Women repatriated from ISIS camps should be offered rehabilitation, not punishment: professor
Two women were arrested in Canada after being repatriated from a Syrian camp for ISIS families
For women and children returning from ISIS detention camps, reintegration into Canadian society may be a challenge — but an expert in preventing violent extremism said it's important the opportunity is provided.
"Rehab and reintegration are the keys to Canadian safety," said Dr. Cécile Rousseau, a professor of McGill University's Division of Social and Transcultural Psychiatry.
"Just as [is the] case in the other young offenders, we should we should target integration and rehab rather than punishment," she added.
At least two Canadian women and their children have been repatriated to Canada after leaving a detention camp for ISIS fighters' family members in Syria.
Canadian police arrested them shortly after their landing, and one of them was charged with terrorism-related offences.
Ottawa lawyer Lawrence Greenspon, who represents one of the women, said authorities are seeking a peace bond for his client.
Rousseau, who directs a clinical team that addresses the prevention of violent extremism, spoke to The Current's Matt Galloway about Canada's obligation to Canadian women and children in the ISIS detention camps, and the concerns she has about their mental health.
Here's part of their conversation.
What do you see as Canada's obligation to these women and children?
I think the human rights issues are very important and Canada has [an] obligation toward all of its citizens, but in particular to our children.
The Supreme Court of Canada has said that the best interest of children is above federal and provincial law.
This is very important in the present case because a lot of children are involved and these children will grow up. And if we think in terms of prevention, integration and rehabilitation of the children and the loved ones who are still young should be our priority.
WATCH: 'It's just not Canadian to let these people rot over there': lawyer
I'll ask you about the children in a moment, but for the women who willingly joined an extremist group, how do you go about assessing the risk that they pose to Canadians now?
Well, you know, as any citizen who kind of commits an offence, assessment should be individualized — and when the person who committed an offence is young, as in this case, again, rehabilitation is the key to Canadian safety.
Even with a severe penalty … they will come out of jail, they will integrate [into] our society, and we want them to feel that they are part of it, that we have a role of it, and that we'll accept them.
Heartache and suffering transform human beings. They can destroy us, but they are also kind of deep motors of transformation.-Dr. Cécile Rousseau
What sort of concerns do you have about their mental health as a result of what they have gone through in those camps?
Well, I think it has been not only a traumatic experience, probably for all of them, but a cumulative trauma experience. You know, they have suffered a lot and for a prolonged period.
That's why coming back to Canada gives us a window of opportunity to change things. Heartache and suffering transform human beings. They can destroy us, but they are also kind of deep motors of transformation.
So we have to see that case by case, because these young women have a life to live and because also a lot of them are mothers and their kids need them. So assessing the mental health and providing help, whatever [happens] with the judicial process, is certainly very important.
What about the kids? … These kids have been through extraordinarily difficult things. How can that shape them in years to come, what they have gone through?
It certainly will be a structuring influence. Now, in which direction? That is for us to build with their family and with them.
The impact on kids depends on the age. The impact on preschoolers is really related to parental relations, direct environment. Is it nurturing or not? Is it threatening rather than ideal?
WATCH: The Canadian mothers inside an ISIS detention camp
You know, from six to 12, school-age kids are much more sensitive to loyalty conflict. So what do my parents think and what do my school and peers and friends think? Do I have divided loyalty?
And this is important because some countries, for example, Kosovo, have done a great job in reintegrating [ISIS] women and children and trying to appease community upheaval. You know, how can they feel welcome? How could the kids not have to choose between their mom, who are demonized, and the rest of the community? So this is kind of very, very important for school-aged kids.
Then you have adolescents who are at the age of rebellion. That can push them against our welcoming society, or on the contrary, push [them] to rebel against their parent and say, look what you did to me.
But again, remembering that these kids will have, at some point — and it's healthy for them — to reconcile, you know, with their parents and family. So thinking in terms of development is key in that situation.
What is the role and the place of what is often called deradicalization in that treatment?
We do not use the term anymore. Why? Because evidence has shown that it doesn't work and that is important.
What promotes the change is not a shift in ideology … it's not deradicalization. What [promotes] a change is the meaning of life, the perspective.
Do you have new chances? What's happening? Are you in a helpless, hopeless situation, or do you begin growing again? Do you have loved ones around you? Do you feel appreciated? This is what [is] the key element to change.
So it's really about life going on and having a meaning in life. And for most of the women who will come back, I think that if we take good care of their children and if we value them as [moms], well, that's a good reason to live.
We have to think that presently there is a huge gap between perceived strength, which is huge with the woman, and actual dangers. You know, a lot of people around can be radicalized … and we don't see them and we don't know them.
These women, we know they will be monitored, and I think they're looking for a second chance. So let's give it to them.
With files from CBC News. Produced by Julie Crysler and Amanda Grant. Q&A has been edited for length and clarity.
