CH: Brian Foo is the creator of "Citizen DJ" — an open-source software that allows musicians to sample recordings from the U.S. Library of Congress collection. We reached him in New York City. And you can find more on that story on our webpage, at: www.cbc.ca/aih.

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May 11, 2020 Episode Transcript

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