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The AIH Transcript for January 29, 2018

Hosts: Helen Mann and Jeff Douglas

STORIES FROM THIS EPISODE

Prologue

HELEN MANN: Hello, I'm Helen man sitting in for Carol Off.

JD: Good evening, I'm Jeff Douglas. This is As It Happens.

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JD: Tonight…

HM: Close to home. Bruce McArthur is now charged with five murders in Toronto. And police have discovered human remains on one of the properties where he worked — a property that belongs to our guest.

JD: Precious little light after their darkest hour. A year after a gunman killed two of his friends as they prayed, a member of the Quebec City Islamic Centre says that if anything, Muslims there now face more intolerance because of their faith

HM: No means to his end. Rick Dykstra is out as the president of Ontario's PC party after allegations of sexual assault. Allegations our guest said she heard about years ago but didn't have the tools to act on.

JD: Last ditch effort. An Ontario truck driver watches as an SUV careens off the highway and winds up on fire in a ditch — and then he pulls the driver from that burning vehicle.

HM: Bellige-renter. An employee of the U.S. embassy in Ottawa says diplomatic immunity exempts her from paying overdue rent to her former landlord. But he says that doesn't mean squat.

JD: And… Caricature assassination. Cleveland's Major League Baseball team announces it's getting rid of the racist feather-wearing indigenous cartoon on its uniforms. But one lawyer who fought for the change doesn't consider that a homerun. As It Happens: The Monday Edition. Radio that believes taking the feather off their caps is a feather in hers.

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Part 1: Bruce McArthur Homeowner, Rick Dykstra: Kym Purchase, SUV Rescue

Bruce McArthur Homeowner

Guest: Karen Fraser

JD: Today police laid three more first degree murder charges against Bruce McArthur, bringing the number of people he's accused of killing to five. Here's part of what Toronto homicide detective Hank Idsinga had to say at a press conference this morning.

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DETECTIVE HANK IDSINGA: And obviously the City of Toronto has never seen anything like this. So it is very tiring and very draining for everyone who's involved. It's a serial killer, alleged serial killer, and he's taken some steps to cover his tracks. We have to uncover these victims and identify these victims and hopefully get some good news or some closing news to the families of these victims.

JD: Toronto homicide detective Hank Idsinga at a press conference earlier today. Bruce McArthur is now accused of killing five men — Selim Esen, Majeed Kayhan, Andrew Kinsman, Dean Lisowick and Soroush Mahmudi. Police say they discovered human remains at the bottom of large flower planters found on properties linked to Mr. McArthur. Since his arrest on January 18^th, police have searched a number of similar properties. Among them a home in Leaside where he sometimes stored landscaping equipment. Karen Fraser owns that home. We reached Ms. Fraser in Toronto.

HM: Ms. Fraser, I can only imagine how disturbing this must be for you. How are you dealing with the latest news today?

KAREN FRASER: Well, at this point we had a lot of it, maybe not the extent. And, you know, you almost go into neutral. I have a feeling that my brain took it and shoved it in the back corner and said I'll bring it out a little bit of the time and think about it.

HM: When did Police first show up at your door?

KF: I'm getting a little vague on times, now last Thursday about 10 o'clock.

HM: And what happened, what did they say?

KF: Get out, it's been a serious crime, you have to get out right now. So we begged for a chance to grab a couple of things and then they said ‘We have an appointment for you downtown at 51 Division to talk with detectives.’ And we drove downtown to the police station and that's how it all started.

HM: So let me just stop you for a second. They said there was a serious crime, did they indicate who they were looking into, what kind of crime we were talking about?

KF: I believe they said that Bruce McArthur had been arrested, and that was enough of a shock. You have to understand he has been kind, helpful, helped with our charity work doing floral gifts for silent auctions. He went above and beyond what our original agreement was to cut the grass.

HM: How did you meet Mr. McArthur?

KF: We have a cottage. We've known the family that owns the farm at the top of our road. The wife of the current farmer is Bruce McArthur's sister. She called me about 10 years ago and said her brother had just purchased a gardening landscaping company. He needed a place to keep some equipment. And I said ‘Okay, when we are away at the cottage in the summer he can cut the lawn, he can use the garage.’ I thought it was a fantastic arrangement.

HM: So you have a garage at your home in Toronto and how often would he come and go?

KF: Well, all winter long we wouldn't see him, and then about April he would arrive, and of course, the hours are very demanding. I don't know if you know the flower business but the auction to buy flats of flowers is about 4 a.m., so he’d be there and arrives at our place about 5 a.m. put flowers in the garage and around the backyard, it was such a pleasure to get up with my morning coffee, I would look out and there be a carpet of beautiful flowers and then by noon they'd all be gone, he drive back and forth picked them up, go to various customers. And he often worked till about 10:00 at night in the summer. So we’d hear garage door shut, as simple as that.

HM: The Toronto police have said today that human remains were found in large flower planters. Have you had any indication that those human remains, any of them were found in the planters on your property?

KF: I believe they the police officer in charge, I believe we said that this morning.

HM: Since the police showed up at your door and they took you down, and you had to be questioned, they basically set up a crime scene at your home. Can you tell us what's been going on there?

KF: Well, the garage was the first part they went after. It's very interesting and bizarre to watch your own home on television. So it meant hazmat suits in and out of the house. And we were we were a little bit frayed around the edges, Helen, to be blunt. I simply couldn't think — I was so horrified.

HM: You know, you said you've known him for over a decade and you began by saying this is someone you knew to be kind and that you got along well with it. Can you share more with what's been going through your mind? Have you replayed things, have you been rethinking the decade of the relationship you had with him?

KF: As in the signs were there we just didn't pay attention, that kind of thing? Nothing, absolutely nothing at all. He had wonderful clients, he was kind and generous to them, I never saw him angry. He worked with his son. It seemed like a good relationship.

HM: And yet these crimes that he stands accused of are just despicable, and you said you're horrified. Can you share with us what you and your husband maybe have been talking about, reflecting on, when it comes to the people who are who are dead and the families who are mourning them?

KF: Well, I I do a lot of work in Flemingdon Park and Thornecliffe, a lot of newcomers to Canada and I know sometimes they feel incredibly vulnerable. A lot of them are here without family. And so I picture these men, glad to be making friends, they found a community they really think that their new life is going to be maybe more than they ever dreamed possible — and then someone, someone took advantage —the terror, the horror. That's what I have real trouble with it. The families, is it better to know is it better not to know? How long you've waited, we feel totally adrift.

HM: Do you have any idea when you're going to be allowed back into your home?

KF: They horrified us by saying it might be a couple more weeks. Apparently, in an average homicide up to a month is kind of typical. This is not an average homicide.

HM: Don't you have any reservations about going back knowing what you know about what was found on the property?

KF: It's a funny thing, people have said to me ‘Oh you're going to sell a house.’ No, I'm just hoping that the horrifying things they're finding are all in those horrible planters and they take them away. Now we're planning to have a smudge pot ceremony or sweet grass ceremony and invite an Imam and someone from the Christian faith and have kind of a cleansing of the area, which might help the whole community.

HM: We have to point out, of course, that Mr. McArthur stands accused of these crimes but he has to have his day in court. I'm just wondering though, has your own opinion of him changed?

KF: In the beginning the police said we have a very good case. Okay, we couldn't believe it. And then we said wait a minute ‘We knew a very nice man. He has not had his day in court, so we will try to believe in him with everything we've got until.’ I don't think we feel that we feel that way any more. We can't hold on much longer. And if it isn't him, we want the person caught and never ever see the light of day again.

HM: Ms. Fraser thank you very much for speaking with us.

KF: Thank you for calling.

HM: All the best.

KF: Thank you.

HM: Bye-bye.

JD: We reached Karen Fraser in Toronto. And we have more on this story on our website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

[Music: Sombre Guitar]

Rick Dykstra: Kym Purchase

Guest: Kym Purchase

JD: The president of the Ontario Progressive Conservative Party, Rick Dykstra, is out. He is the latest powerful man in the party to face allegations of sexual misconduct, less than 130 days until a provincial election. And there are new questions today about who knew of these allegations before they surfaced — and when. In a new Maclean’s Magazine story an unnamed female conservative staffer alleges Mr. Dykstra sexually assaulted her in 2014 when he was a federal MP. The article also alleges that senior Conservative Party staffers learned of these allegations in 2015 but did not act on them. Another person familiar with the allegations was Kym Purchase. She is the former chief of staff in the Whip's office. She met Mr. Dykstra as accuser for coffee in 2014. We reached Ms. Purchase today, in Halifax.

HM: Ms. Purchase, how did you feel when you learned that these allegations of sexual assault against Rick Dykstra were finally made public nearly four years after you first learned of them?

KIM PURCHASE: I felt, I guess, an immediate sense of anxiety in terms of how far the story had gotten with respect to a person who had reported it. But I think part of me was also relieved.

HM: We should make clear that Mr. Dykstra was, until very recently, President of the Ontario Progressive Conservatives. But at this time — the period you're talking about — he was a federal MP. When did you actually learn of the allegations?

HM: In the spring of 2014.

HM: And how did you come to be involved?

KP: There were friends of hers, some of whom were also staffers on the Hill, who had spent some social time with her on the previous weekend and she had made serious allegations.

HM: So what did you do with that information?

KP: I called her and I asked her if she would be okay meeting with me and she agreed to do so, so we met later that morning. When we met she asked me directly whether or not anybody knew we were meeting and I said ‘no,’ And she said ‘well it’s very important if we have this conversation that it's just between you and me,’ and I gave her my word. And so she went on to tell me that she had been at a party with several MPs and they had been drinking and she was getting a cab home and this MP, she alleged that he got in the car with her. I remembered it as them going to her place, but I read from Mr. Maher’s story that in fact it was his place, and that she went inside and he assaulted her and then she was able to leave. She decided to go and file a police report and she subsequent to that decided that she did not want to go forward with that complaint. But when she said that she was assaulted and she felt that she did not have a choice, I do believe her.

HM: She says Mr. Dykstra forced oral sex on her. You didn't know that particular detail at the time, you just knew that she was very upset by her experience.

KP: Yeah, and I didn't I didn't want to question her, like I wanted her to tell her story. I wasn't there to decide whether or not she was credible or, you know, whether there was any veracity to it. I found out about it and I felt like I needed to contact her and I wanted to help.

HM: And what was your sense of what she wanted from you, what she thought should happen next?

KP: She was not really happy that I knew, she was not happy that I contacted her office and that there was already some suspicion there as to why she was contacting me. She asked me for my word that I would not do anything further on it, but if she changed her mind at a time in the future she could call me.

HM: Did you have any formal tools at hand that you could have carried on some kind of process, some procedures that you should have perhaps followed or if there'd been available to you?

KP: Not at that time, no. There are harassment policies, I think, from the different parties and I understand that there's legislation being debated but, you know, at that time, like right now, if she decided to go public then then I would have supported her.

HM: As you know, in the article in Maclean's, she says that she is certain that she asked for a file to be created, presumably one that would have been kept as a record in the Whip's office. Is that your recollection?

KP: No, that is not my recollection. My recollection was she wanted to make sure that there was no leak and no information that got out. I thought a lot about this. I read that and I'm troubled by it as well. I really just wanted to help. And when I left that meeting I thought what I was doing was respecting what she asked of me.

HM: So did you share the information with anyone?

KP: I couldn't, it's terrible but I couldn't.

HM: Did it weigh on you?

KP: An awful lot. You know, here's this young woman, early in her career, carrying this burden and what she's most afraid of is that someone is going to find out and her career is going to be ruined before it gets started.

HM: Bring us forward to the fall of 2015 and the allegations reach senior Conservative campaign operatives, at that point before deciding whether they might drop Rick Dykstra as the candidate for MP. They decided not to do that. Can you tell us anything about that process?

KP: A request came in from her lawyer to the Whips office looking for a document, this memo, that I did not have. And I subsequently received communication from the party lawyer. I'm not privy to who was aware beyond my communication with the lawyer.

HM: And at that point you did share the information?

KP: Oh yeah, yeah.

HM: We talked a moment ago about efforts underway to introduce some kind of mechanism to protect people who work on Parliament Hill. Do you believe that a bill like this would have protected this particular staffer back in 2014?

KP: You know, I don't really know. What I do believe is that it's up to the person to decide if they want to go through, I think that's fundamental. But that being said if there is nothing in place nothing will change. There has to be something that protects people and there has to be consequences. There has to be an ability for like a third party to be able to examine this.

HM: Did you have concerns that if something like this comes to the surface from one person that there may potentially be other victims?

KP: Yes, I absolutely did. Anybody who's spent any time on Parliament Hill, whether as a staffer, an MP or a journalist, knows that there are whispers and rumors and that sort of thing. It's entirely possible that other things will come out and if that's what happens so be it time.

HM: Have you reached out to this woman now that this information is public?

KP: You know, I thought about it but I don't want to disturb whatever sort of safe place she's created for herself and I don't want to intrude upon her life. I hope she's doing really well.

HM: Do you have regrets about the situation?

KP: No, not really. I mean, I regret that she had to go through it. I regret that this went on for so long and now it's coming out but I really just wanted to help and I believed that listening to her story, believing her and then respecting her wishes was the best that I could do to help. I don't regret it.

HM: Kym Purchase, I appreciate you speaking with us today, thank you very much.

KP: Thank you very, very much.

HM: Goodbye.

KP: Bye-bye.

JD: Kim Purchase is the former chief of staff of the Conservative party Whips office. She's currently chief of staff in the Nova Scotia Progressive Conservative Party leader's office. Last week that leader, the leader of that party, Jamie Bailey, resigned because of sexual harassment allegations against him by a former staffer. Ms. Purchase would not comment on that case.

[Music: Piano Ballad]

SUV Rescue

Guest: Darrin Martin

JD: Over the weekend Darrin Martin was driving his truck on a highway in Ontario when he saw a red SUV in front of him go out of control. Now Mr. Martin and others who were on the highway that day are being called heroes for possibly saving that driver’s life. We reached Darrin Martin on the road near Onondaga, New York.

HM: Mr. Martin, you're a truck driver, you're on the road a lot, so I imagine you've seen lots of things. Anything like you witnessed on the weekend?

DARRIN MARTIN: No. I’m usually just before or just after or accidents — but this one I was like literally like 15 feet in front of me when it happened.

JD: How did it unfold, what did you see?

DM: The car started to swerve in and of the two lanes and then took a hard left into the ditch and was flying through the air, it started tumbling into actually on the other side of the highway into oncoming traffic. And both myself and Jeremy were —I was traveling with another company driver — we just both just pulled over.

HM: And you decided you were going to try and help out, what was going through your mind, What were you worried about?

DM: If he was alive or whoever was in the car was alive because of the nature of the accident. As I was watching it I’m thinking there's no way anyone is going to survive this. Jeremy actually beat me to the car and as soon as I got to the car I asked him if he’s still alive or is he dead he goes no he's alive. George was on the opposite side of the highway.

HM: Yeah, explain who George was, because there was a few people involved in this.

DM: George was actually on the other side of the highway heading towards Buffalo and while this car was flying through the air, when it was coming down had George not been paying attention the car would have literally landed on his hood. Him and Jeremy were the first on scene. They started talking to the guy, he started coming to, I think he kind of realized, not really realized what had happened, but he kind of realized he was parked on the other side of the highway and don't quite sure remembers how he got there. And that's when I started scouting around the car to see, you know, the damage and everything else. And we were just waiting around for the EMTs to show up. And that's when I noticed there were some smoke coming out of the hood. And we didn’t there was a fire or it was just a radiator or steam and I had a little closer look and that's when I noticed there was a little bit of itty, bitty fire going on, but I couldn't see it, though.

HM: So what did you do then?

DM: As soon as I realized it was a fire I had — Jeremy's a little quicker running than I am — so I asked him if he could run back across the highway without getting hit and grab our fire extinguishers out of our trucks and he came back. I didn't want the gentleman the car to kind of know what was going on, I didn’t want to panic him and I tried to douse it out as best I could but it was in a kind of a spot where I couldn't get to it. I just said, you know what, we've got to find a way to get this guy out because I don't know how fast this fire's going to spread. And Jeremy and George got together and they said well the only way we're going to get him out is throught the passenger door.

HM: So you started pulling on the door, right? And then what happens?

DM: They started heaving on the door. And while they were doing that Jeremy noticed there were some flames shooting up from the floor on the driver's side, it was actually burning his feet, and he was so out of it I don't think you even realize at the time that his feet were on fire. So I jump right in basically on top of his lap leaning in through the broken glass. And every time the flame would come up I would douse it with the fire extinguisher. And everytime they came back that's all I kept doing.

HM: Can you tell me what's going on in your mind and your own physical response when all this is happening?

DM: What was going on in my mind was if this door doesn't open up you he's going to burn alive. There's no question like we're not him out. And I started freaking out a little bit. I said we've got to get this guy out of here and I was kind of yelling Jeremy, you gotta get this door open. And then finally it's like they both grunted and the door popped open. And I immediately ran around and I said Jeremy go look after this fire so I'm going into the car. And I looked up to him I said Are you there your arms or anything on your upper body, you've got the broken bones? He says no. I said okay on the count of three I'm going to start heaving you out of here as best I can. And I did one good heave and nothing happened. And now the fire's coming up through his pant leg and it starts to come up through the hood. And I say okay sir I’m going to give you one more good pull and I said you got to help me on this one. So he kind of helped and I pulled and I was able to break free from underneath the steering wheel and were able to get him about three feet from the car when the whole front of the car just went up in flames. And the paramedics showed up. They didn't really want us to move him anymore. But the fire was getting so big you could actually feel the heat coming off the car. So I looked down at the gentleman I said you mind if I move you and he says no get me out of here. And we proceeded to pick him up. We moved it back about another 10 feet.

HM: Throughout this whole rescue are you thinking about your own safety at any point there, thinking you know I'm putting myself at risk here?

DM: No, the only thing on my mind was that I didn't want to see him burn alive. I mean, of all the way to die, that’s not the way to go. Whatever we could do to get this guy out of this car was only thing on my mind.

HM: Well Mr. Martin, I'm glad that you were there and that you're okay. Thank you very much. Safe travels.

DM: Thank you.

HM: Okay, bye-bye.

DM: Take care. Bye-bye.

JD: Darrin Martin is a truck driver from St. Catharines, Ontario. According to the OPP the person in the SUV suffered minor injuries and has been charged with careless driving.

[Music: Oboe]

Halifax Explosions

JD: The people who run the Twitter account @CFLinHalifax want a CFL team in Halifax. To promote their cause they create mock-ups of possible uniforms, art and slogans that the city might use for a team. But it is clear that the Canadian Football League has no affiliation with the social media account identifying itself as @CFLinHalifax. I know that because today the CFL issued a statement that reads in part quote “We want to make it clear that the Canadian Football League has no affiliation with the social media accounts identifying themselves as @CFLinHalifax” unquote. Now you might wonder why the league would even bother making that official clarification. I mean, there isn't even a CFL team in Halifax yet — although talks are apparently ongoing. Well here's why. Yesterday, the CFL in Halifax account tweeted out a potential logo for a potential Halifax football team — The Halifax Explosions. The accompanying tweet reads quote “100 years ago a force was unleashed that made the city stronger, bigger and more united than ever before. Now we channel that force onto the football field as we flatten all that stands in our way #history” And another tweet featuring mocked up Halifax Explosions uniforms reads quote “These blazing hot uniform concepts for the Halifax Explosions is the last thing other teams would see before realising it's too late” unquote. @CFLinHalifax's Twitter mentions are certainly blowing up — and so are people. I will skip all the tweeted shock, profanity and disbelief — and sum up the response by saying for the most part it seems the vast majority don't support naming a team after a blast that killed about 2,000 people and injured 9,000 others — so it's tasteless. But it's also just a lousy name because yes, sure, you want a football team to sound powerful but not like an unmitigated disaster.

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Part 2: Cleveland Mascot, Quebec Mosque

Cleveland Mascot

Guest: Tara Houska

JD: In 2019 Cleveland's Major League Baseball team will take to the field without a caricature of a grinning Indigenous person on their uniforms. Major League Baseball said today that the mascot known as ‘Chief Wahoo’ was not appropriate on the field, although there will be no ban on putting the mascot on merchandise. Tara Houska is a lawyer, an activist and a member of the Couchiching First Nation. We reached her in Duluth, Minnesota.

HM: Ms, Houska tell us about your thoughts today on the end of Chief Wahoo, at least the future end of Chief Wahoo?

TARA HOUSKA: I think it's wonderful to see progress after so many decades of resistance but also recognize that you know it wasn't quite a full “We're getting rid of a logo because it's racist, we're getting getting rid of it because there's differing opinions and we're not going to actually do it until 2019.”

HM: So the fact that they were asked to make the decision by Major League Baseball as opposed to generating the decision themselves, that that bothers you a bit?

TH: Yeah for sure. You know, they gave an interview, The team owner gave an interview, in which he describes, really sadly, this decision and the reporter talks about his voice cracking during it, how it's the hardest decision the team has ever had to make during its history. You know, clearly was not happy about having to make this step forward towards progress.

HM: So what's it like to hear that tone when he's talking about it?

TH: You know, I think it speaks volumes as to why we want these things to be changed. You know, people clearly don't understand and don't want to. You know, they talked about their feelings and about how they're so sad to make this difficult, difficult decision and that they're going to continue to sell the, you know, the gear — the Wahoo gear — and they're not going to change any of the team's history and they're not going to lose any of that and they're still going to keep the name and people might be offended by the name but they're never going to change that kind of thing.

HM: You and others have been fighting to get the Cleveland Indians to drop both the name and the mascot for so many years. What's been involved in pushing them to do this?

TH: I mean, the protests against the against Chief Wahoo and against the Cleveland team and against other teams that carry Native mascots has been going on since before I was born. You know, nearly 60 years of advocacy — showing up at the stadiums, trying to educate people, trying to write articles about it, pushing people to join Native American advocacy groups — to see why this matters. You know, to see why something that is essentially red face, it is red face, should not be being used and it has really damaging effects on Indigenous people.

HM: What do you see when you look at Chief Wahoo?

TH: I see little red Sambo. You know, I see something that is a gross caricature cartoon of a Native person, and something that society has recognized that is not acceptable for other races of people but still continues to be something that is acceptable when it comes to Native people.

HM: You know, the mascot isn't going to be used on uniforms after 2019. But I understand that the team will be allowed to sell the image on merchandise, at least locally. What do you make of that? Why is that happening?

TH: I think it's — we can't wear it on national television. But at the same time we know our fans love it and we're going to cash in on this nostalgic racism. It really is, like, it's nostalgic racism. We're acknowledging that it's racist, we're acknowledging that it's an issue, that it's offensive to Native people, but we also, at the same time, acknowledge that you guys have nostalgia about it so that that overcomes and outweighs any feelings or, you know, empirically demonstrated damage against Native people. This actually harms the self-esteem of Native youth and changes perspectives about Native people — and continues to be this idea in society about what we are and who we are, today.

HM: So will you continue to push for them to stop selling this or putting it on any of their merchandise in the future?

TH: Absolutely. You know, this is not — this is a great step forward but it's just one small step forward. You know, we shouldn't be in a situation where it's not 2018 and we have a team called the Washington Redskins. We shouldn't be in a situation where we have a team called the Indians. I mean, can you imagine a team called the Blacks? Or called any other race of people for that matter. It's just not acceptable. I think it speaks volumes when you look at — they had a mock T-shirt that was the Cleveland Caucasians — and the Internet flipped out about it. You know, people were so upset and so offended that you would dare do something like that. And it's something that we will continue to advocate against and move forward and push everyone to move forward as a societal whole.

HM: You mentioned earlier the team ownership being choked up about having to make this decision. They also have said, the team, that in making this they're doing it despite the longstanding attachment that many Cleveland fans have to this mascot. Do you understand beyond this idea of nostalgic racism, what it is that the fans are so attached to?

TH: I think with any sports team that's very strong, you know, there's like a sense of locality and team pride. You know, I'm from Minnesota so Minnesota Vikings, Minnesota Twins, these are teams that we've had for a long time. However, when it comes to something like, here's a group of people that is saying I am not a mascot, I'm a person. You know, I think that then you look at that and you say okay well maybe we should look at changing this, maybe this is something that was, you know, at the time people did it and didn't care. But you know we're moving forward together. There's also team names that have changed, right. I mean, there's you look at the Washington Bullets — that changed because there were so many murders and violent crime was such an issue in Washington D.C. they changed to the Washington Wizards. These things can happen, people can move forward.

HM: So do you think it's possible that the team will actually change the name as well in the future?

TH: I’m guessing that they probably are looking at ‘OK so we have the most offensive logo in sports and now we don't so now the view will shift back to the Washington football team as the most offensive name in sports. Yes our offensive but it's not as offensive as theirs.’ So I'm guessing that they're maybe thinking that they get a little bit of breathing room and patting themselves on the back for kind of making this half-step forward, like this compromise. But I know there will be people that will certainly continue to resist.

HM: Ms. Houska, thanks so much for talking to us.

TH: Thank you, appreciate it.

HM: Okay, bye-bye.

TH: Bye.

JD: Tara Houska is a lawyer, an activist and a member of the Couchiching First Nation. We reached her in Duluth, Minnesota.

[Music: Jazz]

Patty Hajdu

JD: It has been a tumultuous past few days in Canadian politics with multiple allegations of sexual misconduct and harassment and a federal bill introduced to tackle this issue could not have arrived that a more appropriate time. Bill C-65 had its second reading today in the House. It would create new protections for Parliament Hill staffers who face sexual harassment. Here's what Patty Hajdu, Minister of Employment Workforce Development and Labour, said in the House today.

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MINSITER PATTY HAJDU: I've sadly heard stories of significant trauma, anxiety and people who have left workplaces, ours in particular, because they were certain that they would not have a resolution for the abuse that they were experiencing. Mr. Speaker, in our workplace here on Parliament Hill, it's no coincidence that we have so many of these stories of Harassment and violence. In fact, the volume of these stories is directly tied to the distinct power imbalances in our workplace that I spoke of earlier. So it's clear, Mr. Speaker, that we need to create safe works workplaces, including right here, so that everyone can thrive. And the first and most critical step, we as a government and society must do, is to support survivors. We need to believe the people who are coming forward. We need to demonstrate that we hear them. That we take them seriously, that we are their allies and that we're committed to ending this behaviour.

JD: Liberal Minister Patty Hajdu speaking in the House of Commons today. Her Liberal colleague Kent Hehr is facing allegations of sexual misconduct from two different women. He was removed from his position as minister of sport and persons with disabilities but remains in the Liberal caucus.

Michelle Rempel

JD: Yesterday Ontario PC Party president Rick Dykstra resigned facing allegations of sexual assault from a political staffer. And conservative MP Michelle Rempel addressed that today in the House. Here's part of what she said.

SOUNDCLIP

MICHELLE REMPEL: Is it possible for a drunk staffer to give consent for sex to a senior male in a workplace organisation who aggressively propositions them? Within any standard workplace code of conduct the answer to that should be unequivocally no. Today there was a report that at one critical point within my party this was a topic for debate and that is disgusting. In that incident, media reports say that people sat around a very senior table and argued semantics around whether action in our workplace should be taken because criminal charges weren't proceeded with. They should be ashamed of themselves and they should have no role or influence in this, or in any, political party. Which brings me to the next point. For the women at the centre of this issue there was no process for anyone to file a formal complaint quote unquote. Think about her decision making process for a minute, weighing job security in the context of making a complaint. An ill-defined process against someone in an environment with high media scrutiny. A raised complaint like this should have been enough to affect some sort of change.

JD: That was conservative member of parliament Michelle Rempel speaking in the House of Commons today.

[Music: Guitar Plucks]

Quebec Mosque

Guest: Mohamed Oudghiri

JD: One year ago tonight a man walked into the Quebec City Islamic Centre carrying two guns. Then he began murdering people as they prayed. Six men died that night. One of them was among Mohamed Oudghiri. Dearest Friends We reached Mr. Oudghiri the following day. Here's a little of what he had to say.

SOUNDCLIP

MOHAMED OUDGHIRI: I'm afraid, I'm afraid because I don't I'm shocked. I never, never, never been believing this could be happening here in Quebec.

JD: When we reached Mr. Oudghiri again today in Quebec City he was surrounded by small children as he and his wife prepared for tonight's memorial service.

HM: Mr. Oudghiri, what is it like for you to hear that tape as you remember those terrible hours a year ago tonight?

MO: Well, yesterday I've been with the local people and I've been astonished because people come from everywhere, you know, from Muslims, from Christian, from Jewish and I had reflection, I say we have to forgive.

HM: What did the people from those different faith communities say to you?

MO: When they come they show us that they are with us, that they are the same as us and they are going to do much better in the future and they are going to have the Muslim community and to forget the fear and forget the impact of what happened. But I want to believe but, you know, the racism and xenophobia from fear of the unknown.

HM: So can I ask you what kinds of things you have heard from people about Islam and about Muslims in the past year? Have they been good things or are you hearing still racism or messages of hate?

MO: There is a big mistake between people, a lot of people and Muslim people, because we don't change, we don't communicate and we don't try to be near the other one. And that's the problem because a lot of people are thinking that Muslims are terrorists because, you know, what's happened in the world, but Islam is not that. And what they're thinking is that we’re terrorists and we are not and they have the fear. And get rid of this fear from people and for us also.

HM: Are people telling you still that they think that Muslims are all terrorists?

MO: Yeah. It's not all the people but some. You know, you see the look when they are looking with some, some…

HM: Some suspicion perhaps?

MO: Yeah, suspicion. And they explain that we don't like you, we hate you. That’s what that means because you see that in their eyes.

HM: In that excerpt from the interview we did with you a year ago, we heard you say, at that time, that you were afraid in the aftermath of the attack on the mosque. Are you still afraid?

MO: Psychologically, yeah, yeah. Because you know each time that you see people talking about that then we have fear. I'm asking myself are we going to have something like that more time coming? I'm not sure.

HM: In the aftermath of that shooting, as we know, all the political leaders, the mayor, the premier, the prime minister, they made lots of promises about, you know, trying to make people feel comfortable and giving you so much support. Has that come through, that support, have they followed up on the words?

MO: I'm not sure. I'm not sure because the newspapers and news speakers on the radio and TV, they are not helping us to feel that we are comfortable here.

HM: Mr. Oudghiri, you lost one of your closest friends that night. What is it been like for you this past year?

MO: How can I tell you that?

HM: It's hard still?

MO: Yeah, yeah.

HM: How is his family doing?

MO: I think we have we have to give the time to work for everybody.

HM: So people are still going through a grieving process. They're still here they're still not healed.

MO: It is imperative to break the logic of violence.

HM: Mr. Oudghiri, I thank you very much for talking with us today. I appreciate it. We're still thinking of you and all the members of your community. I appreciate your talk.

MO: Thank you very much.

HM: You take care.

JD: Mohamed Oudghiri attends the Quebec City Islamic Centre. We reached him in Quebec City.

[Music: Sombre Guitar]

Coco Schumann Obit

JD: It was all extremely dangerous. You know, 17-year-old boys are cheeky, naïve, bold and cheeky. That is how jazz guitarist Heinz Jakob "Coco" Schumann described his first few performances in Berlin. It was 1941 and Mr. Schumann was an enthusiastic teenager making a name for himself in the city's underground clubs. But Mr. Schumann was Jewish, and as he explained in a 2014 interview with journalists Katerina Oikonomakou, at that time degenerate music, like jazz, especially played by Jews, was forbidden. Someone was always on the lookout for a member of the Reichsmusikkammer, which promoted quote “good German music.” And when its agents came around the club Mr. Schumann would quickly switch to a German tune. Eventually though, the Nazis caught on and in 1943 he was arrested and sent to a concentration camp. He kept playing music with a band known as the Ghetto Swingers and they were forced to be part of a propaganda film the Nazis used to try to present a normalised view of the camp to the outside world. And as Mr. Schumann recalled quote “Nothing was normal, nothing. We played forbidden music, yes. And then came the transports to Auschwitz.” unquote At Auschwitz, Mr. Schumann formed another band with inmates and again managed to survive by entertaining the guards. And after the war he returned to Berlin and relaunched his musical career. As he said in 2014. Quote “music has saved me and the music is all I have done after the war.” Mr. Schumann died Sunday. He was 93 years old.

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Part 3: Gun Registry Opponent, Diplomatic Immunity Rent

Gun Registry Opponent

Guest: Blair Hagen

JD: Beginning today gun owners in the province of Quebec will have to do something that their counterparts across the country do not — they will have to register their firearms with the provincial government. The Quebec registry has been a long time coming. After the conservative federal government, the Harper Government, abolished its long gun registry in 2012, the province announced plans to go it alone. Now a national group representing gun owners is fighting this new law. Blair Hagen is the executive vice president of the National Firearms Association. We reached him in Vancouver.

HM: Mr. Hagen what are you hearing from gun owners in Quebec who are opposed to this new registry?

BLAIR HAGEN: Well, there’s a lot of fear. There’s a lot of concern and theres a lot of confusion about this, as was the case with the federal registry when it got started. There was not a lot of information that came out about the requirements, about how people were supposed to go about fulfilling their obligations under this law and even what the desired goals were. So I think that gun owners in Quebec are a little ill at ease at this point.

HM: You explained the confusion but why are they fearful?

BH: Why are they fearful? I think it's the same fear that was generated by the Federal Registry back in the 1990s — the fear of losing your guns, losing your property. And that did happen when the Federal Registry was in operation. There were firearms reclassifications, there were firearm seizures that came as a result of that. And I think Quebeckers remember those days and believe that is going to happen again. You know, there is an old saying, those who do not learn from the past are condemned to repeat it. And I think that's what's Quebec is doing here.

HM: What in your mind is wrong with Quebec having its own gun registry?

BH: First of all, our objection to this comes from the Alberta challenge of 2001, where it was found that firearms registration for purposes of criminal law was a federal jurisdiction. As you might remember, Quebec challenged the laws saying that the registration of property was the provincial purview. So when Quebec decided to start this registry, I think it's a reasonable statement to say this is to be used to support criminal law in Quebec. That decision flew in the face of this and we decided that it had to be challenged. We're not challenging the right of provinces to enact registries of property. Yes, that is a provincial right. But this is not just a registry of property. This is a registry that is going to be used for the purposes of criminal law.

HM: As you know, a judge rejected that argument in Quebec Superior Court saying that the legislation was constitutional. So are you concerned that you're looking at an uphill battle here in terms of the court process?

BH: Well, I think we're looking at a long battle but it's one that has to be fought. We are appealing that decision and asking for an injunction. Now who knows where it goes from here, but we're not done, we're not going to stop.

HM: One of the many arguments that is offered in favour of registration is, you know, the knowledge that people have to register lots of things — cars, their dogs — why not guns?

BH: Well, it seems that the purposes of registries in Canada in the past is, first of all, I mean, to criminalize the possession of firearms. It's a criminal offence to possess a firearm in Canada today, if you have a firearms licence that grants you a five year exemption from prosecution under that law. The federal registry was advertised for the same purposes but unfortunately most Canadians who were forced to face that decided that this was a means by the government to seize their property. And unfortunately many people just refused to register on that basis.

HM: What evidence do they point to that that was actually happening? I mean, there was a reclassification issues with certain firearms, but, you know, very many weapons were allowed to remain as they were, always in the possession of the people who had licences for them.

BH: For a time, for a time, but the gradual goal of the registry was progressive reclassification and confiscation.

HM: You have philosophical opposition to this as well, though. What's behind that?

BH: Yes, as well as practical opposition there is philosophical opposition. This is a Canadian right. This is a Canadian right and cultural tradition that's being targeted by governments and bureaucracies, and that is wrong. These governments dismiss those rights, a lot of these governments dismiss those rights, and treat the property Canadians in contempt.

HM: Quebec’s public security minister says this registry will help police when they're going into situations like domestic violence calls to know what kinds of guns might be in the home. What do you say to that?

BH: Unfortunately that was not found to be the case under the federal registry. The government that ended the federal registry was a law and order government. And if there was any value in that registry they would have kept it.

HM: But police chiefs at the time, as you know, endorsed that registry because they made this very argument and they are the professionals in this field. They seem to think it's useful.

BH: The political police do. But certainly the cops on the street didn't. This is just simply a means to target individuals and seize their property. And frankly that's wrong. And we will not stand for it.

HM: You think that the Association of Police Chiefs is not adequately representing the needs of their officers?

BH: That's a reasonable statement.

HM: People in Quebec keep electing governments that favour a registry. So should it not be up to the people of the province to get to see a law implemented that it appears most people are in favour of in that province?

BH: Yeah, that's true. And if there is going to be a political solution to this it's going to have to come from in Quebec. We can fight this in the courts and we will continue to do so, but if Quebeckers opposed this registry it's going to be up to them to get politically active and elect a government or change a government that recognizes that this is the wrong way to go and that the tax-payers dollars shall not be wasted this way. This is a Quebec issue, yes, I agree with you, but that's why I put that plea out to Quebeckers who are concerned about their rights and freedoms to get politically active and help us correct this.

HM: And if they agree with this law and they re-elect this government, would you accept that?

BH: Well, we would have to accept that. I mean, that's a political process. We disagree with this. We will continue to take our legal disagreements to the courts and we'll do everything we can to assist Quebeckers in seeking a political solution to this.

HM: All right, Mr. Hagen I appreciate very much for speaking with us. Thanks very much.

BH: Thank you.

JD: Blair Hagen is executive vice president of the National Firearms Association. We reached him in Vancouver.

[Music: Hip-Hop]

Refugee Spelling Bee

Guest: Professor Kenneth Catania

JD: 11-year-old Marios Al Bazi placed fourth in his class spelling bee in St. John's, Newfoundland. And if it hadn't been for the word jauntily he would have placed even higher. And that is impressive because Marios is a refugee from Iraq. He spoke no English when he arrived in Canada — and that was just 20 months ago. But this year, after a lot of work and some help from one of the family's private sponsors Peter Jackson, he proved himself a sprawling force to be reckoned with. Marios joined Ariana Kelland and Jeremy Eaton guest hosts of the St. John's Morning Show to talk about his strategy.

SOUNDCLIP

MARIOS AL BAZI: Most Arabic people usually speak Arabic but I like to go to camps and stuff and speaking with English people but not keep on speaking Arabic again and again and again.

ARIANA KELLAND: What were some of the words?

MAB: Fluorescent.

[LAUGHTER]

JEREMY EATON: Ariana can you spell fluorescent?

AK: Can you?

JE: Not a bit.

AK: Now, yeah, I'll admit that I'm not the best speller but so we have fluorescent, let's just take a pass on that one. How many passes do we get? Marios do we get three passes?

MAB: Zero.

[LAUGHTER]

AK: Zero? He's tough, he's tough. Let's do the next word.

JE: Okay, give me a word. Give me an easy word no Marios.

MAB: Paralysis.

JE: Jeepers creepers. Paralysis. P-A-R-A-L-Y-I-S?

MAB: Say it again?

JE: P-A-R-A-L-Y-I-S?

MAB: No, S-I-S.

JE: Instantaneous. Marios?

MAB: I-N-S-T-A-N-T-A-N-E-O-U-S.

[LAUGHTER]

AK: I'm taking out my headphones. You come over sit in this chair.

JE: And you have a new job. So when you get ready for a spelling bee like this do you practice a bunch of words. How do you prepare for an event like this, Marios?

MAB: They give you this list with hundred words and you'll just have to practice it and then they'll probably give you fifty if you've got too many good spellers in the class, which is what happened to the other class, there was five winners. Then they had to do two spelling bees for the five winners and all the class, but our class got to have 35 words for like the whole class and one person won.

JD: Amazing. That child spoke no English 20 months ago. Marios Al Bazi is a Grade 6 student at McDonald Drive Elementary in St. John's, Newfoundland. He placed fourth in a recent class spelling bee. He was speaking to CBC hosts Ariana Kelland and Jeremy Eaton.

[Music: Rhythmic Guitar Strumming]

Diplomatic Immunity Rent

Guest: Rolf Baumann

JD: The tradition of diplomatic immunity is almost as old as diplomacy itself. In its earliest form it was simple, it was I won't kill your messenger if you don't kill mine. And the modern version is obviously a bit more complex than that — but the principle is the same — countries granted immunity to each other's diplomats to make sure that everyone is treated fairly. But according to her landlord, one American embassy worker in Ottawa is stretching that principle a bit thin. Rolf Baumann says his former tenant owes him more than $8,000 in back rent, which she is refusing to pay on the basis of diplomatic immunity. We are each Mr. Baumann in Ottawa.

HM: Mr. Bauman when you leased your townhouse to an American diplomat what kind of tenant did you expect you were getting?

ROLF BAUMANN: A very professional one, one that had a proper credit check, proof of employment and someone was an executive within the embassy.

HM: Okay, so that was the expectation. How accurate did it turn out to be?

RB: The first year seemed to be fine. And then there became issues from other tenants that were of concern — but I don't want to get into that. But suffice it to say her employer agreed to move-out date which it turns out she did not honour.

HM: So then you asked her for the money. How much are we talking about?

RB: It ended up being $8,650, which is, you know, to me a lot of money.

HM: And her reaction was?

RB: Well, going through the process that I had to go through, I even reached out to global affairs to see how do I deal with this. And they were very sympathetic and said ‘You’re just going to have to follow the law. And your next steps will be going to the landlord-tenant tribunal.’ And when the court date came we waited for Betsy, who was the tenant, to show up and she did not.

HM: I see. And so when did you find out that she was asking or saying that she didn't have to spend this money, didn't have to pay you, because of diplomatic immunity?

RB: Well after I finally received the decision and the judgment, I had to engage in retaining a law firm — Vice & Hunter law firm — to represent my interests because now we’re getting into the territory of going in front of the Ontario Court system. She in turn retained the law firm and the law firm sent a letter to Vice & Hunter stating that she is going to invoke diplomatic immunity. She is not responsible for paying the debt on the decision made by the Ontario rental tribunal and cease and desist, otherwise we will move forward with going after a motion to quash and go after our costs.

HM: What goes through your mind at that point?

RB: I’m actually in disbelief. I mean, how does a person who signs or enters into a contract have the authority and the rights to hide behind the veil of diplomatic immunity? I mean, I was I really was bamboozled by reading that and having the lawyer sit me down and saying well this is going to be very interesting to try to get your money.

HM: Did you contact the American Embassy for their point on this?

RB: I think I have spent enough time going back and forth. I did reach out again to global affairs and received the same response, ‘You're on your own.’ So that's where I realized that the only way to move forward on this is to engage the courts and see how far this goes.

HM: Right. Have you ever rented to diplomats before this?

RB: Oh, absolutely. I've been a landlord for 35 years. I have had many embassies rent from me. And this is the first time that someone has pulled the diplomatic immunity card and said they're not going to pay because they're immune from any responsibility to pay their debt.

HM: Will you ever rent to diplomats again?

RB: I would say, short — no. But again, if this ends up being that Betsy is liable and responsible enough to pay her bills and her outstanding rent arrears, it would be something that I would reconsider. At this point in time I have a bad taste in my mouth.

HM: So do you have any confidence you're going to get the money?

RB: It's just, you know, not at this time. It really will depend on the outcome of the court system. I mean, I have faith in our court system. I find it interesting that I'm being taken to court this Friday to quash the motion to be able to take Betsy to court to review what's called a discovery examination and the process garnishing her wages. So on one side I'm being taken to court because I'm owed money, on the other side, it's going to be an exercise in our legal system to see how far and how powerful diplomatic immunity goes.

HM: Do you hope by going to the media that you're going to shame her into paying?

RB: No, that's not my intent. I think right now it's based on principle of someone invoking diplomatic immunity and trying to get away with this. I mean, this has been going on for quite some time. This is not an isolated incident. CBC has done reports on this in the past that I have researched and gained information on. And I think moving forward, you know, the world has to realize that if this is the power that a diplomat has, or even an employee of a U.S. embassy, then what's the purpose of continuing to do business on any merits?

HM: Well Mr. Baumann I appreciate you taking us through the story. Thanks very much.

RB: Thank you.

HM: All right, bye-bye.

JD: Rolf Baumann is a landlord in Ottawa. That is where we reached him.

[Music: Jazz]

Listener Response: Patrick Brown

JD: As you heard earlier on in the program people from every political party are grappling with how to deal with sexual misconduct in the workplace, on Parliament Hill and in the provincial capitals as well. Last week, when Patrick Brown resigned as leader of the Ontario Progressive Conservative Party amid allegations of sexually inappropriate behaviour, we spoke to a former Ontario PC staffer who felt Mr. Brown needed to step aside. After that we received two e-mails on the topic, both questioning the fate of Mr. Brown. This note came in from David Gervais in Kingston, Ontario.

HM: The accusations on social media and the trying in the public forum have really made me sad and sick inside. This allows the accuser to trash someone's life for actions that may not even be criminal. Because it's a movement it is hard to defend against a system based on revenge for actions that don't discern criminal from unethical, unethical from innocent. The sentence also does not know moderation. The sentence is always a loss of income, loss of friends, isolation from co-workers and public shame. The hallmarks of our judicial system are innocent until proven guilty, impartial judgments, the right to defend and face your accuser and, if guilty, a sentence appropriate to the crime. All of these hallmarks are abandoned by this new social media justice system.

JD: That note came from David Gervais in Kingston, Ontario.

HM: In our interview last week former Ontario PC staffer Ginny Movat had this to say quote “I think that victims will feel emboldened, as they should, and it will further undermine and push out those abusers who have been hiding in the system” unquote. You can have your say on this, or any other story, by emailing us aih@cbc.ca or by contacting us on Facebook or Twitter @CBCAsIt Happens.

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January 29, 2018 episode transcript

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