Polish filmmaker Agnieszka Holland examines moral choice in an immoral world
Her latest film, Green Border, will premiere in North America at TIFF
This fall, as Writers & Company wraps up after a remarkable 33 year run, we're revisiting episodes selected from the show's archive. This episode originally aired Dec. 17, 2013.
Artistically ambitious, compassionate and controversial, Agnieszka Holland's films tell unconventional human stories that illuminate important moments in history — from famine in 1930s Ukraine to the Holocaust to Soviet repression in Czechoslovakia. She's also directed popular adaptations of The Secret Garden and Washington Square, as well as episodes of ground-breaking television series such as The Wire, House of Cards and Treme.
Born in 1948 to a Catholic mother and Jewish father, Holland grew up in Warsaw and attended film school in Czechoslovakia during the Prague Spring of the late 1960s. She depicts this time in her three-part series, Burning Bush, produced for HBO Europe. Holland's latest film, Green Border, tells the story of the Syrian refugee crisis along Poland's border with Belarus. It's been called a "humanitarian masterpiece" and will have its North America premiere at the Toronto International Film Festival.
An early aversion to politics
"My father was arrested at some point in 1961 and jumped out of the window during the interrogation and killed himself. I was 13 and I didn't understand exactly what it was and why it happened. But I started to feel that [politics] is a cruel and cynical game, where the individual has very little choice to make any kind of change. And if I want to be an artist, I have to cut myself out of this kind of activities. In my home, my stepfather and my mother and their friends were talking all the time about who will be the next secretary of the party. I found it totally stupid.
"So when the change at the top of Czechoslovak Communist Party happened in January '68, I didn't pay any attention to that change. I thought then, 'one gangster changes another gangster.' It was probably March or April when I realized that something is going on in a very powerful way. I was on the street. Some demonstration [was happening]. They were marching. There was something so joyful, free and youthful in this, that I started to go with them, just to join them, curious about where it's going and what will happen. From that moment, I was marching until I was stopped and imprisoned."
An 'interesting' experience in prison
"At this time, I was young and fearless. Of course, I was scared a bit. I didn't know if I would stand it. The prison was pretty brutal. But after a few days, I was sure that I would live through it, even if it would be long.
"They treated me very badly. And there were some threats that I could stay there forever, that they could kill me or something.
It was also the experience that things are always more complex and complicated, and that even with a really bad guy you can create some kind of human connection, at least for a short moment.
"My main interrogator was really nice. We had some kind of bond. I thought that he's maybe not such a bad guy. After a few years, I was back in Prague for some reason after I finished school. I met my friends who had been in the opposition and I was asking about this interrogator, to see what he became. They said that he is one of the most brutal, terrible guys, a cynical pig.
"I was lucky. It was also the experience that things are always more complex and complicated, and that even with a really bad guy you can create some kind of human connection, at least for a short moment.
"My biggest fear was that I would tell something that would harm other people. I was lucky that it didn't happen to me, that I was smart enough or lucky enough to navigate through the situation in a successful way. But to be alone, to be in the prison — because they kept me alone for about two weeks — it was very interesting."
Pushing against the human tendency to conform
"I was able to see it several times in my lifetime that the people are not really made for freedom, you know? That people are really conformists by nature, that they need to belong. And that to go against the stream is difficult and only a few people are able to do it.
"It's not only in the dramatic times like that, or the painful times. I think it's on an everyday basis. In the normal Western democracy, you can see the same kind of conformity, of course. It doesn't always translate to the political dimension, but it is like that. So I think you cannot ask people to be heroic and you cannot ask people to be extremely courageous and to sacrifice the things which are important for their well-being.
I was always fascinated by those who go against the stream, especially for those who don't have the ambition to be the leaders or to be that great revolutionary.
"And it's normal. I don't have a great delusion about the capacity of humanity. But I was always fascinated by those who go against the stream, especially those who don't have the ambition to be the leaders or to be that great revolutionary. But about the people who have something inside of them that even against their will or against their good sense, they are going to do things which are, logically speaking, not very good for them or for their family. And I think it's some kind of gene. I think there is something inside of your system, the gene of justice or something, that you just cannot help. You cannot accept the things that are wrong."
Agnieszka Holland's comments have been edited for length and clarity.
