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The AIH Transcript for October 25, 2017

Hosts: Carol Off and Jeff Douglas

STORIES FROM THIS EPISODE

Prologue

CAROL OFF: Hello, I'm Carol off.

JEFF DOUGLAS: Good evening, I'm Jeff Douglas. This is As It Happens.

[Music: Theme]

JD: Tonight…

CO: It's a positive step but it's not for good. A Turkish judge orders the release of human rights activists facing terrorism charges but the reprieve is only temporary.

JD: The domino effect. Remembering one of the prime movers of early rock n roll. A master of boogie woogie piano with a voice so undeniable that even Elvis Presley once said “I can't sing it like Fats Domino can. I know that.”

CO: He was looking forward, now he may be going back. Our guest’s father assumed he was meeting with U.S. authorities to finalize his permanent residency, but instead he was detained and is facing deportation.

JD: She says it was rape, the accused say it was consensual. But a Brooklyn city councillor doesn't see how that's possible because the men in question are police officers and the young woman was in their custody.

CO: Cover story. After Quebec's justice minister unveiled what she felt were clarifications of the provinces law about face covering, it seems most of you feel more in the dark than ever.

JD: And… His costume is strictly squash and wear. A famous Halloween video of a dancing man in a black leotard with a pumpkin on his face is both eerie and idiotic. But our guest, the man behind that pumpkin, makes it sound supernatural. As It Happens the Wednesday edition. Radio that guesses he’s really carved out a face for himself.

[Music: Theme]

Back To Top »

Part 1: Turkey: Amnesty International, immigrant daughter, dancing pumpkin man

Turkey: Amnesty Intrenational

Guest: Milena Buyum

JD: In Istanbul tonight shortly before midnight Turkish time, a judge ordered the interim release of eight human rights advocates. They face terrorism charges and their trials will continue but for now at least they will be able to return home to their family and friends. Among the released is a senior employee with Amnesty International, another member of the organization continues to be held. Milena Buyum is a turkey campaigner for Amnesty. We reached her in London shortly after the judge's decision.

CO: Ms. Buyum, how are you feeling about this news that has just broken that your colleagues are out of jail?

MILENA BUYUM: It's an incredible feeling that after almost four months of imprisonment, where they shouldn't have even spent a single hour, let alone so many days and weeks, that they are finally going to walk out of that prison and their trial will continue, but at least they will be outside, they will not be locked up. And that's a great feeling. I feel very emotional actually.

CO: I'm sure, and what have they been missing? What home things have they may not be able to take part in over these four months of being in prison?

MB: My first thought, actually, is for Veli Acu, a young 29-year-old human rights defender whose wife is expecting their first child. And the prosecutor had actually asked for him to remain in prison. It seems like the judge decided to release him as well. And I'm particularly happy about the outcome because I think his wife has been incredibly anxious him not being with her during these very important months of a young expecting mother’s life really. So my first thought is he has missed those few months of her pregnancy. But I'm really happy that he now will be with her when her child comes to this world.

CO: These are human rights workers. They are a part of as many as 50,000 people who were arrested after the attempted coup in Turkey, and people lost their jobs as well. We're talking about teachers, lawyers, opposition leaders, a huge number of journalists who are still detained and these human rights workers. Can you tell us what were the charges against these this group of 11?

MB: They are still facing actually these really trumped up membership of an armed terrorist organization charges, which is, knowing them personally having worked with some of them, having actually having among them people that are as close as family to us. It's absolutely ludicrous to suggest that people who have advocated all their lives for peaceful defense of human rights would be accused with such an outrageous and grotesque accusation.

CO: Now the charges seem to relate to a digital security and stress training workshop being held in a hotel that had been planned for some time. It seemed to be not being done in secret but they said it was a secret meeting in order to organize an uprising, to conduct espionage. Another one of your colleagues, the chairman of Amnesty, Turkey's Amnesty International, he knew about it and he was arrested the month before because he knew that they were going to be meeting for this workshop. So is this the basis of the of the evidence against them?

MB: I mean, evidence I would put in between quotation marks. We have seen the 17-page indictment. In it are completely banal activities like messaging the participants to this perfectly legitimate and lawful activity, which is a workshop on holistic security, which is what they were attending in Istanbul. It is presented as if there was some kind of secrecy and some kind of conspiracy around this event. This is the sort of thing that human rights defenders have to arm themselves with in terms of basically developing the ability to work in really difficult, stressful circumstances. That event started with a yoga session. İlknur Üstün, one of them, works with violence against women. Today in court she explained how she interviews survivors of rape and domestic violence, and how this in turn has its toll on the person who carries out such interviews, and how one has to equip oneself against the kind of erosion of oneself’s wellness, well-being. This workshop was about arming them with those tools to enable them to live through these difficult times in Turkey, and they are incredibly difficult times.

CO: And so what then do you think this is about? If there's no evidence, there’s as all these people up on these charges. What do you think is the point?

MB: Oh, this is a really crucial question actually. I mean, why is anything happening? You know, when I was describing the kind of crackdown that has been taking place in Turkey, the one group of people who are crucial in that situation are human rights defenders. And undermining and tainting them appears to be the approach. And I think by tainting them one is weakening the dissenting voices and those who stand by the others, the journalists, the academics, the teachers, those who have been unfairly treated, are subjected to bogus charges themselves. These are the people who would do it. And I think dragging them through an unfair trial process is an attempt to weaken all opposition, all dissenting voices, all in people who are basically standing up to the abuses that are taking place in Turkey at the moment.

CO: Ms. Buyum, I appreciate speaking with you tonight.

MB: Thank you very much for taking the time.

JD: Milena Buyum is a turkey campaigner for Amnesty International. We reached her in London.

[Music: Ambient Piano]

Immigrant daughter

Guest: Viviana Andazola Marquez

JD: For Melecio Andazola Morales said it was an exciting day. After months of paperwork the undocumented immigrant and his daughter were on their way to a meeting with U.S. authorities. They believed the meeting was a last hurdle before he would finally be granted permanent residency in the U.S., where he has lived since 1998. But instead of being granted a green card, Mr. Andazola Morales was arrested and slated for deportation. Viviana Andazola Marquez is his daughter. She wrote about the experience in a recent piece from The New York Times. She called it “I accidentally turned my dad into immigration services.” We reached Viviana Andazola Marquez in New Haven, Connecticut.

CO: Ms. Andazola Marquez, when was the last time you spoke to your dad?

VIVIANA ANDAZOLA MARQUEZ: I actually spoke to him yesterday. We speak on the phone pretty often.

CO: How was he doing?

VAM: Well, you know, he's a little bit anxious. He has been having trouble sleeping but is hopeful that he'll get out soon, and wants to be with his family soon.

CO: But when you were driving over that what were you going to do? What was your expectation?

VAM: Yeah, I mean, I really thought that we're going to walk out with my dad's green card. When my dad first got his appointment he had been really excited because he was like “oh maybe we can think about going to Mexico in December?” And making plans for the future assuming that he was going to have his green card. Yeah, I really walked in there thinking we're going to leave and my dad's going to have a green card and I don't have to worry about this anymore.

CO: And how long have you had this uncertainty?

VAM: My whole life. Well, he entered in 98, so when I was about two, but I wasn't really worrying about it then because I didn't know what it meant. But I probably realized that my dad was undocumented when I was like four.

CO: How did you know that? What sort of things indicated to you that there was this uncertainty?

VAM: My grandma moved in with us when I was about four and I remember there was one time we were in Texas and we're going to the mall and then I remember my parents having this conversation acting kind of jittery. And I remember overhearing them saying “Oh, is that what I think it is?” And then my mom was like “Yeah it's them” and then I was like “Oh, what is that?” And then they said “it's La Migra,”which is the Spanish term for referencing ICE (Immigration and Customs Enforcement).

CO: So all of this is the background to that moment when you drove over to the United States Citizenship and Immigration office with your dad feeling optimistic, you’re finally going to clear up this. And then what happened in that meeting? What happened when you got there?

VAM: We met with our lawyer, he was prepping us for how to answer the questions. The interview went as planned and the officer then told my dad that his application should be approved. But there was only one more thing to review. So I was like “oh great.” It sounds like this is going to work out. And then she said to my dad “Can you ask your daughter to leave? I have a confidential matter to discuss with you.” So I left the room kind of confused but also was ‘maybe I'm just being paranoid’ She said that his application should be approved so I'm just going to wait outside. And then about 20 minutes later the lawyer came out and informed me that three ICE officials had detained my dad and had pushed him out of the room without being able to explain to him any of his rights.

CO: So Immigration and Customs Enforcement, ICE as it's known. You'd gone in there with this idea that this is going to be kind of a happy ending to all of these years of uncertainty. And you're in the middle of a nightmare now.

VAM: Yeah. Yeah, no I definitely did not anticipate this. I was a little bit worried because I had seen some news reports about ICE deploying these sort of tactics. But I was like ‘there's just no way. My dad did everything right, he has no record. There's just no way that they can detain him’ and I kind of went in with that trust, and then ultimately found myself in the situation.

CO: Now the authorities say that your father was stopped from entering the United States in 1997, but returned to the U.S. undetected in 1998. And they're saying that that means that he could have committed a felony and that's why he was denied.

CO: What do you say to that?

VAM: To my understanding that is true, but there is a system in which my dad could have obtained a pardon, and it was in their discretion still to give my dad an opportunity to continue with this process given his track record and him paying taxes every year and having citizen children. But ultimately they used their discretion to reinstate the exclusion order instead of giving him an opportunity to remedy the infraction that he made.

CO: So there's a lot of wiggle room, a lot of discretion that they have. Do you think that they will use that to benefit your father or against him?

VAM: Pp to this point I've only seen them use it against him, and they're in this unique position right now to do the right thing. The current motion that we have filed with them is to cancel the reinstatement of the exclusion and we're really hoping that they'll use their discretion for the right thing this time around. And, you know, kind of give my dad a fair opportunity to have this case in before a judge and let the court decide whether or not he deserves to be here.

CO: Now you were the one who petitioned the government initially to have your father's status changed. You were the one who encouraged him to do this. Do you feel responsible for the situation he's now in?

VAM: You know, I've been grappling with that a lot but I can't say that I do because I was just providing a means for my dad to do right by the law, and get an opportunity in the very narrow parameters that he had to obtain status. And my dad has been trying to obtain status since 2001, and me petitioning for him additionally just sped up the process because of the prior system that they have. There's just no way that I could have anticipated that us trying to do right by the law in trying to change his status would result in this outcome.

CO: You're a senior at Yale University. What would it mean for you if your dad is deported?

VAM: You know, I don't really know. There could be a chance that I'd have to leave school, at least temporarily, to try to adjust my family and get them set up to living life without my dad present, because he's the sole financial provider of our family. So that would definitely be something that I’d have to think about, and a potential reality for me.

CO: Extraordinary. Ms. Andazola Marquez I appreciate speaking with you, thank you.

VAM: Thank you

JD: and Viviana Andazola Marquez is Melecio Andazola Morales’ daughter. Mr. Andazola Morales was detained earlier this month and is slated for deportation. We reached his daughter in New Haven, Connecticut.

[Music: Industrial Hip Hop]

Listener response: Quebec’s Bill 62 (face-covering)

JD: Yesterday evening on the program Stéphanie Vallée told us that there had been some confusion about a new face-covering law. Ms. Vallée is Quebec’s justice minister. She told Carol that her government's new law requires people to uncover their faces when they're getting on a bus or attending a college class, but Minister Vallée insisted that the law does not discriminate against Muslim women. Even those who believe their faith requires them to keep their faces covered. Well, judging by your responses to that conversation the minister's clarification didn't clarify everything.

SOUNDCLIP

CALLER1: Carol I just heard your interview with Quebec’s justice minister and I'm sorry that you didn't get a chance to ask her what we're going to do when it's 30 degrees below zero here in Montreal and we get on the bus and metro and our faces are completely covered except for our eyes. We don't want to get frostbitten. And so most of us walk around all winter wearing a niqab. It just happens to not be a black niqab, it could be a colourful scarf or whatever. But I want to know if I'm going to have to get on the bus and pull all my frozen scarf off my face and say hello to the bus driver and then put my little woolen niqab back on my face. I wish I had had a chance to ask her because she just doesn't know what she's doing.

CALLER 2: I'm profoundly ashamed that our provincial Liberal regime is dedicating any resources at all to pursuing this agenda, even as our schools and hospitals are falling apart, often literally. More than anything, I'm embarrassed by Minister Vallée’s disingenuous approach to political discourse. She is a legal professional. She must be aware that the meaning of the law lies in the foreseeable consequences of its enforcement. And no amount of hairsplitting can change the reality on the ground and denying that Bill 62 targets Muslim women is the height of hypocrisy. I am disgusted by the provincial Liberals move to garner support from the audiences of Quebec City shock jocks, and I;m really grateful to Carol Off for so elegantly putting systemic racism. Quebec must do better. Thank you very much.

JD: Thank you Etienne and thanks to everyone who called or wrote in response to our conversation with Quebec justice minister Stéphanie Vallée. Those calls that we aired did reflect the vast majority of your responses. You can find more on this story on our website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

[Music: Electric Guitar]

Dancing pumpkin man

Guest: Matt Geiler

JD: To all the kids on Twitter he is a seasonal hero akin to Santa Claus. Every October a video resurfaces to mark the beginning of the Halloween season. It manages to be, at once, chilling and ridiculous. I will describe it to you. I would describe it to you, but there's no one better suited to do so than the dancing Pumpkin Man himself. We reached the legend goes by Matt Geiler in Omaha.

CO: Matt just for our listeners who haven't seen this or don't remember that they've seen this, what are you doing in this video?

MATT GEILER: I am joyously gyrating in a black unitard with a pumpkin on my face in a manic celebration of the spirit of Halloween.

CO: And the song — the piece of music?

MG: The song is The Ghost Busters theme.

CO: OK, let's go back the night when this began. How long ago, what year did you first do this video?

MG: This was two nights before Halloween 2006. At the time I was working as a news anchor, which is absolutely true but probably unbelievable. And we just had kind of gotten to the point in the evening where we were about to go live, but we had about seven minutes left before the show and the had to be stacked. So we were really scrambling to fill up a hole in the broadcast. And since our shows that week were Halloween themed just kind of out of desperation I did that.

[LAUGHTER]

CO: You did what? You ran out and put on a black unitard and a pumpkin head?

MG: Right. I said to my producer I said, “I want you to throw up a grave yard on the green screen. I'm just going to dance for like four minutes and then we can just put that into the block right before weather and it will eat up some time.”

CO: You did this live?

MG: We didn't do it live. The broadcast was live. It was probably about five or six minutes before we went live.

CO: But you were the anchor of the news?

[LAUGHTER]

MG: Right.

CO: Did anyone consider this inappropriate?

MG: You know, there was not a lot of oversight at the station. We were kind of left to our own devices, which was kind of inexplicable, but nobody at the time really had anything to say about it. I mean, I had a news director and also general manager there. They were kind of more concerned with the broadcast on our sister station to tell you the truth.

[LAUGHTER]

CO: Now had you had to cover this much air time before in some way?

MG: Oh yeah, I mean, we had a nightly broadcast that was 22 minutes every night seven-days-a-week. When I got hired the news director said “You'll have to borrow a camera people from the other station because there's not a designated photographer for this program.”So even from the get go like a lot of times I would just fill myself doing MOS pieces where you can literally see my arm up holding the camera on myself. I mean, it was crazy.

CO: It gives a new meaning to the word shoestring.

MG: Absolutely. Yeah it was beyond shoestring, it was like you just kind of had to fend for yourself. you know.

CO: After this video, which is I mean, it's kind of a staple of Halloween now, there's even versions that run for hours and that you can play at your Halloween parties. Was it an overnight sensation? Were you instantly famous for doing dancing Pumpkin Man?

MG: No, actually it was probably the day after we did it the guy who managed the YouTube channel the station threw it up on the YouTube channel. I think it sat there for about two years with maybe a couple hundred views and nothing happened with it until a guy at, I believe it was BuzzFeed, featured it in 2009. He was like “This is the greatest Halloween video the internet has ever produced” or something like that. And so that's when it first started to kind of gain its viral traction I guess.

CO: Do you have any idea how many people have seen it on YouTube?

MG: Right now I think the original is sitting at like six-and-a-half-million-views. But that's not counting — I mean, there's hundreds and hundreds of people who have mashed it up was different songs and stuff. So I think the last time anybody checked I think if you count all those it's probably closer to like 10.

CO: Now you're no longer a news anchor. You're no longer at that station and you don't even do the news anymore right?

MG: Right, right. Yeah.

[LAUGHTER]

CO: But is this still, I mean, do you still do Dancing Pumpkin Man or is that sort of in your past?

MG: It has been in my past for a while up until America's Got Talent called this year and was like “hey can we get to Dancing Pumpkin Man on? Really I had only ever done it that one time. It wasn't like a thing I toured around or anything. In my real life I'm an improvisational comedian and I tour a lot, I do a lot of colleges and clubs. So yeah, it's not something that I'm I do live really.

CO: And you have a costume for Halloween this year?

MG: I don't, it's weird. I do so much work in TV and live performance where I'm in costumes that I very rarely think about like the Halloween costume. I need to get on it because it's fast approaching.

CO: You do, it’s not much time to invent that. But and there's a lot of people who are going to be out there as Dancing Pumpkin Man.

MG: I know, I've had people trying to get in touch with me and asked how do you get the mask. The mask is the part that always hangs them up. They're always asking where I got the mask.

CO: What was it actually that you used as a mask?

MG: Yeah that's where I kind of can't help them because the original mask was just like a declaration from the lobby of the news station that I very quickly fashioned into a kind of a makeshift mask.

[LAUGHTER]

CO: All right Matt it's good to talk to you. Thanks.

MG: Thank you.

JD: Matt Geiler is the man in the unitard behind the pumpkin in a classic, classic, yes classic Halloween YouTube video. We reached him in Omaha, Nebraska to see that video and some photographs of Mr. Geiler dressed up for Halloween as a child visit our website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

Back To Top »

Part 2: Fats Domino obit, NYPD rape case

Fats Domino obit

Guest: Eric Paulsen

JD: When I say the king of rock n roll you think Elvis. But Elvis himself reportedly refused to be called that when Fats Domino was in the room. Mr. Domino was a legend of rock n roll, if not the king, he was one of them. He sold millions of records, was best known for hits like Blueberry Hill and Ain't That A Shame. Fats Domino died yesterday. He was 89 years old. Eric Paulsen is a TV anchor in New Orleans. He was friends with Fats Domino. We reached him in New Orleans.

CO: Eric, first of all I'm sorry for the loss of your friend.

ERIC PAULSEN: Yeah, it's been a tough day here in New Orleans. And, you know, a tough day for music lovers all around the world.

CO: First of all how is the family doing? How are — I guess Fats Domino's daughter you've been in touch with — how is she doing?

EP: Yes, Fats had eight children. Two of them are no longer with us, but Adonica is the daughter who he’s been living with ever since the floods from Katrina drove him from his home in the Ninth Ward.

CO: And she is and she is coping?

EP: She's coping Yes. Fats’ health has been diminishing for several years now. So while it wasn't unexpected, it's still a shock that it happened.

CO: Always, it always is. And how did you first come to meet Fats Domino?

EP: I do a morning television show here in New Orleans. And for years I had been trying to get Fats Domino to do an interview, as all of my colleagues tried. And he was camera shy and wouldn't do it. And then about 14-15 years ago he was having a birthday. And I just, on chance, I gave his daughter a call to see if he'd do the interview and she said well “I'll go ask him.” She asked him and she said “Yeah he'll do it.” And I said “Well, go ask him again he's done this before.” So she wouldn't ask him again and he came back and said “Yes I'll do the interview.” And I went over there, we talked for several hours, he played some music for me, and as we were leaving I noticed he had a picture on the wall of himself standing in front of — he has a big Cadillac couch, it’s the back of an old Cadillac made into a couch, and he had a wonderful picture of him standing in front of it. And I admired it and I told him about it, and a couple of days later he sent it over to my house with a very nice note as a gift.

CO: The picture or the couch?

[LAUGHTER]

EP: The picture. I wish I had the couch it would be wonderful. The next week he called me up and asked if I wanted to go for a drink. And we went to a little bar in the Ninth Ward and had drinks and all of a sudden it was friends.

CO: And so you know hung out with him quite a bit and he got to know him. What was he like?

EP: You know, for a guy who is that big of a star, very humble man, kind of shy, but still he loved the flash. When he'd go on stage and of the diamond rings, and you know, the watches and things like that. But at home he just wanted to live in the Ninth Ward in his house, and cook red beans and, you know, just make music.

CO: And it's funny you mention the flash of the diamonds because we were digging through our archives to see what we had on interviews with Fats Domino. And there was one from the CBC interview with him in 1968, and he's actually, he's talking about buying jewelry even when he has very little money. I just want to play that clip for you so we just get a bit of his voice.

SOUNDCLIP

FATS DOMINO: About 20 years ago when I first started I had $3,700 in the bank. And I took $3,650 and left $50 in the bank. That’s how much I like jewelry. Didn't know where the rest was going to come from but I had an idea I’d be working, I wasn’t sure.

CO: So 20 years earlier, so it was 1948 that he took that money out to buy jewelry.

EP: Yeah, because his first big song was in 1949, The Fat Man him and Dave Bartholomew. And you know I did a thing for them actually for the Rock n Roll Hall of Fame. And arguably that was the first rock n roll song in history.

CO: Describe it for those who haven't seen a live performance with Fats Domino, what was it like?

EP: He's got an infectious smile and he always sits at the keyboard and he's got the mic usually on his right side, and he's just looking at the audience and smiling and it's just it's, it's, it's, it's amazing. In fact I was on stage with him for the last big show he ever did. That was at Tipitina's, which is a club here in New Orleans, in I think 2007.

CO: And that was after Katrina right? Because you mentioned this very important story, which is that he stayed, he was in New Orleans during Hurricane Katrina. He didn't leave and he had to be rescued. Tell us a bit about what happened there?

EP: Katrina was coming in the weekend before, and I was live on the air doing live coverage for our hurricane coverage, and I called Fats while we were in a break. And I was begging him to leave because he was in an area I knew was vulnerable, and he just wouldn't do it, he was stubborn. And then after the storm hit there were all kinds of rumors that he was he had perished, but he hadn't, he got rescued and was OK. But I went back with him to his house, when he first went back there, we were walking by a sign that said it RIP Fats Domino on the front of his house written in spray paint. So I said “Fats, what do you think about that?”And he goes “They got me dead too soon.”

CO: He lost a lot in that flood didn't he?

EP: Oh yeah. He had two big, beautiful grand pianos there. The Cadillac chair was in that house and that's where I first got to meet him. I mean, really meet him. And so he got like 13 feet of water in this house. It was a rough, rough time.

CO: Just talk a bit about his influence on rock n roll, because you say not only was the first rock n roll song his, but the tremendous influence. I mean, that's one thing one thing to be a great musician and to and to perform as well as he did, but to influence as broadly as he did is really quite something. Tell us a bit about that?

EP: Well, he did. And I think all the people from the British Invasion, from the Beatles or The Rolling Stones, to everybody else they, worshipped Fats Domino. When the Beatles came to New Orleans in the 60s the person they wanted to meet was Fats Domino. So when I was interviewing him I said “Well you got to meet the Beatles” and he goes “No, the Beatles got to meet me.”

[LAUGHTER]

CO: And he was right. I mean, they felt that way they. They worshipped him. Lady Madonna definitely inspired by Fats Domino. But John Lennon was hugely inspired by him, Led Zeppelin, Randy Newman, Ricky Nelson all did covers of his work. And I guess what's interesting is that…

EP: Pat Boone even did a cover of his work.

CO: And actually sold better than his own work did.

EP: But I said “At least you get the residuals Fats” And he goes “That's right.”

[LAUGHTER]

CO: But something about the way that he was able to, at a time when there was very little crossover between black and white audiences, that he was able to draw in both of those, that that young people both black and white were so drawn to his music at an early age. And how did he feel about that?

EP: Well, he told me stories about how he and Dave would be on the road, they could go and play before a sold out house, but then they could not check into a hotel that would accept blacks. They only wanted white people, so they had to go out of town to stay, or you know find a restaurant where they'd be willing to serve them. Even though these same people were lovingly listening to his music at the concert.

CO: And you mentioned Dave Bartholomew who was his partner. If you could pick one Fats Domino song for us to play, I know this is hard, but what would it be?

EP: Maybe the one they didn't write, “Blueberry Hill”, but the one I love and I think it's so apropos for this day is “Ain't That A Shame.” Ain't that a shame we lost Fats?

CO: Nice choice. Eric thanks so much for speaking about him.

EP: All right Carol, thank you.

CO: Bye.

EP: Bye, bye.

JD: We reached Eric Paulsen in New Orleans Louisiana. His friend, the legendary musician Fats Domino, died this week. He was 89 years old. If you'd like to see some photographs of Fats Domino in front of the Cadillac chair visit our website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

[Music: Ambient Tones & Bass]

Law Society

JD: An update now on a story we brought you earlier on in the week. Doug Racine the head of Saskatoon’s Aboriginal Law Group, was frustrated with the law society of Saskatchewan. He argued that the society had not done enough to protect indigenous clients who had been taken advantage of by irresponsible lawyers, particularly during the residential schools compensation process. Now we were hoping to speak to the society on this program, but they sent us a media release that reads in part quote “The Law Society does not have a window into the independent assessment process because it is a closed process intended to create a safe and private environment within which the claims of residential school survivors are assessed. Because of the closed nature of the process, The Law Society only has the ability to become involved upon the receipt of a complaint from one of the parties involved: a lawyer, claimant or adjudicator. Where the Law Society has received complaints regarding lawyer conduct in the independent assessment process, it has investigated those complaints as it would any other, and where appropriate has initiated discipline proceedings against those lawyers. We have encouraged Mr. Racine to report to the Law Society any information of a specific lawyers misconduct of which he is aware and is at liberty to divulge” unquote.

[Music: Ambient Guitar Plucks]

NYPD rape case

Guest: Mark Treyger

JD: Last month a teenage girl was arrested in Coney Island, New York. While she was in custody she claims the police raped her. Two police police officers involved say the sex was consensual. Can a person though, really consent to sex while in police custody? That is a question to which the New York State Penal Code does not seem to have an answer. Mark Treyger is seeking to change that. Mr. Treyger is a Brooklyn city councillor. We reached him in Brooklyn.

CO: Councilman Treyger, first of all, can you tell us about this case of this young woman who was on Coney Island, what happened?

COUNCILMAN MARK TREYGER: Yes, this is a very disturbing case. But on the night of September 15 this teenage girl was with her friends by a park, the undercover police car with detectives began to approach their car, spoke to them. They asked the girl to join them in their vehicle, proceeded to, according to reports, handcuffed her, took her into their custody, and they took her into a parking lot of a Chipotle restaurant in my district, in Coney Island, where according to reports they proceeded to sexually assault and basically rape her.

CO: And they forced her into acts while she was handcuffed?

MT: Correct. That is what we've been reading, and as a matter of fact, the lawyer for the detectives conceded that things happened in the car. But his excuse for it is outrageous, claiming that it was consensual. There is no such thing as consensual sex when you are under arrest, handcuffed in the custody of police officers. That is rape, that is sexual assault. And I found his excuse to be completely incredulous and outrageous. And that's what prompted me in my office to research the state penal code to examine and evaluate the state laws on this. And we were shocked to learn that when it comes to corrections officers in correctional facilities, there is no such thing as consensual sex between an corrections officer and an inmate. The same is true for parole officers and parolees. But there was a glaring omission for police officers and people in their custody.

CO: And I want to get, to in just a moment, what you're trying to do to remedy that, but just go back to the case of this young woman who was taken into custody that night and allegedly these officers raped her. What did she do? Did she report what happened to her immediately?

MT: She went to a hospital where they administered a rape kit examination and the DNA tests, according to reports, came back that they found DNA from both of the officers on the girl.

CO: And what happened to the officers after that was found?

MT: Well, it's my understanding that the Brooklyn district attorney's office is actively investigating the case. But I am truly perplexed why they have not been arrested up to this point. I do know that the NYPD has taken away their badges, and they are on leave, but that's as far as it goes right now.

CO: But these officers do not deny that they had sex with the girl. They claim it was consensual sex. Is that what you understand?

MT: Correct. That is what their lawyer has said publicly, that his client's claim that the sex was consensual, and that's why I was just appalled and shocked by that comment because to any rational person, how can you describe that is consensual sex when the person is under arrest, in handcuffs and in custody of the police? And I think what they're trying to do by saying it was consensual is that knowing that there's no official state crime on the books about this, they might plead guilty possibly to a much lesser charge that might not carry any type of severe penalties, maybe official misconduct. But what occurred was rape. And I've spoken to a number of officers who were shocked to learn that there is no official word on the books, and they're equally appalled by what happened to this girl. And might I add something that I think is also important to get out, that I am outraged and disgusted by the attorney’s efforts to denigrate, degrade, demean, this teenage girl by sharing with the media some of her social media posts or pictures of her, that are completely irrelevant to what transpired that night.

CO: And what you're saying, this is a story it was leaked to the papers so quickly, even before the actual officers had been identified, so it appeared that the police force may have been trying to get ahead of this story, in which they released this statement that had been consensual sex. And then also leaked to the press these pictures of this teenage girl looking very kind of coquettish and sex kittenish as teenage girls often post on their Facebook pages.

MT: Completely irrelevant, snd it is demeaning and degrading to all victims of sexual assault and rape to try to smear the victim. This is a tactic to try to turn the table against the victim. And we cannot stand for that. And again, I'm equally appalled that there's no official law on the books that make this a crime. So it is really important that both the city and the state move on this to send a very clear message that what occurred it was absolutely disgusting, outrageous and acceptable, and it never happens again. And you know there's a reason why the state law specified corrections officers not being able to engage in sexual activity with inmates. There’s a reason why the law specifies parole officers that they can’t engage sexual activity with people they oversee. I don't understand for the life of me why police officers were not included in that law, because clearly someone who is under arrest they’re in handcuffs or they're under their custody, if they try to leave or escape that's a charge that could be leveled against them. If a cop is pursuing you, arresting you, or trying to stop you, you can't just walk away and leave or escape. And so that's why it's mind boggling and really just shocking that this is not a law already, but that's why we have to move expeditiously and get this on the books.

CO: All right, we'll leave it there. Councilman Treyger, I appreciate speaking with you. Thank you.

MT: Thank you. Thanks so much.

JD: Mark Treyger is a city councilman in Brooklyn, New York and that is where we reached him.

[Music: Electric Guitar Plucks]

Monetary Fund chief Christine Lagarde on climate change

JD: When International Monetary Fund chief Christine Lagarde spoke in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia yesterday, it wasn't just to praise Saudi Arabia for its efforts on gender equality, although she did do that. It was also to warn the world that if we do not begin to take climate change seriously our future is not looking so bright. Or rather it is looking blindingly bright and altogether too hot. Ms. Legarde spoke on a panel at the Future Investment Initiative, and when asked what the world will look like in the future, this was her answer.

SOUNDCLIP

CHRISTINE LEGARDE: What is needed now is clearly to address two key issues. And that will drive us towards either utopia dystopia. The first one is climate change. As I've said before, if we don't do anything about climate change now, in 50 years’ time will be toasted, roasted and grilled. So, decisions are needed at this point in time, which will probably mean that in 50 years’ time oil will be a secondary commodity, which is well understood in the kingdom and I'm delighted about that. The second thing is inequality. And what I mean by inequality is inequality between men and women. Again, the kingdom is doing some good things about it, and inequalities between countries. If you look at a map at the moment, those countries that will suffer massively from climate change are surprise, surprise, those countries that are low income countries at the moment. If we don't address those two issues of climate change and growing inequalities we will be moving towards a dark 50 years from now.

JD: That was IMF chief Christine Lagarde speaking in Riyadh yesterday.

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Part 3: Kevin Page, indigenous rookie cards

Dateline: Japanese cat burglar

JD: Dateline Osaka, Japan.

[Music]

JD: In Japanese the phrase “neko o kaburu” literally means to wear a cat or to put a cat on one's head. It refers to acting innocent while hiding your claws, so to speak. Another cat related figure of speech echoes the Biblical expression pearls before swine. It is “neko ni koban” which literally translated means gold coins to a cat. And put together these phrases metaphorically speaking, tell the tale of Mitsuaki Tanigawa. Tanigawa-san is not a cat, he is a man, but a man, who for years wore a cat, not just on his head, but over his entire body. A man so utterly unassuming that he essentially became the proverbial cat. By that I mean no one considered for a moment that Tanigawa-san might possibly have an interest in gold, even as he raked in a fortune with concealed claws. Right under the noses, and the blushing cheeks, of authorities. No, Tanigawa-san is not a cat, but he was a very successful cat-burglar. Beginning around 2009 Tanigawa-san would don a black body suit and a balaclava, and slip stealthily into the night, raiding homes, offices and stores in the eastern end of Osaka. Eventually making off with more than 29 million yen. That is about $330,000. Rare footage captured by CCTV cameras showed an agile figure darting along high walls or squeezing through tight gaps between buildings. And that led police to believe they were looking for a man in the prime of youth. They dubbed him “The Ninja of Heisei” a reference to Japan's modern imperial era. And then earlier this summer he was caught on a security camera briefly revealing his face, and police eventually had their suspect. By day, Mitsuaki Tanigawa, mild-mannered, 74-year-old pensioner. And so ends the tale with an alleged ageing cat burglar bagged. Except that Mitsuaki Tanigawa then allegedly let the cat out of the bag himself. He was quoted as saying “I did not want to work and theft is quicker. I thought I would never be caught. I am defeated.”

[Music: Reggae]

Kevin Page

Guest: Kevin Page

JD: It has not been a great month for Bill Morneau. Canada's finance minister has found himself fending off criticisms over his multi-million dollar stake in the family company. The opposition has cast him as someone out of touch with the middle class. And so this week's fall fiscal update gave the minister a chance to change the narrative a bit. And his update entitled “Progress for the Middle Class” was wholly optimistic. It boasts a deficit reduction of nearly 10 billion dollars, thanks to a strong economy, and eight billion dollars in new spending. Well, Kevin Page has some of his own questions. Mr. Page is a former parliamentary budget officer and the current president and CEO of the Institute of Fiscal Studies and Democracies at the University of Ottawa. We reached him in Ottawa.

CO: Mr. PAGE This looks like a happy news story. The Global and Mail saying surprisingly strong economy is going to generate 9 billion dollars more than we thought. We're leading the G7 with growth. Employment is up. So why the long face?

KEVIN PAGE: Well, there shouldn't be a long face. It's all of what you said and it was I think a good day for the minister of finance after a number of difficult months dealing with small taxation issues. He finally got to present an economic update with really good news, the best economic news we've had since prior to the 2008 recession. If there's really issues it's does the government have a fiscal plan going forward to deal with this change in the economy? You know, it's one thing to put stimulus in the economy, to use the credit card when times are weak, and then the question really is for a lot of people should we be using the credit card basically deficit financing a number of measures really on the backs of future generations.

CO: So you think that what they should do, they should be presenting their balanced budgets. I was just looking at a story from December 2015, Justin Trudeau saying that having balanced books are cast in stone within four years, that was his projection. So you think that they should be holding to that and balancing the books is that right?

KP: Yeah, I think when the economy is this strong and you're adding stimulus to the economy through deficit financing type measures there's a concern that you have fiscal policy being too stimulative. We have monetary policy with the government the Bank of Canada earlier today, raised some concerns with rising inflation, and probably the likelihood of further interest rate increases in the future. You know, the economy is already firing on all cylinders. Do we need to have these large deficits? Doesn't have to be cast in stone, but a plan that has a target so we know that you know the government of the day is making tradeoffs and decisions and is acting responsibly in this economic environment. I think certainly all the opposition parties, I think a number of economic commentators, say that yesterday was a strong economic update but with respect to the fiscal plan it really wasn't much of a fiscal plan. There were certainly no deficit targets.

CO: But here's the argument that the liberals are presenting and Mr. Morneau is presenting. The reason why the economy is so strong is because they are investing, that they're using the revenue they've got to redistribute wealth down to the middle and lower classes and away from the wealthy. That that and that redistribution of wealth, especially in the can to child benefit, is what has created this extra revenue. All those things they say flow from that decision and he says that setting a target for balancing the books is not in the interest of Canadians. What do you say to that?

KP: Well, I mean I think definitely the economy is much stronger than was anticipated back in 2015 right now. I mean, it's a different environment, so the environment that they inherited, the economy was weak they added stimulutive measures, big infrastructure spending initiatives. I mean, the question is do you need to do more. When the economy really is growing like north of three per cent unemployment rate is six per cent, I think most people would say that's about as good as it gets for an economy in terms of its potential. And I think the argument to deficit finance is weak. You can redistribute income in a balanced budget environment when the economy is growing at three per cent and you have significant revenues coming in. You don't need to be rebalancing from high income to low income or middle income in an environment where it's still running deficits at this point in time.

CO: But the argument is that the debt to GDP ratio is good. It's on track to decline, as they promised. They are ahead of other G-7 countries, ahead of others in the world in having that ratio as good as it is, a level to be seen not since the 1970s.

KP: Well again, that remains to be seen. If you look at the numbers it's a best case scenario, it says the economy will grow you know three per cent this year and will stay to grow basically what most economists would say potential, the unemployment rate continues to fall down, inflation stays very modest. Interest rates crawl gently, in that environment and you have strong GDP growth and you’re running deficits I mean I think that's the issue. It wasn't that long ago when I was probably on your show talking about how deep the the 2008-09 recession that really very few people saw coming. You want to make sure that you're not adding too much to the stock of debt that is going to create instability further down the road. When the times are good there's that expression, you want you governor of the Bank of Canada and your minister of finance to take the punchbowl away from the party. You don't need to be using the credit card to finance these sorts of measures.

CO: Just quickly to close if there is a dark cloud that is possibly on the horizon certainly the Bank of Canada is worried about this. All the uncertainty around NAFTA, which is a cornerstone of the Canadian economy as you know, if that deal gets canceled what happens to this advantage that Mr. Morneau is speaking of right now?

KP: Well, it could be it could change on a dime. We’re assuming strong growth in years. Absolutely if we had a shock like that to the world economy, big trade disruption, that would be significant. I think there is equally large concerns, it's just a massive amount of household that we've been building up. You know, and some of that it's just that we've kept these interest rates so low that all of us are going out and taking advantage of low interest rates. So debt continues to grow at the household level faster than incomes, it's at very high levels. So if something was the turnaround quickly we could find a lot of people that are in a position that they can't afford that debt. Again, we shouldn't be long faced. We should be happy. The minister of finance should celebrate the fact that the economy is as strong as it is. We’ll have a budget in a few months and maybe another opportunity for the Liberal government to present a stronger fiscal plan.

CO: All right let’s turn that frown upside down and smile.

KP: No need for frowns.

CO: Mr. Page good talk to you, thank you.

KP: An honour, thank you so much.

JD: Kevin Paige is the former parliamentary budget officer and the current president and CEO of the Institute of Fiscal Studies and Democracies at the University of Ottawa. And we reached him in Ottawa.

[Music: Guitar Plucks]

Annie Pootoogook

JD: It has been more than a year now since the body of renowned Inuk artist Annie Pootoogook was discovered in the Rideau River. But as Ottawa police prepare to wrap up the investigation into her death, the expectation is that what or who may have caused it will be deemed inconclusive due to lack of evidence. That is troubling news Veldon Coburn. He adopted Ms. Pootoogook’s daughter Napachie. It’s troubling to him even if he believes police have done their job. Here's some of what Mr. Coburn had to say to CBC's Judy Trinh yesterday about the investigations likely outcome.

SOUNDCLIP

VELDON COBURN: They have pursued all leads that have come, whatever information the public had brought to their attention. Whatever was plausible they had made every effort to track down so I was assured I was assured that they took it seriously.

JUDY TRINH: So we are being told that the investigation report will be done by November 15^th. If the results are such that they are going to close it, they're going to deem the investigation as not suspicious but yet unable to determine an exact cause of death. Does that leave a lot of questions for you to explain to your daughter?

VC: Yeah, it leaves an immense number of questions. They’re questions that aren't going to arise immediately, but she does talk about her mother. We went to the McMichael gallery in early September when they opened the exhibit, and she knows her biological mother. And as she matures, gets older, it's going to leave so many gaps in understanding. It's easy to empathize, sympathize with families of missing and murdered Indigenous women, when they don't have any answers. It's a death that leaves a lot unanswered. It's something that will probably haunt her through the rest of her life.

JD: What would you like me Napachie to know about her mother?

VC: I think there's so many things, like the family, the Pootoogook’s come down and talk about how loving and delicate and tender Annie was. We’d prefer — but she's going to find out anyways what was written about Annie — the bad things. But I know that she's going to know that her mother was an internationally acclaimed artist, quite accomplished. She was not somebody who sought out celebrity. It came to her, very humble, very loving. I think most of the things that she's going to learn about her mother will come probably from her biological family and we’re quite close with them.

JD: Veldon Coburn is the adoptive father of Napachie, daughter of the late Inuk artist Annie Pootoogook. Ms. Pootoogook’s body was discovered last September in the Rideau River. Findings of an Ottawa police investigation into the cause of her death are expected to be inconclusive.

[Music: Ambient Bass Tones]

Robert Guillaume obit

SOUNDCLIP

WOMAN: You.

ROBERT GUILLAUME: Who?

WOMAN: You are leaving muddy tracks all over the place.

RG: Well that’s because I’ve got muddy feet.

[SITCOM LAUGH TRACK]

WOMAN: I want your shoes.

RG: They’ll be too small.

[SITCOM LAUGH TRACK]

WOMAN: You're tracking up the governor's mansion and it is disgusting.

RG: Fine I’ll walk on my hands. This is some place you got here. I came here as a favour to Mrs. Tate and the dogs tried to kill me, the gardener tried to drown me, the security men searched me and now I got a stormtrooper after my shoe.

[SITCOM LAUGH TRACK]

JD: That was actor Robert Guillaume reporting for his first day of duty as a butler at the governor's house on the hit 80s sitcom Benson. Robert Guillaume died yesterday. He was 89 years old. Mr. Guillaume was no ordinary actor. His performance as Benson on the sitcom Soap was so popular that they gave the character his own series. And his performance was so strong that the character went from Butler to lieutenant governor over that series seven seasons. Not only that, Robert Guillaume became the first ever African-American to win comedy Emmys — one for Soap, one for Benson, both for playing Benson. But that one character was just one part of his career. He started as a managing editor on the show Sports Night, provided the voice for the eccentric Rafiki in Disney's The Lion King, and was the first African-American performer to play the lead in The Phantom Of The Opera on Broadway. From 1999, here is Robert Guillaume speaking with Meryl Marshall from the Archive of American television about how he shaped the character of Benson.

SOUNDCLIP

ROBERT GUILLAUME: I wanted Benson to embody the American dream, and that is that you go from one place, to another, to another, to another. And it seemed to me I wanted the arc of that character to start one place and end up in another place. And I really wanted sociologically, I mean, I always had these pretensions. Sociologically I wanted African-Americans to see or to feel that it was possible to start as a butler and end up — it was perfectly logical. Because we knew he was an intelligent man. We knew he was witty. We knew he was sharp. So why shouldn't he develop that. And so I went to night school, which we mentioned several times in the script, and I went to law school. And so it was quite understandable that I would end up being someone who could be considered for lieutenant governor. And our last episode was I was running for governor. There wasn't any resistance to the idea. It was just something that I said remember now we've got to put in so and so and so-and-so and we've got to do this. We've got to upgrade this character.

JD: That was actor Robert Guillaume in conversation with Meryl Marshall in 1999. Mr. Guillaume, most famous for playing Benson the acerbic Butler died yesterday. He was 89 years old.

[Music: Piano Ballad]

Indigenous rookie cards

Guest: Naim Cardinal

JD: Naim Cardinal has finally completed his rookie card collection. 70 official cards, 70 different NHL — players all of them Indigenous. Yesterday Mr. Cardinal showed off his collection on Twitter, which includes legends like Ron Delorme, Reggie Leach, Jordin Tootoo. And his sense of triumph is well earned. He has been working on the deck for three years. Naim Cardinal lives in Edmonton and that is where we reached him name.

CO: Naim, what inspired you to start this collection?

NAIM CARDINAL: Well, I've been collecting off and on for quite a few years now, and sometimes I would take breaks for up to two years, just because I get kind of bored with it. I wasn't really motivated to keep a collection going. But I picked up a few rookie cards of some of the players I have in my collection now and that kind of kept me going in my collecting. I saw those rookie cards and I just thought like it would be really fun project a really meaningful project to try to accumulate all the Indigenous players in the NHL who have played in a regular season game and have an NHL rookie card.

CO: And why was it important for you to recognize that the cards of those Indigenous players in the NHL?

NC: I'm a First Nations person. I'm a member of the Tallcree First Nation and I always admired the Indigenous players in the NHL. Growing up I was a big hockey fan, I didn't really play hockey a whole lot but I loved watching hockey and I kept track of a lot of the players. Growing up it was really awesome to see a lot of the Indigenous players on TV. And I just think it's so important for us to see the amount of Indigenous players that are in NHL and you know can be really inspiring for some of our youth to be able to see that, just to see the amount of NHL players who are Indigenous all altogether in my collection.

CO: And, you know, it's not just for Indigenous people or for young people. I mean, it's really fascinating and interesting to know that so many of the players that people probably knew or could recognize, that were Indigenous or that they had identified as Indigenous. And there’s 70 official cards that you have collected so far, is that right?

NC: Yes, I have. And yeah, I agree with you it's very important for everyone to see. I think a lot of people were surprised by some of the people who were in my collection, as was I when I was putting it together, and when I was going through the list that I found online from various web sites. But yeah, I think it's a really important thing to see and it's generated a lot of good conversation on my Twitter account and with my friends as well.

CO: What are some of the cards and the players cards you have collected? Tell us a few names and tell us a bit about them.

NC: Well, I have George Armstrong, that's my oldest card, that is from the 1952-53 Parker set. Just doing some of the research online about him. His mother was Anishinaabe or Ojibwe from Ontario. And yeah he found his way into the NHL and he's a very well-known player from the Toronto Maple Leafs. As well Fred Sasakamoose a rookie card. He's the first First Nations player in the NHL. It's been recognized for that a lot lately, which is very important as well. I also have like a lot of current players like Carey Price Jordan Tootoo, Jordan Nolan, Michael Ferland from the Calgary Flames. So it just it's a big variation in the different amount of rookie cards that I have.

CO: And Jordan Tootoo who you just mentioned, he's been a bit of an inspiration for you hasn't he?

NC: Yeah, he has. I read his book and I actually read his book in one day. I started reading it and I couldn't put it down just because like his story was so intriguing and it was so inspirational. Hearing about all the things that he went through in his youth and growing up, even when he was an adult in the NHL. And I think it's important for people to hear some of those things, because especially Indigenous people seeing someone who is so successful and is this professional hockey player going through these struggles every day, we don't think about those things sometimes when we see them playing hockey. And a lot of those traumas and experiences he's had are shared traumas and experiences with Indigenous people. So it's really inspiring to hear what he's overcome in his career and in his life to get where he is right now.

CO: Do you know what kind of racism they encountered? What kind of obstacles that they may have faced in order to move up in the ranks of the NHL?

NC: I know for a while that history was something that was hidden amongst the players. And even on some of the older cards that I have there are some slightly racist features on them, like the stereotypical features. Like on some of the rookie cards on the these cartoon characters, and it's of the player who is on the card. I know some of them are wearing feathers and they're saying his nickname is ‘Chief’ or things like that. So it's definitely come a long way, but I know there's still work for us to do together.

CO: Did you find any of the players did not have an official NHL card?

NC: Yes I did. There was actually several players in my collection that I had to find cards outside the NHL issued sets. That's Ted Hodgson was one, that was the big 8.5 x 11 card that I had in my set. And that was a team issued set from his days in the WHA with the Cleveland Crusaders. Another guy was Wayne King, who played a few games in NHL and unfortunately never got a card. So I had to find a team issued stamp, which was about three inches by two inches, so it's not a regular size card either.

CO: And so now you have this set that I doubt that anybody else has such a collection as that. What are you going to do with it?

NC: What I plan on doing is I plan on keeping it in my family for as long as I can. And I think it is something that we can continue to build on, because I know there's going to be more Indigenous players coming into the NHL and it's something that can be ongoing, like an ongoing hobby for me and something I can just continue to add to each year.

CO: And is there any way that you can share it — that others can see the collection?

NC: Well, I have it posted on my Twitter account right now, but I’ve been recently thinking about making a website and just having a little feature of the card and maybe have a short bio of each player. But for now it's on my Twitter page and it's available there for anyone to see.

CO: Well we will direct people to your Twitter page so they can see this and that and look forward to possibly in the future that you put together more of a website. Naim it's good to talk to you. Thank you.

NC: Yeah, it’s good talking to you too. Thank you so much.

CO: Bye.

NC: Bye.

JD: Naim Cardinal has collected rookie cards of 70 Indigenous NHL players. We reached Mr. Cardinal in Edmonton. And to see his collection do visit him on Twitter. As Carol mentioned, I will give you the details. It is: @NaimCardinal.

[Music: Upbeat 50’s Bebop]

Soylent CFIA

SOUNDCLIP

Even on vacation Metrecal fits your way of life. Metrecal helps you restrict your calories while providing sound nutrition and appetite satisfaction. Just open, pour and drink. Deliciously pleasing by any standard. Metrecal, the established dietary with clinically proven safety and effectiveness.

JD: That is a 1961 commercial for a meal replacement product called Metrecal, which was hugely popular for a while. Although, deliciously pleasing by any standard is a stretch. In fact, TIME magazine described it as vile. Metrecal contained skim milk and soybean flour and was fortified with vitamins and minerals. In its advertising it essentially claimed that, nutritionally speaking, you could subsist on it alone if you wanted to. Although it presented only one reason why you would want to.

SOUNDCLIP

Is this the day you finally do something about your weight?

JD: Well why don't you do something about your face jerk? In 2017 so-called “meal replacements” are not about weight loss, they are about streamlining your life, eliminating all that wasted time you spent eating old timey solid food, so you can spend more time on your social media brand or whatever. For example Soylent. The company says Soylent contains quote “a complete blend of everything the body needs to thrive.” People swear by it. Some people swear at it, like a very small percentage of users who had severe gastrointestinal response to it. And still Soylent tried to prove you can't keep a good meal replacement down. Poor choice of words there, but what I mean is it introduced a new formula this year and it hoped things would look up. But when they look up here to Canada things don't look good. The Canadian Food Inspection Agency has just announced that Soylent does not meet its standards for a meal replacement, therefore it cannot be sold in Canada or even shipped to Canada. It won't be recalled, but it also can't be reordered. The makers of Soylent say the CFIA standards quote “do not reflect the current understanding of human nutritional needs” unquote. However, they are reluctantly complying and they say they're working to get it back to Canadians who have grown to depend on its richly bland beigeness. So we send out our sympathies to those who have just learned that the powder that they have been taking has taken a powder.

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October 25, 2017 episode transcript

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