Dave Eggers on his new middle-school novel The Lifters

It's not unusual to have an addiction to your phone or social media, but most of us over a certain age can remember what life was like before the Internet. That's not the case for kids growing up right now. For them, phones, Facebook and Instagram have been around forever — and the implications of that are a little tricky. Author Dave Eggers isn't the only person to point out the risks of naturalised technology, but he may be the person to do it most convincingly.

In 2013, Eggers published a novel called The Circle about social media and the invasion of privacy, and it anticipated many of the discussions that we're having right now. Just as that conversation comes to a head in the mainstream, Eggers has turned his attention elsewhere. His new book is called The Lifters, and it's aimed at aimed at middle-school-aged readers. Unlike in The Circle — where characters can't escape the technology bubble — in The Lifters, there's not a phone in sight. Today, Eggers talks to guest host Gill Deacon about that very deliberate choice.

— Produced by Chris Trowbridge