Note: Transcripts may contain errors. If you wish to re-use all, or part of, a transcript, please contact CBC for permission. Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print. Copyright © CBC 2020

The AIH Transcript for January 30, 2020

Hosts: Carol Off and Chris Howden

CAROL OFF: Hello, I’m Carol Off.

CHRIS HOWDEN: Good evening, I'm Chris Howden. This is As It Happens.

[Music: Theme]

Prologue

CH: Tonight:

CO: Coronavirus alert. As the World Health Organization declares a global emergency, we speak to a BBC reporter in Beijing living in quarantine in his apartment. He says one of the world's biggest cities looks like a ghost town.

CH: One of U.S. President Donald Trump's lawyers is arguing that abuse of power is not an impeachable offence. Our guest says that idea is not only offensive. In her words, it's "flabbergastingly stupid".

CO: A team Mascot has one job: To get everyone together behind a common goal. But Laurentian University says Victor the Voyageur's not doing that at all — so they're putting him on ice.

CH: A very cold case. An archaeologist is shocked to discover that a young woman who was mummified in ancient Egypt didn't die of natural causes at all.

CO: Raise your hand if you're sure. Well, I'm pretty sure I don't like the idea of robots that can sweat. But that hasn't stopped scientists from creating them anyway.

CH: And... Sky watch. A researcher discovers a new type of Northern lights with the help of a group of aurora chasers in Finland. She'll tell us why she got shivers the first time she saw the images.

CH: As It Happens, the Thursday edition. Radio that trusts she'll speak in glowing terms.

[Music: Theme]

Part one: Coronavirus: quarantined reporter, Trump impeachment, new aurora borealis

Coronavirus: quarantined reporter

Guest: Stephen McDonell

CH: The world is now in the midst of a global health emergency. That was the announcement from the World Health Organization today, as the coronavirus continues to spread. According to Johns Hopkins University researchers, there are now more than eight-thousand cases of the virus, and more than 170 people have died. Here is W.H.O Director-General Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus.

SOUNDCLIP

TEDROS ADHANOM GHEBREYESUS: The main reason for this declaration is not because of what is happening in China, but because of what is happening in other countries. Our greatest concern is the potential for the virus to spread to countries with weaker health systems. W.H.O continues to have the confidence in China's capacity to control the outbreak. I was in China just a few days ago, where I met with President Xi Jinping. I left in absolutely no doubt about China's commitment to transparency and to protecting the world's people.

CH: That was W.H.O. Director-General Tedros Adhanom announcing that the coronavirus outbreak has officially become a global health emergency. Inside China, BBC reporter Stephen McDonell is trying to cover the story. But after visiting Hubei province, he's been forced to quarantine himself in his apartment in Beijing. That's where we reached him.

CO: Stephen, you're covering one of the biggest stories in China in years, and yet, you're forced to stay home in quarantine. As a reporter, what's that like?

STEPHEN MCDONELL: Well, it's not too bad because, in a way, at least I got to initially go to the sort of heart of it in Hubei province. And it's because we were there that upon returning to Beijing, I’ve had to stay at home for a couple of weeks. You know, it's it is also interesting here though because at the moment, seriously like in this enormous city, there's barely anybody on the streets. It's incredible. Shops are closed. And it's like the whole country has gone into sort of ghost town mode. It's quite incredible.

CO: from the contact you have had with people. What's the level of fear that people are feeling right now?

SM: Obviously, it's more serious when you're in the sort of what you might call the disaster hot zone — the virus hot zone. So we went down to Hunan and drove into Hubei Province. Now, the closer we're getting to Hubei, the more people are worried. There are obviously more checkpoints. There are police. There are medical teams dressed head-to-toe in protective gear. To pass those checkpoints, you need to have a temperature screening. And then once you go into Hubei, well, of course, people are most worried there because that's where the coronavirus outbreak started. When I there, I sort of thought to come back to Beijing and people will be much more relaxed. But it hasn't been that way. I mean, going into the building I live in, you have to also have a screen. The building that the BBC bureau is in, they're doing the same thing. I think though that the mood that people are worried. Well, it's hard to sum it up because obviously there’s a lot of different views. But I think mainly they're pretty happy that the government is taking this very decisive action — even though it's kind of draconian and heavy-handed. And locking down a province of 60 million people, it's like the entire population of Italy not being able to move around.

CO: Right. So you got into Hubei province in order to do this story there — difficulty even getting in. But how did you get out? Because 60 million people, as you point out, in Hubei province are basically locked down in that place. So how difficult was it actually to cross the border and get out of that province and get back to Beijing?

SM: When we went to go in, the police were like, well, we'll let you in, but we’re not going to let you back out again. And that's when we first realized they were going to lock down the whole province. So we thought, oh well, what the hell? And we just pushed ahead and went in, not knowing how we’d get back out again. We traveled through lots of towns — which just felt like they were completely deserted. If people had top order that nobody lived there anymore, you would believe it. Apart from the odd person walking down the street, sort of hunched over with their facemask on. And then we went to a small city and we're interviewing a patient from their hospital bed via phone app. I wished this person good health, you know, [ speaking Mandarin] as you say in Mandarin. And hung up the phone, as if on cue, the police turned up and the local sort of government officials were hot on their heels and basically said they didn't want us there. And we'd sort of at that point realized we're not going to get around any more than to do any more of the filming that we'd done. And so we said to them, well look, you know even if we wanted to go, how would we get out of this province? Because you know it's all locked down. Oh, no worries, they said [chuckle]. And they escorted us back across the border — so with the police lights flashing. It was more important for them to breach their own quarantine procedures then have a sort of team of pesky journalists hanging around.

CO: As far as the virus itself, the reports are that it is still spreading, that they haven't contained the spread. That's quite alarming. Either we're getting new that more people are being diagnosed and we're getting that data, or it's actually on the move. So what are you hearing as far as if the containment efforts are actually working?

SM: Well, the comparison, I guess, is SARS. So in 2002, SARS outbreak happened here, leading to more than 700 deaths. This time round, it's spreading much more quickly. So already, there are there are more people in Beijing at this stage of this crisis than there were in the entire SARS emergency — which lasted for seven months. However, this time round, the virus doesn't seem to be as deadly — at least not at this stage — unless it mutates. So while on the one hand, the authorities are very worried about the speed of it, there is some silver lining in that it doesn't seem to be as deadly. The larger question of whether or not they’re actually controlling this is an interesting one. I mean, I think the situation is surely much better than the complete global disaster it could have been if they had not put these very strict travel restrictions in place in China. You know, you can you can you can imagine like again, comparing to SARS, there are six times as many people flying out of China now as there were in 2002 when the SARS outbreak happened. So that's why it's more important to get on top of this much more quickly. And I think why the government decided you know what? If we have to lock down 60-million people for a couple of months, that's what we're going to do.

CO: All right, Stephen. We will leave it there. Stay healthy, and I hope you don't get too bored being cooped up in your apartment. But I appreciate speaking with you. Thank you.

SM: No worries. I'm sure that the BBC will keep me busy filing anyway [both chuckle].

CO: Goodnight.

CO: Good to talk to you too.

CH: Stephen McDonell is the BBC's China correspondent. We reached him in quarantine in Beijing, China. Mr. McDonell may not be going anywhere, but a Montreal family is one step closer to going home — or part of the family is. Over the past few days we've been following Megan Millward and Lie Zhung and their quest to leave the countryside of Hubei. Today, they finally heard from Canadian consular officials about plans to get their family home. But their relief was short-lived when they learned that only some of them would be allowed to leave. Ms. Millward gave an update to Mike Finnerty, host of CBC Montreal's "Daybreak".

SOUNDCLIP

MEGAN MILLWARD: So the good news is that now we know that there is a plan to evacuate. The bad news is that my husband, who is a permanent resident of Canada, but not a citizen, will not be part of the evacuation. What I was told by the person at the consulate is that it's the Chinese government who determines who counts as a foreign citizen. And so because he has a Chinese passport, he Chinese national and will not be allowed to leave.

MIKE FINNERTY: What do you think of that?

MM: Obviously, I don't think it's great. I would rather that he is not stuck in an area that is full of people who are sick with this virus because I would rather see that come down with it. Especially since we're in the countryside, and there are not only roadblocks on the highway, there are also roadblocks on the small roads, and even the roads leading out of this town. If something were to happen, even if we didn't contract the coronavirus, if he had anything else or he needed medical support, there's basically no capacity at any hospitals nearby.

CH: That's Megan Millward speaking with CBC Montreal's Mike Finnerty. Today, Ms. Millward connected with consular officials about plans to repatriate her family from Hubei province in China. However, her husband — Lie Zhung — will not be going with them. He is a permanent resident of Canada. But, as you heard, he has a Chinese passport. And because the Chinese government considers him a Chinese national, he is not allowed to leave.

[Music: Ambient]

Trump impeachment

Guest: Elizabeth Holtzman

CH: The impeachment of U.S. President Donald Trump has been front page news for months. But the Senate trial could all be over within a matter of days. If senators decide not to allow witness testimony, a final vote to convict or acquit President Trump could come as early as Friday night. But before they get there, senators have a chance to question the impeachment managers, and the President's legal team — which includes Harvard Law School professor emeritus Alan Dershowitz. Yesterday, he argued that even if the president did leverage US security aid for political reasons, it wouldn't be an impeachable offense -- if he thought his re-election was in the public interest.

SOUNDCLIP

ALAN DERSHOWITZ: Every public official that I know believes that his election is in the public interest. And mostly you’re right. Your election is in the public interest. And if a president does something which he believes will help him get elected in the public interest that cannot be the kind of quid pro quo that results in impeachment.

CH: That's not the only controversial argument posed by Alan Dershowitz. He's also said that abuse of power is not a basis for impeachment conviction — because it is not a criminal offence. That isn't sitting well with Elizabeth Holtzman. She's a former Democratic Congresswoman, and was on the House Judiciary Committee where she voted to impeach President Richard Nixon — for, among other things, abuse of power. We reached Elizabeth Holtzman in New York.

CO: Ms Holtzman, hearing Alan Dershowitz just now argue that if the president does something he believes will get him elected, and he believes that's in the public interest, that it's not impeachable. So what do you make of Alan Dershowitz his argument?

ELIZABETH HOLTZMAN: It's nonsense. It's absurd. It's fraudulent. And it's crackpot law. I was on the House Judiciary Committee during Watergate. And the Nixon impeachment — which everyone says is the gold standard of impeachment proceedings. Charge Nixon with trying to cover up abuse of powers of his office in order to get re-elected. So Dershowitz’s his argument is a complete contradiction of history. It's flabbergasting in the stupidity, in the dishonesty and in the cracked-pottedness of it.

CO: Now, I understand that Alan Dershowitz he actually taught you. So [chuckling] when you say this is crackpot, I mean, what do you make of that coming from somebody I presume you respected at some point?

EH: Yeah, well, he wasn't the greatest professor I had at Harvard Law School. And he wasn't the most brilliant professor. But having sat through the Watergate impeachment proceeding, the break-in at the Democratic National Headquarters by Nixon's people was designed to help him get re-elected. And the cover-up of that break-in was designed to help him get re-elected. Nobody in his right mind made the argument at that time that it was okay for Nixon to do those things. People went to jail for those things.

CO: It's interesting that there were on the air yesterday repeats of the interview that Richard Nixon gave to David Frost — where President Nixon says that when a president does something, it's not illegal. And that basically saying that burglary may be a crime, but the president must have the discretion of doing something if it's in the public interest. There was a kind of breathtaking moment when he said that years ago. Did the people accept that then?

EH: But Dershowitz has made that argument even worse. Because what Dershowitz is saying is that if a president does it in his own interest, in other words, if a president does it to get re-elected, that per say is in the public interest. That per say is acceptable. I mean, that is such garbage. It's really kind of shocking. Somebody said does he have a brain tumour? I mean, your jaw just drops at hearing it.

CO: Now, Donald Trump has tweeted his defence over and over again. He says no quid pro quo. And now, he has a lawyer who says, well, maybe quid pro quo, but that's not an impeachable offence. So what do you make of that contradiction?

EH: [chuckling] Everything they say is a contradiction. If it’s not a contradiction with what they said before, it's a contradiction with what the law is. I mean, the day before that, Alan Dershowitz said that an abuse of power is not an impeachable offence. And even though he admitted that he said that it was an impeachable offence many years ago. And even though he admitted that he's the only legal scholar — if you want to call him a scholar, I don't — who espouses this point of view. He just went ahead and said it. And you know I don't know how to react to that except to say that that argument is also nonsense. And it's also willfully deceptive because, in the Nixon impeachment, our second article of impeachment was called abuse of power. And that article was adopted with the most Republican support of all. So what is he talking about?

CO: Does it appear though that the Republicans are embracing it because they're looking for the talking points? They need the argument that can take them to the place where they say, well, let's shut this down. Let's not have witnesses. It's over. This is not an impeachable offence. Let's move on. Is that is that what Mr. Dershowitz accomplishes with this is that he gives the Republicans their arguments?

EH: I think so. I think so. And I think the point is the ends justify the means. If the end is to get Donald Trump acquitted then any argument that he makes is in furtherance of that. That's probably okay. After all, you can make that argument for anybody. Why isn't it in the public good for someone to lie about the law if it's to get a president re-elected if you think that's in the public good? So all that [laughing] Alan Dershowitz is arguing is, yes, the ends justify the means.

CO: Just finally, does it appear though that Mr. Dershowitz has given the Republicans what they need to shut this down, to have a vote to acquit the President?

EH: Of course, they could. People could latch onto this argument and say, you know, Trump acted for his own best interest in getting re-elected. That's a public good. So, therefore, whatever he did is not an impeachable offence. Trump once said that if he stood on Fifth Avenue and shot a gun, he would lose no supporters. Well, that's what Dershowitz is saying. And that's what a support for acquittal here would be. Whatever the president wants, he can have. There's no crime. There's no wrongdoing if the president does it in his own interest.

CO: Ms Holtzman, I know you're glued to this trial, so we'll let you go. Thanks for speaking with us.

EH: Thank you. Bye.

CH: Elizabeth Holtzman is a former Democratic Congresswoman who was on the House Judiciary Committee where she voted to impeach President Richard Nixon. We reached Ms Holtzman in New York.

[Music: World music]

New aurora borealis

Guest: Minna Palmroth

CH: Between fake news, terrible opinions, and everyone else's life looking way better than yours, there's a lot of bad stuff on Facebook. But in Finland, something good has come out of the platform — the discovery of a new form of northern lights. That's thanks to a community of amateur stargazers, who passed the information on to Minna Palmroth. She is a professor of computational space physics at the University of Helsinki. We reached her in Espoo, Finland.

CO: Professor Palmroth, can you describe this new form of northern lights. What do they look like?

MINA PALMROTH: Yeah, sure. So they are like dunes on a sandy beach. So basically, what you see is horizontal aurora — where the light from the aurora comes such that it's it looks like waves. So that there are places on the aurora which are more bright and then places adjacently where it's not so bright, so you can see this wavy structure in the aurora.

CO: Wow! And, of course, we're not doing justice to it. People have to see it. And we'll give them the connections so they can go online and look at it. But what kinds of colours are we talking about?

MP: That's green — green only — coming from the 100 kilometres altitude.

CO: Wow! And very bright? Have you got really good pictures?

MP: Yeah, so I guess the brightness is such that if an aurora watcher could be you know taking pictures of the aurora, it would be barely visible to the naked eye. So it's much better viewed from the camera. [CO laughs] So it's ideal for the chasers — or aurora chasers.

CO: You mentioned the aurora chasers. And these are amateurs. These are people who love to do this just to out of pure delight of staring into the sky. So how did you come to learn about this new form?

MP: Yeah. So, years ago, like maybe five years ago, I got a very polite email from the chasers in Finland, saying that good professor, can you join our Facebook group to explain the physics of the aurora? And I did that. And over the years, I’ve found that I'm always explaining the same things because you know the group grew and so on. And then I decided that okay, I'll make a book. I'll write the book so that I don't have to answer all the time. So then I write what I did is that I made a list of the known auroral forms which is known in science, and used in science, like omega bands, and so on. And. I made a challenge for the chasers saying that catch me these aurora and I'll put them into the book then. So it basically became like a bird watching book. But instead of birds you take auroral forms [both laughing]. So then when the book was ready, one of the chasers said to me that, oh well, now you didn't say where these stripes belong to. And that was basically the start of this new study.

CO: Wow! And so when someone [laughing] says where do these stripes belong? And you looked, did you realize right away that this was something special?

MP: I actually kind of had the shivers as you say in English. Because I hadn't seen anything like that before. And I was thinking immediately that this must be something new. Of course, it might be just my ignorance. And I haven't possibly been read reading all of the papers which come in the aurora community. So then I made a literature search. And at least to my knowledge, it seems so. And the paper was peer-reviewed. So neither did the reviewers of the paper or so, so we do think it's a new form.

CO: How often does that happen that you find a new form of northern lights?

MP: I might be wrong, of course. But I don't remember that there has been a new form, apart maybe from the picket fence — which was followed by the Canadian chasers a while ago. That was probably something that could be.

CO: WOW! We have talked to about this. And so this is that the picket fence is something that the Canadians found. And so just back just to this latest one that you've discovered in Finland. How different is it from the existing ones that we already know about?

MP: Well, it is rather distinctive. Normally when we see an aurora, we see a curtain or arc. And now we see this waveform — which isn't something that you basically normally expect when you see the aurora. And I actually think also that one of the reasons here why this was found now is the improving of the digital cameras because if the phenomenon is like barely visible to the naked eye, maybe it's difficult to discern.

CO: So now is it only in Finland? Does have to have the right camera and be in Finland in order to see this phenomenon?

MP: No. And I mean now that this paper is out, I've been already receiving a lot of observations from all around the world and also from the Canadians also. So beautiful pictures of the dunes people have put into Twitter and so on and also emailed me directly.

CO: Wow! Well, hats off to the aurora chasers around the world, and especially those in Finland. And thank you for speaking with us, Professor Palmroth.

MP: Thank you very much. And thanks for calling me. And I hope there will be lots of great observations of the dunes yours from Canada.

CO: That sounds very exciting. Thank you so much.

MP: Thank you. Bye.

CO: Goodnight.

CH: Minna Palmroth is a professor of computational space physics at the University of Helsinki. We reached her in Espoo, Finland.

[Music: Instrumental bells chime]

Part two: Brexit: British Member of European Parliament, murdered mummy

Brexit: British Member of European Parliament

Guest: Alexandra Phillips

CH: Breaking up was extremely hard to do. But at long last, the time has come: British members of European Parliament are headed home this week. And whether they fought for Brexit or bitterly opposed it, their time in Brussels is over. After an emotional vote for the Brexit withdrawal agreement yesterday, the 47-year relationship came to an end. The UK officially leaves the EU tomorrow. And Alexandra Phillips leaves what has — for nearly a year now — been her second home. Ms Phillips is the Green Party Member of European Parliament for South East England — for another few hours at least. We reached her today in Brighton.

CO: Ms Phillips, how are you feeling personally having taken your leave of Brussels?

ALEXANDRA PHILIPS: Well, obviously, I am profoundly sad and pretty devastated. But you know I think now we need to reflect on the next eleven months and how we can ensure that the UK is aligned as closely as possible with the EU so that we don't become some sort of race to the bottom on standards — whether they be workers’ rights or environmental protections. I think that's the real worry that we have now.

CO: But just to go back to what it was like yesterday, and during the vote. And so many symbols, right? I mean, there's so many things going on, powerful images that came from that moment. And I'm just wondering what the exchanges were like? What was the feeling and the mood you got from your fellow MEPs?

AP: Well, you know, I think you know they also felt profound sadness. And you know there's a lot of love actually I think in that room — especially when we sang “Auld Lang Syne”. But I think a lot of MEPs are really sad to see the Brits go, and hope that we will be back and return one day.

CO: And what was the feeling you had when Nigel Farage was with the other Brexitiers, with their little flags — the union jacks. And the remarks he's made that we are now. We won't be talked down to anymore. We're not going to be bullied anymore. Is that something that was shared by many people?

AP: [snicker] No, I mean that's deeply embarrassing because he clearly, after even 20 years of being an MEP there, simply doesn't understand how the system works [laughing]. And I think that's partly because he's refused to engage with it. And it's not about being bullied. It's not being about being talked down. It's about a collective. And about working with our neighbours. You know there are 73 British MEPs. And there will be until midnight tomorrow, European time. And we've got a large or you know we have had up until then a large seat at the table. So it's about collaboration. And, unfortunately, Farage and others like that do not understand it. And they also spout lies about MEPs not being able to propose laws and so forth. But we had a big law across the European Union a couple of years back on data protection. And that actually came from a Green MEP who proposed it, and the commission took it up. So not only did they choose to misunderstand how Europe works, but they also purport a lot of misinformation as well.

CO: Well, their view they’ve said that you and others don't understand how democracy works. [AP scoffs] and that they won the vote. And that the Brits have spoken, and this is how they want things to be. So what do you say to that?

AP: Well, democracy is pretty dead in the UK. It needs ripe reform. Our politicians and our media are owned. And their owned by rich individuals and presidents of other countries. And that's how it all works. And people are spouting lies like the famous 350-million pounds a week. And because austerity has crippled so many poor people in the UK, you know, we’re the sixth richest nation apparently, yet, three-million children remain in poverty. That's a third of all children in the UK live in poverty — which is a national outcry, really. And that is down purely down to austerity. And I understand why people in that situation would’ve voted to leave, being told these lies about the NHS, having been promised a better future by Nigel Farage and his mates. But actually, unfortunately, it will only be Nigel Farage and his mates — the very rich individuals — who will benefit from Brexit. And it will be those at the other end of the scale, the most vulnerable, and the poorest in society who will lose out the most. And that's a tragedy, actually.

CO: But what will you do now — because you're not going to roll this back. If you feel that these are who are going to lose out, then what obligations do you and others have to try and make this work as best you can for those you feel who are going to be the losers of Brexit?

AP: Well, that's why I said in response to your first question, the next 11 months are crucial because this is a transition period. And so we need to work very hard to ensure, to put pressure on our own government to ensure that we are closely aligned with the EU on a whole host of standards. So that it's not some sort of race to the bottom on workers’ rights or environmental protections. But you know that's going to be incredibly difficult because we have a very right-wing government now. We've not seen this type of right-wing government well in my lifetime, and I've seen Thatcher. So, yeah, I will work as hard as I can, but I don't hold a huge amount of hope out in the immediate future. I think that going forward. It's clear that we need to kick the Tories out of government here. And the only way to do that is to hurt. Because we have this archaic first past, the post system is to have some sort of anti-Tory alliance so that people only have one anti-Tory option to vote for in each constituency. And then we can do things like you know revamp our whole democratic system, bring in proportional representation, get rid of first past the post, and potentially have another referendum on rejoining the EU. But we're talking about being you know a decade away from that.

CO: All right. [laughing] You've we've been joined by your son, who clearly wants your attention [both laughing], and deserves it more than I do. So we'll let you go, Ms Phillips. And, of course, we'll be watching the developments over these weeks, and these next eleven months. Thank you.

AP: Lovely. Thanks so much.

CH: Alexandra Phillips is a Green Party MEP who's taking her leave of Brussels this week, as the UK's 47-year relationship with the European Union comes to an end. We reached her in Brighton.

[Music: winding instrumental]

Laurentian mascot

CH: He's a burly, bearded, toque-wearing caricature of a French-Canadian explorer. Now, Laurentian University is saying au revoir to its mascot, Victor the Voyager. The mascot has been put on indefinite hiatus as the Sudbury, Ontario university looks for a new one. The school says Victor the Voyageur's image does not match with the university's goal to be more inclusive. Shelly Moore-Frappier is Laurentian's interim Associate Vice President of Academic Indigenous Programs. Here's what she told CBC Sudbury.

SOUNDCLIP

SHELLY MOORE-FRAPPIER: You know, it's 2020, so let's start talking about things that reflect us all. So I think that's essentially what we're looking at is that we want people to see themselves. And the Lurentian community is a diverse community. When we look at the internationalization and the Indigenisation of our Lurentian community, I think that we need to start to think about okay, so how does everybody feel included? So when you can't see yourself in something, then you go okay, that's one step further away from belonging, right? So we want to create a place where everybody feels a sense of belonging, and yeah.

CASEY STRANGES: What can you tell us about the history of the voyageur?

SMF: You know, I can only speak from my point of view of how I understand it. I think that we can't ignore that voyageurs played a part in colonization. I think that's evident. However, that's the reason why we're doing this review is talking about it from all different angles, and looking at what is it that we want? You know, what are those things about the voyageur that we want to uphold ? Or you know why did we choose the voyageur in the first place. I think that we really need to have those conversations before we start to make some comments about those conversations [laughing deeply].

CS: What kind of a mascot would you like to see?

SMF: I don't want to see a peoples characterized. You know, I think that I would like to see something that everyone can relate to.

CH: That was Shelly Moore-Frappier, Interim Vice President of Academic Indigenous Programs at Laurentian University. She was speaking with CBC Sudbury reporter Casey Stranges. Victor the Voyageur, Laurentian's mascot, has been put on an indefinite hiatus. The school is now looking for a new mascot who is more inclusive.

[Music: Sombre piano]

Murdered mummy

Guest: Eileen Murphy

CH: Eileen Murphy has uncovered a millennias-old murder. Professor Murphy is an archaeologist at Queen's University Belfast. She's part of a team that's been working on the ancient Egyptian mummy of a young woman called Takabuti. Professor Murphy first encountered the mummy during a childhood visit to Belfast's Ulster Museum. And now, using modern technology, her team has made a horrific discovery. We reached Professor Eileen Murphy in Belfast.

CO: Professor Murphy, first of all, who was Takabuti?

EILEEN MURPHY: Takabuti was a young woman. She was probably about in her 20s or 30s when she died. And she would have lived in Egypt during the 25th dynasty, so about two-thousand, six-hundred years ago.

CO: And was she someone special. Was she royalty? What do you know about her?

EM: Well, we know from her hieroglyphics that she was a mistress of a house. So that means that she was probably married, and probably high status. And the hieroglyphics also tell us that her father was a priest of Amun — which, again, is an indication that she would have been you know quite wealthy.

CO: And how did she die?

EM: Well, this is the big discovery. For many years, we all thought she looked very peaceful in her coffin. And her skeleton looked quite healthy. Her mummy looked quite healthy. But advances in imaging techniques have now revealed that she actually died from a massive as stab wound to her back, up near her left shoulder.

CO: And what can you tell about that stab wound? What might have happened? Was there a fight? Was she defending herself? She was stabbed in the back I guess, hey?

EM: Yeah, basically, she was stabbed in the back. So it probably was dealt from above. And it was probably some sort of a battle axe. Because you know the injury is quite large. And she was actually a very petite person. She's only about five-foot-one. She was quite tiny. So she probably had this massive injury to her back. And that probably would have killed her pretty quickly.

CO: How old was she then?

EM: So she was only about in her 20s or 30s. And you know we've got quite a lot of information about her hair. You know, she was quite unusual in that she kept her own hair. You know, because most Egyptians at that time would have been shaven-headed because of the heat and because of lice infestation. But she had a head of auburn curls. So we kind of get an impression you know she was a young woman who cared about her appearance.

CO: And so I'm sure you were trying to imagine what led to this young woman — this beautiful young woman — being murdered?

EM: Well, that's it. We know in the broader context that Egypt was quite tumultuous at that time. It was ruled by princes from Ethiopia. And there was a lot of sort of attacks from the Assyrians to the north. So there was a lot of sort of political intrigue and people coming and going. So maybe poor Takabuti got caught up in that.

CO: You've also determined though that her mother was possibly of European or Caucasian descent.

EM: Well, yes, this is what the DNA results are suggesting so far. And whenever you look at Takabuti's facial features, you know even the antiquarians back in 1835 or commenting on how sort of what they refer to as Caucasian she looked. There's interesting things about her name as well — which isn't Egyptian. And one translation suggests that means from two places. So were still doing tests, but at the moment, we're thinking that perhaps her mother was from outside Egypt, and that her father may have been Egyptian.

CO: I understand that you, as a young girl going to the museum, you would actually see these remains. It was something from your childhood.

EM: Oh, absolutely. That's one of my earliest memories is as going to the Ulster Museum with my mum. And I always wanted to make a b-line to go and see Takabuti. And she was presented in it was quite a dark room, you know? And she was very much the centrepiece. But I always thought she was just amazing. And she is one of the reasons that I became an archaeologist.

CO: But given that inspired you, or it had such an effect on music as a girl, what does it say to you now to know that Takabuti died of such violence?

EM: Well, I have to say I was I was quite shocked because that was not something I was anticipating. You know, like I say, we were very much focusing on her as a as a person, and her hair, and you know how she was mummified. And we hadn't seen any obvious sort of signs of disease. So it really was a shock discovery when you know this new investigation of the images revealed this really obvious blow. You know, it's very stark. So it is quite horrible. But I suppose you know it's sort of his telling her story. And we’ve been able to do that more and more detail. And now, we can maybe appreciate that she had a pretty unpleasant end.

CO: And so it's not just science, you start to imagine how she lived, and what it was like, and what might have led to this horrible end?

EM: Well, absolutely. And you know people like myself who are you know bio-archaeologists and who do study the remains of the dead, you know, we always do want to find out more about the person. Because we know we're very privileged to be able to you know look at the remains for our ancestors. So we want to tell their stories, and remember that they're people. You know, that they're more than just a body.

CO: And more than just an object or a spectacle. So I'm wondering if now, knowing what you know, do people ever wonder, do you ever wonder, whether out of respect for the dead that she should be wrapped back up and allowed to rest in peace?

EM: Well, this is this is a question that comes up. Now, Takabuti, she is partially wrapped. You know, all you can see is her face and one hand and one foot. So there is a lot of debate about the display of the dead and the ethics involved with that. But there's been a lot of work and a lot of surveys done you know to sort of get the consent views of the public. And most people you know do want to see the remains of people from long ago. And with the ancient Egyptians in a way, you know they wanted to be kind of honoured and remembered. And another aspect of the display of Egyptian mummies is that it's you know a lot of the people in Egypt actually support this because they think it's a really nice way to share their culture around the world. I mean, it's a debate — there's no right or wrong answer.

CO: It's such a sad story. I appreciate talking to you, Professor Murphy. Thank you.

EM: Thank you very much.

CH: Eileen Murphy is a professor of bio-archaeology at Queen's University Belfast. We reached her in Belfast.

[Music: Jazz]

Sweaty robots

CH: Thomas Edison once said that genius is one per cent inspiration and 99 per cent perspiration — a brilliant maxim about the hard work that goes into creativity. Or may just a personal confession from Mr. Edison about why his shirts were always so wet. When it comes to robots, I've always used that saying to reassure myself. Because they will definitely try to destroy humanity, but there couldn't ever be an evil robot genius — because machines can't perspire. Well, that's not reassuring anymore — because scientists from Cornell University and the Istituto Italiano di Technologia have created a soft robot hand that sweats. It has three fingers that look like orange plastic caterpillars. Each finger contains a reservoir of water. When the hand reaches a certain temperature, its pores open, water comes out, and evaporates — cooling it down — which is the point. As a new study explains, they were trying to find a way to prevent robots from overheating — the way perspiring prevents humans from overheating. As study co-author T.J. Wallin points out, "...the combination of sweating, relative hairlessness, and upright bipedal gait enabled [humans] to physically exhaust our prey over prolonged chases." Can he not hear himself? If we make upright bipedal robots — and we don't make them too hairy — their ability to sweat means they'll be able to physically exhaust their prey over prolonged chases. And their prey will be us. So we have to do all that's humanly possible to stop them. Or they'll do all that's humidly possible to stop us.

[Music: Electronic]

Part three: Howard university art, pencil crayon guitar

Sinclair

SOUNDCLIP

ANNOUNCER: Sinclair's in the middle of the field Christine Sinclair. She just broke the record.

[cheering]

ANNOUNCER: one-hundred, eighty-five career goals, Christine Sinclair.

CH: The moment Canadian soccer legend Christine Sinclair broke the record for most goals scored in international soccer ever. She did it yesterday at an Olympic qualifying tournament — during Canada's 11-0 win over St. Kitts and Nevis. She took a pass from teammate Adriana Leon — and popped it in the bottom-left corner.

SOUNDCLIP

CHRISTINE SINCLAIR: Before the game, Dri told me she's got me. So I just thought Dri breaking down the right side. And she, yeah, she saw me cross it perfectly. And all I could think of is just don't miss the net. But, luckily, I didn’t [laughing].

CH: Christine Sinclair on her record-breaking goal. To mark the achievement, CBC Sports put together a video of Canadian athletes congratulating Christine Sinclair, including some of her former teammates.

SOUNDCLIP

WOMAN: Christine Sinclair, the G.O.A.T. We're so proud and honored to play next to such an incredible woman.

MAN: Congrats Christine, the greatest scorer of all time.

MAN#2: I just want to congratulate you on your international goal record.

WOMAN#2: Congratulations on breaking the all-time international goals record. What an accomplishment.

MAN#3: What a privilege to be able to mark this occasion to hear about you breaking your record.

WOMAN#3: Christine, we are so very proud of you. Thank you for the joy that you have brought us.

MAN#4: I don't think she's ever played the game for records and adulation. And she just enjoys it.

MAN#5: It's been an honour and a privilege to follow your career.

WOMAN#4: You are a big pride for our country so thank you from all of us for making us so proud.

WOMAN#5: Legend, on and off the field. I’m out of words.

MAN#5: You’re an inspiration for a lot of kids. Continued success. Thank you for wearing number 12.

WOMAN#6: you're not only a legend among young soccer players across this country. But you are so admired, and such an icon to the athletes from every sport.

MAN#6: I think everyone in Canada knows now it's achievable. Canadians can.

MAN#7: As a dad of a daughter and play soccer, you've done great things, and we're very grateful.

WOMAN#8: We love you. And congratulations.

ALL: Congratulations.

CH: Canadian sports legends congratulating Christine Sinclair on breaking the record for most goals in international soccer.

[Music: Piano]

Howard University art

Guest: Patricia Turner Walters

CH: For decades, Patricia Turner Walters has been collecting African-American art. She has sculptures, prints, paintings, and photographs. It's her passion. And now, she's giving it all away. Ms. Walters has decided to gift more than 150 of her pieces, valued at more than three-million dollars Canadian, to Howard University in Washington DC. That's where her late husband, the activist and scholar Ronald Walters, worked for decades. We reached Patricia Turner Walters in Ashton, Maryland.

CO: Mrs Walters, what effect does it have on you to know that so much of your personal collection is not going to be with you?

PATRICIA TURNER WALTERS: Well, I thought I was going to be much more difficult than it has evolved to be. But I think it's for the greater good. And I'm all about at this point in my life being about my husband's continued legacy. So I know that this art collection going to Howard — and NHBC U that he absolutely loved — will make up for the fact that it's not living with me anymore.

CO: And it's Howard University. This is in, Washington, DC.

PTW: That's correct, yes.

CO: I want to ask you a lot about your husband in a moment. But just about you, because this is your collection. Collections are very personal, aren't they? And so they reflect a lot about the person who was purchasing the art and looking for it. How would you describe this collection?

PTW: Well, I think it's a very diverse collection. It originated with my absolute passion for the what we call the masters. And they are the artists in the African-American community that were in the 19th century. So we're talking 18-hundreds. Like, for instance, the oldest piece in my art collection is by Robert Seldon Duncanson, who modeled himself after the Hudson River Valley artists — landscape artists. In fact, he lived in Canada for a while because he was a freed slave — a freed man rather. And so the masters, I have quite a few of those in my collection. And so my art runs the gamut to the Harlem Renaissance — which is another very important timeframe, that's the 40s, 30s, 40s, 60s. And I have now moved to what we call the contemporary artists. So you could say that those are the Kehinde Wiley’s, who happened to have done President Obama's portrait that hangs in the Portrait Gallery here in Washington. So I have a very, very… and it's hard for me to switch from I to Howard's collection now. Diverse collection, it runs the gamut, truly, of African-American artists.

CO: When you talk about the masters, in particular those similar to the Hudson River School, these artists through the same age. Not all of them made money, but some of them did quite well. And what about the African-American artists whose work you have collected? Did they profit from their work over their lifetimes?

PTW: I think that the vast majority of them did not — especially the early, early artists like Grafton Tyler Brown. They had to have other jobs. Duncanson was a carpenter, and so he did a lot of carpentry work. He was able to make a living from his work. Not so much from his art. Because it was difficult for African-Americans to really generate moneys for their art — particularly in the 18-hundreds. Now, the Harlem Renaissance artists, on the other hand, many of them worked in NHBCU. That's the beauty of Howard's history. They employed quite a few artists. Many of our famous artists and the black community in the art world taught at Howard University and went to school there.

CO: And when you speak of the Harlem Renaissance artists, were used the NHBC. That's the National Historical Black Colleges and Universities.

PTW: That’s the historically black colleges, um-hmm.

CO: Right. Now, how did you get into collecting? Do you remember a particular thing that inspired you to be doing this.

PTW: Oh, absolutely. The way I got passionately involved it was just a very innocent holiday party that I went to. And the young lady that I met taught at Howard also; her name was Anita Moore Hackney. I walked into her home and my life changed. It was absolutely just a wonderful experience. Her walls were just full of African-American art. I didn't quite know what it was that I was looking at. I just knew that my life was really changed forever. And she was a hostess, so she couldn't guide me through. I begged her could I walk through her home to look at the art? She permitted me to do that. And later, she invited me back. We had a one-on-one conversation. And she began to mentor and tutor me. And my life has never been the same again.

CO: And another person who obviously inspired you, and your life was never the same after, was your husband, Ronald Walters.

PTW: Absolutely.

CO: And the extraordinary work that he did. I mean, there's so much to say about him. But I mean this is somebody that perhaps a lot of people don't know. That he organized one of the United States' first lunch counter sit-ins. And this is in Wichita, Kansas. And so he was active on that front at a very early age and early time, wasn't he?

PTW: Yes, he was only 19 years of age when he decided to organize that sit-in. We had been married 25 years before I even knew anything about this history. And he was a college professor by then, and had written at least five books by then. And I said Ron, I said, why didn’t you ever share this story with me? I said, this is historical, I said, it was before the Greensboro sit-in — which is the sit-in movement that helped precipitate the civil rights struggle, for God's sake. [laughing] I said, how could you not share that with me? And he just did not think it was a big deal. So he did do that. And they successfully integrated the Dockum Drug Store in Wichita, Kansas — which is a part of the huge Rexal chain — which is very large out in the Midwest. And so they sit-in for two weeks, and that was his activist period. But my husband stayed an activist throughout his life. He was a college professor, and a brilliant one. But he also worked with the Congressional Black Caucus leadership. He worked in different organizations like TransAfrica and African Heritage Studies Association. And so he gave his life to the uplifting of the black race.

CO: Did he share your passion for the visual arts?

PTW: [laughing] actually, not. He could have cared less. He just knew that this was my thing and that I was very passionate about it. And so one day, around the dinner table, I was saying, Honey, I'm gonna try to help you understand my passion. I told him, I said, I'm collecting our visual history. When I say “our” people from the African diaspora — primarily black American artists. And I said I'm collecting to preserve our culture, and to preserve our history through vision. And I said, basically, you're uplifting the race. You're helping to educate our generation of students. So we have something in common. And it was just like a light bulb had gone off in his head, truly. He got it. I never really had issues with him after that [CO laughs]. He just let me buy anything I wanted. And because I was working too, and African-American art back in the day… It’s exploded now. But back in the day, it was much cheaper, and it was easier for me to purchase pieces — even original pieces. But now, like the collection I had now, I could never have had in this day and age because the African-American art has just absolutely exploded. And Norman Lewis, I was just looking online the other day, and a Norman Lewis has just recently sold for one-point-five million dollars. Well, I own two Norman Lewis’. Well, Howard does now. And I didn't pay anywhere near that [laughing].

CO: Wow!

PTW: So I was very fortunate that I started collecting and had a love for African-American artists when I could afford it. That's the only thing that I regret for the young people that they cannot afford the kind of art that I was blessed to have.

CO: This is a very generous gift, and I'm glad people will be able to see the work you've collected. And Mrs Walters, thank you.

PTW: Well, thank you for having me on.

CH: That was Patricia Turner Walters in Ashton, Maryland — talking about her art collection, which she's donated to Howard University.

[Music: Bright instrumental]

NB ashes locket

CH: A year-and-a-half ago, Jackie McLean's husband was killed. Robb Costello was a Fredericton police officer. He died in a shooting in the New Brunswick city, along with three other people. Now Ms. McLean has lost something else. An important memento: a locket containing some of his ashes. A few days ago, she went shopping at a Sobey's in Saint John. She went home and took a nap. And when she woke up, she realized the locket was missing. Here's what she told the CBC's Bob Murphy about the loss.

SOUNDCLIP

BOB MURPHY: What was that moment like then when you woke up and you realized it wasn't on your anymore?

JACKIE MCLEAN: Panic. I got very upset very quickly. But I calmed down relatively quick — which is very surprising. Because prior to Rob's death, if I'd lost something of such sentimental value, I probably would have been in full on hysterics. But I feel sometimes like Rob left a bit of his calm and patience with me when he left. So I could kind of hear his voice in the back of my mind saying it's okay, we'll find it.

BM: This was a big part of you — this pendant — that you would rarely take this off?

JM: I have only taken the pendant off for medical tests and visiting the massage therapist. And I put it right back on. I wear it in the shower. I've worn it everywhere. I don't take it off, ever. Rob stays with me all the time. In fact, I oftentimes call it Rob. You know, like I will touch it. When I have anxiety, I oftentimes will rub it between my fingers just to remind me that he is there.

BM: After you realized it was missing, you took to Facebook to ask people to help look forward. What was the response you got on Facebook?

JM: Oh my gosh, I was not prepared for the response that I got. I was contacted by a St. John police officer that I didn't previously know. He and his daughter went over and searched the southeast parking lot and contacted the people at Sobey’s. I'm just so overwhelmed by the number of people that have been so willing to help. Even my dear mother-in-law, who has a bad hip, she went over and walked the Sobey's parking lot herself. And I said, you didn't have to do that. I mean, I did it myself. But you know she's got a bad hip. And she said I'll do anything for you to help you find this piece of Rob that you have. So I'm hopeful that it will be found, but it doesn't look very promising at this point.

BM: So what if you don't find the locker? I suppose that is a possibility.

JM: Well, my backup plan is that I have ordered a replacement pendant. And this one I have had engraved, so it will have the information, Rob's name, and end of watch date on it. So, hopefully, if this new one was to go missing that it would be easily identifiable. And I’m fortunate to have a small urn of Rob's remains here that I can take a little bit from to fill this new locket.

CH: That was Jackie McLean speaking with Bob Murphy on CBC Radio's Maritime Noon. Her husband, Robb Costello, was a Fredericton police officer who died in a shooting in 2018.

[Music: Sombre]

Pencil crayon guitar

Guest: Bryan Rosychuk

CH: An Edmonton Goodwill store recently received a guitar — which is probably not uncommon, since it gets hundreds of donations a day. But the donated instrument doesn't look like an ordinary electric guitar. It's a work of art. And a work of art supplies: it's made with more than a thousand pencil crayons, all bought at the thrift store. Bryan Rosychuk is a retired teacher who made the guitar. We reached him in Edmonton.

CO: Brian, you have taken recycling to a whole new level. What gave you the idea to make this guitar out of pencils crayons?

BRYAN ROSYCHUK: There are quite a few people doing different things with pencil crayons. And I actually got the idea from a friend. He gave me the idea, and did a little research, and that got me going on the project.

CO: Okay, but so where did you get the pencil crayons?

BR: Well, that's the beauty of it is I generally get them at Goodwill. I've had to collect them for about a year before I could actually undertake the project.

CO: So how many pencils crayons did you need to collect?

BR: There's 12-hundred pieces in this particular guitar. It took probably to complete the whole project about the time of the gestation period of an elephant — which is about 20 months or 22 months.

CO: [laughing] Did it feel like you were giving birth to an elephant in the course of this?

BR: Well, it's definitely my first-born. And as a man, that's not bad.

CO: [laughing] Okay, so a lot of colours go into this. Did you get all the colours you needed?

BR: That's an interesting question. First of all, you can only use certain kinds of pencil crayons. And that comes down to Laurentian and Crayola. Now, I've become somewhat of an expert on pencil crayons, and I cannot use things like [naming brands] because I have to make sure that diameters are all the same. So I can make straight lines within a curved mold.

CO: Okay. And not only that, you're putting a very specific logo in the middle of this — all these bright colours in your guitar. Can you say what that was?

BR: Well, the logo is the “Goodie” symbol or logo that Goodwill originally used. And now incorporates into their logo. And as a tribute guitar, I thought it was most fitting.

CO: Why did you want to make that tribute to Goodwill on the guitar?

BR: Goodwill does amazing things for people — challenged people. They have an amazing mission statement — which includes, of course, recycling and reusing all in an effort for sustainability. As a special needs teacher, I worked with some of the young people that are challenged. And Goodwill does an amazing job in giving those people to get some work experience, to help build self-esteem and help get them ready for the world.

CO: And, I'll make a personal admission here that I have a brother who is very much involved with Goodwill, and worked there. And I would share your thoughts and feelings about it. But to make that logo, it's very specific colors. There's only three, right? There's white, there's black — which aren't colors — and blue. So what did it take you to find a lot of white pencil crayons?

BR: Well, that's a very interesting question. Actually, white pencil crayons are fairly easy to get. If you think about children coloring, of course, they love the reds and the bright blues. But why would you colour white on white paper? So I definitely get a lot of whites. And if you could see the guitar, it also has the logo, and it also has rainbow patterns built in. Because I wanted to sort of include everybody in my effort.

CO: And so there are all these colours around it. And we'll give people instructions where to go online to see this beautiful guitar. But it's an electric guitar, right?

BR: It is. It's quite playable actually. As part of my tribute yesterday, I did a couple of songs for them. I wrote a couple songs, and we had an event. And I got the opportunity to present the guitar to the Goodwill people. And the main acceptor was a young fellow named Trevor that they actually hire, and he accepted it for Goodwill.

CO: And just one little detail because we've omitted how you made, and people are wondering how to do this at home, it's all glued together with epoxy, right?

BR: Well, it's not actually glued. Probably almost anybody can do it. Well, almost anybody can do it. [CO laughs] What I do is I cut the crayons into one-and-three-quarter-inch pieces. I make a mold to house them. And then I put the crayons in the mold and I use a an epoxy cast resin. And I have to do three pours of this double agent that hardens up. And in between layers it takes three days of curing. And then I top it off with another layer of this material, put on an electric guitar neck and pickups and parts that I have actually acquired from Goodwill over time. I'm quite a guitar fan. And that's what I say, anybody can make one. It's sort of like Ukrainian food Ukrainian food is the best in the world in my mind, of course, being Ukrainian. But the actual products don't really cost a lot of money, it's the labour.

CO: Okay. So kind of like a cabbage roll?

BR: More like a pierogi.

CO: [laughing] Okay. Now, it’s beautiful to look at. And now we need to know what it sounds like. And I understand that you can do that for us, play a little bit one on this guitar.

BR: I'll give you a little bit about a 10-second thing here, if you don’t mind.

CO: All right. Thank you.

BR: Just give me about a-second-and-a-half to get warmed up here.

SOUNDCLIP

[Bryan plays guitar]

BR: I love the CBC.

CO: [Laughing] All right. We got a little tribute in there too. So that's great. Thanks for the plug, and thanks for making the guitar. Where's it going to be?

BR: Hopefully, they will be putting it on display. I told them if they really decide to sell it, I'd like to get first shot at it. But no, I think it'll be put up on display in their head office.

CO: So that's where you if you want to go and see it, or you can see it online. We're going to give you those connections. Bryan, it's great fun to talk to you. Thank you.

BR: Oh, thank you for the interest. And I definitely am a big, big CBC fan. And keep up the great work.

CO: And I love pierogis.

BR: I love you and pierogis.

CO: [laughing] Bye-bye.

BR: Bye-bye

CH: Bryan Rosychuk recently built electric guitars out of pencil crayons. We reached him in Edmonton. And if you want to see what those guitars look like...head to our Twitter page: @CBCAsItHappens.

Back To Top »

Provide Transcript Feedback

CBC would like to acknowledge the support of the Broadcasting Accessibility Fund.

January 30, 2020 episode transcript

More Stories Like This