The Next Chapter·Q&A

Suzette Mayr explores Black queerness & joy in The Sleeping Car Porter — and won the Giller Prize for it

Suzette Mayr spoke to The Next Chapter columnist Ryan B. Patrick about what inspired her to write The Sleeping Car Porter.

The Sleeping Car Porter is about Baxter, a queer Black man who works as a sleeping car porter in 1929

An author with gray and black hair holds her book while standing on stage.
Suzette Mayr is the author of the novel The Sleeping Car Porter. (John Kristalovich/Scotiabank Giller Prize)
Ryan B. Patrick interviews Suzette Mayr on her 2022 Scotiabank Giller Prize- winning novel, The Sleeping Car Porter.

Calgary writer Suzette Mayr's novel The Sleeping Car Porter takes readers on a ride — a train ride across 1920s Canada. It's a ride that's enthralled readers: The Sleeping Car Porter won the 2022 Scotiabank Giller Prize, Canada's biggest prixe for fiction, and was one of the top 10 bestselling Canadian books in 2022 and a CBC Books' pick for best fiction of 2022

The book cover features an illustration of a black man in a pink and mustard full suit with a beige brimmed hat. He stands in a field lines with trees in the background and he stands beside a small white bunny and a grey squirrel at his feet.

The Sleeping Car Porter  is about Baxter, a closeted queer Black man who works as a sleeping car porter on a train in 1929. He smiles and tries to be invisible to the passengers, but what he wants is to save up and go to dentistry school. On one particular trip out west, the train is stalled and Baxter finds a postcard of two gay men. The postcard reawakens memories and desires and ultimately puts his job in jeopardy.

Mayr is also the author of the novels MonocerosDr. Edith Vane and the Hares of Crawley Hall, Moon Honey, The Widows and Venous Hum

She spoke to CBC Books producer and The Next Chapter columnist Ryan B. Patrick about The Sleeping Car Porter

You mentioned in the past that this book is inspired by your dear friend and former creative writing instructor, Fred Wah. He told you the true story of the Black sleeping car porters. Why did you feel compelled to tell this story?

Fred Wah is my former creative writing teacher. He will always be my teacher, so it was yet another assignment he was giving me. One of my biggest fears as a writer is having nothing to write about. So this story was always my Plan B: "Fred told me about these sleeping car porters. I know nothing about them. When I'm in-between projects, I'll just work on this project."

But as it percolated through the years, it became more pressing for me. Especially because I started doing research and understanding their significance in North American culture and the terrible conditions under which they worked and still triumphed. 

These were tough, important, interesting people.

These were tough, important, interesting people. What kind of psychology would be behind somebody being that tough, but working a job that difficult and — in some cases — quite degrading and humiliating? You'd have to have a very special kind of psychology to do that.

I've always been interested in how people's brains work, how they interact with each other, how they negotiate power hierarchies and power differentials and how you can subvert that when you are somebody who is lower down in terms of power.

How do you identify with your protagonist, Baxter?

For a long time, Baxter was straight. In one storyline, I thought maybe he would be a polygamist. I'd heard that some of the porters would have families on either end of the line. Some people had families in the U.S. and in Canada. I think it was partly loneliness and desperation. So I had that. But I knew that I wanted to complicate it a bit and have him be a queer person. He wasn't resonating with me as a straight, married man or a twice-married man. I thought, "What about me? What about people like me?" I started thinking more about queer history and who he could be, so he became a queer person.

I thought, 'What about me? What about people like me?' I started thinking more about queer history and who he could be, so he became a queer person.

That still wasn't enough, because I was having to time travel to 1929. I had to change genders. I had to live in a different part of the country that I didn't know very well. If I lived then, what would I be interested in? I've always been interested in horror fiction and speculative fiction. I thought, what would he be reading? He'd be reading Dracula. He'd be reading H.G. Wells. I've always been interested in horror fiction and speculative fiction. I thought, what would he be reading? He'd be reading Dracula. He'd be reading H.G. Wells.

As soon as I found that, I felt like I now know who this person is. I understand this person. He's a bit of a nerd, and he likes guys. 

How does your own identity as a Black queer woman of mixed heritage inform how you understood Baxter?

When I was first figuring out my sexuality, there was a lot of hiding, secrecy and anxiety. You become an Oscar-worthy actor because you're presenting this face to the world but living closeted. So I had to do some incredible gymnastics, in terms of lying to the people I love. I was scared they wouldn't accept me.

I did a lot of sneaking around. It wasn't illegal, certainly, but it was the early 1990s. You had to be careful. I had friends who were chased and beaten up. It was dangerous, so that certainly fed into how I tried to understand men like Baxter. 

WATCH | Suzette Mayr on writing the book she wanted to read: 

Giller winner Suzette Mayr wrote story of 'Black joy' she couldn't find

2 years ago
Duration 7:08
Suzette Mayr has won the 2022 Scotiabank Giller Prize for her novel The Sleeping Car Porter, the story of a gay Black man in 1929 who works as a porter on a train that travels across the country.

What is Baxter's obsession with dentistry about? He also has a knack for describing how people's teeth are shaped and formed or deformed. What is the obsession about?

He wants to be a dentist. He loves people's mouths. He loves teeth. He loves occlusions and that kind of thing. When I'm building a character, a lot of it is figuring out what their desires are. What are their motivations? What's the thing that gets them through the day? Him being a dentist fits so beautifully because he would be surrounded by all kinds of mouths and all kinds of teeth.

His job is terrible. On the other hand, holy smokes, he can observe so many mouths in the meantime, and I needed to give him some kind of sanctuary where he could go into his head when faced with the worst of the worst. 

There's a scene where a passenger is yelling at him for something he hasn't done. Baxter disassociates and starts studying the man's mouth as he's shouting and that keeps him safe psychologically. It gives him a way out.

LISTEN | Suzette Mayr reacts to winning the Giller Prize: 

If you could go back in time to when you were just starting out as a writer, what would you tell your younger self?

I would say just keep on doing what you're doing and don't worry about what other people are going to think.

In elementary, junior and high school, I was a little bit of a weirdo. I had a different way of looking at things. I remember people would say, "Oh, that's different" or "that's interesting," which really meant "that's weird."

Little Suzette, just let your freak flag fly. It's awesome.

Little Suzette, just let your freak flag fly. It's awesome. Prince was the guy in thigh-high red boots, and a bikini bottom. Prince is the way to go. Prince is my model.

Suzette Mayr's comments have been edited for length and clarity.

Interview produced by Lisa Mathews, Shelagh Rogers and Jacqueline Kirke. 

ABOUT THE AUTHOR

Nikky Manfredi is an associate producer at CBC Books. She is a writer, producer and fact-checker based in Toronto.

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