Note: Transcripts may contain errors. If you wish to re-use all, or part of, a transcript, please contact CBC for permission. Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print. Copyright © CBC 2019

The AIH Transcript for August 28, 2019

Hosts: Helen Mann and Ramraajh Sharvendiran

Prologue

HELEN MANN: Hello I'm Helen Mann.

RAMRAAJH SHARVENDIRAN: Good evening. I'm Ramraajh Sharvendiran. This is As It Happens.

[Music: Theme]

RS: Tonight...

HM: Intermission accomplished. British Prime Minister Boris Johnson says he'll suspend parliament for five weeks -- leaving precious little time for Brexit opponents to stop their country from crashing out of the EU.

RS: Don't go forth unless you can multiply. Doesn't matter what you want to teach in Ontario the provincial government insists you will have to pass a standardized math test before you're allowed in a classroom.

HM: No man was an island -- but he came close. The late Larry Dohey knew more about Newfoundland and Labrador than anyone else and gladly enlightened anyone who asked.

RS: History retreats itself. The curator of the Banting House Museum is overjoyed when he is sent reams of documents belonging to Sir Frederick Banting himself -- and underjoyed when it gets lost in the mail.

HM: Ape-ily ever after. A recent experiment suggests our simian ancestors might be key to our understanding of the evolution of language because it showed that orangutans can play the kazoo.

RS: And winning with just one hand down. A London doctor explains the radical step he took to save a patient's hand after a terrible accident -- sewing it to the patient's groin. As It Happens. The Wednesday Edition. Radio that assumes he had mixed feelings about getting one major surgery under his belt.

[Music: Theme]

Part 1: Boris Johnson's suspension of Parliament 'anything but normal', says MP

UK Parliament suspended

Guest: Tom Brake

SOUNDCLIP

[Crowd chanting: Stop the Coup]

RS: Protesters chanting "Stop the Coup" outside British Parliament today after Boris Johnson pulled the plug on parliament. With the queen's permission the UK's Prime Minister has announced that he'll suspend parliament for five weeks starting in mid-September. Many of his Westminster colleagues say it's an insult to democracy and it unfairly shortens the already short time they have to work out legislation that would prevent a no-deal Brexit before the October 31st deadline. Here's how the Prime Minister responded to that.

SOUNDCLIP

BORIS JOHNSON: Well that is completely untrue. If you look at what we're doing -- we're bringing forward a new legislative program on crime, on hospitals, and making sure that we have the education funding that we need. And there will be ample time on both sides of that crucial October 17th summit -- ample time -- in parliament for MPs to debate the EU to Brexit and all the other issues...ample time.

RS: Tom Brake is a Liberal Democrat MP and the party's Brexit spokesperson. We reached him in London.

HM: Tom Brake the speaker of the House of Commons -- John Bercow -- is calling this a constitutional outrage. What do you call it?

TOM BRAKE: Well I call it a constitutional outrage as well. Boris Johnson -- our prime minister -- is pretended that what he has done is normal. It is anything but normal. This has not happened before. And parliament -- I believe a majority of members of parliament are going to work to stop him simply shutting down our parliament.

HM: What do you mean when you say this hasn't happened before? How is this different from any previous prorogation?

TB: What prorogation is normally used for is when a government has completed the set of bills that they brought forward in the previous Queen's Speech. They tie up a few loose ends. They clear the decks. Parliament doesn't sit for a week or two and then parliament is recalled or resumes a new session of parliament with a new set of bills -- proposed bills -- in the Queen's Speech. What this is about is actually shutting down parliament so the parliament isn't sitting at the point when the prime minister wants to push through a no-deal crashing out of the European Union Brexit -- something for which he does not have a mandate and he knows that a majority of members of parliament would stop him doing it. So his solution to this problem -- the sort of solution that dictators around the world adopt -- is simply to shut our parliament.

HM: Boris Johnson -- does he not have the constitutional right to do this? After all the Queen has approved it. I'm just wondering what you and your colleagues can do to stop it at this point?

TB: Well he may have the rights to do it but the reason he is doing it is because he knows that a majority of MPs have on a number of occasions made it very clear that they will not let him ram through no-deal causing the sorts of problems that his own government have identified in their analysis -- things such as: medicines, food, and fuel shortages. We are not prepared to accept that. We've made that clear. A majority of us are opposed to it. Yeah he thinks the solution to his problem -- his Democratic dilemma -- is simply to shut down parliament.

HM: Do you think that this is going to trigger a non-confidence vote in the few days that parliament will actually be back?

TB: Well there are other things that parliament can do and members of the opposition parties and indeed members of the Conservative Party have been working together on and we believe that a legislative approach is still possible -- one that would make it in effect law that he had to rule out no-deal. So the possibility of no-confidence clearly remains but that certainly is not our priority at the moment.

HM: So what do you think Mr. Johnson's strategy is here then?

TB: Mr. Johnson's strategy is to try to crash the UK out of the European Union without a deal -- and he knows parliament is opposed to it.

HM: But given how many people are opposed to that -- both in the general public and of course members of parliament in various parties including as you point out his own Conservative Party -- how is a no-deal Brexit in Mr. Johnson's long term interests?

TB: Well Mr. Johnson has said he was going to do or die by the 31st of October. He's clearly decided to die -- or at least he's decided to drag the country down with him.

HM: But is it possible that he is trying to force someone else to trigger an election?

TB: If he were to try that route his intent on holding a general election would again have the sole purpose of having the country in the middle of a general election at the point where we passed the 31st of October thereby guaranteeing that members of parliament are not there -- not sitting -- because when parliament's in a general election there is no parliament and there by guaranteeing again that we would crash out of the European Union on the 31st of October.

HM: If you manage to succeed in passing legislation that prevents the government from leaving the EU without a deal -- what effect will it actually have? I mean you haven't been able to come to terms with a deal so the deadline will still happen. How do you deal with that?

TB: We have already been this route before and succeeded in getting the government to request and it was granted an extension to Article 50. But the first step is to get no-deal ruled-out in law. And then I hope we can move on to things like ensuring that any deal or the prospect of no-deal is something that the country as a whole has to vote on because they certainly weren't warned that this was on the cards three years ago.

HM: So you basically want a new referendum?

TB: Yes basically we want a new referendum so that everyone in the country now that they can read about things like the impact of no-deal -- medicines, food, and fuel shortages. And they can determine whether in fact that is something that they want to proceed with or whether in fact they want to pull the plug on this very costly damaging exercise that is Brexit.

HM: Those who argue against a new referendum point out that that would be anti-democratic given the country voted to leave three years ago.

TB: Well how can a referendum in which everyone in the country takes part be anti-democratic? What is anti-democratic in my view is proceeding with something which was won by a small margin which the polls now suggest people would vote the other way. The 'leave campaigns' which were all found guilty of breaking the law and fined as a result of that. The terms of leaving are not as was on offer three years ago. That's why I think it is perfectly democratic to say to the people, look this is how things stand now. If with hindsight you feel well this isn't what I thought was going to happen then you want to vote to remain you should be entitled to do that.

HM: The patience of EU leaders appears to be running even thinner than it was before. What evidence do you have that they would even be willing to give an extension to the UK on Article 50?

TB: Well the indications are is that the EU are reluctant to be seen to be the body that precipitated no-deal. That is why I think they would be flexible. I think particularly if for instance we were able to indicate that the extension was the first stage towards perhaps either having a people's vote on any deal or alternatively a general election -- and in those circumstances they made it clear that they would support an extension.

HM: Tom Brake thank you for your time today.

TB: Thank you.

RS: Tom Brake is a Liberal Democrat MP for the UK and the party's Brexit spokesperson. For more on this story go to our website: cbc.ca/aih.

[Music]

Larry Dohey obit

Guest: Brian O’Connell

RS: In St. John's, Newfoundland, a museum called The Rooms towers above the city's skyline. Inside you can spend hours roaming the halls reading about the history and culture of Newfoundland and Labrador -- or you could just ask Larry. Larry Dohey was an archivist at The Rooms. But today he's being remembered as much more than a museum employee. He was also a master storyteller and an unofficial ambassador for the province. Mr. Dohey died suddenly on Tuesday after suffering a brain hemorrhage. He was 59. He didn't just recount stories of his home province -- Larry Dohey also had incredible tales of his own. Here he is telling the CBC about his childhood memories of eating fish at Christmas time.

SOUNDCLIP

LARRY DOHEY: The Newfoundland dictionary -- the dictionary of Newfoundland and Labrador --actually has the term 'Christmas fish.' The fish at our house -- only because my father loved it so much -- and that was roasted capelin. So my father would take that dry capelin, he'd put it in a brown paper bag, and then he'd put that paper bag into you know a pan of water or run it under the sink until that bag was soaked, and then he'd put that into the woodstove because growing up we all had woodstoves. And he put it there and when he looked in and he saw that that paper bag was all dried up, he would take it out and he would feast throughout Christmas. That roasted capelin you know that permeated the whole house.

RS: Mr. Dohey was also the co-host of "Archival Moments" a local radio show in St. John's along with Brian O'Connell. We reached Mr. O'Connell in St. John's, Newfoundland.

HM: Brian I'm really sorry for your loss.

BRIAN O'CONNELL: Thank you so much for that. We're saddened by Larry's passing. It was very sudden. And we all extend our condolences to Ian and to his family. He was a wonderful man.

HM: What's it like for you hearing his voice today?

BRIAN O'CONNELL: There was something very calm about his voice. But also he had a knack for storytelling, you know. He was one of those guys who could spin a tale. The only difference is they weren't tall tales -- they were actual tales from history. And when you hear Larry's voice telling those stories you're hearing the voices from the past. He was able to take a piece of history and was able to put a place, and a face to it, a name -- in many cases, an address.

HM: In that clip we just heard there is a lot of the personal in it obviously when he's telling the story about his dad and the capelin. Did he bring a lot of that to the stories he told as well?

BRIAN O'CONNELL: Oh a tremendous amount. Oftentimes when he was telling a story he would sidestep to something personal. Recently we did a show about Newfoundland summer garden parties and he set off on a story about waiting for the various ladies in the community to bring their coal plates to the community hall and actually referenced a lady by name who made the best potato salad in the community. At one point we had to stop because the story he was telling was quite funny and I was just laughing uncontrollably. He told it with such gusto and actually put you in the place.

HM: Give us an idea of what Larry Dohey meant to the people of Newfoundland.

BRIAN O'CONNELL: You know he was an archivist. He was a historian. He was a storyteller. He started out originally headed into the clergy and then he became an archivist for the Basilica of St. John the Baptist here in St. John. They have a tremendous archive collection that goes back hundreds of years. And from then he went on to university and that became his passion. He worked at The Rooms and he was very proud of the work that they did at The Rooms. He made The Rooms less of a museum and more of a place that was like your home. When you went to The Rooms there was music, there was food. We saw everything that we were. And he made us very proud of it. And one of the things that Larry really worked on was the World War One exhibit. And he wanted to tell that story of the Royal Newfoundland regiment. And he often told many of those stories -- names of young men long gone but the history of the province and how it affected the old colony.

HM: I gather he wanted to ensure that Newfoundland history wasn't ignored or misunderstood. How did he work to change perceptions that people might have?

BRIAN O'CONNELL: He had a sense of who we were. He wanted us to be proud of our forebears. He wanted us to be proud of how they carved out a life here. He would often say you know when Toronto was just a small community of cabins on the side of Lake Ontario, St. John's was a city that was practising British law back in the day. He wanted us to know that Newfoundland was the foothold in North America for everything that came after. But he also talked about the humor and he was very proud of our dialect. He made us realize that the language that we have here is an incredible language -- it comes from many places including his hometown of St. Bride's. You can still hear that dialect very clear.

HM: What was he like as a friend?

BRIAN O'CONNELL: He's a great guy to have a glass of wine with. He had lots of stories. He was the kind of guy who would go and do anything for you. I remember one time looking at a photograph many times leaving The Rooms and I had commented about it several times. And then one day...it showed up in my mailbox that he had gotten a copy of it and sent it to me. It was just one of those photographs of the colonial building in St. John's. But he was always thinking of other people and the other thing was if you were going to have Larry for dinner you had better book it far out because he was involved with so many charities. He also encouraged people to bring their families and their children to The Rooms because they developed so many programs for kids here in Newfoundland and The Rooms became a place where children could come and have fun. And many times going in to record the show on a Thursday morning when there were children and school buses outside -- the sound of children's laughter echoing through The Rooms was the most pleasant thing. And he loved that.

HM: Looking at social media reaction today to his passing, it seems as if almost everyone knew him there.

BRIAN O'CONNELL: Yeah I think everybody did. We knew that we had quite a few listeners to the show -- this morning Rick Mercer, Alan Doyle, Mark Critch -- just a few of our local celebrities here. And then so many more -- people in government people, from coves and bays, people from across St. John's and across the province. I'm just gobsmacked at the outpouring.

HM: Larry was just 59. And you know known as this walking encyclopedia of Newfoundland and Labrador. What has been lost with his death?

BRIAN O'CONNELL: Oh my. We've lost probably one of our greatest historians, one of our best storytellers. We've lost a man who gave us so much pride in this place. But I think he set such a huge example that it won't be lost -- I'm confident that we will continue on to remember our past and teach it to our children.

HM: Is there one particular thought or memory that you will especially cherish as you're thinking about Larry?

BRIAN O'CONNELL: There are two things actually when he would discover a new story like the time Joey Smallwood took a caravan of cars and and tanker trucks across the island when they opened up the TransCanada Highway -- he had this mischievous grin that would come across his face. And the other thing was when he was starting a story he would always say "There was a time" and it was almost as if an elder in your family was going to tell you a very important story...something that you wanted to hear.

HM: Well Brian I wish I had known him. I'm really happy that you're able to share your memories with us today. Thank you so much.

BRIAN O'CONNELL: Thank you so much. He was a wonderful person and he won't be forgotten here.

RS: Brian O'Connell is a friend of Larry Dohey. We reached Mr. O'Connell in St. John's. Larry Dohey -- the Newfoundland historian and storyteller -- died this week. He was 59 years old.

[Music]

Severed hand doctor

Guest: Roger Adlard

RS: Sometimes you face a tough choice. Like whether you lose your hand or have it attached to your groin for two weeks. After an undisclosed period of time a patient at St. George's Hospital in London, England, recently chose the latter. Roger Adlard is one of the doctors who did the surgery. We reached him in London. And a warning: some of the details in this interview are quite graphic.

HM: Dr. Adlard this was a horrific accident. There's really no way of getting around describing it. Can you take us through what happened?

ROGER ADLARD: Yes. The poor patient Mr. Lelliott had been using a circular saw as his job as a carpenter and unfortunately his hand got caught under the blade and almost totally amputated his hand. It was hanging on by a dorsal skin and a little bit of bone. And the trouble was that he did it not just once but [inaudible] and it came back down again on his hand a few centimetres further on. So he had what we call double level subtotal amputation.

HM: He must have lost an awful lot of blood.

RA: He described it as a horrific scene. He said he was having an out of body experience and it must be been horrific for everyone involved.

HM: What did you think when you first heard about the accident and the degree of damage?

RA: Actually I wasn't too concerned. We have these sort of amputated hands about once a month at St. George's Hospital which is a major trauma centre. And so we do see these sort of injuries. So my first thought was that this is you know a big operation but something we can handle and will be feasible.

HM: When did you realize this surgery might pose some challenges though?

RA: Well after we took him from A-E -- from our accident and emergency department -- up into a theater it became quickly evident that this was more than just a simple amputation. And it was at two different levels. And there'd been a swathe of tissue loss which made things very complex.

HM: And besides the tissue what kind of damage did you see?

RA: All his tendons, all his arteries, all his nerves to all his fingers and thumb had gone. And also they hadn't just been cut through, they were missing. Three of the fingers were severely damaged but almost unreconstructably. It was a severe injury. The most complex I've seen.

HM: In layman's terms describe for us what you did during the actual surgery?

RA: Yeah. So the initial operation that night we started at 7:00 in the evening and finished at 9:00 in the morning. And we had to -- first of all -- re-establish a blood supply to all his fingers. This wasn't easy because we couldn't just join the arteries up like we would normally do. So we harvested veins from his feet and used these to bridge the gaps between the arteries in the hand and each finger and thumb. And the same problem with the nerves -- holistic nerves from his forearm -- and used those to bridge the gaps in the nerves. And finally the tendons also in the same manner.

HM: What were you looking for in the days that followed in terms of recovery?

RA: Yeah. So initially we just wanted the fingers to survive. And it quickly became evident that although with all five fingers were surviving; the middle finger had very little stability to it and actually was going to become a nuisance to him in life. And this was fortunate that in some ways because we also saw that there was some skin that was not surviving to the palm of his hand and we were able to cannibalize the parts from his middle finger and use it to reconstruct the dead skin that he was having.

HM: The hand itself you mentioned the palm there was not enough skin to cover it. How did you address that?

RA: So the next step that happened about two weeks after his initial surgery is we did what we call a groin-flap. And this involves burying the hand into his groin -- just the top of his leg. We lift some tissue in a sort of a rectangular flap up from the groin and stitch it in place into his hands so his hand is actually joined to the top of his leg. And it remains like this for two weeks until that skin grows roots and takes to the hand. And then we're able to divide the bridge of skin between the hand and the groin.

HM: And his hand was actually stuck in that position for two weeks?

RA: Indeed. It takes a lot -- we had to explain this obviously to the patient very clearly beforehand and see whether he was able to go through this. But it was possibly the only technique we could use to save his hand at this point. And he was keen that we gave it a go. He was able go home the next day and for two weeks he had his hand bandaged up in this position -- pretty uncomfortable I think you can imagine.

HM: How unusual is the procedure of this kind?

RA: It's actually a technique that we used to use quite often maybe 20-30 years ago before we had very good microscopic techniques. Unfortunately because of the nature of his injury the microscopic techniques that we would normally use using what we call free-flaps were not available to us. So it's always good sometimes to go back to history and use things that were done in the past.

HM: Were any of your colleagues surprised that you chose this measure?

RA: Not really. I think initially it raises a few eyebrows when you first describe it because we are used to doing more modern methods. But once they saw the degree of damage and then the other options were not really an option for us you know it becomes a matter of sort of saving this chap's hand.

HM: How is he doing now?

RA: He's doing really well actually. He is doing better than my expectation would be. This is always a devastating injury and you're never going to get your hand back to full function but already he's able to pinch and hold a pen and do fine control with his index and thumb. And his hand is nice and supple. His skin's stable. His sensation is slowly returning. And he's not having the horrible acute pain that he had in the first few days following surgery. So he's doing good. He's doing really well.

HM: Does he have extensive physiotherapy to come?

RA: He has to have lots of lots of physiotherapy. And this is the other thing you need a good patient and a good physiotherapist to do hand surgery like this. I know he's very determined and he will do well as a result of this.

HM: Dr. Adlard it's fascinating hearing all about it. Thank you very much.

RA: No problem at all. Lovely to speak to you.

RS: Roger Adlard is a plastic surgeon at St. George's Hospital in London, England. That's where we reached him. And we have more on this story including some photos of the hand on our website: cbc.ca/aih.

[Music]

Kazoo

RS: We humans have long believed we were alone in our ability to express ourselves through kazoos. We also believed we were the only species to have voluntary control over vocal fold oscillation. Although we don't necessarily think of it in exactly those words we think of it as voice control. The scientific term is active voicing. And now new science shows orangutans can do it too. The experiment was ingenious. Since we know apes can't say words, scientists gave them something else that would test their voice control and that something was a kazoo.

SOUNDCLIP

[Instrument being played]

RS: Terrible kazoo-playing of course. But what's important is that in a very short time, two of the orangutans learned to change their vocalizations so the thing would make noise in different ways. That's active voicing. And according to the researchers it suggests that, quote, "Great apes, our closest relatives, may hold the key to how language evolved in our lineage." It's an impressive conclusion reached with the help of a simple instrument and like the humble kazoo itself it's generated a fascinating buzz.

[Music]

Greta Thunberg

RS: After two weeks of no showers and no plumbing, 16-year-old climate change activists Greta Thunberg arrived in New York City today. Ms. Thunberg's journey began on August 14th in England. She's sailed across the Atlantic on a slick -- but no frills -- zero emissions racing yacht to attend UN climate summits -- and to highlight the urgency of cutting carbon emissions. She waved at crowds waiting for her as she pulled into the harbor today. Here's some of what she had to say after she got off the boat and spoke to reporters.

SOUNDCLIP

GRETA THUNBERG: All of this is very overwhelming. The ground is still shaking for me. But I want to thank everyone so much -- everyone who is here and everyone who is involved in this climate fight because this is a fight across borders, across continents, and it's as you said it is insane that a 16-year-old has to cross the Atlantic Ocean to make a stand. And this of course is not something that I want everyone to do. The trip was -- it was very surprisingly good. I did not feel seasick once...

[Crowd cheers]

GRETA THUNBERG: And I am very grateful for Team Malizia and everyone else who has been making this trip possible. And of course for everyone else, every activist who fight daily to save the world basically -- to keep the fossil fuels in the ground and to create safe passage to...Sorry my brain is not working correctly.

[Crowd cheers]

GRETA THUNBERG: The climate and ecological crisis is a global crisis and the biggest crisis humanity has ever faced. And if we don't manage to work together to cooperate and to work together despite our differences then we will fail.

RS: Greta Thunberg speaking today in Manhattan after wrapping up her journey across the Atlantic Ocean by boat.

[Music]

Part 2: Teacher testing

Teacher testing

Guest: Liz Stuart

RS: Those who can't do probably shouldn't teach. That's apparently the logic behind an Ontario government decision to have all teacher candidates in the province undergo a standardized math test before they can enter the classroom. That's ALL teachers -- including the ones who plan on teaching kindergarten, or drama, or English lit. The government says it's responding to the declining math scores on standardized tests for students called EQAO tests in the province. Stephen Lecce is the Minister of Education in the province of Ontario. Here he is speaking to reporters today.

SOUNDCLIP

STEPHEN LECCE: I mean at the end of the day you know I find it very helpful to understand to use measurements as a way to dictate where government invest. I think what we are saying is we care deeply in respect our educators who work hard. I think most educators like most people in most professions accept that professional development is a reality in the marketplace -- and that in the interests of serving our students we have to constantly be improving our skills and how we teach and what we teach. And so the test is informative simply to understand where we need to improve and where we need to allocate more resources. I mean many of the questions I'm getting today are premised on data from the EQAO. So in the absence of having a metric -- without knowing the problem and you know where we want to get to we can't really measure it. So I think parents in the province -- and certainly culturally this government believes in equating performance metrics. That's a normative way of doing business.

RS: Ontario's Education Minister Stephen Lecce says part of the solution to students falling math scores is having their teachers undergo testing too. But teachers say the ministry's calculations don't add up. Liz Stuart is an elementary school teacher and the President of the Ontario English Catholic Teachers Association. We reached her in Toronto.

HM: Ms. Stuart do you think you would need to brush up on your math skills if you had to take a test like the one that's being proposed?

LIZ STUART: Well it's difficult to know because we're not exactly sure what's going to be in the proposed math test at this point in time. We know there's a plan to bring a test in place for our pre-service teachers so teacher candidates before they can become permanent. We're not sure of what the content will be. That's our understanding at this point.

HM: And it would be elementary and secondary?

LS: Yes. Yeah it would apply to everybody.

HM: What do you think -- would you be willing to take such a test as a teacher?

LS: Well I mean I certainly hope I could do it and pass it. But I think the concern we have is first of all I mean it's the entire premise which is flawed because there's no connection between somebodies math knowledge and math instruction and student success. I mean there's just no correlation there. You know I fully understand Grade 6 math. It's how I instruct and how my students are able to learn that impacts their student test scores which is what this is all premised on. Instructional practice and what happens in a classroom is what enables students to learn. So if you want to improve scores then we need to look at -- you need to look at curriculum and you need to look at curriculum delivery. And those are two very different things that are not the same as testing somebody's math understanding. I could have exemplary understanding of math but my teaching practice I may need some assistance with.

HM: So the province says it's undertaking this because of the declining math scores it's seeing on these standardized tests. And the latest results do show that less than half of Ontario students are earning A's or B's. What is behind this decline?

LS: There's a variety of things that come into play. I mean we've been saying for quite some time -- and in fact it started several years ago under the old government but you know the new government is continuing with looking at the math curriculum and we have been saying like I can say for quite some time that that would be a good move that we need to take a look at the curriculum that's being delivered, making sure it's appropriate, making sure it's giving students the skills that they need. I think we need to look at making sure we're investing in our classrooms and all the supports necessary for the students who sit in front of us and those students have changed over the years. Our demographics have changed over the years and the diversity within our classrooms has certainly shifted -- certainly since I first began teaching. There's also the fact that I have students in my classroom who may have differing needs and need different instructional techniques and sometimes I need assistance in making sure I am able to meet the needs of all the students in my classroom. So I think we need to factor all of those pieces in as well. And you know I will say just today the minister talked about ensuring that new teachers have the skills to teach math and involve math in their teaching where appropriate and that they will invest. I mean the government's saying they're going to invest in professional development for educators. That would be a path we would see. You know if we're looking at investing in professional development I think that's a great opportunity for teachers. But taking the money and spending them on testing people in a small snapshot in time is not the best way if we're looking at how can we improve on student achievement.

HM: I want to point out you mentioned the curriculum the Minister Stephen Lecce says that the province will be embarking on a curriculum rewrite. He's criticizing the discovery math curriculum that was brought in under the previous government. Do you think there is a problem with that curriculum?

LS: No I think teachers have been talking for quite some time looking at revamping. And that's something that we should do anyway. You know it's good to -- on a regular basis -- take a look at a curriculum that's being delivered. I think with anything else that you can't point to any one thing and say well that's the reason why things aren't great.

HM: There are going to be parents out there who are going to look at these math numbers who are going to be concerned about their own kids math performance and wonder why they shouldn't know that their teacher have the skills -- the math skills -- to bring those kids along. What do you say to those parents?

LS: I think what we've always said is when you look at standardized tests you have to remember that's literally a snapshot of maybe two or three day period in one part of the school year. It does not give you a full picture of how any student is achieving within the classroom. And the best way to look at that is A) through dialogue with your child's classroom teacher and B) through looking at your students report card because that gives a true overview and looks at their progression throughout that time period. It looks at how the student is growing and it will show you where their weaknesses are.

HM: We are seeing more jurisdictions turning away from standardized tests. Why do you think the province is putting so much weight on these test results?

LS: I think because it's a political move. I mean we have been saying for decades since the test came in that you know this was not a good use of time, it's certainly not a good way to assess student progress, and you know it is blatantly just a waste of money. Money that could be better used within the classrooms -- truly supporting students. When you have you know real estate agents using it to say which area is best to move to because that school performs better that is never the way it was supposed to be used. Imagine this you have a school who looks at their Grade 6 test results and says oh you know our students didn't do so well in math this year so we really need to look at what we're doing here in school. Meanwhile the teachers know that during those two days there was a heat wave and they don't have air conditioning. So yes you'll see dips and valleys sometimes but to plan how a school is going to address curriculum based on two days in May or June is just asinine.

HM: Ms. Stuart I appreciate you talking with us. Thank you.

LS: No problem. Thank you.

RS: Liz Stuart is the President of the Ontario English Catholic Teachers Association. We reached her in Toronto.

[Music]

Lost In Transit

RS: You don't have to go far to find a historic home that was the birthplace of someone important. But you have to go to Adelaide Street in London, Ontario, to find the birthplace of insulin. That's what they call Banting House -- where Sir Frederick Banting was living when he had a middle of the night epiphany that led to the discovery of insulin. Grant Maltman is the curator there. And a little while back he was contacted by Nancy Hardy-Banting of British Columbia. She is the widow of Sir Frederick Banting's son. And she said she had some documents that might be of interest to the museum. But as Mr. Maltman told the CBC's "Afternoon Drive" yesterday -- it wasn't an easy feat getting them from BC to London, Ontario.

SOUNDCLIP

GRANT MALTMAN: This is every curator's dream and nightmare on all rolled into one. So she had mentioned you know she had a couple of speeches, a couple of signed documents, and a couple of photographs that she thought we might be interested in. And I said well that's fantastic. If you're going through the items perhaps there might be something that you're not aware of that would be important but might be important to us. So I offered to help go through the documents for her and you could hear the silence through the email. Oh no. And she writes back well I guess it'll take a little longer to get these items to you because most of that stuff you're asking for I'm getting ready to send off to the shredder.

JONATHAN PINTO: Oh no.

GRANT MALTMAN: Yeah. And I said please don't. I understand you know there's a lot of junk as she said that you wouldn't be interested in. And I said well let us make that decision and help you.

JONATHAN PINTO: And then something happened in transit right?

GRANT MALTMAN: Well there's the nightmare. So we reached out to a museum in British Columbia to help pack things up and to courier it to us. It was one envelope and four boxes and the envelope arrived overnight as we'd requested. And it was fantastic and I sent a quick email out with the time change and just saying what a wonderful photograph this was -- it was a beautiful photograph of Sir Frederick's first wife -- Marion -- in her wedding gown with her bouquet. And he just emailed us back -- wait till you see the rest of the stuff. And a day goes by and two days go by. -- and then the weekend comes. Still nothing on the Monday. And so we started to get concerned and realized that it had become lost in transit.

JONATHAN PINTO: Wow. Okay so what happened next?

GRANT MALTMAN: Oh about two-three weeks working at both ends we had one tracking number and they said well you've got it and we have the item in. Yes but there's four more boxes and apparently only one packing label was attached to the entire grouping and so ended up in the warehouse in Coquitlam --sort of the warehouse of lost packages. But three weeks later then it came to the door and it was like Christmas in July.

JONATHAN PINTO: Tell me more about these boxes. It's about 200 pounds archives. When the delivery arrived I was in my office upstairs and hear just "thud." And it was a treasure trove of documents and photographs and objects that really show a personal side to Banting's life with his son Bill. One of the prizes is a letter that was written to Dr. Banting from his sister that was delivered to his house here in London. So it's the only letter I have in our collection and the only one I'm aware of that survives from his London period and it's Christmas in 1920 and he's just broken up with his fiancee -- and so it's a bit of a conciliatory letter from his sister and she is trying to bring up his spirits.

JONATHAN PINTO: And so what will you be doing with this letter now?

GRANT MALTMAN: Well with the rest of the documents we're busy cataloging them and making sure we get them in the database and really just starting to do the research on them and figure out where they're going to fit into our exhibit and research program. We'll be celebrating our 100th anniversary in 2020. And so this for sure will be going on display. We might put a little teaser out -- this letter specifically before that though.

RS: That was Grant Maltman the curator of the Banting House National Historic Site in London, Ontario. He was speaking with Jonathan Pinto -- guest host of CBC Radio's "Afternoon Drive."

[Music]

Hermine Ricketts obit

RS: Hermine Ricketts' vegetable garden was her healing place. Ms. Ricketts was an architect in Florida. After health problems forced her to close her firm in the late 90s, she spent 10 to 12 hours a day in her yard tending to her jalapenos and tomatoes. So in 2013 when the village of Miami Shores changed its zoning bylaws to outlaw vegetable gardens in front yards Ms. Ricketts wasn't going down without a fight. She and her husband Tom Carroll spent six years challenging the law and finally earlier this year the Florida legislature finally passed a law inspired by their efforts. It bans local bans on vegetable gardens. Hermine Ricketts died this week after a long illness. She was 63. Last month, As It Happens guest host Susan Bonner spoke to Ms. Ricketts just after the law allowing her to plant vegetables again came into effect.

SOUNDCLIP

SB: What does this day mean to you?

HR: It's a relief that it’s over. Six years of uncertainty and stress is over.

SB: Your battle started in 2013, when the village of Miami Shores issued a ban against vegetable gardens in front yards. What was the reason behind this?

HR: Well, sense of property value. They believe that you should be able to come in, buy a house, lay down some grass, flip it, and sell it for more money. That's what they consider property value.

SB: Why did the village council think it was bad for property values to put vegetables in the front yard?

HR: Because they're short-sighted and moronic. Because they do not understand what value is. To them, value is money — not a lifestyle. Not preserving butterflies, bees, insects. The legacy of their children and grandchildren, they don't consider that of any value.

SB: How did this multi-year fight against this ruling how did it affect you personally?

HR: Personally, I became stressed and ill — very ill — to the point where I couldn't be in the garden anymore. I spent most of the time in the hospital with surgeries. Just dealing with major health issues, you know? So it took away the fun and the healing that I would get for my garden.

SB: So the Miami Shores ban was upheld through multiple appeals that you made. Why didn't you just give up? It was making you sick. It was so hard.

HR: Because they had no right. And it was folly. It was folly. It was nonsense. To say something as stupid as you cannot have the female plant up front. You can only have the male of the plant that bares no food and the front. You know, it's like having a Saudi Arabia for a garden, where the woman, the female, the bearer of the food stays in the back. It’s just folly. I don't like stupidity.

SB: You were actually told you can't plant any plants that are considered female in the front of your home?

HR: Well, that's one of the statements that were made in a deposition by the code inspector. The male of the plant — if the plant did not transport fruit — it could stay. As long as you can eat something from the garden, you cannot have it in the front yard.

SB: But you won, eventually, by helping to get the state law changed.

HR: Yeah, because someone at a higher level realized that it is utter nonsense to prevent someone from growing vegetables in their front yard. Someone was wise enough to see the folly of the arguments both by the lower courts and the village. And I'm very grateful for that. So it was just you know patience — stressful patience, but still patience.

RS: That's from our July interview with Florida gardener Hermine Ricketts. At the time, a law she inspired which allows Florida residents to plant vegetables in their front yards had just gone into effect. Ms. Ricketts died this week. She was 63.

[Music]

Phone scam

RS: It's a familiar scam. Someone calls and says you're about to be arrested. Turns out without knowing it, you committed a bad crime -- drug trafficking let's say. Maybe some money laundering to boot. And the CRA -- or if you're in the States, the IRS -- is onto you. You're in a really tough spot. But first things first, could you confirm your name, your address, and some important details relating to your bank account? Recently a North Carolina woman got a call like that. The man on the other end of the line claimed to be Officer John Black from Social Security Administration. But it turns out he dialed a wrong number because he was speaking with an actual police officer: Ann Stephens. And so the hunter became the hunted. Police Captain Stephens recorded her call with the scammer. Here's how it sounded.

SOUNDCLIP

MAN: Okay now go ahead and let me know how many bank accounts are originally owned by you? It has nothing to do with illegal activities.

ANN STEPHENS: Well if it has nothing to do with illegal activities, why do I have to give you my -- tell you how many bank accounts I have?

MAN: See if you do not tell me how many bank accounts you have we'll go ahead and suspend all the bank accounts which are connected to your social security. So don't blame us if you lose any money. We're trying to help you out here. Okay?

ANN STEPHENS: Well I just don't understand why I'm giving you my...I would like to know what the allegations are against me and what you're going to take out a warrant for.

MAN: Right now there are two criminal charges against you. Number one: drug trafficking. And number two: money laundering.

ANN STEPHENS: Well that's better than the 25 the first guy told me were out against me.

[Call ends]

ANN STEPHENS: And they've hung up on me. They're all scammers. Just hang up on them or have a little fun.

RS: That was part of an exchange between Apex Police Captain Ann Stephens and a scam artist claiming to be an officer himself. The North Carolina Police Department posted the video of that call on Facebook to draw attention to the tactics used by scammers.

Back To Top »

Provide Transcript Feedback

CBC would like to acknowledge the support of the Broadcasting Accessibility Fund.

August 28, 2019 Episode Transcript

More Stories Like This