'Accurate, fair, unbiased information' is a public right, argues Lisa LaFlamme

Ideas53:59Lisa LaFlamme: In Defence of Democracy

*This episode is also available as an IDEAS podcast.

As a journalist, Lisa LaFlamme says reporting the truth has always been at the core of how she approaches a story. But she adds, "the truth is muddy. Democracy is muddy. And it's bloody."

In her 35-year career in journalism, she has witnessed democracy at its most resilient and at its most vulnerable.

"There is a relationship between democracy and journalism that I don't think we are connecting the dots enough [on] to really say this is happening on our watch."

For almost 12 years LaFlamme was the chief anchor and senior editor of CTV National News. In November 2023, the Samara Centre for Democracy hosted In Defence of Democracy, an event where IDEAS host Nahlah Ayed interviewed Lisa Laflamme, at the Winter Garden Theatre in Toronto.

Here is an excerpt from their conversation, which took place in the weeks following Hamas' attack in Israel, and the start of the Israel-Hamas war. 

I wanted to begin by acknowledging the difficult context in which we're meeting tonight. An inflection point in history I think is an understatement, for all those who are caught up in the moment abroad, here in Canada, and around the world. In times like these, normally, you would be getting on a plane and going somewhere. I'm just wondering what your thoughts are as you watch this time from afar? 

Well, you're absolutely right, Nahlah. I think this is the first conflict I haven't covered in over 22 years. And, it is very different to be watching it than to be watching your back on the ground, wherever that conflict is. Big news abroad, and we are just seeing the direct impact on neighbourhoods and communities here in Canada. I have to say the Islamophobia, the antisemitism that is unfolding in this country right now is so painful to see, and is so wrong. I feel like we have to say out loud again and again, there is such a difference between free speech and hate speech, and it's important to know that.

But in the context of journalism, it's more than ever, the reason why experience and context and history is so critically important whenever anything like this happens. It does feel like we're at a bit of a turning point. I heard an expression the other day that democracy is such a cliffhanger right now, that even Gen Z is paying attention.  

We as journalists are really fond of saying that journalism is integral to democracy. But I wonder in the face of so much evidence that trust is waning in traditional media, is it still true in your estimate that journalism is foundational to protecting democracy?

I think the two go hand in glove. It is the public's right to have accurate, fair, unbiased information. It is their right to have that in a democracy. More than ever, though, because of the misinformation and disinformation that is just so rampant — and, honestly, if people don't realize, and a lot is on the shoulders of the consumer here, the difference between journalism and noise, news and noise... it's time really. It's past time to focus down on that.

But I would say in so many countries I've been throughout the world where people and journalists would really risk their entire lives for something we totally take for granted in this country, and that is a democracy. Believe me, when you are in a country where there is no free press, that is when you realize that the two are completely linked. If you let journalism die, you are irreparably damaging your democracy, in my view. 

At the same time, though, there are countries, and I don't want to pick on anyone in particular, where journalism is really strong, but the democratic backsliding is worse. How do you square those things? How is it possible for those two things to coexist? 

That's a great point. And I'm going to mention Tunisia here, because after the Arab Spring, for sure, there was this amazing feeling of freedom. Journalists that are friends of mine to this day felt it. They could say what they want. A president was brought in, they thought this guy is a democrat. This is a new world. Well guess what's happened in these 12 years? He is now more of an autocrat. There are reporters once again being imprisoned, challenged, intimidated, harassed. 

But you might be referring to closer to home.

I'm talking somewhere closer to home.

See, she didn't want to say it. I'm going to make you say it, sister. 

There are some incredibly strong journalists in the U.S. and people who do wonderful investigative reporting and excellent political reporting. And yet, sometimes they're preaching to the choir.  There isn't the reach that one would hope for in traditional media, like, New York Times, Washington Post, you know, other organizations. What's your sense? I mean, could that tide reverse? 

Well, I believe it could reverse, but things need to happen now... because the same rules that allow Breitbart to exist, for example, are the same rules that allow, here in this country, the Daily Hive, The Narwhal to exist. I mean, it is the loudest bullhorn, if you will.

And it has to also come back to society. People are so disenfranchised, they're depressed, they're deflated for any number of reasons that they're going to look to something that speaks to them, and I'm not going to say, although I'm about to say, this conversation could be divided between before Trump and after Trump. I'm not saying he created the polarization, but he 100 percent gave it oxygen, enough to overload the system with lies and basically short circuit the system. And that is where we still are. I mean, to refer to journalists as 'the enemy of the people,' people were listening. 

In terms of specifically the media, and it gives me no joy to say this, but the level of trust in traditional media is as low as it's ever been. Where do you see the most evidence of that in the circles that you move in?

Well, I mean, you can see it in the numbers, you can see it in newspapers that are dying, you can see it in television broadcasts that are dying. Okay, where did this erosion of trust start? Certainly, social media had a role in it. There's no doubt about it. Misinformation had a role in it. Media literacy, or lack thereof, had a role in it. It is a bit of a mess when you look at, for me, local news.  

The erosion of local news?

The erosion of local news. It's the most basic thing. Every single one of us, no matter what community you grew up in, and depending on your age, you would have known the whole action team, the Ron Burgundy action news team. Let's face it. And that's gone.

And the centralization of news is really impacting what to me was essentially relationship-building. I mean, when I was a local reporter, I'm sure it was the same for you, maybe you think the every Wednesday night council meeting was boring or the school trustees meeting was boring, but actually that's where the stories emerged from. Those were where we built those relationships, the community trusted us, as the reporters, covering that city, town, whatever it was, whatever platform, and that's gone. 

So what is the reality now where television news is concerned? It used to be, as you say, kind of king, and then cablenetworks came along, and then social media and all of that. Where does it stand now in your estimate? 

It's a crisis time, I would say. I'm not using that word lightly, and especially in [this] context. We're talking about journalism, mass layoffs. There are ramifications to all of this, to gutting newsrooms. There's ramifications for the conflict we're seeing right now, actually. Canadian news outlets didn't have any bureaus in the Middle East. I don't think any did, correct? I will be corrected, I'm sure, if I missed one. 

As far as I know, you're correct. 

And that means everyone parachutes in. That means you learn on the plane, basically. And you and I have both had to do this. But there's no institutional knowledge anymore. There are not as many veterans. I think I became a better journalist because I was eavesdropping on the veteran beside me.

And learning how to push that source, how to build that Rolodex made me better. It made me who I am, really. And I feel bad in these shrunken newsrooms where there aren't as many veterans anymore that some of those skills that we learned, they're disappearing: double-sourcing, all of these things. I am a bit of a broken record on this one, but it's danger zone time for democracy because this is what we're looking at.

I think about these family-owned newspapers, family-owned TV stations. It was a source of pride, and it was personal. Corporations don't have that sense of stewardship. Their responsibility is not to democracy. It's to the shareholder. And who pays? Canadians pay. Canadian democracy pays. I truly feel that way.