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The AIH Transcript for November 8, 2017

Hosts: Carol Off and Jeff Douglas

STORIES FROM THIS EPISODE

Prologue

CAROL OFF: Hello, I'm Carol off.

JEFF DOUGLAS: Good evening, I'm Jeff Douglas. This is As It Happens.

[Music: Theme]

JD: Tonight…

CO: Jokes on him. After a New Jersey politician shared a sexist crack about the women's march on Washington, our guest was inspired to run against him — and last night she marched to victory.

JD: The reproof is in the polling. Triumphs in Virginia for the Democrats, including a win for trans woman over a long-serving Republican who called himself the state's chief homophobe, serve as a rebuke to President Trump.

CO: Err on the side of extreme caution. Residents in Delhi, India wake up to an uncomfortable blanket of thick gray smog, and doctors have declared a public health emergency.

JD: What she's won and who she's lost. Author Eden Robinson celebrates winning the Writers’ Trust fellowship and mourns the death of an enormously influential figure — her father.

CO: What not to swear. According to a ruling from the Canadian Broadcast Standards Council it’s fine for French broadcasters to fill the airwaves with the f-word, but on English radio it's still a massive faux pas.

JD: Careful, Carol. And…Here comes treble. She hasn't cracked any glass at the Metropolitan Opera in New York, but Soprano Audrey Luna’s attempt at singing the highest note ever on that stage — an A above high C — is leaving audiences shattered. As It Happens, the Wednesday edition. Radio that brings you interesting guests with alarming frequency.

[Music: Theme]

Back To Top »

Part 1: US state elections: woman beats sexist incumbent/reporter, Met soprano highest note

US state elections: New Jersey woman beats sexist incumbent/Virginia elections: reporter

Guest: Ashley Bennett/Michael Tackett

JD: What a difference a year makes. On November the 8th of 2016 Donald Trump won the U.S. presidential election. But last night's elections, in several American States, produced vastly different results from those we watched coming in a year ago tonight. In Virginia, the Democrats snagged their biggest win in decades at the state legislature, and in New Jersey voters elected a Democrat to replace the unpopular Republican Governor Chris Christie. What was also striking about last night's results were the new faces who beat out establishment candidates. One of those new faces is Ashley Bennett. Ms. Bennett was emboldened to run for office after a New Jersey Republican made fun of the Women's March movement. Last night, she beat him. We reached Ms. Bennett in Egg Harbour, New Jersey.

CO: Ms. Bennett, what did it mean to you to win this election?

ASHLEY BENNETT: It left me speechless, I’m still speechless. But it meant a lot to me because of how this race is began, to get the support from family and friends, neighbours, former teachers and former classmates. It meant everything to me.

CO: And now tell us what it is — the moment that inspired you to enter politics?

AB: OK, so it goes back before what happened at the Women's March. I knew that Hillary was going to win in the presidential election, so much that I was so confident I went to bed, and I woke up at 2:30 in the morning and I saw the map go red, and I was like “Oh my God, what happened?” And it just sparked me to get engaged and get involved. So I got involved with my local Democratic club here In Atlantic County. And when the Women's March came about I unfortunately couldn't go because I work in the hospital and we manage a 24 hour crisis hotline. And so I saw it on CNN and I was so inspired. And then I get an e-mail with the screenshot of a current sitting official, John Carman, post his meme on Facebook. “Will the Women’s March be over in time to cook dinner?”

CO: Let's stop there because we can't let this moment just slide by here. So this is when — you weren't in the Women's March — you're watching comments made by the man you defeated in the election last night, John Carman. And what he wrote on Facebook is “Will the women's protest end in time for them to cook dinner.”

AB: Yes.

CO: What do you think he thought he was accomplishing by saying that?

AB: Basically he was trying to make a joke an make a mockery of what women were seeking to accomplish that day and what he in fact did was anger a lot of his constituents because Atlantic County is fifty-two per cent women.

CO: And you vote. Maybe he didn't know that.

AB: And we vote. We vote, and we hold jobs, and we cook dinner, and we got school, and we run PTAs, we do a lot of things.

CO: And I understand there was a huge response to Mr. Carman’s remarks, and that people were protesting this meme and they arrived at the county board. One person was carrying a box of mac and cheese and instructions for Mr. Carman to cook his own dinner.

AB: Yes, that happened. One brought a feminist book it was quite a movement at that meeting. And I went to the meeting, I initially wasn't going to speak, but there were some young girls that were there and they had spoken. One was filled with anxiety, the other one was a little tearful, and I just thought “I have to say something.” Who speaks for them, who's going to be their advocate? And I waited, I spoke, but I waited to see what Freeholder Carman would say. What we got at the end of it was, “If you were offended, that was not my intent, but the women I surround myself with are strong and were unaffected,” so essentially the rest of us were weak. I didn't take too kindly to that. So I walked with a number of different people, and I decided I was just going to run.

CO: And that's a big leap though, because you had a job, as you mentioned, at the local hospital, you’re a mental health caseworker. You have no political experience and it was just this moment you decided to do it. Did you think you were going to win?

AB: Initially when I told the Democratic Party that I wanted to run, and I wasn't expecting them to take me seriously, and they did. And then I was shocked by that, and then I won the Democratic nomination in the primary and then the race was on. The whole time I was like “I can't believe this is happening,” and we knocked on doors, we hosted events, we made phone calls, and we had a lot of support and I didn't know what the outcome would be, but to me, I was going to be happy either way because I stood up for something that I believed in.

CO: Mr. Carman also appeared in a photo wearing a New Jersey map with a Confederate flag as part of the patch. How much did that help you win do you think?

AB: I don’t know if it helped me win, I think that it just continued to underline a sense of tone-deafness that was a pattern. He said it had no racial overtones, but you’re from New Jersey, you've never lived in the south. And my family, my grandparents are still alive, I’m very thankful for them, they’re from the south, they know what that means. And so the party condemned him for wearing that and I made a response, and as a response I ended up on a white supremacist blog.

CO: I just wonder also Mr. Carman seems to have helped you in this election. And also I wonder if Chris Christie helped you because he is one of the least popular governors in history. There seems to have been a backlash against him in New Jersey. Do you think that that contributed to your success?

AB: I think that it was — I don't know if it was a direct contribution — but I think that people want change. And I think when people are tired of their elected officials in the things that they do, it doesn't feel like they accurately represent them, I think that these are the type of stories that you'll see. And what I continue to ask this entire election is, it's never wrong to hold your elected official to a higher standard. It’s never wrong.

CO: Well, I think that those are words to live by for any politician, anyone in politics, and Ms. Bennett, I congratulate you on your success, and thanks for speaking with us.

AB: Thank you so much.

CO: Take care.

AB: You too.

JD: Ashley Bennett won in New Jersey's Atlantic County Freeholders election last night against an establishment Republican candidate. We reached her an Egg Harbour New Jersey. Now Ms. Bennett was not the only candidate to make headlines last night. In Virginia where the Democrats scored huge wins. All eyes were on Danica Roem. Ms Roem is a transgender heavy metal singer and former journalist. The Republican defeat it was the author of Virginia's anti-trans bathroom bill. Here's part of what Danica Roem said last night in her victory speech.

SOUNDCLIP

DANICA ROEM: To every person who’s ever been singled out, who’s ever been stigmatized, who’s ever been the misfit, who's never been the kid in the corner, who's ever needed someone to stand up for them when they didn't have a voice of their own. This one's for you. The election has to prove, nationwide, that discrimination is a disqualifier. We can't get lost tearing each other down.

[APPLAUSE & CHEERING]

DR: I want to make a point here, that no matter what you look, like where you come from, how you worship, who you love, how you identify and yeah, how you rock.

[APPLAUSE & CHEERING]

DR: If you have good public policy ideas, bring those ideas to the table because this is America too, and we are stronger together.

[APPLAUSE & CHEERING]

JD: That was Danica Roem celebrating her victory last night as Virginia's first openly transgender state legislator. Ms. Roem’s win is just part of a very good result for Democrats in Virginia last night — and part of a big rebuke to President Donald Trump. Michael Tackett is national political writer with The New York Times. We reached him in Washington, D.C.

CO: Michael, there's a lot of focus today in Virginia on the success of Danica Roem. But if you can give us a sense of the bigger picture in Virginia, what do you think happened last night?

MICHAEL TACKETT: Well, I think you had a couple of things. One was you had a validation of a long-emerging demographic trend in the northern Virginia suburbs. These are the suburbs right outside of Washington, D.C., where the growth has been undeniable, it's a very diverse kind of growth. It's Indian-Americans, it's Koreans and Vietnamese, it's Latinos, it's African-Americans and they're transforming that region, both economically and politically.

CO: And do you think that this was a demonstration that Democrats are energized, that people went out to vote that perhaps haven't in the past, or any evidence that Republicans are voting Democrat?

MT: I don't think there's much evidence of the latter, but there is evidence of the former, that there were numerous groups trying to get out the vote in northern Virginia, and that was a concern of the Democrats before the election. Would there be energy for a low key candidate like Ralph Northam for governor. It turns out some of the down ballot races, like the Danica Rhome race, really helped to provide some of that energy. There were also two Latinas who were elected to the Virginia House of Delegates — firsts for them. There was a Vietnamese-American — the first to be elected in another delegate race. So really it was a very broad-based quilt of a coalition.

CO: Can you shed some light on what happened in the race for governor? Republican Ed Gillespie was trounced by Democrat Ralph Northam, who is a very low key candidate. What happened there?

MT: For Ed Gillespie it was a very ill-fitting suit to try to be Donald Trump. Ed Gillespie was an establishment Republican. He was chairman of the National Party, he was a counselor to George W. Bush, he was a Washington K Street lobbyist. And he tried to run a Trumpian kind of campaign that emphasized fear of illegal immigrants, that emphasized honouring Confederate monuments, criticizing NFL football players who kneeled during the national anthem. None of that really rang authentic. And to the extent that it did anything, is energize the other side to come out and vote against him.

CO: But why would Mr. Gillespie be inspired to do that, given that the polls indicate that President Trump is in the 38 per cent area of popularity.

MT: One reason would be that in an off year election like this one turnout is very low. So you really have to concentrate on getting your partisans out. And he may have miscalculated the composition of the electorate. Had this been sort of a typical off year electorate where turnout wasn't all that good, he's probably closer in this race, although I don't think he wins.

CO: We heard the GOP a congressman from Virginia, Scott Taylor, he said that these results in Virginia were quote “a referendum on President Trump's administration,” and he said it was the divisive rhetoric of Mr. Trump, and that's why the Republicans did so badly. Do you think that's the case?

MT: I don't think you'd hear a lot of Republicans argue with that point, except perhaps President Trump himself. He came out after the election, very quickly, and essentially said that Gillespie's problem was he didn't embrace Trump enough. And I think the overwhelming majority would share the sentiments of the congressman you quoted.

CO: You note know in your analysis in the New York Times that where the victory came from, where the votes came from, very wealthy counties, well educated parts of Virginia who voted Democrat, and rural Virginia still seems to support Republicanism And Mr. Trump. So what message would that send to Democrats?

MT: I think the message to send is that they need to talk about the future not the past. Part of the problem for the Republicans is the rural areas have people who are bemoaning the loss of jobs in industries that are going to go away, like coal and tobacco, whereas the Democrats are trying to talk about jobs in technology and STEM education — things that will have a future in this country. When you see Northern Virginia, and I spent a lot of time out there, these are some of the wealthiest counties in the country. They're also highly educated and they're also deeply rich in diversity. So it's a different blend of immigrant population than a classic wave of Latino voters, if you will, that you see in some southwestern states and it's not easily replicated for the Democrats. So you can't overdraw the lessons from this result too much, it's not like this could happen in Iowa, or this could happen in Michigan, or this could happen in Pennsylvania.

CO: Does it indicate that the split is still there, that the demographic of voters that got Mr. Trump elected a year ago is still in existence?

MT: I think that what we've seen is that his core base is still with him wholeheartedly, but that base I believe is smaller than has been interpreted. It may be 25 to 30 per cent of the electorate. That other 14 or 15 per cent of the vote that he won was kind of the persuadable part of the electorate. And that's the part of the electorate that the polls show that he is losing or has lost. And it makes it very difficult to come up with a winning coalition when almost two thirds of the electorate oppose the issue.

CO: But there was a politico feature today profiling Trump supporters who say they know Trump isn't helping them but they still support him. And is it possible Democrats still might be missing the big picture as they go into the midterms, that there still is that strong feeling that Democrats don't represent them and that Mr. Trump does?

MT: Midterms are never kind to a president, particularly in the first term in office. There's a long history of that in that, and that is with presidents who are far more popular than President Trump. So the Democrats victory is certainly in no way assured. They have a big hill to climb. However, they have a lot of energy now after the results of yesterday, that perhaps they wouldn't have had, that will help them in recruiting candidates, that will help them in raising money, that will help them in building organizations that turnout for elections.

CO: All right, we'll be watching. Michael thank you very much.

MT: Great to be with you. Thank you.

JD: Michael Tackett is a national political writer with The New York Times. We reached him in Washington D.C. Another big winner in last night's elections in Virginia was Chris Hurst. Mr. Hurst decided to run after his girlfriend, journalist Alison Parker, was shot and killed on live television in 2015 last February, As It Happens guest host Helen Mann spoke to Chris Hurst. Here's part of that conversation from our archives.

SOUNDCLIP

CHRIS HURST: I don't like people because they like guns, and I'm not outraged that Allison was murdered because she was shot and killed. I'm outraged because she was murdered. So I think that there are things that we can do in the United States and at the state level in Virginia to reduce the amount of people who are dying from a gun. And I think that we really need to have an extended focus on the vast majority of people who die with a gun, which is from suicide.

HELEN MANN: Now your proposals though are different from a lot of the conventional gun control advocate policies. What would you specifically like to see done?

CH: I think anything that we can do to better identify and dangerousness, the level at which someone becomes a threat to themselves or someone else, and then have appropriate due process and law enforcement protocols to remove any type of dangerous tool that might be at their disposal to help them complete their act.

JD: From our archives that was As It Happens guest host Helen Mann in conversation with Chris Hurst last February. Mr. Hurst won his race for the District of Virginia's house of delegates last night. He ran after his girlfriend, Alison Parker, was shot and killed while conducting a live television interview in 2015.

[Music: Ambient Bass Tones]

Met soprano highest note

Guest: Audrey Luna

JD: Sopranos can always hit the high notes at the Metropolitan Opera in New York City. But in the Met’s current production a soprano is being asked to hit the highest note — a note higher than any that has been hit before in the 137 year history of the storied Opera House. For a brief moment in The Exterminating Angel, Audrey Luna is called upon to sing an A above high C, for non-musicians that is high — that is very high. We reached Audrey Luna in New York City.

CO: Ms. Luna, what's it like for you to take the stage and know that you are hitting the high notes never before attempted at the Met?

AUDREY LUNA: Well, I didn't know that until a couple of days ago. So I'm surprised and it’s exciting. I mean, I knew I had never seen anything written in music that went that high. But it's just all these Sopranos back in the day, you'd say, I thought that they hit those notes all the time.

CO: The opera is called The Exterminating Angel, and Thomas Adès,did he, did he tell you, did he warn you before you agreed do star in this opera that you were going to have to hit these notes?

AL: I did get a fair warning. I had already sung Ariel in the Tempest here at the Met in 2012, which goes to a G. When I did find out that I would be singing an A, it was it was a good two years before that he said, “So you've got an A right?” Because I had just sustained, an A flat, here on the Met stage, singing Olympie. I think he just he wanted to know if I had one semitone higher than that. And I said “Yeah I I've sung all the way up to a C above high C.” He said “OK I didn't know that.” I said “Don't make me do that.”

[LAUGHTER]

AL: He said “It's just an A.”

CO: We’re going to play some, a few clips. One of them is, we'll start with that extraordinary high note you hit the Met in the production of The Tempest, this is your high G above C, and let's just play that.

SOUNDCLIP

[HIGH PITCHED OPERA SINGING]

CO: How do you do that?

AL: Oh Gosh. Well, I love that scene too because in that moment Prospero is telling me — it's called the Mosquito moment — that's what Tom said. So Prospero is telling me to go down there and buzz around and taunt the group of travelers that I've just arrived on the island, like a mosquito. And so he's great at doing that musically. I mean, I seriously do sound like a little mosquito there, don’t I?

[LAUGHTER]

CO: But it's also like electricity, I'm sure to be in the theater for that must be extraordinary.

AL: No.

CO: Well OK. I'm going to say it is. You can be modest. It must be thrilling for audiences to hear something like that. Oh come on admit it. You know they’ve told you that.

[LAUGHTER}

AL: It was thrilling to do it.

CO: All right, well let's go on to a higher thrill, a bigger thrill. And this is, I believe, the note that you will be hitting in The Exterminating Angel, this is A above high C in this clip, so here we go.

SOUNDCLIP

[HIGH PITCHED OPERA SINGING]

CO: And so you have to hit that note before you even come on the stage. You do it twice, but do it before you've even walked on stage, this is the first note you sing, right?

AL: It is. And that's the repeat, the first time I actually begin on the A. And it really is just laughter. It's off stage laughter. The guests of the party are about to arrive into the house and then we all walk onto the stage, and then that's the repeat, I sing it again.

CO: And I know you're to get modest again, but those who have spoken about your singing have described this tone as full. It's one thing to hit the notes, it’s one thing to hold the note, actually to let it hang there for a moment, which is what you are capable of doing.

AL: Oh thank you, and whoever said that, I thank them too. I credit my voice teacher. I feel like she instilled a really solid technique. One where the voice is full from top to bottom and that's what I'm always striving for. I think that's what every singer is always striving for, is for a very even-sounding voice.

CO: Shrillness, I think that is what you're avoiding. And you've called it I think Wagnerian coloratura spectacle.

AL: That's what it feels like in the aria at the end of the opera. Yeah it's unlike anything I've ever heard, or seen written. It took a while for me to even understand how to sing it. Yeah, it's pretty challenging, definitely pushes me to my limit.

CO: Is this a double dog dare?

AL: This is the double dog dare — it’s the whole role.

[LAUGHTER]

AL: Maybe the A, triple dog dare. But yeah.

CO: Do you think this is something that you will be able to sustain, or do you think will actually go beyond this at some point?

AL: I have sung a C above high C in practice. If someone writes it I would try it. I mean, I like to just see what my limits are. And I didn't even really know that I had these notes in me. It was something that I was playing around with on my own. And then when I actually had the chance to sing these notes and perform them on stage I grabbed at the chance, and it really made my career what it is today, and I'm just so lucky that I have found some sort of niche.

CO: But now I understand that in the score for The Exterminating Angel, that Thomas Adès has in brackets put B, in case somebody wanted to do that.

AL: And that I got a crack open my score because I haven't counted the ledger lines to see where the B is, I didn't even know that. And so I'd love to see where that B is. I didn’t even know.

CO: I think it's just under the line Quadruple dog dare.

[LAUGHTER]

AL: Yes.

CO: Well, I wish you great success of this performance. It really sounds quite delightful Ms. Luna. I appreciate speaking with you, thank you.

AL: Thank you so much. Thanks.

CO: Bye, bye.

AL: Bye.

JD: We reached Soprano Audrey Luna in New York. And Canadians will have a chance to see and hear Ms. Luna’s performance in movie theaters across this country as part of the Met’s live broadcast that's November 18th.

Back To Top »

Part 2: Delhi smog, Eden Robinson

Delhi smog

Guest: Gopal Krishna

JD: They are waiting for action — breathlessly. Deadly smog is back in Delhi. Residents of India's capital awoke to such bad air that doctors have declared a public health emergency. And while the local government needs to figure out what to do about it, all schools are closed for the rest of the week. Gopal Krishna is a public health scholar and the founder of the environmental NGO Toxics Watch Alliance. We reached Mr. Krishna in Delhi.

CO: Mr. Krishna, what does it look like, what does it feel like to be in Delhi today?

GOPAL KRISHNA: It is a suffocating experience for everyone, and the kind of climate and the kind of air pollution load which we are witnessing it is nondiscriminatory. It is this kind of atmosphere this kind of pollution load is not discriminating between rich and the poor everybody is equally affected and everybody is suffering same kind of breathing problem.

CO: What kinds of breathing problems? Tell some of the things that people are suffering that you are seeing?

GK: They are feeling a sense of suffocatiion because of the wind there is darkness, there is a low visibility around and people are feeling that to the kind of air they are breathing is giving them a suffocating experience.

CO: The kind of pollution, the kinds of pollutants are very, very small. I mean, these are carcinogenic chemicals — lead, arsenic, cadmium, mercury, — and there are tiny particles that pass through filters and get into people’s organs and their brains, right?

GK: Yeah, actually it’s a cocktail of air pollutants, and those air pollutants are ultra-fine particles. And because of the combination of the smoke and the fog it has become worse. As a result and the Delhi government has announced a holiday for the schools, but that is no solution because indoor air pollution and outdoor air pollution, there is no demarcating line between them. There is no boundary between, it is a constant exchange between enduring air outdoor air. It is hardly a relief.

CO: In Delhi there are a lot of people who work in the streets, who live on the street, or live without adequate housing. How can they protect themselves from this? I mean, you said everyone is being affected, but does it not affect the poor more?

GK: It definitely affects the poor, and the children, and the people who are in the hospitals more. They are more vulnerable. But given the fact that there is not there is no boundary wall between indoor and outdoor, air pollutants are passengers without passports and they don't respect the boundaries of the rich and the poor and the outside atmosphere and the inside atmosphere within the household is no better. From the air quality point of view they are in a similar condition.

CO: How often have things got this bad in Delhi?

GK: It has aggravated this year. This has been happening every winter and everybody was apprehending that there will be a situation, even prior to the arrival of this kind of a public health emergency. And the chief minister of Delhi, the central ministers, they were all worried about the biomass burning in Punjab Instead of taking remedial measures there is massive biomass burning within Delhi because there are biomass waste-based power plants in Delhi — where garbage is being burned. Thousands of tons of garbage is being burned on a daily basis. Added to that migration of pollutants from the neighbouring states, from Uttar Pradesh from Haryana and from Punjab.

CO: And so the that the Chief Minister of Delhi has said that the city is a gas chamber — those are his words. Another doctor who said that the air quality, what people are taking in, is equivalent to smoking 50 cigarettes a day. So they are very aware of how bad things are. What is the government going to do about it?

GK: The government has been only being lip service and it has consistently been insensitive towards it actually. The current situation is akin to an air pollution plague of sort, where although everybody's affected equally. People who are decision makers they have consistently failed in taking remedial measures. In Delhi there is a massive vehicular pollution load. Besides that there are farmers who are in the state of Punjab who are burning biomass in the agricultural field. They are burning agricultural waste, which is actually creating this kind of pollution plague of sorts.

CO: So as much as they have done is to declare a public health emergency. They're saying that people should stay indoors. You point out that's pointless. It moves through walls, it moves into houses, it's everywhere. So what else can they do at this point to protect people, especially the vulnerable, from the kinds of illnesses that that they're vulnerable to?

GK: The immediate escape could be that the Delhi government will stop the operation of the biomass waste plant, which is burning in Delhi. By incentivizing and providing support to the farmers who are burning it, and within Delhi the government should immediately close down all the waste power plants and also other coal-based power plants, so that the pollution load subsides for over a period of time in the coming few days. To bring some immediate relief, the closure of these plants, and the stoppage of burning of biomass waste is of immediate necessity.

CO: The BBC is saying that people in the city are panicking, that they can't breathe, that the sky is dark. How do you see people, how are they reacting to this pollution?

GK: They are in a very helpless situation. They see of that sunlight is not visible because of smog. It appears that the sun is not rising in Delhi, and that also is creating unprecedented atmosphere and climate, which people in general have not witnessed. This year it has aggravated in an unprecedented manner.

CO: Sounds quite extraordinary. Mr. Krishna, I appreciate speaking with you tonight.

GK: A pleasure speaking to you.

CO: Bye.

JD: Gopal Krishna is the founder of Toxics Watch Alliance. We reached him in Delhi.

[Music: Ambient Tones]

Eden Robinson

Guest: Eden Robinson

JD: When she was a kid growing up in Kitimat Village, British Columbia, Eden Robinson's family would tell stories about a trouble making Raven by the name of Weget. Weget was always an example of what not to do because he broke all the rules. Well, years later the fiction writer from a Heisla and Heiltsuk First Nations has made Weget the driving force in her latest novel, Son of a Trickster. Now, Eden Robinson will get the creative freedom to tell more stories about Weget, or whatever else calls out to her, because she is the 2017 recipient of the Writers’ Trust Fellowship, which comes with a purse of $50,000. We reached Eden Robinson in Toronto.

CO: Eden, first of all, big congratulations to you.

EDEN ROBINSON: Thank you.

CO: $50,000 this is supposed to help people stay in the business of being writers. What does it mean for you?

[LAUGHTER]

EDEN ROBINSON: This means that I can have more time for writing and I won't have to freelance this year.

CO: And this is good because we have this book Son of a Trickster, this novel, which is we are told, the first in a trilogy and we want the rest of it. So does that mean the $50,000 buys us a couple more volumes of those this?

[LAUGHTER]

ER: It does. I actually finished the second novel. We've done the substantive edits now we're into the smaller edits, so it should be out October 2018.

CO: Excellent, good news. I mean, there's so much going on in your professional life right now. I mean, Son of a Trickster shortlisted for the Giller Prize, your novel Monkey Beach doing exceptionally well out there, now this award. How does it feel to be at this point in your career?

ER: It's quite stunning, a little overwhelming and just it just makes me feel so humbled.

CO: I know that it's also in the midst of this crazy time, some personal things that were difficult for you to deal with. Your father passed away.

ER: Yes. My dad passed away suddenly on October 21st.

CO: I'm so sorry.

ER: Thank you.

CO: And I know you were caring for him and trying to juggle all these demands and all these sort of high points. How difficult was that for you?

ER: Well, my dad was my best friend, and he was diagnosed with Parkinson's in 1998. And I didn't move home until 2003, and I had a very different relationship with him as an adult. I discovered that he was funny, and he had a quirky sense of humor, and he loved adventure, and he loved, loved, loved his community.

CO: And your dad is Johnny Robinson, right?

ER: Yes.

CO: What did did he teach you? Because I know he influenced you, what did he teach you?

ER: He taught me a love of stories. He told stories all the time, and we would wake up and have coffee and he would tell me stories over coffee. He loved to drive, and he loved sasquatches.

[LAUGHTER]

CO: Breaking news.

ER: When he read the Son of a Trickster his big disappointment was that there weren't any sasquatches.

[LAUGHTER]

CO: Did he ever see one?

ER: No, he was hopeful that he would see one. I think the closest we ever came was when we were camping in Dragon Lake in northern B.C. and I had put my ear plugs in, because Dad had a really bad sleep apnea, and that night the whole campground heard inhuman yodeling.

CO: Yodeling?

ER: Well it was musical but not quite a wolf, not quite a person.

CO: We love Sasquatch stories here at As It Happens so that's very special. But I want to ask you about another animal, another mythical animal that is part of the Son of a Trickster in this novel, which is a raven and their relationship with this boy Jared. Can you tell us about Jared and the raven?

ER: I loved Weget stories growing up. Trickster stories in Heisla and Heiltsuk culture were all about —our culture was heavily protocol-based, lots of hierarchy, and what happens if you don't follow the rules. They were also in the Heisla a public domain. Under Heisla copyright if you use a story that's owned by someone you have to throw them a potlatch, and that can that can be very expensive. So I tended to stay towards stories that were — the Weget stories in particular were told as funny, crazy stories to teach you about our Nuyim, our protocols by having a character that broke all of them — and what happens when you break the rule. And I was trying to bring Weget into a modern setting just to see what would happen if he was running around loose in the world today.

[LAUGHTER]

CO: And this boy, this Jared, the teenager who sells weed cookies and has a dysfunctional family life. OK wait a second, let’s just stop here a second, because we have to point out the very, very famous Eden Robinson laugh.

[LAUGHTER]

ER: It's not full frontal yet, I haven’t had all the coffee I need.

CO: Well we’ll see if we can get that from you before this ends because you are famous for this laugh, among many other things.

[LAUGHTER]

ER: I have an aunt Ramona who I share this laugh with.

CO: Well what's it like to be in the room with you and aunt Ramona?

ER: Very, very loud.

[LAUGHTER]

CO: I heard it when you speak with Shelagh Rogers, and I've heard it from other people who know you, and now I'm hearing it firsthand and I love it.

ER: Thank you.

CO: But how did you get inside the head of a teenage boy. I mean, that's got to be the most frightening place to go.

[LAUGHTER]

ER: Well, a few years ago Monkey Beach was put on a pilot curriculum for First Nations English 10, 11 and 12 in British Columbia. And they didn't have a big budget, so I would tour northern B.C. going to the different high schools, and I would do workshops for like 30 or 40 students at a time. We split the class up into a couple of groups and each group would create a character. And then we'd have the characters go on an adventure. And they were very quiet at first usually, but once they were engaged they sent their characters on the craziest wildest adventures. And I loved seeing that. So a lot of the details about teenagers and their thinking came from sessions with the students.

CO: And does Jared — in the next book is Jared growing up?

ER: Yes. This is a year later, and he's going down to Vancouver to do some upgrading to get into a diagnostic medical phonography program. Because he's going part time he doesn't have much of a student loan, so he ends up staying with his aunt who's been estranged from his mother for many, many years. And it turns out she's an eccentric writer with some political activism — not based on anyone.

CO: I don't know anybody like that.

[LAUGHTER]

CO: Does she have a laugh as well?

ER: She does. So while he's at her apartment he discovers it’s haunted and the ghost that lives there is a huge fan of Doctor Who and Douglas Adams, so he changes his name to Dent Arthur Dent, so the elements of the supernatural start creeping back into his life and he knows he's the son of the trickster. But he's in complete denial about what that really means. And this book is him dealing with that.

CO: Well Eden, I look forward to reading that. And it's been a great pleasure speaking with you. Thank you.

ER: Thank you so much.

CO: Bye, bye.

ER: Bye.

JD: Eden Robinson is this year's recipient of the Writers’ Trust Fellowship, which comes with the $50,000 prize. We reached her in Toronto. And for more on this story go to our website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

[Music: Whimsical Strings]

F-word on French radio

JD: When it comes to language in this country there are still to use Hugh MacLennan’s evocative phrase — two solitudes. And yesterday we received depressing confirmation that the French and English cultures in this country may always remain thus, ultimately because of English Canada's enduring problem with that f-word — fustiness. This confirmation came in the form of a ruling by the Canadian Broadcast Standards Council, or CBSC, about the French language Montreal radio stations CKOI-FM. On two occasions this year that station aired clips of musicians saying the F-word — that is the swear f-word. Someone complained and the CBSC took on the case. Ultimately the council's decision revolved around the f-word — affect that is. What affect the English four letter F word has on French listeners. And those of us who work on Anglophone radio programs greeted yesterday's decision with a loud “wtf y the foolishness.” Of course we can't say that other f-word on the air, and in its ruling the council reiterates that quote “the f-word should not be broadcast on radio during daytime or early evening hours” unquote. But then that ruling goes on to say quote “using the F-word in French does not have the same vulgar connotation as it does in English.” Therefore quote “If the word is used infrequently and not as an insult towards a particular person it will be deemed acceptable in the context of French language programming” unquote Well ffs — frustrating French stipulation. Still I guess it is fair, even if it means us English broadcasters feel kind of backward, while French Canada enjoys a new F-word momentum — I mean forward.

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Part 3: Abbotsford police officer obit, Passchendaele medal

Senator Dyck on Indian Act

JD: For over 140 years the Indian Act has made it easier for men to pass on legal status to their children than for women. Now the government is pledging to do away with that inequality. Last spring, the government refused to adopt a Senate amendment that would have eliminated all sex-based discrimination from the act. But yesterday the government's representative in the, Senate Peter Harder, announced that the government had changed its position. Senator Lillian Dyck has been advocating for equality in the Indian Act for decades. Here she is addressing the Senate yesterday. This is for the record.

SOUNDCLIP

SENATOR LILLIAN DYCK: When I woke up this morning the classic line from the movie 2001: A Space Odyssey was prominent in my mind. It goes like this: Something's going to happen, something wonderful. Colleagues, if we pass today's motion something wonderful will happen. Something that First Nation women have been waiting for, for nearly 150 years. Finally Indian women will be recognized in law as having equal rights as Indian men to transmit their status as registered Indians, and all that goes with it — Your language, your culture, your connection to your family, your connection to your community. And with that The many First Nation women like Mary Two-Axe Earley, Jeannette Corbiere Lavell, Yvonne Bédard, Sharon McIvor, Lynn Gehl and Senator Sandra Lovelace Nicholas can breathe can breathe a sigh of relief. I know I will.

[APPLAUSE]

JD: That was Senator Lillian Dyck speaking yesterday in the Senate after the government announced it will now eliminate all sex-based discrimination in the Indian Act.

[Music: Acoustic Guitar Plucks]

Slain Abbotsford police officer obit

Guest: Warren Banks

JD: He died protecting you and me. That is what the chief of the Abbotsford Police Department said about Constable John Davidson. As you may have heard on the program earlier this week, the veteran officer was killed on Monday. Police say they were responding to a call when a man began shooting. The suspect has been since charged with first degree murder. Since Constable Davidson’s death people have been paying tribute to a dedicated officer who played an important part in the community. Warren banks only had a brief encounter with Constable Davidson. But it's one that he has not forgotten. We reached Mr. Banks in Delta, British Columbia.

CO: Warren when you saw the picture of Constable John Davidson in the paper after he'd been killed how did you react?

WARREN BANKS: Frankly, my heart just sank into my stomach because I had literally dealt with him less than a week prior. It sounds weird. I only met the guy for 20 minutes, but I was just crushed.

CO: Now take us back to your encounter, your 20 minutes with Constable John Davidson. What day was that?

WB: It's very memorable because, first of all, it was Halloween, so I was driving home wearing my costume we wore costumes at work that day. So, I had this big brown cultist robe on and it had sort of an arcane symbol on the front. So when he pulled me over I was starting to — Abbotsford is a fairly conservative town — so I was a thinking, ‘am I going to get some flak for this?’

CO: And why were you pulled over?

WB: Well, my insurance had expired a couple of days previous.

CO: And so what was it like? What was your encounter like?

WB: Right away he made an impact because, first of all, he addressed me by my name. In memory, I can't remember in my dealings with the police ever having someone address me by my name. And then he was very casual and friendly about it — but professional. And then he explained to me “I have this thing in my car, it scans plates. Unfortunately yours came up, so I had to pull you over and let you know so I can give him my registration.”

CO: And you're in this Halloween costume?

[LAUGHTER]

WB: Yeah, I'm wearing this Halloween costume. The other reason I remember him is because he made a a joke he said “Oh I don't suppose that's a Halloween costume is it?” I said “It is.” And he said “I thought it was a little unusual for a dress.” So right away I can't remember last time a police officer made a joke to me while I was being pulled over.

CO: And then and then what happened?

WB: He went back to his car to fill out his stuff and he said “I'll be right back.” So I was waiting for him, he came back and said “OK Mr. Banks, you don't have any insurance so I couldn't let you drive away with it. Normally we’d impound it and you'd get a $600 ticket. But it's obvious to me talking to you that you didn't realize that your insurance had expired. So I'm going to give you a lesser ticket for failure to produce insurance, but unfortunately you're going have to leave your car here. You're going to have to go off, get some insurance, and then you can come back put your decal on and be on your way.” And I was like, “Well thank you very much, I really appreciate it.” And he said “OK, well I have to go back to my car and finish the ticket. I'll come back with you with the ticket and then and then we're done our business.” So I got out of the, car started taking my costume off and looking on my phone for an insurance broker, and he came back and he said, “Oh, what's the problem?” And I said, “Oh, I'm just trying to find an insurance broker to get car insurance,” and he said, “Oh, I know one just three blocks down. Just hop in my car, I’ll give you a ride.” I told him it's only three blocks officer you don't need to drive me.” He's like “No, no no problem. Just jump in the front seat.” So I went to jump in the front seat. He's like, “Oh, hang on you got to get in the back because I left all my gear on the front seat.” And we kind of laughed a bit and I was like, “Oh, is that where you keep your pepper spray and your riot gear?” And he laughed and then got in the backseat and we drove the three blocks and we just had a nice conversation, and then we got to the end, outside the insurance agent, and he turned around and said “All right here you go.” And the whole time I was just noting like what a remarkable experience I was having because you get pulled over by the police. You don't usually feel good afterwards you know. And here I am like wow this is — I was kind of happy, I had a smile on my face and so I thought a lot of times people do a good job and they never get to hear about it. And I feel like we needed a little bit more of that. So I just turned to him and shook his hand and said, “Officer Davidson, it was a pleasure to be arrested by you.” And he just laughed and said, “You're not under arrest, you're not under arrest,” and I said “I'm not sure the proper term here, but I just wanted to say I think you've done a really good job today and it was a pleasure meeting you and I just wanted you to know.” He made an impact and I won't forget him. I mean, at the time even, I was looking on his uniform for his name and asking him some things because I thought I need to maybe get a hold of the Abbotsford police and just say look “I've had some bad experience with the police in the past. But this guy is something else and I just want to make sure that you guys know that.”

CO: You said you've had dealings with police in the past, how did your dealing with him compare to what you've known before?

WB: Oh, well the last time I got pulled over for speeding the officer came up and was a bit rude and implied that what you just did, that was stupid wasn't it. And it was very — it really left a bad taste in my mouth — and it would happen a few months ago. So it was sort of when I got pulled over this time it kind of came back up, and so it was it was like almost like a 180 degree swing from what I had happen to me a few months ago.

CO: You know, since he died, since Constable John Davis was killed, the stories from other people have poured in haven't they. I mean, the stories of how he dealt with young kids and people like you and just how much respect he showed everybody he had dealings with. What do you think Abbotsford, and the police department has lost with the death of Constable John Davidson?

WB: I mean, this is a man who I think could have provided an excellent example to current officers and just a role model for any officer coming up, because it's a stressful job being a police officer. It's often thankless. There's no need to be anything other than the minimal base level of professionalism, you don't have to be nice, you can be you can be downright mean if you want. So to go above and beyond that in a job that's already giving you enough cause to be less than pleasant to people. Maybe I'm an idealist but I feel like that's what I expect when I get pulled over or have any interactions with the police. So to have him not be there to sort of provide an example, I think it's a huge loss to the community. I mean, this is a guy who went out and dealt with kids and made them like the police who they may not have otherwise.

CO: Well it really is a tragedy and I think it's just his family is expressing that. And so is the whole community. But Warren, I appreciate you telling us your 20 minutes with Constable John Davidson. Thank you.

WB: Well thank you for giving me the opportunity.

CO: Bye, bye.

WB: Bye, bye.

JD: That was Warren Banks speaking of his encounter with Constable John Davidson, who was killed in the line of duty earlier this week. We reached Mr. Banks in Delta, British Columbia. We have more on that story on our website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

[Music: Ambient Tones]

From Our Archives: Sessions laughter charge

JD: Back in January, Desiree Fairooz was arrested and charged during U.S. Attorney General Jeff Sessions confirmation hearing — because she laughed. Today Ms. Fairooz is finally laughing again — because after nearly a year she can move on. Earlier this week the Department of Justice dropped its case against her. In May she was convicted of disorderly conduct and parading or demonstrating on Capitol grounds. In a motion The U.S. attorney's office said that Ms. Fairooz had quote “let out a loud burst of laughter, followed by a second louder burst of laughter” unquote, and that when police then tried to quietly escort Ms. Fairooz from the room she quote “grew louder and more disruptive, eventually halting the confirmation hearing.” Unquote. Well, in July the United States Superior Court of the District of Columbia ordered a retrial for Ms. Fairooz. The judge rejected the notion that her laughter alone could be a sufficient basis for a conviction. Well this week Ms. Fairooz celebrated the news of her case dismissal on Twitter. She said quote “What a relief. Guess they have got enough laughing matters to deal with.” Unquote. Desiree Fairooz spoke with Carol on the day she was convicted back in May. Here's part of that conversation from our archives.

SOUNDCLIP

CO: Why exactly did you laugh? What happened that prompted that laughter?

DESIREE FAIROOZ: As I recall one of the senators was introducing Jeffrey Sessions by lauding his character, and he said something to the effect that he was very qualified to represent all of American citizens. And I thought that laughable, literally, you know, it just seems so ridiculous.

CO: We're talking about, I think it's Republican Senator Richard Shelby, who said of Jeff Sessions, his history, he said “he had a history of treating all Americans equally under the law, which is clear and well-documented,” that's the point at which you laughed, right?

DF: That's correct.

CO: Can you well maybe just demonstrate the sound you made?

DF: I don't know that I can replicate that. It was something involuntary — my partner says I have many different laughs — so that one is not one that I could probably practice or replay, but just think of it as a giggle, an involuntary giggle.

CO: Well the police said it was loud.

DF: Well, you can judge for yourself by listening to the video. I think anyone's laugh is about the same as anyone's cough. You know you can cough small, you can cough big —depends on the person's vocal cords I suppose. So I don't think so, I think if anything, I may have deserved a gentle warning, not an ejection, much less an arrest. And it's ridiculous I was convicted for that charge.

JD: That was Desiree Fairooz speaking to Carol earlier this year, in May, to be precise. This week the Department of Justice dropped its case against Ms. Fairooz, who was arrested for laughing during the confirmation hearing for U.S. Attorney General Jeff Sessions.

[Music: Industrial Pop]

Passchendaele medal

JD: Lesley Kerr never met her great-grandfather, but she does know about his life as a soldier. She knows he was at Passchendaele during the First World War and she knows about the Victoria Cross that he received for gallantry. The medal was passed down through her family but Ms. Kerr's father eventually sold it. And now, decades later, Ms. Kerr has new information about the medal and she's wondering if she can get it back. We reached Lesley Kerr in Vaughn, Ontario.

CO: Lesley, where is your great-grandfather's Victoria Cross?

LESLEY KERR: I don't know. I've been looking for it for quite some time. A journalist informed me that it’s possibly with a family just outside of Ottawa in Carleton but that's as far as I know. And I know it's going up for auction December 5^th.

CO: And that's all you know is it will be there at auction?

LK: Yeah, I believe the auction it appears to be online as well. The auction house in London, England.

CO: How did the medal come to leave your family?

LK: My mother left my father when I was quite young, about seven years old, and my father he had sole custody of me, so he had the house and the income to bring it in. So he was strapped for money and decided to sell the Victoria Cross to pay for the mortgage and ensure that I live a stable life and that nothing else has changed. But he was pretty intent on me not being affected by it, other than my mom not living with us anymore.

CO: And so this is how it came to leave your family, and how it came to be part of your family and part of your history, is the story of Passchendaele, isn't it?

LK: Yes, my great-grandfather, he went behind, I guess, a German pillbox they would call it. He opened fire that enabled the rest of his battalion to further advance. So hekilled a few Germans and captured some, and then continue to, as far as I have read, to fire on the other Germans that were retreating and that helped his battalion advance further.

CO: And this is almost exactly 100 years ago.

LK: Yes.

CO: It was an awful, awful battle, an awful place Passchendaele, for those men. Many have said, historians have said, it was just, it was a hopeless cause. But in the Canadian Press story about your great-grandfather they quote a historian who wrote that he quote “opened fire at point blank range with devastating results.” What do you know about him? What was what was he like what would have given him that spunk?

LK: I never met him. I know my father did. I know that he was quite feisty, that I have heard of him. And that's to the extent that I know, I know that he was he was quite spunky, quite feisty and a little impatient. So that's what I've been told.

CO: Spunky and feisty doesn't seem to quite cover it does it? When you think that must have been like, at that moment. That place, the rain, the constant rain, the mud, the death all around you, the position that they had to attack, that the Germans had, which was just so extraordinary and so fortified, and yet there were these brave Canadians, these men who fought the impossible fight.

LK: And it's a beautiful thing, I think it's a great story to tell. Even just for us living everyday lives to take on that leadership and get that gumption and go for what you believe you need to accomplish.

CO: Have you wondered over the years what happened to the Victoria Cross?

LK: I've been wondering for quite some time, since my dad sold it. And then I can actively start looking for it until a few years ago. I always wondered where it went, but I didn't have enough financial stability to seek it out and potentially purchase it back. Once I became more stable, that's when I started to actively look for it. I realized how much people ask for medals and thought “OK maybe I could somehow contact the family, or seek out the family to deal with them directly.” But every time I was searching it always would say OK it's a private family. Nothing has been disclosed. So it's been very difficult for me to try to locate it.

CO: Of all the medals trying to recover, I mean, the Victoria Cross is a very rare meda,l isn't it? It was the highest award given by the British for bravery. Do you know what the bidding — how the bidding will begin on this medal?

LK: The way I came to realize that the medal was going up for auction is a distant relative of mine sent me the article. That's where I found out the bidding was starting at 250.

CO: $250,000?

LK: Yeah, that's the potential start of the bid.

CO: And you're sure it's for Captain Colin Fraser Baron.

LK: Yes. That's what the article said. So I guess we'll see on December 5th what it starts at.

CO: But the last Victoria Cross belonging to a Canadian that went up for auction sold for $550,000.

LK: Yeah, that's unreachable for me. So whoever purchases it, at least I would hope, that I'm able to visit it if it's in a museum, or somewhere where hopefully his story will be told. It would set my mind at ease at least knowing where it is and the ability to go there and pay respects to someone who just with all gumption and courage just going forward and and helping Canadians out.

CO: Now we know that often people who do collect these medals and buy them at auction are people who do feel that they are custodians, that they're taking care of history, and quite often they loan these pieces of history to museums, so that your hope that you be able to at least know where it is and be able to see it and show it to your family?

LK: That's what I'm hoping for, if anything. If I can't purchase it then I'm hoping that they're able to do it show it and put it on display somewhere to preserve the story to further motivate other people to live their life and take initiative. It would be a shame if it was stuck in somebody's house. Where I'm coming from is looking for the medal for all these years and not being able to find it in any museum or anything, leads me to believe that it was in somebody's house for quite some time. And the story remains in that house as opposed to being you know exposed to the rest of Canadians.

CO: Lesley, I hope at least you get to have some contact with this medal and I appreciate speaking with you, thank you.

LK: Thank you. Thank you for your time.

JD: We reached Lesley Kerr in Vaughn Ontario. And if you would like see a photograph of her great-grandfather or share that interview visit our website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

[Music: Ambient Tones]

New Zealand “first cat” obit

JD: People in New Zealand are mourning the loss of a prominent, adorable public figure who slept most of the time — Paddles, the country's “first cat” Paddles was owned by Jacinda Ardern, New Zealand's new prime minister. A spokesperson for Ms. Ardern confirmed that the nationally beloved cat was hit by a car. Paddles was a polydactyl, meaning she had extra claws, they looked like thumbs. And after she was adopted by Ms. Ardern, she, the cat, became a social media star with nearly 12,000 followers on Twitter. Paddles is also known for nearly ruining her owner's first phone call with U.S. President Donald Trump. She went into the room and meowed loudly in the background. She was escorted out. Here is how the story of paddles death was reported by radio New Zealand's Anusha Bradley.

SOUNDCLIP

ANUSHA BRADLEY: Paddles was just four weeks old when she was found on the streets West Auckland with her two siblings just before last Christmas. The double-thumbed kitten spent three months in the SPCA’s care recovering from her ordeal, before being adopted by the now first couple in March. Sarah Jolly was the SPCA worker who looked after Paddles and organized her adoption. She says it was love at first sight.

SARAH JOLLY: She was one of my favourite cats because she was so friendly. I thought about Paddles, her name was actually Sadie when she was here and pretty much fell in love right away.

AB: Paddles’ untimely death has made headlines around the world, with tributes pouring in, including from the U.S. ambassador to New Zealand Gracie Brown. But not everyone is shedding tears. The infamous cat-hater and would be politician, Gareth Morgan, took to Twitter to announce his disgust at what he says is the prime minister's callous disregard for wildlife by letting Paddles roam free. Other Twitter users pounced on his comments as cruel and heartless, accusing Mr. Morgan of using the first couple's loss to push his own agenda. Speaking from parliament to Jacinda Ardern wouldn't be drawn into the catfight.

PRIME MINISTER JACINDA ARDERN: I think I would just describe the situation as sad all around.

AB: The first couple is encouraging anyone wanting to remember Paddles to donate to the SPCA.

JD: That was Radio New Zealand's Anusha Bradley reporting on the untimely death of Paddles, considered New Zealand's first cat because he was owned by the country's new prime minister, died yesterday in a car accident.

[Music: Rhodes Chords]

Tiffany’s tin cans

JD: It is the year 2017 and we are still winking — we are winking more than ever in fact. And nowadays we don't just do it face-to-face we use semi-colons and closing parentheses, we use emojis, and I don't know who decided way back in the day when winking would be a fun thing, but it is just as dubious now as it ever was. For one thing you have to somehow interpret what exactly the winker means. Are they being sly, funny, ironic, are they being misguidedly seductive? It doesn't matter because whatever the intention it usually comes off as condescending or gross. Just for example, Tiffany and Co, has just introduced a product line it called “everyday objects” And the items in his drole new collection include a sterling silver harmonica, a sterling silver crazy straw, and a sterling silver yoyo. Among many other cute luxury versions that common stuff non-millionaire people might buy at, well wherever common stuff non-millionaire people shop. It's just a lot of fun according to the company, which says that these everyday objects quote “possess a whimsical wink that is quintessentially Tiffany.” Well look, I'm not sure you can possess a wink, but something possessed the Tiffany's people to charge 250 American bucks for that silver curly straw. 175 American bucks for a sterling silver golf tee, and for a simply adorbs tin can, in you guessed it, sterling silver — a thousand U.S. dollars. Now you could say it's whimsical to produce expensive versions of the mundane things non-wealthy people buy, and likely throw away. It's just that that wink that is quintessentially Tiffany strikes me as condescending although, it is obvious that Tiffany is really winking because there is no way on earth it went into manufacturing thousand dollar tin cans with both eyes open.

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Noverber 8, 2017 episode transcript

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