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The AIH Transcript for December 5, 2019

Hosts: Carol Off and Karen Gordon

CAROL OFF: Hello, I’m Carol Off.

KAREN GORDON: Good evening, I'm Karen Gordon. This is As It Happens.

[Music: Theme]

Prologue

KG: Tonight:

CO: a matter of interpretation. The Supreme Court denies the appeal of 95-year-old Helmut Oberlander. And now the former interpreter for the Nazis may finally be deported to Germany.

KG: There's nothing right about where she was left. A Nova Scotia woman with intellectual disabilities were moved to a suitable home — after being placed in a hospital by the province and abandoned.

CO: Prevention means no cure at all. Australia restricts the right of refugees being held offshore to get medical attention onshore. Our guest says that will have devastating health consequences.

KG: Liable to find them liable a personal-injury lawyer wants social media sites like Facebook to do more to protect young people from sex trafficking. And she's using product liability laws to build her case.

CO: Sure he's retired, but he's no empty nester. Ninety-one-year-old George Adams has built and hung 900 birdhouses around Southwestern Ontario — and they've proven to be a real chick magnet.

KG: And… a bicycle built for two dimensional people. The stationary bike company Peloton won't back-pedal on its widely criticized commercial. And our guest has her own story of an onscreen workout that didn't work out.

KG: As It Happens., the Thursday edition. Radio that takes peloton off its Christmas cardio list

[Music: Theme]

Part one: Ex-Nazi Supreme Court appeal denied, Australia detention doctor, Peloton ad actor

Ex-Nazi Supreme Court appeal denied

Guest: Len Rudner

KG: He's been at war with the federal government for nearly 25 years — over what he did during the war. And today, Helmut Oberlander lost his last battle. The Supreme Court has decided not to hear the appeal of the ex-Nazi interpreter. It means that Mr. Oberlander, who is 95 years old, could have his Canadian citizenship stripped, and be deported to his native Germany. For Len Rudner, it's about time. Mr. Rudner is the former regional director at the Canadian Jewish Congress. He spent years researching Mr. Oberlander's case. We reached Mr. Rudner in Thornhill, Ontario.

CO: Mr. Rudner, what does it mean to you that Helmut Oberlander may actually be deported to Germany after all these years?

LEN RUDNER: Well, Carol, it is the end of a very long road. And it's a tragedy that's been written in many pieces over the last 20 or 25 years. But it is a piece of justice, and better justice served cold, and in small portions of than not served at all.

CO: What was Helmut Oberlander role during World War 2 with the Nazis?

LR: Mr. Oberlander was conscripted into a mobile killing unit — specifically EK10A — which was part of Einsatzgruppen D. The mobile killing units were purposely constructed to follow the German army into Russia following the invasion of the Soviet Union in 1941. And their role was very precise: to murder civilians, to murder commissars, to murder communists. But most especially, to murder Jews, and they murdered one-and-a-half-million Jews before their work was done.

CO: What did he actually do in that unit?

LR: Mr. Oberlander was conscripted to act as a translator. We can leave it to listeners to figure out what it is that a translator would be doing in a unit that was devoted to the process of murdering civilians. It's unlikely that a translator would have been asking for road directions, and the best way to get from one town to the next.

CO: How has it been described? I mean, people have documented what happened at these sites where people were murdered and put into mass graves. So he would have been attendant to those, would he?

LR: Well, Mr. Oberlander, in one of the many cases that went before the courts, said that he was unaware that he was a member of a mobile killing unit. Justice Andrew MacKay, in 2000, did not find that to be credible. These were small units. It would be virtually impossible for anybody not to know what was going on. And what was going on, these units would arrive in towns, the Jews would be gathered, some of the men would be taken away to dig pits. Then they would be marched to the pit. They would be made to stand at the end of the grid at the edge of the pit, and they would be murdered — one by one, and bullet by bullet.

CO: When Mr. Oberlander came to Canada, what did he tell the authorities about his time in Germany?

LR: Well, I can tell you what he didn't tell them. He did not say that I was a member of a mobile killing unit. The current version is that, yes, he was a member of his unit, but he was coerced.

CO: He was at the age of 17. So is that not an argument that if he’s 17 years old, he fears for his life that whatever he did, he had to do it, or he would have faced the similar consequences?

LR: When the Federal Court of Appeal addressed this matter in 201, they determined the defence of duress was not applicable in this case because Mr. Oberlander served with the unit for a period of 18 months. He had no difficulty with joining his mother's application for German citizenship. He received a medal. And during all the times where Mr. Oberlander was on solitary guard duty, or when he went off on the leave, he always came back.

CO: There are photographs of some of these mass graves, and what happened in these places. He was not identified ever in any of these photographs or any of this evidence.

LR: That's correct. Mr. Oberlander has not lost his citizenship, and does not stand ready to be deported because he engaged in war crimes. It was because he lied about his wartime activities. And that if he would have been truthful, he would not have been admitted to Canada. And that finding has never been overturned.

CO: Why has it taken the Canadian government four attempts to strip him of his Canadian citizenship and deport him then?

LR: I think for the longest time, the Canadian government was not interested in pursuing this. It was ancient history — nothing to be gained by opening old wounds. Once the decision had been made to begin to open up files of gentlemen like Helmut Oberlander, things moved glacially. It was almost as if the government of the time — whichever government it might have been — was really hoping that the grim reaper would collect these people before a decision actually had to be made. There were something like 30 cases that Canadian Jewish Congress was aware of. Of those 30 cases — excluding Mr. Oberlander — only one of them resulted in a deportation.

CO: You had family who disappeared during this time in Ukraine. Is this case in any way personal for you?

LR: [deep sigh] Well, my family was very lucky. My grandparents came to this country before the war. And yet, in the south Ukraine, which was the hunting grounds of Einsatzgruppen D, there is a town, which depending on the time of day, was either in Poland, or was in the Ukraine, or it was Russia. And that was one of the towns that my family came from. It has always been a question to me as to whether there were any members of my family in [the town] when the mobile killing units came. You know, did history cause the paths of any of my relatives to cross with that of Mr. Oberlander? There's no way of knowing. But the tragedy of the Holocaust is greater in a sense than what any one family experienced. We all in one way or another stood on the edge of that pit, and we're still looking into it.

CO: Just finally, Mr. Oberlander is 95 years old. He has poor vision, poor hearing, and he hasn't held German citizenship since 1960. What's the value at the end of his life to return him to Germany?

LR: It is a question of justice, I think. Yes, Mr. Oberlander is 95 years old. When all of this started, he was 75 years old. When he was acting as a translator for the mobile killing units, he was 17. And when the mobile killing units came to towns, the Jews who they marched to the edge of the grave and dispatched into oblivion were men and women. They were very young, and they were very old. We cannot — and should not — judge Mr. Oberlander because of his current frailties or because of his age. Rather, I think it is important to remember that when he was a cog in the machinery of mass murder, he was young. And the justice it is we now see being given to him is mild compared to the injustice that was meted out to the victims of the mobile killing units.

CO: Mr. Rudner, thank you.

LR: Thank you, Carol.

KG: Len Rudner is the former regional director at the Canadian Jewish Congress, and he researched Helmut Oberlander's case. Today, Canada's top court said it would not be hearing the appeal of 95-year-old Mr. Oberlander, who was an interpreter for the Nazis.

[Music: World music]

Australia detention doctor

Guest: Nick Martin

KG: There are nearly 500 hundred asylum seekers still being held in Papua New Guinea and Nauru — often in dire conditions. But for the past ten months, there seemed to be some hope for those in Australia's offshore detention centres. If doctors determined that a person needed urgent medical treatment they couldn't access on the islands, they were sent to the mainland. Yesterday, that changed. Australian lawmakers voted to revoke that law — known as "medevac". Doctors who have witnessed how living in the detention centres can impact people's health are devastated. Including Nick Martin — who says that, with this move, "Australia has become a little crueller." Dr. Martin was the senior medical officer on Nauru from November 2016 until August 2017. We reached him in Perth, Australia.

CO: Dr. Martin, now that this medevac has been revoked, how will Australia decide who of these people on these detention islands will get medical attention?

NICK MARTIN: It looks like they'll go back to the old system, and that was a very haphazard way of going about choosing who needed to get medical attention or not. In the past, the doctors, of which I was one of them, would recommend refugees did get transferred for investigation and treatment. But then that decision would go to a pretty faceless committee, who usually just say no, or ignore the recommendation. And sometimes would only decide to move a refugee once there's a threat of legal action. And so the system that did exist was very inefficient. It was unbelievably slow. And it meant there was no real proper triaging or correct triaging of a patient who moved.

CO: So basically, doctors will not be deciding who needs medical attention, it'll be politicians?

NM: Yes, they do have doctors in the process, and we give out recommendations. But they are all overridden, or the decision to move the refugee is made by other people. So bureaucrats and politicians, yes.

CO: Why did the Australian government make this change, revoke this medevac, and revert back to the old system?

NM: It is hard to fathom. I think that's been the most difficult thing, really. But of all the things, all the challenges facing Australia and the rest of the world right now, they decided to focus on repealing medical care for about 500 people. But a lot of it is that when they lost a bill when the medivac bill was actually pushed through in the beginning, so nine months ago, and that's the first time the government had lost a vote for 90 years. And I think a lot of it was annoyance frankly or hurt feelings about that, and they set their stall on saying no, we were going to do this. They have managed to conflate denying medical care with border protection — which is a false argument in my mind.

CO: But some of the messaging they're saying, the Australia's Home Affairs Minister has suggested that medevacing people — refugees from these detention islands — and bringing them for medical treatment in Australia is a backdoor, it's a way to sneak into the country. What do you say to that?

NM: I think if you're going to get on a boat, a leaky boat, at great expense, having fled your home anyway, bear in mind that 90 per cent of these people have been assessed as being genuine refugees. To go through a fairly hostile offshore very remote island and spend around six or seven years in the vague hope that at some point you might just get ill enough to get transferred to Australia whilst being in detention the entire time, and you can get removed back again over time, That's a pretty long bow to draw. Minister Dutton has also demonized refugees over the years of every description — whether it be African gangs, or the Lebanese community. He calls the refugees “offshore rapists and murderers and terrorists”. And so I think he will say anything to try and justify his fairly brutal callous position.

CO: What kinds of ailments are we're talking about here? What reasons would they be brought to Australia to get any kind of medical treatment, these refugees?

NM: I think overwhelmingly now it's psychiatric reasons. And that's after six or seven years in definite detention. The burden of mental illness on the islands is quite unbelievable. And so severe depression, other conditions like that would be the biggest thing. But also, lots of other just general things that if you're in a remote town in Canada, you could get fixed up pretty quickly just by one trip to a bigger hospital. So let's say you have a breast lump something like that, that can be excluded as being nasty by one scan, but that's not available on Nauru.

CO: Well, we've spoken with a number of people who have been on those islands — both as doctors and as refugees — one of who's now in Canada through a private sponsorship. And he told us, as I'm sure you've heard, just horror stories of what it was like. He spent six years on Manus Island, and it seriously damaged his mental health. He did get treatment in Australia before he came to Canada. He was allowed to get that. Now, what happens to people like Amir now that this has been revoked?

NM: Well, he's lucky to get away. And I think it's wonderful that Canada has accepted him. I think it's a phenomenal show of humanity and decency. But the frustrating thing it was so avoidable. So yeah, we'll have a whole cohort of refugees who try to seek help for Australia, and Australia effectively has damaged them for life.

CO: You lost your job, didn't you? You were a doctor Nauru, which is one of these detention islands, and you blew the whistle on what you saw there. Why was it worth it to you to reveal that?

NM: [laughing] Was it worth it. Yeah, it had to be. Because, yeah, I lost my job, but at the same time, I felt there came a tipping point where I just could not carry on any longer having seen the things I'd seen without speaking up and saying, no, this is criminal.

CO: You wrote in a letter, I think yesterday, you said that this is to Australians who seemed to delight in the ongoing cruelty being inflicted on vulnerable people. You said that Australia just became a little crueler and a little more sadistic. Do you think that this is how Australians, in general, do they support what's happening, the treatment of these refugees on these islands?

NM: The Australian people are being fed a diet of absolute racist rhetoric and invective by the political parties in charge, saying this is a huge threat. And so I think the Australian people, there will be some who seem to delight in punching down on refugees, and that's just tragic really. But I think Australians are fundamentally a decent people — much like everyone’s decent. But for some reason the Australian Government has a bee in it’s bonnet about people who arrive by boat — which is just a very bizarre thing to hang your hat on. But that's what they decided to do, and they think there are votes in it.

CO: Dr. Martin, I appreciate speaking with you. Thank you.

NM: Thank you very much.

KG: Nick Martin is the former senior medical officer on Nauru — one of Australia's offshore detention islands. We reached him in Perth.

[Music: Ambient]

Peloton actor

Guest: Julie Alexandria

KG: Creepy. Sexist. Dystopian. Not the rave reviews you want if you're trying to sell exercise bikes. But those are the reviews the company Peloton is getting, after releasing its newest ad for its internet-connected spin classes. The ad shows a montage of selfie-filmed clips of a slim young woman talking to her phone — documenting how her partner's gift of a Peloton bike has changed her life. At the end, you see the couple sitting together watching the video. Here's the ad.

SOUNDCLIP

[Music: “She’s So High” by Tal Bachman/ pop]

MAN: Okay, you ready?!

WOMAN: Yes!

MAN: Now!

WOMAN: A peloton!

WOMAN ON SCREEN: Give it up for our first-time riders!

WOMAN: All right, first ride. I’m a little nervous, but excited! Let’s do this. Five days in a row! Are you surprised? I am. 6 am, yay!

MAN ON SCREEN: Rising with the sun!

WOMAN: That was totally worth it!

WOMAN ON SCREEN: Let’s go Grace in Boston! 50 rides!

WOMAN: She said my name! A year ago, I didn’t realize how much this would change me. Thank you.

ANNOUNCER: This holiday, give the gist of Peloton.

KG: Since the Peloton ad was released, the backlash has been so severe that the company's stock has taken a dive. Julie Alexandria is an actor and TV host who had her own eyebrow-raising experience auditioning for a Peloton ad. We reached her in San Diego, California.

CO: Julie, what did you think when you first saw that Peloton ad?

JULIE ALEXANDRIA: You know, I cringed. I thought it was so cringey. I it struck me right away that something was just off. First of all, the emotions of having tears in your eyes about a first ride on a stationary bike that's in your home is just a little obtuse. [CO laughs]I just thought I was a little bit much, the whole thing.

CO: And the relationship between this woman, who she's very fit, obviously. But she's so grateful to this husband who would give her this gift. What do you make of that?

JA: Yeah, I mean, well, I think this sort of prays upon a lot of women's insecurity when it comes to physical appearance, and someone gives you a gift that sort of implies productive weight loss I think is a little bit strange. But who knows, maybe the backstory is that she really wanted to get in shape, but wait… she's already in shape. [CO laughs] So that part was a little bit strange. But then would it have been worse if she wasn't in shape, I don’t know? But yeah, it was a little bit weird. I think the strangest part of it was at the end, when they're both sitting on the couch watching her journey. And she's looking at him for just desperate approval in her eyes, like see, see what I did? And that's what struck me that's so awkward. Like, why did she need her husband's validation to say that she’s done a good job? I don't know, it just seemed off, the whole thing.

CO: Okay, you mentioned her eyes, because that's a big discussion. She does look desperate, doesn't she? And she has what one person tweeted, the lady in the peloton ad has perpetually sad eyebrows. Did you notice that as well?

JA: [JA and CO share a laugh] I did. You know, I would say this actress was a victim of bad direction. I think it was just a terrible direction that the ad went in, and it's unfortunate.

CO: Okay, so you've had your own awkward experience with Peloton ads. You auditioned for a different one. Can you tell us about that story?

JA: Sure. So when I was an actor in New York City, this was just a few years ago, it was actually the first Peloton ad. Well, I got down to the very last producer callbacks — which is when they have all the big wigs in the room. And it came down to myself and two other women. And the one thing that we noticed was that we, the women, the females in the room, were all very young [laughing]. And in our sort of early to mid-20s, and the men that they had chosen to pair us up with — because it was a husband and wife commercial — so it’s a husband wife team basically — the men were all old, and really not attractive. [Both laugh again]

CO: What?!

JA: And so we were just kind of like okay, this is a little awkward. And I thought to myself there's no way I'm getting this role because this guy could be my dad. And that's what they do in commercial auditions is that they kind of do a round-robin, and they pair you up with different people to see who looks best together on camera as they're trying to create a couple or a family. And I thought there's just no way that this is happening because this is so blatantly obviously awkward.

CO: So you didn't get that role, and you didn't I guess audition for this latest one to have perpetually sad eyebrows in a commercial?

JA: No, no, no, no. My commercial TV career is no longer [laughing]. But, you know, commercial acting is the toughest acting that there is out there because you have to convey what it takes actors in movies over the course of two hours, you have to convey that in 60, sometimes 30 seconds. And so it's really tough. And I feel for these actors. I feel for the actress so much in particular — because this ad, if Peloton doesn't pull it, you know which could have a financial impact on her personally, you know, she's always going to be known as the “Peloton Girl”.

CO: Yeah. Do you think it's already too late for her?

JA: Oh gosh, no. I don't want to say that. I mean, I hope that she has a wonderful career ahead of her. But I do think that going into the room, or as they call it you know going into the casting room, they will recognize her from this ad. Because, I mean, it essentially went viral.

CO: So Peloton is defending their ad, and says that people are misrepresenting the commercial. That it’s just meant to show how users lives have been positively impacted by their bikes. So what do you make of that?

JA: Good for Peloton I guess, for defending themselves. And I guess I take that to mean good for her — the actress — because she'll still get her residual checks. Because, at the end of the day, that would be the worst thing is if they pulled the ad and then admitted defeat. Then she wouldn't get paid, and the rest of the actors wouldn't get paid. So for that, I'm happy that they're defending it. But, at the same time, I guarantee you they will rebrand it. And come January, they'll come out with another ad that will be all about real people who are having weight struggles, and who are actually having real journeys. And I think that's the biggest issue that I take with the ad is that it didn't feel real.

CO: There are a number of parodies of this ad online. It's a joke. It's been talked about in so many articles. [laughing] How do you think women would react if there's actually a Peloton bike under the Christmas tree for them this year?

JA: [laughing]I hope that if there is one, that they do their own reenactment of the commercial, and then post it online, and it goes viral. No, you know, look, I hope that whoever gets that gift, it's a lovely gift. And I hope that they like it, and don't take offence to it. And, hopefully, it's something that they want. But, at the end of the day, nine times out of ten, it'll probably become a clothes hanger.

CO: [laughing ] Julie, thanks so much.

JA: Thank you.

CO: Bye-bye.

JA: Bye-bye.

KG: Julie Alexandria is an actor and TV host. We reached her in San Diego, California. And we've got more on this story on our website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

[Music: Ambient]

Pantone Blue

KG: How could anyone forget how Pantone guided us gently into the new century with its Colour of the Year in 2000: Cerulean? Or how the 2006 winner, Sand Dollar, soothed our nerves about a rollercoaster economy? And who is not still basking in the magic of 2019's Colour, Living Coral — which Pantone said, quote, "embraces us with warmth and nourishment to provide comfort and buoyancy in our continually shifting environment." Unquote. Of course it does. It's why we all repainted our houses that warm, nourishing, comfortable, buoyant shade of orangey-pink. But get ready to put down nine coats of primer, because Pantone has just named the 2020 Colour of the Year. It is...Classic Blue. Not to overstate things, but it will change your life. According to Pantone, Classic Blue is "elegant in its simplicity", "suggestive of the sky at dusk", and "reassuring". Classic Blue "offer[s] refuge", "aid[s] concentration and bring[s] laser-like clarity". And it "fosters resilience". There's so much more. Classic Blue is "honest" and "non-aggressive and easily relatable". And, as the Executive Director of the Pantone Colour Institute opines, quote, "Classic Blue encourages us to look beyond the obvious to expand our thinking; challenging us to think more deeply, increase our perspective, and open the flow of communication." Unquote. Well, look: it's a nice blue. But somebody must have spilled some red in it — because that is some purple prose.

[Music: Folk]

Part two: Nova Scotia intellectual disabilities ruling, anti-Facebook lawyer

Nova Scotia intellectual disabilities ruling

Guest: Jo-Anne Pushie

KG: After years of living in a hospital psychiatric ward, Beth MacLean is finally moving to a home. Ms. MacLean has intellectual and physical disabilities — but no psychiatric illness. Her hospital stay was supposed to be temporary. Instead, the Province left her there. And she might still be there today, if it weren't for a human rights complaint she filed, along with two other people with disabilities. Yesterday, Nova Scotia's Human Rights Commission ruled the province had discriminated against them. It ordered it to move them to suitable community housing — and pay them up to 140-thousand dollars each. Jo-Anne Pushie is an advocate for Ms. MacLean, and is her former social worker at the hospital. We reached her in Dartmouth.

CO: Ms. Pushie, can you tell me, first of all, what was life like for Beth MacLean at the psychiatric ward at the hospital?

JO-ANNE PUSHIE: Yes, Beth initially went to the Nova Scotia Hospital at around about age oh, 19 or 20. And she didn't go to Emerald Hall to begin. She went to another unit, where she essentially stayed for about seven years. When she was transferred to the Nova Scotia Hospital, it was on a promise that she would be there for one year. And one year turned into many years. In 2007, she was transferred to Emerald Hall. So at that point, she was given a little more freedom in that she could walk about the unit. However, Emerald Hall is a locked unit. So her ability to move about was very restricted. She could not leave the unit without a staff member. Everything is scheduled, your meals, your bath. It's a very controlled institutional environment. Emerald Hall should have been functioning as an acute psychiatric unit. However, because of the people that were awaiting placement, it essentially became a custodial care facility.

CO: And so why was she put there. What was her condition that they thought that this would be appropriate?

JAP: Yeah, so as a child, as a 14-year-old, she was transferred into an adult facility — which should never have happened. She remained there until I think around 2001.

CO: But there was an incident in October 2000 that precipitated this. What was that?

JAP: I believe born out of frustration, Beth struck out at a staff member at Kings Rehabilitation Centre — and was transferred to the Nova Scotia Hospital. Now, Beth didn't have a psychiatric illness. She has an intellectual disability.

CO: And that was after she'd been at Kings since 1986?

JAP: That's right, she went into Kings as a child, at the age of 14. And she would have been placed in a dormitory-style facility — probably six or eight people — which would be harsh for any 14-year-old.

CO: Beth MacLean had an opportunity to tell her story before this inquiry. How did she describe in her own words what living was like for her?

JAP: Beth is very clear about what has happened. You know, she's indicated that she never wanted to be in institutions. She always asked to be in the community. You would have to know Beth. She's curious. She's lovely. She's genuine. She's friendly. She loves to engage in conversation with people. And to place her in a controlling environment, and to leave her there to languish, it was very difficult for her. And she came to really speak about how she hated being in these places. And she had some terminology that I won't use, you know, descriptors that really expressed how defeated she felt.

CO: I think she called it an [expletive] hole.

JAP: [slight sigh] that was one name for Emerald Hall, yes.

CO: Did she have no advocate? I mean, did she not have a voice, anyone speaking for her within the government, within family, or anywhere?

JAP: Well, she would have had an assigned care coordinator through the Department of Community Services. However, the Department of Community Services placed a moratorium on the development of small options in around 1998. So, essentially, there was no development. So Beth is one person, there was many more individuals who were stuck in Emerald Hall and in other places. So the department and the Minister of Community Services, who had the responsibility to develop services, supports, placements, essentially, there was nothing happening.

CO: What will now change for Beth MacLean?

JAP: Well, Beth, right now, is transitioning into a home in the community with the appropriate supports. Having lived the vast majority of her life in institutions, she has lost the ability, you know, to do many of the tasks that we do. However, Beth is curious, and she is smart. You know, she's warm and engaging. So I am confident that she will do well.

CO: How old is she now?

JAP: Beth is 49, and she went into the first institutional placement at around ten. You know, she's lived 39 years of her life in institutions.

CO: The province has been ordered to put money in trust for her, and for another complainant with similar conditions, a third complainant has since died. And so is it enough?

JAP: People look at the amount that she was awarded and say, oh wow, 100-thousand dollars. You know, that's a big amount. However, when you look at that, and you do the math, 100-thousand dollars is a very small amount when you're talking about 39 years of your life.

CO: And there's another 40-thousand dollars for legal fees. So that doesn't have to come out of this 100-thousand dollars, is that right.

JAP: That's correct.

CO: Walter Thompson, who led this inquiry, he said the case was not comparable to that of a person who was wrongfully imprisoned. That was something that was suggested. What do you make of that?

JAP: I find that concerning. Because, essentially, Beth has been locked up, and for about seven years when she first went to the Nova Scotia Hospital, she spent the vast majority of every day in a locked room. So in my mind, knowing what Beth has gone through, it is very comparable.

CO: How is Beth feeling about her future?

JAP: I spoke with Beth on Sunday. She's so looking forward to, you know, moving full-time into her home. And she's looking forward to a bright future.

CO: Well, it's a long time coming, so it's good to hear it. Ms. Pushie, I appreciate speaking with you. Thank you.

JAP: Thank you so much for your interest.

KG: Jo-Anne Pushie is an advocate for Beth MacLean. She's also Ms. MacLean's former social worker. She's in Dartmouth, Nova Scotia.

[Music: Ambient]

Nancy Pelosi impeachment

KG: The U.S. president's actions have left Democrats with no choice but to act. That's what House Speaker Nancy Pelosi said this morning — as she announced that she was asking her colleagues to proceed with articles of impeachment agaist Donald Trump. It was expected. And it means there will almost certainly be an impeachment trial in the Republican-held Senate. For months, lawmakers in Washington have been investigating whether Mr. Trump abused his power when it came to his dealings with Ukraine. After her announcement this morning, Ms. Pelosi held another press conference later in the day. As she was leaving the room where that was held, she was asked this by a reporter:

SOUNDCLIP

[Sound: A flurry of camera clicks]

REPORTER: Do you hate the president, Madam. Speaker?

NANCY PELOSI: I don't hate anybody. I was raised in a catholic house; we don't hate anybody in the world. So don’t accuse me.

REPORTER: I did not accuse you. I asked the question. Representative colleagues yesterday suggested that the Democrats are doing this simply because they like the guy.

NP: Let me just say this, I think the president is a coward when it comes to helping out kids who are afraid of gun violence. I think he is cruel when he doesn't deal with helping our Dreamers, of which we're very proud. I think he's in denial about the climate crisis. However, that's about the election. Take it up the left. This is about the Constitution of the United States, and the facts that lead to the president's violation of his oath of office. And as a Catholic, I resent your using the word hate in a sentence that addresses me. I don't hate anyone. I was raised in a way that is a heart full of love, and always prayed for the president. And I still pray for the president. I pray for the president all the time. So don't mess with me when it comes to words like that.

KG: That was Democratic House Speaker Nancy Pelosi speaking at a press conference, after announcing she would ask House Democrats to proceed with articles of impeachment against President Donald Trump. The White House's press secretary said today that the Democrats "should be ashamed" — and that "we look foward to a fair trial in the Senate."

[Music: Horns!]

Anti-Facebook lawyer

Guest: Annie McAdams

KG: Facebook is all about keeping in touch with friends. But the tech company might not be feeling too chummy towards Annie McAdams right now. For years, Ms. McAdams has made her name as one of Houston's best personal-injury lawyers — taking on restaurants, real estate developers, and drunk drivers. Now she's using her background in product liability to tackle a new adversary: social media sites like Facebook and Instagram, which she accuses of facilitating the sex trafficking of minors. And, while courts have stymied previous efforts, Ms. McAdams is making headway, with three suits against Facebook in Texas. We reached Annie McAdams in Houston.

CO: Ms. McAdams, first of all, how are Facebook and Instagram making it easier for predators who traffic minors?

ANNIE MCADAMS: Facebook and Instagram continue to facilitate a known threat on their platform by connecting predators with children on their platform, with no limitation or identity verification.

CO: Is Facebook aware of this?

AM: Facebook admits it's a problem on their site. But yet, fails to warn the users of the known risk.

CO: Huh. But Facebook says, and this is a quote, they have zero tolerance for any behaviour or content that exploits children on our platform. And they say they use sophisticated technology to aggressively combat this behaviour and to protect children. So what evidence do you have that that's not the case?

CO: We will be watching your cases. Ms. McAdams, thank you.

AM: Thank you.

KG: Annie McAdams is a personal-injury lawyer who's launched several lawsuits against Facebook. We reached her in Houston.

[Music: World music]

Prankster banana artist

KG: It is a work of deceptive complexity. For, certainly, it is what it appears to be. And yet, by its very nature, it conceals itself — its essence only exposed, paradoxically, by destroying the piece itself. A common object, and a comment on its own commonness. A symbol of temptation, and the inevitability of decay. A ... OK ... It's a banana, duct-taped to a wall. And it'll cost you upwards of 155 thousand Canadian. Right now, at the Art Basel show in Miami Beach, you can see new work by the Italian artist Maurizio Cattelan — known in the art world as a prankster. Among other things, he made the fully functioning gold toilet entitled "America", which was stolen in London earlier this year — and a sculpture of Pope John Paul the Second being crushed by a meteorite, which many did not find pleasing. For this new exhibit, Mr. Cattelan tried sculpting bananas out of bronze, and resin. Neither captured the je ne sais quoi he sought. Then, suddenly, he knew exactly quoi: he procured a banana. Some duct tape. And stuck the former to the wall with the latter. He calls it "comedian". And the website Artnet reports that the first two "editions" have already sold. For the third, he and his gallery are asking just shy of 200-thousand Canadian. Mr. Cattelan's gallery says that the work, quote, "offers insight into how we assign worth and what kind of objects we value." Unquote. Which sounds like an art-world way of saying the artist knows it's ridiculous. Or, at the very least, that he knows he's throwing us a curve.

[Music: Ambient]

Part three: Sudbury organ donation, birdhouse maker, Vienna Opera House composer

Sudbury organ donation

Guest: Pam Nicholson

KG: One set of numbers is encouraging: the number of organ transplants performed in Canada has gone up in the last decade. But a second set of numbers dulls the silver lining of that cloud: more than 200 people died last year waiting for an organ. And more than four thousand are still on wait lists for transplants. All these statistics come from the Canadian Institute for Health Information. And they suggest Canada still has a long way to go when it comes to ensuring organs are available to those who need them. An article in today's Globe and Mail highlights one hospital's approach — and points to some possible solutions. The facility is Sudbury's Health Sciences North. And Pam Nicholson is its organ donation lead. We reached Ms. Nicholson in Sudbury.

CO: Ms. Nicholson, how do you identify a possible organ donor at Health Sciences North? It must be a very delicate task?

PAM NICHOLSON: We actually have something called The GIFT Trigger, so the G stands for a GCS of three. GCS is an indication of neurologically how the patient is doing. And a three is quite a low score on that I stands for an injured brain, so someone who's had a brain injury and is not doing well. F stands for family questions, so if the family's asking for information, or we have a plan to talk to the family. And T stands for limiting therapy, so if we a plan to discuss with the family taking their loved one off the ventilator, that would require notification so that we could assess for the potential for donation.

CO: Now, you've been very successful. The provincial average for persuading eligible families to donate their loved one's organs is only about 58 per cent in Ontario. Your hospital is up there at 92 per cent. You had 12 vote of 13 eligible families last year. So what is your interaction with them? How is it different do you think than what happens elsewhere?

PM: One thing is Sudbury is known as being a very generous, giving, happy community. So I think that helps us. The other thing that we have is we have a local group — the Irish Heritage Club. They've worked for years educating our community about the importance and the value of organ and tissue donation. We have one of the higher registration rates in the province, where people have given their consent to be a donor. I think we're up around 56 per cent. All these filters down to help us with our work at the hospital.

CO: All right, you've given us a bunch of numbers. But it seems to me from what people are saying that you are a huge part of the success that the hospital has. And in the Globe and Mail article, today are people who say that it was speaking with you that gave them this confidence or move them forward in that. What's your magic that you bring to that?

PM: Well, I think it's very kind to think that it's me. But I think it's all of us together. We wait until the time is right to talk to families. These mostly are not expected death. Something very awful has happened. So the first thing you want to do is, you know, express condolences, and say something like It's very nice to meet you, but I'm very sorry for the circumstance. And then I think I would ask them, you know, how long have you been at the hospital? Getting a sense of, you know, have they eaten recently? Have they had any sleep? Are they waiting for someone else to come and be here with them? Those are all really important things to understand. The next thing I think we would ask them is, you know, what has the doctor told you? Because I want to make sure that they understand the same thing that I understand that I've been told by the health care team. And then once I understood and, you know, that we all understood the same thing. The next thing that we would do is have a very nice conversation about their loved one that's in the bed in ICU. You know, can you tell me about them. And then whatever happens next really is just led by the family.

CO: And this is the approach that you give. You sounded very sympathetic and understanding of them. Is there something in particular that you say that makes them feel that this is something that their loved one would want?

PM: Well, you know, when you're meeting with the family, I think one of the most important things is that we have the time to sit with the family and give them the time to talk about the things that they need to talk about. At end of life, people do like talking about their loved one. Eventually, we do get to a point where the conversation of donation comes up. But I never really approach a family under the premise that I'm there to ask them about donation. I really look at it as I'm meeting people. There's things I can do to help them through this process. And I'm really there to offer them something, not ask them for something. And what I mean by that is donation isn't going to change what's happened to their loved one. However, it may help them down the road to know that at least something good has come out of that. The other thing that's really important is before I'll go meet with the family, I know if their loved one had registered their consent or not. So they definitely know what their loved one's wishes were when they're making the next step decision about donation.

CO: But even if people have agreed, you still have to get the family's permission, is that right?

PM: When someone registers their consent to be a donor, it is a legal consent. So if that person, for example, had no family at all, we could move ahead with the donation. However, our legislation, the Trillium Gift of Life Network Act, requires us, if there is family there, to ask the family did their loved one ever change their mind? And you're right. If the family is not agreeable for some reason, they can overturn that consent decision. But most times, when the patient is registered, the family does agree to move ahead with donation.

CO: We see today that there are new numbers released by the Canadian Institute for Health Information indicating that 223 people died waiting for an organ transplant this year, and more than 4,000 people were on a waiting list for a transplant. What do you make of those numbers?

PM: That's really difficult for me to answer. But I can tell you organ donation is really rare, and I don't think people realize how rare it is. To be an organ donor, you need to die on a ventilator in ICU. And I think the latest data shows that about one to two per cent of all deaths from an ICU actually move on to be actual organ donors. And it is so rare. It's just probably not surprising.

CO: I just want to ask you finally, what would you say then, what do you want to say to people who haven't registered or haven't thought about this? What can you tell them about why they should?

PM: I think what's really important for people to know is that I believe I've met with enough families over the years that I've been doing this job, and it really does help them with their grieving process to know that something good was able to come out of this situation. The other thing I would like people to know is if they really wanted to try to help people at the end of their life, that they register their wish. And they should have the comfort to know that there's coordinators like myself. We’re their voice at the end of their life. And we're going to do our best to help your family honour your wish to help other people.

CO: Ms. Nicholson, thank you.

PM: Thank you so much.

KG: Pam Nicholson is a nurse with the Trillium Gift of Life Network, and the organ donation coordinator at Health Sciences North in Sudbury, Ontario. That's where we reached her today.

[Music: Folk]

Marathon book

KG: It took him more than seven hours. And he came in last. But back in 2016, Sean Kachmarski finished his first marathon. Partly thanks to an Edmonton marathon volunteer who ran beside him for four hours, encouraging him to finish. Now, Mr. Kachmarski has written a book, called "Just Finish." And this morning, he spoke with Mark Connolly, host of "Edmonton AM", from West Yorkshire, England, about that race.

SOUNDCLIP

SEAN KACHMARSKI: Well, it was just incredible. You know, if you were to ask me in 2013, that in 2015. that I would ever run a marathon, the answer would be absolutely no. And it would be absolutely, you know, not even in my comprehension. So when I crossed that, just like this overwhelming sense of I just did it, and I can't believe I've done it. That was essentially what main things was going through my mind. I can't believe that I did what I set my sights on doing.

MARK CONNOLLY: So how did it come about that you would write a book about it?

SK: Well, the thing was is that the whole journey of how I got to the end of the marathon is in the book. And as I was doing this journey, I was telling people about little snippets of what I've done and the silly challenges I put myself through. And they all said oh, you should write a book. You should write a book. And I went, no, there’s no chance I’m ever going to write a book. And it mirrors what I was saying to myself, Oh, I'm never going to go run a marathon, I’m never going to run a half marathon. And so just this year, I said to myself, you know what? I’m going sit down and get this on paper. And it was really nice just did reflect on my journey, and what I've done, and the pain and suffering, and the joys and the triumphs that I had.

MC: And I understand you've continued your running, and maybe even gone a little further?

SK: Yes. As part of the book, I've sort of topped off my journey with running at 50k ultra-marathon. That was a feat in itself. It was just really, really hard [chuckle].

KG: That was Sean Kachmarski speaking with "Edmonton AM" host Mark Connolly this morning.

[Music: Ambient]

Birdhouse maker

Guest: George Adams

KG: Twenty years ago, George Adams decided it was time to retire as a beef farmer. But he was determined not to sit idle in his retirement. In fact, he doesn't do much sitting at all. You're more likely find him trekking through Huron County, in Southwestern Ontario — hanging one of his homemade birdhouses on a hydro pole. He figures he's put up 900 of them so far. And at age 91, has no plans to stop. We reached George Adams in his workshop, in Brussels, Ontario.

CO: George, what gave you the idea to put up all these birdhouses?

GEORGE ADAMS: Well, when I was a kid at home, there used to be a bluebird nest in the hallow post back of the lane. And in this country here now, the fence posts and everything are getting to be kind of a rarity. The only people that have fences of any account are the Mennonite people. So I was looking for something to do. And I thought, well, I’ll make some birdhouses, and I’ll put them on the hydro poles because there's no fence post to put them on.

CO: So, George, you're saying that the birds don't have any place to perch anymore. All the trees and the fence posts are difficult to find.

GA: Are gone. Yeah, that's right. Oh, some people said no, you can't do that. They'll fine you. Well, I said I don't know. So the first year, I put up 25 between Brussels here on Number Four Highway — or London Road now. And Nobody said a word.

CO: So, no one has come along and said you can't do that?

GA: That’s right. And now, Hydro One employees, if they have to put in a new hydro pole, they’ll put the birdhouse back up if they can get it off without breaking it.

CO: That's very interesting!

GA: And so that's very encouraging too. And they were all occupied like first year. And so they’re bluebird-sized, an inch-and-a-half hole. And the tree swallows, they use them too.

CO: When you say occupied, so they're not just looking for a place to perch — which these houses offer. They're moving in. They're keeping warm, and taking up residence in your houses?

GA: Well, yeah, they got to have someplace to lay their eggs and hatch the young ones out, and feed them till they get ready to fly. One of the problems with some of the birds that nest in the hay fields and that is if you're cutting hay, you cannot see them until you’re on top of them. Then, when you cut the grass away, if there's young ones, the seagulls will pick them up. So it's one of those situations where you can't win.

CO: Now, you now have about 900 birdhouses installed.

GA: Yes. So when I cleaned them out in the fall, we marked them down. I go by the road they're on. And I just mark them down with a stroke. And if there’s a stroke, that birdhouse was cleaned.

CO: You have a map of all your bird houses?

GA: [laugh] No, no, I don't have a map, but I know the roads.

CO: Wow! And now, when you say clean them out, why is it necessary for you to go out and do that?

GA: Well, a bird don't use an old nest — even if the bird house isn't cleaned out, they will build another nest on top of the old nest. If you don't clean the old birds’ old nest out, the snow gets in, it's gets wet, and it deteriorates the birdhouse.

CO: How difficult do you think it is for four birds now in southern Ontario?

GA: Well, it's more difficult. We don't have as many birds now as we used to have. That's for sure. There's lots of fence posts, and there was more bush. There was lots of places for them that are now all gone.

CO: I understand you build these houses for sale. What do you do with the money you getfrom the birdhouses?

GA: It goes into the Prostrate Cancer Research Fund.

CO: Wow! How much money have you raised selling your bird houses?

GA: Well, we're well over ten-thousand dollars now.

CO: That’s impressive.

GA: And I sell birdhouses up and the Belmore Syrup Festival in the spring. There’s quite a few bought up there. You get talking, would you like a bluebird house? Oh, yeah. So I have to go down to London for a checkup every once in a while. The nurse that came in, she bought one.

CO: Would you like to see more people do what you're doing, putting up birdhouses?

GA: Oh yeah, if got some lumber around that’s not going to be used for nothing else, why don’t you make some birdhouses with it. I shipped a birdhouse out after the other interview that I had on the Internet out to Saskatchewan. And this fellow said he was talking to me, he said I've got some lumber around here. He said I'd like to see one of your birdhouses or plans on how to make it. So maybe you could send me out the plans for ones. So I thought, well, I'll just send them a birdhouse out, and he can copy it. [CO chuckles]

CO: Well, George, good work on your part. And thanks for doing what you do for the birds.

GA: It’s a hobby. And I farmed. Before I quit, I owned 800 acres, and 300, 400 head of cattle.

CO: And now you have 900 birdhouses to take care of.

GA: Yes, and I'm making more all the time.

CO: Good for you, George. Thanks so much.

GA: Okay. Thank you very much.

CO: Take care. Bye.

GA: Bye.

KG: George Adams is a retired farmer, who builds and deploys birdhouses in Southwestern Ontario. We reached him at his home in Brussels, Ontario.

[Music: Instrumentals]

Bridgehead Coffee

KG: Ottawa's homegrown coffee shop is looking to spill the beans beyond the boundaries of the capital. Bridgehead — which has been serving up hot brown stuff across Ottawa since 1999 — has been bought out by the parent company of the limping Toronto-based Second Cup. The nine-point-five million dollar deal has been in the works for the past 18 months. Tracey Clark is Bridgehead's current president and CEO. This morning, she told CBC Ottawa it was the right time to sell.

SOUNDCLIP

TRACY CLARK: You know, being from Ottawa, it's hard to grow out of town. And particularly if you're interested in The Big Smoke. And so the opportunity to join Aegis to provide opportunities with real estate, with capital, was shared services, and yet, have the opportunity to be independent and run autonomously is just too good an opportunity. But the hard part was actually realizing a couple of years ago that I wanted to focus on the team, and growing the team, and getting ready for an opportunity. And that's actually when I think about some of the highs of building a business. There's been the impact that we've had in our coffee-growing communities, which has been huge. And that continues to excite me. There's the fostering community connections in our stores that's been really great. But then there's that staff community, and building a strong culture, and particularly building a strong team. So I'd like to think that parenting is a grieving process. And, in fact, leading a company is also a grieving process all the way along because you've got to let it grow up, and so the team's ready, and the company's ready. So who am I to stand in their way?

ROBYN BRESNAHAN: I'm going to read you something that’s not going to feel good.

TC: Okay.

RB: Really Ottawa just tweeted to this news, happy goat here I come [TC sighs]. #independent. #coffee.

TC: I hope that we can keep serving in the cup. Actually, I don't hope that. I know that we will. And there's an independent spirit within Bridgehead that I feel that it's alive and will continue to be alive. And I hope to bring that to other communities.

KG: That's Bridgehead CEO Tracey Clark speaking with CBC Ottawa host Robyn Bresnahan. Ms. Clark is mum on the details as to where Bridgehead will expand to first — but maintains it operate under the same name, and the head office will remain in Ottawa.

[Music: Indie rock]

Vienna Opera House composer

Guest: Olga Neuwirth

KG: For 150 years, men have dominated the opera in Vienna. But now, for the first time, an opera written by a woman will be staged at the Vienna State Opera in Austria. And it's not just any opera. It's called "Orlando" — a take on Virginia Woolf's playful novel about gender fluidity and trans identity. Olga Neuwirth wrote the opera, and we reached her in Vienna

CO: Olga, why has it taken 150 years for the Vienna State Opera to put on a show written by a woman?

OLGA NEUWIRTH: Well, I guess that classical music is the most patriarchic system, and maybe they didn't trust a female composer that she has a brain that ought to be able to compose. Because this was their prejudice for many, many centuries.

CO: Well, that was in past centuries. But why do you think even in these past years there has been, you're the first woman to do it, so what do you make of that?

ON: Well, I think the time was not ready because classical music society was not ready. And when I started 30 years ago as a female composer, I really had to fight and stick to my ideas. Because it was not very easy to stay into your dreams and your ideas as a female composer.

CO: So what does it mean for you to be the first?

ON: well, in a way, it's an honour. But also, it's very sad. But I hope after being the first there will be a second, and a third, and so on.

CO: All right. So you're doing Virginia Woolf's “Orlando”. That's the book you've written. So what is the story? For people who don't know the story, can you give us a background for it?

ON: Okay, that’s not so easy because it's very complex book, and it's a haunting story, a very fast story through many centuries. A journey I would call it through many centuries with a main character who is striving for freedom of expression, originality, and fluid identity. So if I might remarkable person who questions every kind of duality, and experiences is a sense of inbetweeness in both life and art.

CO: And it is full of gender-bending, isn't it?

ON: Yes, it's full of gender-bending. And so in questioning all norms of gender, so duality in gender norms, and also against any stereotype in how society asks for gender norms. So it's very fascinating that Virginia Woolf wrote about it already in 1928.

CO: And in the story Virginia Woolf wrote, Orlando begins as a man and ends as a woman in this story. Why did you want to make this into an opera? Why this story?

ON: Why this story? Because I think the story of Orlando is, yes, a quest for freedom. It's a quest for having your own opinion. It's against putting into any norms. So every human being is allowed to decide what kind of gender, what kind of life he or she wants to lead, or especially with him to use of non-binary gendered people and advance gender people, we have to open up our minds that it's not only a duality. And I think it's very important. So that's why I wanted to give a statement with this book also because it's a statement into the very rigid house, an old traditional house like the Vienna State Opera.

CO: [laughing] So you’re going to shake things up, aren't you?

ON: Well, I try a bit. And, yeah, with the topic of Orlando, because if you get the chance to make a statement as the first woman, then I want to make a statement.

CO: [laughing] So are you getting any pushback at this point?

ON: Well, yeah, [laughing] there is kind of pushback, of course. But we have to lift it. We can't change anything if we don't dare anything.

CO: All right. So you're shaking things up. First of all, just by being a woman and having an opera in Austria. You're also with the story itself. Why is opera, because people have often said that opera is the most sexist, the most misogynist of the art forms, why is that?

ON: Hmm, if I would know, and I've never understood it because I didn't grow up like that. And I didn't really go into operas, you know. I grew up with jazz and punk and other kinds of music and literature and arts. But so I never understood that rigidity. But I think it's like rehearsing all the time when you're already a child to become a great musician, it takes a lot of time. So I think it kind of also maybe dehumanizes beings. And if you have kind of reached a point like you are in a state opera playing in a famous orchestra or in an opera, like the Vienna State Opera, I think it's easier. You feel safe, and you don't have to open up and to get stuck. So I think everything comes together in this kind of opera world. And everybody wants to have the beautiful voices. It's beautiful. And also, to be kind of secure in listening to it. It’s going into a museum, and you see the most beautiful paintings all over again. So that's the same thing with music.

CO: But it's not just that it's beautiful. But, at the same time, the female characters often in opera meet terrible fates — especially if they're a bit uppity [both laugh]. And you're pushing back on that as well.

ON: Yes, I always did when I was collaborating with my friend Elfriede Jelinek, the Austrian writer and Nobel Prize winner. So we always had topics where it's that we didn't want that woman goes lunatic or becomes mad because, you know, man was always telling the story. If love doesn’t work out, and relationships, then they go mad. So I was always against that. So I always had women in their centre who are sex empowered.

CO: Okay, it is going to open on the 8th of December, is that right? What kind of reaction do you think you'll get from that very traditional Viennese opera audience?

ON: Well, I don't know. I think the very conservative ones are not coming to the premiere because, I mean, [CO laughs] it’s like you don't open up at all. You stay rigid. The other ones maybe have not such petrified minds. Maybe they go into this opera house and come out like being annoyed. Or maybe you think, oh, actually it's not too bad, maybe interesting. So that would be the best.

CO: Olga, I wish you success. And I wish you all the best. Thanks for speaking with us.

ON: Thank you very much. Thank you very much. Bye-bye.

CO: Bye.

KG: Olga Neuwirth is the Austrian composer who wrote "Orlando". We reached her in Vienna. We have more on that opera on our website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

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December 5, 2019 episode transcript

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