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The AIH transcript for June 7, 2023

HELEN MANN: Hello, I'm Helen Mann, sitting in for Nil Köksal.

CHRIS HOWDEN: Good evening. I'm Chris Howden. This is As It Happens.

[music: theme]

Prologue

CH: Tonight:

HM: Burned out. As fire threatens a Cree community in northern Quebec, an evacuee describes the moment they went from preparing to leave to got to go.

CH: In the running, or running jokes. After Chris Christie and Mike Pence join the Republican presidential race, a GOP strategist tells us whether they're both long shots, or they just have no shot at all.

HM: Pros are seeing some cons. Professional golfers at the Canadian Open are stunned by the news that the PGA Tour will join forces with Saudi-backed LIV -- a rival that was perceived as the pariah.

CH: It was excrement to be. A thrilled ecologist tells us about an exciting new way to get damaging microplastics out of our water -- with the help of some hungry sea creatures who consolidate the tiny particles in their poop.

HM: He had his fingers on a lot of pies. A friend remembers the legendary New York pizza chef Andrew Bellucci, who revived the city's distinctive pizza. And whose dough couldn't be topped.

CH: And… send in the crowns. No cameras were allowed in the courtroom when Prince Harry testified this week, so two British news networks got two red-haired actors to imitate the red-haired prince on screen.

CH: As It Happens, the Wednesday edition. Radio that suggests both networks need a copy editor.

Part 1: Oujé-Bougoumou Fire, PGA/LIV Merger, Pizza Visionary Obit

Oujé-Bougoumou Fire

Guest: Gaston Cooper

CH: As you may well know firsthand, smoke is lingering over a huge area of Canada and the US tonight. And air quality warnings have been issued for communities hundreds of kilometres from the closest forest fire. In Northern Quebec, the Premier has warned residents that evacuation orders are a matter of survival. Thousands have already fled for temporary shelters as the flames threaten businesses and homes. Gaston Cooper is among the evacuees from the Cree community of Oujé-Bougoumou in Northern Quebec. We reached him in Chicoutimi.

HM: Gaston, When did you realize that it was time to leave?

GASTON COOPER: I think it was around late afternoon. We've been monitoring the fire situation in our area days. And yesterday, around 3:30, 4, our chief came over while we're in a big meeting with the community, and announced that we will be evacuating tomorrow morning, which is this morning. But little did we know that the fire had spread more quickly than they had predicted. So, around supper time, we were scrambling to gather all of our belongings and get ready to leave.

HM: What was the feeling like when you learned that the fire had jumped a protective barrier?

GC: When we heard the announcement, I was sitting with a couple of the elders and former chief and a very respected person. And when I was telling them that we're going to be evacuating, you can see his face, how shocked he was. And he was asked to do the closing prayer. And one of the things he said right off the beginning, it was very emotional. And he said, God is not blind. God is not deaf. And he started doing the prayer. You can really sense that he was very emotional at the same time. And everybody felt that. And I think that's when we realized that, you know, the emotions were high and that this was serious. And we didn't expect it to be this bad. As soon as we decided to evacuate and were on our way, we heard the neighbouring town, which is a much bigger community of Shabogamo were evacuating at the same time, and that created chaos on the highway.

HM: What were you seeing at the time and what were you smelling in the air?

GC: At the base of the clouds, it looked like a normal day. And, all of a sudden, we started to see smoke, smell the smoke, and it got thicker and thicker. And every now and then during the meeting, as we were getting out, you can see ashed falling. We knew that the fire was very close.

HM: What was that like for people dealing with breathing and other health issues, for, even for those elders that you mentioned?

GC: Those elders were our priority. Like, even myself, I have a chronic cough, and even the smell of smoke or any anything, I do cough a lot and I need to sort of catch my breath. Our elders are usually the ones that suffer the most. And I even asked one of the elders, do you have somebody to drive you? And he said, no. Can you drive yourself? He said, no, I can't drive. And I said, I'll take you. And you're very happy.

HM: You said that the road out was was chaotic. What was that trip down to Chicoutimi like?

GC: Oh, my gosh, how can I best describe it? I mean, it, it normally takes about three and a half, 4 hours at the most to get to Chicoutimi from our location. We left around 7. And we only got a chance to, to arrive and sleep at 4 a.m. this morning. And you can just imagine the flow of traffic when you had the two communities evacuating at the same time. And that long stretch, there's no buildings in between. It's about 200 kilometres. And I'm pretty sure I can almost guarantee that the flow of traffic was bumper-to-bumper most of the way.

HM: Right. What kind of welcome have you had in Chicoutimi?

GC: I think it was very positive. When we got there, the Red Cross was there. Everybody was there to accommodate us there. There was a big gymnasium at the local cegep in Chicoutimi. Others were, had a chance to find rooms where they can sleep. Some of the people were sleeping in their own cars because there was not enough room in the gymnasium. Some were also put in other locations like the arenas because when Shabogamo moved, and they're a much bigger community than us, they were relocated to Laval, which is like a half hour. And everything in between Chicoutimi and Laval was full. But most of the people were very, very accommodating. Even this morning, I forgot my meds, my medication, I had a chance to go to the pharmacy. You know, they were very helpful. Even the places when we went shopping. We needed some supplies because we didn't bring everything we needed. And they were asking a lot of questions and welcoming us. And that, you know, they wanted to know more about where we're all from and where the fire was. And we would show them on our apps where the fire was. And they were, like, surprised how close it was. And we're still not out of the danger.

HM: Well, it's good to hear you're being treated well while you're away, but you've got to have your mind back on on your home and your community. Have you heard anything about what's happening back there this morning?

GC: This morning, our chief issued a communique advising us that there are going to be five water bombers that are going to be, you know, spreading the water near and around the community. They've also bulldozed the fire berrier. But the fire is still approaching and it's going straight to the community.

HM: Before I let you go, what's the air like in Chicoutimi? I mean, we're hearing, you know, as far away as New York's here, where I am in Toronto, we're feeling the smoke and seeing as well. But we're not even nearly as close as you are. What's it like where you are now?

GC: Right now, like, I see the rains. And I wish it would be raining where I come from because we really, really need that rain. You know, there's a lot of people that are trying to adapt, to move. And some of them are still in shock. Even just last night, during the night, one of the parents posted the video of her child crying at the gymnasium in the middle of the night saying, I want to go home, Mommy, I want to go home. And you can realize how people are affected by this evacuation.

HM: It's awful. It really is. I'm so sorry that you and everybody you know is dealing with this. Thank you so much for talking to us. And I wish you the very best.

GC: Thank you very much.

CH: Gaston Cooper is among the evacuees from the Cree community of Oujé-Bougoumou in northern Quebec. We reached him in Chicoutimi.

PGA/LIV Merger

Guest: Rick Young

CH: PGA golfers like Rory McIlroy came to Toronto to play golf. But since they arrived, they've been having to answer uncomfortable questions about the tour's bombshell deal with its Saudi-financed rival, LIV Golf. Like the rest of the world, the players were shocked by the news, in part because the deal follows a year of acrimony. The head of the PGA, Jay Monahan, lambasted LIV and any players who joined it, pointing to the Saudi kingdom's human rights record. Now, this about-face by the PGA will see the Public Investment Fund of Saudi Arabia -- or PIF -- pour billions into the sport, which some people call a blatant attempt at sports washing. Here's what Rory McIlroy, one of the strongest critics of LIV, said this morning at the Canadian Open.

SOUNDCLIP

RORY MCILROY: But it's not LIV. I think that's the thing. I still hate LIV. Like, I hate LIV. Like, I hope it goes away. And I would fully expect that it does. And I think that's where the distinction here is. This is the PGA Tour, the DP World tour, and the PIF -- very different from LIV. All I've tried to do is protect what the PGA Tour is and what the PGA Tour stands for. And I think it will continue to do that. So, like, going forward, I hope that there's, you know, there may be a team element and you're going to see maybe me, maybe whoever else play in some sort of team golf. But I don't think it'll look anything like LIV has looked. And I think that's a good thing.

CH: PGA Golf star Rory McIlroy speaking to reporters this morning at the Canadian Open. We reached golf writer Rick Young at the tournament in Toronto.

HM: Rick, when you hear Rory McIlroy say there that he hates LIV, how does that square with this merger?

RICK YOUNG: Well, I think the first thing, Helen, we should distinguish here before we go any further on Rory is the fact this isn't really a merger. This is the PIF has, has literally purchased the PGA Tour and DP World Tour. They are going to be the people that are going to have the money. They're going to pay the players. This is effectively the PIF's tour now. Saudi Arabia now controls professional golf worldwide.

HM: So, when he says, you know, he wants to back what the PGA stands for, the PGA doesn't stand for anything anymore -- it doesn't effectively exist.

RY: Boy, there's so much to unpack. The one thing that I would say in regards to Rory and his comments about LIV, I think those are well-positioned. He, and the likes of Tiger Woods, and many, many players opted to stay. They felt morally it was a better thing to do. And for their careers they felt like it was a better thing to do to stay on the PGA Tour, rather than jump to LIV for the millions of dollars that Saudi Arabia and the PIF were offering. I don't think that that position would, would have necessarily changed from any of them. But the news yesterday when it dropped here at Oakdale, at the RBC Canadian Open, I think, I would say, that it caught so many players, some of the best players in the world, completely off guard. I think there was a lot of very upset players in the players-only meeting last night with Jay Monahan, the commissioner of the PGA Tour. And I think there's a lot of players that are upset today. However, I would say 24 hours after the announcement was made, I think some cooler heads are starting to prevail. I think maybe some of the agents are in some of the player's ears, telling them a little bit more about the potential because we're talking billions -- billions and billions -- of dollars. And a movement of professional golf to a level in professional sports that you would reserve for things like the Premiership, the NFL, NBA. The PGA Tour is no longer going to be what we thought it was, which was a niche sport. This is professional golf, literally going to the top of the pyramid.

HM: You say that 24 hours after Jay Monahan flew up to Toronto to talk to these, these folks who are playing, cooler heads are prevailing. But you also say that's maybe because they're talking to their agents. It sounds basically like money talks here.

RY: [chuckle] No, that's absolutely what it is. It's absolutely what it is, Helen. This is, this is all about the money and how much of it is going to be going to the players? How much bigger events are going to be? What a potential team element. You heard Rory referenced it in his comments to us. How much of that will draw in new corporate sponsorship? So, how will that trickle down? Well, that trickles down right to the players pockets.

HM: And this comes after, you know, a year of moralizing that the PGA should not be associating with the Saudis. You know, pointing to 9/11, to the death of Jamal Khashoggi, to human rights abuses within Saudi Arabia. Jay Monahan himself had said very famously, have you ever had to apologize for being a member of the PGA Tour? So what's happened to all of that?

RY: I would love Jay Monahan to be with us right now. He has been on CNBC and CNN. And it's interesting for me to hear him call himself a hypocrite. He knows he's going to be called a hypocrite. He knows that the PGA Tour is going to be labelled hypocritical. It's hard to look at the PGA Tour if you're a casual fan and say you didn't sell out, but you did sell out. That's really what this comes down to. You sold out your morals. You sold out to a regime that you basically said you wanted no part of when LIV was formed a year ago.

HM: You have 9/11 families basically saying the PGA is nothing more now than paid Saudi shills. I mean, I heard Bryson DeChambeau last night on CNN, when asked about all of this, asked about the abuses, asked about 9/11 and the families saying, honestly, he actually used the term nobody's perfect to describe the Saudis. [RY chuckles] And said that they are trying to, you know, look forward and be better allies. Do you think that golf fans beyond the players themselves are going to accept all that?

RY: No, I think, I think some will. But I do believe that the PGA Tour and professional golf, they are going to lose some fans. They will probably counter that argument by saying, yes, maybe we will, and we accept that. But we think that we're also going to gain new fans on a worldwide scale that we've never had before based on how much bigger we are. This will be a blow. There can be no doubt. [fierce wind]

HM: What's in this for the Saudis? You know, beyond, obviously, there's some profit here. But we hear the term sports-washing all the time. Is that what's, what appears to be going on here?

RY: Yes, I think the Saudis have been engaged in sport-washing for several years. I think when you look at the Formula One, you have the WWE, now you've got professional golf. This is their way of trying to the sport-wash away, you know, the murder of a Washington Post reporter and the human rights abuses. They can't get around that, but they can soften it. And I think that's precisely why this deal is being put into place.

HM: How has this affected the Canadian Open this year?

RY: Yeah, this is two years in a row that the Canadian Open has been disrupted. A lot of the lustre and a lot of the attention globally that this tournament would be getting this week hs been diverted to this acquisition, this merger, this sale, call it whatever you will. And, I think, that's really unfortunate. I think tomorrow morning, when the first tee goes in the ground, and the first drive is struck, I'm very hopeful that that can be put towards the backburner. And we focus on golf here. At least that's my hope.

HM: Rick, thank you for taking time to join us. I appreciate it.

RY: Oh, Helen, no problem at all. Happy to help.

HM: Okay. Bye-bye.

RY: Okay. Bye-bye.

CH: Rick Young is a business analyst for ScoreGolf magazine. He's in Toronto.

[ambient synth]

Pizza Visionary Obit

Guest: Matthew Katakis

CH: They called him the "Don of Dough". Andrew Bellucci, a legend in the world of New York pizza died this week at the age of 59. He was making one of his famous clam pizzas in the kitchen of the pizzeria that bore his name in Astoria, Queens when he had a heart attack. He began working to revive and refine traditional New York pizza in the 1990s. But just as he began to get attention, he ended up behind bars, convicted of embezzling money from a law firm he'd worked for in the past. It took decades for him to make it back to the top of the New York pizza world. But in recent years, that's where he found himself. With The New York Times, calling his pizza's 'life-changing'. Matthew Katakis was his business partner at Andrew Bellucci's Pizzeria. We reached him in Astoria, Queens.

HM: Matthew, first of all, my condolences on the loss of your friend and partner.

MATTHEW KATAKIS: Thank you very much.

HM: Before we get to the man, I need to ask you about what he was so passionate about? What was so great about the pizza that Andrew Bellucci made?

MK: Bellucci was, he basically was inspired and possessed and obsessed with the dough, and how to make great pizza using the highest end ingredients for the sauce, the best cheese available, and then, through his own trial and error, figuring out the best dough he could make. It just ate so well that you couldn't just have one slice. And he believed that every pie should be a little bit charred, should have the little bit of char for flavour. And it was just a magic slice that, you know, I couldn't stop eating. And I literally called him the Don of Dough.

HM: Do you know if he had, like, some secret that made that dough so special?

MK: That's the first question I asked him. I thought it was all about New York City water or, you know, how much water-to-flour ratio. But he explained that it was basically the ambient temperature, or the atmosphere of the room, that impacted the yeast and how it worked its magic. And basically, you know, he believed that dough should be fermented. And a lot of pizzerias cut corners and won't invest the time. So, he said it's all about time and consistency and discipline, and that will give you the perfect crust.

HM: He was especially famous, as I understand it, for his clam pizza, which the New York Times described as life-changing. Describe that one for me. What was that like? What is that like?

MK: Well, not only was he famous for the clam pizza, he actually passed away making one. And his secret to that was he made, you know, fresh chimichurri. He layered it on. And then, he would par-cook the pizza. And then, when it had about 10 per cent more, he would, time needed, he would pull it out and put the fresh-shucked clams and throw it back in the oven for another, you know, 90 seconds, just to get a little char. So, the clams were just heated enough, not overly cooked, and it was exquisite. And anybody that tasted it was a convert. And I literally told him, you know, I guess, you know, I built the church of Bellucci, and I'm your first disciple here.

HM: [chuckling] I understand he had this dream to get a michelin star for his pizza, on the one hand. And on the other hand, he wanted to make sure you always had a $3 slice on the menu. Why was that so important to him?

MK: He wanted to be accessible. He wanted everybody to, to have, you know, a taste of his pizza. So, accessibility. And he always wanted to compare the price of a slice to a ride on the subway. And he originally called the classic New York City slice. He called it the "Subway Slice". And he always wanted it to be the same price as a token on the subway in New York City.

HM: I understand there was a wake for Andrew yesterday that some chefs travelled from all across the country to attend -- many of them pizza chefs. Why did he mean so much to that chef community? What kind of guy was he?

MK: Well, he was accessible. And that was what was interesting, right? So, he would reach out to some of these guys for questions, but they would call back and ask for questions. And he was constantly talking and networking with these pizza guys. And he just came into the scene, back into the scene, you know, about three years ago, when he opened his first shop in Astoria. And then, you know, nine blocks away with me, he opened his second shop. And he was the only guy in New York with two pizzerias on the same avenue with the same name. And it caused a bit of confusion. But he was just so accessible that everybody loved him. So people flew in from the East Coast all the way to the West Coast -- famous guys. It was a who's who of the pizza world yesterday. It was an honour to be in that room. I'm getting goosebumps just, you know, revisiting that moment.

HM: Yeah. Sounds like it was nice to give him such a lovely send-off. What is your hope for Bellucci's Pizzeria in Astoria, Queens now that, that he is gone?

MK: Well, we had plans to, you know, open up other spots and actually build him that temperature-controlled room that he always dreamt about, that would give him the constant, you know, the same dough over and over again without fluctuation. My, my, my dream is to honour his memory. And I am telling anybody that's tasted his pizza before, if you come in and you feel that we're not honouring his name or the quality that he used to push out daily, then, you know, we won't continue. So far, so good. We're just going to keep marching on. And with our heads held up high, honouring his memory, and remembering all the good times and all the lessons he taught myself and my team and my staff. We loved him. And he had this humbleness and kindness inside of his heart that, when it really showed, it was wonderful to watch.

HM: Matthew, thank you for sharing those memories with us.

MK: My pleasure. Thank you for having me on your program. Thank you very much for honouring Andrew.

HM: Okay. All right. Goodbye.

CH: We reached Matthew Katakis in Queens, New York. He was the business partner of Andrew Bellucci, a legendary New York pizza chef who died this week at the age of 59.

[indie rock]

Prince Harry Actors

CH: This week, Prince Harry has been in London testifying against the Mirror Group newspapers, which he has accused of phone hacking and other devious methods of stealing personal information. Here now is some of the prince's blistering testimony from yesterday. What? There's no recorded testimony because cameras aren't allowed in the courtroom?! [scoff] What's the plan here, then? You want me to do what? Are you, are you sure? That is, [sigh] I mean, okay, if that's the only option, then okay. [a very regal instrumental] [CH speaks in a British accent] I believe that, again, as a child, every single one of these articles played an important role, a destructive role, [clears throat] in my growing up. To give any confirmation that I can specifically, no, no, no, stop, stop. I'm sorry. I can't. I can't. I can't do this. Stop, stop the royal music. [the royal music stops] That was a terrible idea. And we should have known it wouldn't work because it is not working on Sky News or on GB News. Because of the whole no cameras thing, both of those British networks decided to hire actors to play Prince Harry. Each has red hair and each has a beard, and each has a different take on the character. For example, here is Sky News's Prince Harry.

SOUNDCLIP

SKY NEWS PRINCE HARRY: I believe that, again, as a child, every single one of these articles played an important role, a destructive role, in my growing up. To give any confirmation that I can specifically remember reading the articles at the time, I believe, would be speculation.

CH: On a show called Harry in Court, Sky News has that actor perform transcripts of the prince's testimony. And, you know, as weird and low-rent as the whole production is, at least he brings a certain dignity to the role, which not to get old drama critic on you, is more than can be said for the guy portraying Prince Harry on the UK's right-wing GB News.

SOUNDCLIP

HOST: Are you suggesting that journalists who wrote articles have blood on their hands?

GB PRINCE HARRY: Journalists and editors who caused pain and upset.

HOST: But specifically, these articles?

GB PRINCE HARRY: It's a broader statement.

HOST: But you're here to put a stop to this madness?

SKY NEWS PRINCE HARRY: Yes. It's not a specific article, but all of the articles, each individual article. As a child, every single one of these articles played a destructive role in my growing up. But to say I've read every single one of these articles would be speculation.

CH: Better than my Prince Harry, but not by much. It is hard to believe that the bigwigs at two different news networks felt this was an effective way to handle the prince's two days in court. Because having two imitators on just gives viewers two false impressions.

[elevator instrumental]

Part 2: Republican Race: Strategist, Mussel Microplastics

Republican Race: Strategist

Guest: David Kochel

CH: So far, when it comes to the Republican presidential race, Donald Trump has not faced much serious competition. But soon enough, he may at least be facing some serious questions. Today, Mr. Trump's former Vice President, Mike Pence, formally joined the presidential race, launching his campaign in Iowa.

SOUNDCLIP

MIKE PENCE: January 6th was a tragic day in the life of our nation. On that fateful day, President Trump's words were reckless. They endangered my family and everyone at the Capitol. But the American people deserve to know that on that day, President Trump also demanded that I choose between him and the constitution. Now, voters will be faced with the same choice. I chose the constitution. [clapping and cheering] And I always will.

CH: Former U.S. Vice President -- and current Republican presidential candidate -- Mike Pence, speaking in Iowa after launching his campaign earlier today. David Kochel is the former executive director of the Republican Party of Iowa and a strategist who's worked on the presidential campaigns of Jeb Bush and Mitt Romney. We reached him in Avon, Colorado.

HM: David, what do you make of the way Mike Pence appeared to go after Trump when speaking to those Iowa voters today?

DAVID KOCHEL: Well, first of all, it's interesting that we kind of heard him name the former president and really be more direct than we've heard. It's been sort of nuanced in the past. But I think this was as direct as you can get. And I frankly think it's a choice that he, he really had to make because it's the, it's the elephant in the room. It's the big issue kind of hanging over the whole candidacy of Mike Pence. And it might be the thing that would make or break his presidential ambitions.

HM: At the same time, there's some risk presumably with the traditional Trump supporters here. Does this criticism potentially hurt him as well?

DK: Yeah. Well, it may. But I don't think he has a choice. Look, he spent three years, 11 months and 16 days supporting the president, being a good, loyal soldier just to run headlong into January 6th. And that entire four years, almost four years, of work will come to nothing if he isn't able to address this, address it in a way that brings people to his cause and that brings people to his understanding of what happened that day. And it's kind of a shame, given his, his record of service, his conservative bona fides and, you know, his standing as an evangelical that would be doing really well in the Iowa caucuses. But, you know, to have come in to January 6th, made the decision that he made, he, I think, he alienated a lot of those people who do believe that the election was stolen or rigged. I mean, I don't believe that. But I think there are a lot of Republican voters who would have preferred Pence fight harder for the Trump re-election.

HM: You know, in the past, one would expect a former vice president to have a pretty good lead coming into this kind of period, pre-election period. And yet, Mike Pence is polling at about, what, four per cent nationally?

DK: Um-hmm.

HM: How big a challenge is this going to be for him to rise up among the others in this pack? And particularly, of course, Donald Trump?

DK: Well, it's going to be a huge challenge. He's alienated a lot of voters who are, you know, ride-or-die Trump voters. But he also, I don't think he ever really had some of the Trump skeptics because he looked like he was doing too much to kind of cover up for the former president and help him when he was being outrageous. So, he almost appears to be a man without a country. If you were to look at this in kind of the pre-Trump era, Mike Pence would be, would be built in a lab to succeed in the Iowa caucuses. You know, which the last three caucuses have been won by an evangelical Christian candidate. But he just seems to be a candidate really without a path at this moment. Although, I found the speech to be very effective. And I think he needed to give it. I just think he's going to really struggle.

HM: Mike Pence isn't, of course, the only candidate to join the race this week. The former Governor of New Jersey, Chris Christie, has also filed his papers. He called Trump a lonely, self-consumed, self-serving mirror hog. That's pretty direct in the attack. [both chuckle] How will that shape the campaign to have someone like Chris Christie direct such a pointed attack at Donald Trump?

DK: Well, look, I think, you know, Christie is going to play a very interesting role in the campaign. I'm not sure it's a voter strategy. I think it's a media strategy. You know, if you remember back to 2016, when he basically destroyed Marco Rubio on the debate stage in New Hampshire. It didn't inure to Christie's benefit whatsoever, but it did certainly have an impact on Rubio. I kind of see the same thing playing out here. He wants to get on the debate stage with Trump. He wants to throw these haymakers at him. But, you know, we see how that worked for people like Liz Cheney and Adam Kinzinger, who are really no longer in the party and both of whom are out of Congress now. So, I'm not sure that there's a way to actually win votes with that strategy. But I think Christie will irritate the former president. I think it'll cause some fireworks on a debate stage if he's able to even qualify for the debates. But I'm not sure it's going to bring voters Christie's way.

HM: How does someone like Chris Christie, who supported Donald Trump for so long, I mean, even helping him with debate preparation in the 2020 race, how does he now really authentically distance himself from Donald Trump?

DK: Well, we're going to see how he does it. You bring up an interesting point. I mean, he spent all those years defending him. He was the first person, really, of national prominence to endorse President Trump. And, look, I think it's a kind of an awkward truth that I'm sure he knew better all along that what kind of leader Trump would be, what kind of character he had to bring to the job. But when you're invested in, in something like a presidential campaign, and you're maybe hoping for something to come out of it, maybe a job like attorney general or something else, you know, you're willing to put up with a lot. And, in this case, I think he's finally decided, you know, the party needs to move on, the country needs to move on. And he's offering himself to be a person who can help accomplish that.

HM: As we hear this criticism directed at Donald Trump, does that become something that he can further weaponize to try and rally his base?

DK: Well, of course, the conservative media ecosystem has built up antibodies around President Trump. And voters in the Republican Party, many of them, really view Trump as the most attacked and vilified person in history. And they've learned from the conservative media how to, how to respond to these criticisms. Pick any topic you want to pick about how Trump's been attacked by not only the Democratic Party, but the media. And they've got a ready answer for it. So, you know, even the Alvin Bragg indictment really caused Trump's numbers to rally because, once again, they see him being attacked by his enemies, and they put on the the helmet and the jersey and they push back and fight hard.

HM: Well, it's a long road ahead. We will be keeping a close eye on how things evolve, of course. Thank you so much, David. I appreciate your insights.

DK: Thank you.

CH: David Kochel is a political strategist and the former executive director of the Republican Party of Iowa.

We reached him in Avon, Colorado.

[brisk piano]

Ottawa Surgeries Cancelled

CH: Yesterday, after months of waiting, Catherine Coll was finally admitted to hospital, where she was scheduled to have potentially dangerous breast implants removed. Outside, the air in Ottawa was smoky from wildfires. The air quality risk was extremely high -- as it was today. But the risk was not restricted to the outside. Poor air quality inside the hospital caused the cancellation of at least two surgeries, including Ms. Coll's. She told CBC Ottawa what happened.

SOUNDCLIP

CATHERINE COLL: Got up at 5;30. I had a friend staying overnight with me to take me to the hospital in Carleton Place for my surgery. So, we headed out at 6:15, and both of us noticed that the air quality was really bad. And he's actually from further past Renfrew, so he had driven through it to come and get me. Arrived at the hospital, and intake was wonderful, and next I know, I'm in a gurney with an I.V. already in, and just sort of waiting under the warming blanket. And then, my surgeon shows up in his civilian clothes to break the bad news to me. So, he, he was he was as upset as everybody else was. He said that due to the air quality, because of the forest fires, the hospital, the Carleton Place Hospital, had to turn off their air intake in order to stop bringing smoke in. And the air intakes are what keep the operating rooms sterile. And so, therefore, the surgeries were, was being cancelled immediately. So, I have 10-year-old implants, and they're expired, and have been recalled four years ago. [chuckling] Wish I'd known about that in time. While I was away on vacation, I really noticed an issue and contacted my surgeon, so they booked me for their first available slot. So, this is, this is not just getting my boobs done, as people say. This is, this is pretty intense, needed surgery. So, you know, I'm shattered. You know, I've planned the next, it's a six-week recovery from this type of surgery. And I have everything planned out. I had people lined up to come in and give me a hand. Obviously, I'm gutted. But, you know, I absolutely understand what happened. This is a force majeure. There's there's nothing anybody can do about this. And I feel sorry for the people who are losing their homes and not getting their emergency heart or valve surgeries and things like that today.

CH: That was Catherine Coll, speaking with CBC Ottawa reporter Joseph Tunney, about how her surgery was cancelled yesterday because of poor air quality inside the hospital.

[brisk piano]

Mussel Microplastics

Guest: Pennie Lindeque

CH: Pennie Lindeque is very excited about the fecies of mussels. I know! Who isn't? But Professor Lindeque has scientific reasons. She's an ecologist at the Plymouth Marine Laboratory. Usually, when she studies the impact of microplastics on organisms, the result is bad. But mussels appear to be the exception -- thanks to their poop. In new research, Professor Lindeque and her team found that the bivalves happily gobble up microplastics and then excrete them, making it easier to clear the contaminant from the water. We reached Pennie Lindeque in Bigbury, England.

HM: Professor Lindeque, did you ever think you'd get this excited about mussel feces?

PENNIE LINDEQUE: No, I can't say I would. It's been really exciting research, I have to say.

HM: So, did you know going into this research that mussels have this relationship with microplastics?

PL: Yes. When we started the research, other people had looked at the ability of mussels to ingest microplastics. So, we knew they had that capability. And we've been working for many years, over 15 years, looking at the ecological impacts of microplastics and other particulate pollutants. But when we realized that they could ingest these microplastics, that they passed through the mussel, they basically packaged them up and then egested them in their poo. We realized that they could maybe help us remove the microplastics from just our sort of coastal waters and our rivers, and put that rubbish out for us to then collect, so it doesn't go into the marine environment where it can cause harm.

HM: So how did you test this?

PL: So, first of all, we just did a really simple experiment, putting the muscles in a beaker of water, and realized that they, they took up the microplastics. But then, we wanted to do a little bit more robust scientific study. So, we put them in a big what we call flume tank. So, a specifically-made stainless steel tank, where water containing food and microplastics was sort of flooded over the mussels. So, very much like you'd get in the natural environment in a tidal cycle. And there, we realized that about five kilograms of mussels, so not really that much, had the capacity to remove almost a quarter of a million microplastics per hour. And I think that's when we really started getting excited to know that, potentially, they could help us with the problem of microplastics in the marine environment.

HM: What is it then about the poop that makes this a good news story?

PL: So, I think one thing that we tested was that if these microplastics are egested in the poop, we wanted to make sure that that still sunk. So mussel feces does normally sink. But because some of the plastic can be quite buoyant in itself, it might stop the mussel feces from sinking. So, we did a number of tests and found out that, actually, that wasn't the case. That fortunately, even if the muscle feces has plastic in it, it still sinks. And that's really important because what it means is we can actually collect that feces containing the microplastics and completely remove it from the system. So, yes, we found some really, you know, high numbers of what they were able to clear in terms of microplastics from the water in the lab. But we're still doing studies in the natural environment where the microplastic concentrations are likely to be much lower. So, we're looking at where can we site be so that they have the best impact? Can we put them close to point sources of microplastic so they can really stop them diluting and moving further into the marine environment?

HM: What kind of effect did the microplastics have on the health of the mussels?

PL: So, in our experiments, that had no impact at all. And we started an experiment now where we have them close to wastewater treatment works, where we know there's a lot of microplastics coming out. And we have them in a transect away from that. And in the three months we had them there, we had very little mortality. And the mussels continued to grow. Of course, this is a point of concern. And we've also done some sort of conceptual modelling to work out that while some research has shown there can be some adverse health effects, such as their ability to attach to rocks and that sort of thing if they ingest high levels of microplastics. In the natural environment, they're not exposed to that level of microplastics that we know can cause them any harm.

HM: But should people worry next time they're at a restaurant and order a plate of mussels?

PL: No, not at all. And that's because mussels are just natural filter feeders. That's what they do. They don't just take out microplastics. They can take out algae, which can be toxic. They can just take out sand and grit. So, before mussels are eaten, they're always put in clean water and they're deprivated. So that means they're taking on sort of sort clean food and clean water, and they get rid of all the grit and things that you don't want to eat. They pass that through and then the muscles are clean. But we would say that the muscles that we use for our experiments are kept in cages, and these are separate to muscles that would be harvested for eating. But as much as the microplastics, that's because we're putting them in some pretty nasty places near these sort of exits of wastewater treatment works. But, no, I certainly wouldn't suggest anyone needs to stop eating mussels at all.

HM: The volume of microplastics in the water being what it is, you have to think we're talking about a lot of mussels that it would take to actually clean up water systems. Is, is this a realistic approach, do you think?

PL: It's not a realistic approach to the problem. No, it isn't. We can't rely on mussels. We have to rely on ourselves as humans to stop that pollution in the first place. But even if we were to stop all plastic pollution going into the environment tomorrow, unfortunately, there would still be some microplastics because of the degradation of larger plastic items. So, this is just a small part of the many solutions that we need to help clear it up.

HM: What about the poop itself? I mean, what do you do with it once you scoop it up after it's got all this microplastic in it?

PL: Yeah. So, at the moment, we're still analyzing all that poop, which is a really lovely job. [both chuckle] But in the future, in the future, my hope would be that we can use it. It's a source of carbon with regards to the feces from the mussels. It's a source of carbon with regards to the plastics. So, ideally, it would be lovely to work with some engineers and seeing if that could actually be a source of a biofuel.

HM: Oh, it's fascinating. It could come full-circle.

PL: That would be great, wouldn't it?

HM: It certainly would. Professor Lindeque, thank you very much for telling us about your work.

PL: Thank you very much for having me.

HM: Okay. Bye.

PL: Bye.

CH: Pennie Lindeque is an ecologist at the Plymouth Marine Laboratory. She's in Bigbury, England.

[chillhop]

TO Semi-Formal Students

CH: In pop culture, few events loom larger for teenagers than the prom or the big semi-formal, which is always epic, life-changing, and/or triumphant. In real-life, of course, there are fewer impromptu, choreographed dance routines and sweetly-resolved love triangles. And significantly fewer occasions when you use your telekinetic powers to get revenge on your senior class. And in recent years, the gap between fact and fiction grew even larger after COVID restrictions moved those pivotal gatherings online. But as those restrictions have been lifted, more and more students are finally having the opportunity once again for some in-person partying. The CBC's Mary Wiens spoke to students at Bill Hogarth Secondary School in Markham, Ontario about one of the year's biggest highlights.

SOUNDCLIP

ZOYA: I am Zoya, and something I really loved about semi-formal was how it was our first real event back from COVID.

JACOB: Hi, my name is Jacob, and a moment I really appreciated during the semi-formal was being with all my friends and being dressed up in a formal occasion.

NICHOLAS FAIR: Hi, I'm Nicholas Fair, and I think it means a little more for, like, the SAC team that helped organize. And I'm a part of that.

MARY WIENS: Tell us what that means.

NF: Student council. We all organized that whole night. And just to see, like, the first song come on and just kind of everyone up off their chairs and kind of rush towards the dance floor, it was just kind of just, like, go, like, oh yeah, it's happening now. And it was just, it was tons of fun. I wore a typical suit, you know, with the pants, blazer on top of it. And I had, like, I was going to wear a tie. I don't know how to tie one, so I just left it at home.

MW: [laughing] What about you?

ZOYA: I wore, like, this black jumper. And I remember my heels were so high, at the end of the night, like, I went barefoot because I couldn't walk anymore.

MW: Okay, tell me about dancing.

ZOYA: Oh, it was like a lot of, like, party songs I remember, like, throwback Justin Bieber played and everybody was screaming.

MW: Does Justin Bieber represent, like, a whole older generation?

ZOYA: Oh, no. I just thought it was, like, cool, because they were playing, like, "Baby". And everybody knew all the words. So, it was like the whole crowd was screaming along.

JACOB: I remember all my friends, who were like pretty shy at the moment, just, like, started singing, you know, all together, jumping around, jumping into, like, every other person. It was pretty fun.

MW: What was it about coming out of all these years of COVID that really made it special?

JACOB: Well, being cooped up in my house for, like, one to two years was really, like, due to COVID, it was really hard, right? Not being able to see my friends for a long time definitely changed how, like, I saw things and changed who I was as a person. But as COVID came to an end, we started opening up, like, I had our first proper school year. I got to connect a lot more with my friends. And having a first big party with all my friends and the Grade itself was life-changing, really. I use the word life-changing because I never really went to a party, like, that extreme. Forever, I would go with my friends and be at McDonalds whie in quarantine, right? So, to actually go to, like, an actual banquet hall with a group of, like, 20, on top of the 500 people that were there, is really, it was different. It was new. Yeah, I mean I have a lot of friends. Most of them, they don't try too hard when they come to school for their clothes. Like, lots of pyjamas, just really baggy clothes and stuff. So, it was nice to see all my friends kind of, you know, a little more fancy and just be like, oh, like they look good today. You know what I mean? It was nice to see.

NF: Not even just my friends, but like, just other students I don't even know. Because at school, they'll, some people probably just throw on, like, whatever. It's like, okay, this is fine. But at semi, like, everyone's dressed up, they actually try. It's like, oh wow! This is, people actually can dress up really well.

MW: Cleaned up nice.

NF: Cleaned up very nice.

MW: Students from Bill Hogarth Secondary School in Markham, Ontario speaking to CBC Toronto's Mary Wiens.

[indie rock]

Part 3: James Beard Humanitarian Award, Deep Water Shark Sighting, Lawn Bowling Changes

James Beard Humanitarian Award

Guest: Olivia Watkins

CH: If you know a little about the James Beard Foundation Awards, you probably think they exclusively reward people on the fancy cooking end of things. The type of people who run tiny bistros you will never get a reservation not, and cannot afford. You might not think it rewards anyone involved in an earlier phase, the farming phase. But this year, the founders of the Black Farmer Fund were given a James Beard Award in the category of "Humanitarian of the Year". They're the first Black winners of that particular award. Olivia Watkins is one of those two winners. We reached her in Stamford, Connecticut.

MW: Olivia, what does it mean for you to be recognized in this way?

OLIVIA WATKINS: It means so much, you know? We have worked hard to make the food system in the northeast region of the United States a just and equitable one. And so, for the work to be recognized on a national stage, especially with an organization that is focused on creating good food for good, it means so much.

HM: The Beard Awards are a big deal in the food community. How will this help you get your message out?

OW: I think, if anything, it will illuminate some of the challenges that are in the food system. It will inspire others to commit to, you know, practicing sustainable practices in their businesses. It will allow others to have an opportunity like Black Farmer Fund to be able to invest and donate if they care about the causes that we are working on. And it will really just continue to push forward the work that we're doing to create an equitable food system.

HM: You have worked to help get Black-owned-and-operated farms off the ground. Is there one in particular that comes to mind when you think about being recognized for your work?

OW: Yes, actually the video that they created featured one of our farmers, Trinity Farm, with farmer David and farmer Veronica Howden. And they are an 80-acre apple and plum orchard. And they were the one of the first organic farmers in their county. And they've been farming for over 30 years. And so, for them, you know, we were able to support them with accessing capital in the height of COVID. Essentially, all of their markets got wiped out overnight. And so, we were able to come in with that access to capital.

HM: What has that meant for them?

OW: You know, I think for them, they're super grateful for our support to be able to have financing that is not predatory. They were being quoted 12 per cent interest rates from other institutions. And so, for them to be able to have a financial institution that is more relationally-focused has meant a lot.

HM: Can I ask how you approach financing organizations like this? I mean, you're not charging 12 per cent interest. How do you do this?

OW: Yeah. So, for us, we raise a combination of grant dollars and notes. And we pool that and offer really competitive rates. So, the highest rate that we offer is, for instance, four per cent. And we really start by getting to know the farmers first. And once we get to know the farmers, we really look to build services and community support around them. So, a lot of the farmers and food businesses will get a combination of a grant and a loan that they could use for whatever they need in their business. So people will use it to buy tractors, to buy land, to pay down personal debt, to start new projects. So, we're really excited to be able to support in that way.

HM: What is the reality for Black farmers in the United States today?

OW: Yeah. The reality is that there are not a lot of financial institutions that they could trust. And so, that was one of the things that we set out to do. You know, for instance, in New York State alone, Black farmers are making -$906 while other farmers are making $42,000. And so, the racial wealth gap is massive across industries, but especially in the agriculture industry.

HM: Over the past few years, as you know, the James Beard Foundation has received quite a bit of criticism for its lack of diversity when it comes to nominees. Do you feel like there might be a shift happening in their approach?

OW: I think there's definitely a shift. I mean, this year at the awards, there was so much diversity across the "Best Chef" categories, across the leadership awards, with Karen and myself being, you know, the first African-Americans for the Humanitarian of the Year award. So, I think they have a lot of people who are in positions of power, who are aware of that and are looking to make those shifts to make sure that people who are underrepresented in the restaurant and agriculture industry are given the stage as well.

HM: You mentioned the family that you helped through the pandemic. I'm wondering about other Black farmers that stand out for you, people who are going to benefit from the recognition of your work

OW: Yeah. So, we have also invested in a couple of livestock farm operations. And so, one of them grows, raises halal meat, livestock for West African migrant communities. Another one of them raises livestock for their community in Ithaca, New York. And so, being able to have access to, you know, organic, free-range, culturally-appropriate livestock for communities of colour is really, really important. And so, we've been able to support those organizations with capital to dig well pumps, to have electricity, to build out of farmstand. So, we're really excited about that as well.

HM: I understand that you are not currently a farmer, but you do have an inherent understanding of the challenges because you started out as one. Tell us a bit about your family's farm, what grows there, and how it, how it's operated?

OW: Yeah, so we steward land in North Carolina. And we currently have a timber farm. Before I transitioned to my role at Black Farmer Fund, I was growing shiitake mushrooms, and I had a small apiary. And that was kind of where I firsthand was experiencing some of the difficulties around accessing capital from financial institutions. And so, you know, my understanding and my background in that, and my family's legacy in that, has really informed the work that I do today.

HM: I have to ask you, did you celebrate your Beard award with a particular meal?

OW: [CHUCKLE] Well, at the reception, we were blessed by the last year's, last year awardees. Each had a stand where they had different small dishes. So, I probably tasted about 20 different types of small plates, and just went around the room, you know, experiencing the amazingness. So that was my celebration.

HM: That sounds like quite the treat.

OW: Yes.

HM: Olivia, congratulations to you and your fellow winner. I really appreciate you speaking with us.

OW: Yeah, thanks for having me.

HM: Okay. Bye.

OW: Bye.

CH: Olivia Watkins is the president of the Black Farmer Fund and the co-winner, along with Karen Washington, of the James Beard Foundation Humanitarian Award for 2023. We reached Ms. watkins in Stamford, Connecticut.

[folk]

Deep Water Shark Sighting

Guest: Matteo Endrizzi

CH: It's a well-known fact that in the 1975 movie "Jaws", you don't actually see much of the shark. That is mostly because Bruce, the animatronic shark, was a diva who malfunctioned constantly. But it had the happy consequence of making the film more suspenseful and exciting. Things played out differently for a group of divers in Vancouver Island's Alberni Inlet. Because when they recently had a rare encounter with a bluntnose sixgill shark. It apparently took a few sightings before the excitement really sank in. Matteo Endrizzi is one of the divers. We reached him in Nanaimo, B.C.

HM: Matteo, tell us about the moment that your diving group first spotted the shark.

MATTEO ENDRIZZI: Connor was the first one to spot the shark at about 60 feet. He signalled to us with his light that he had seen something. So, Garrett swam over to see what he had seen. And there was nothing there. But Connor was signalling there was a shark. And so, we were like, okay, like, but there's nothing there, so let's just carry on with our dive.

HM: Did you guys believe Connor, or do you think he'd just, like, seen something else?

ME: We didn't really believe him at first [chuckle] because, you know, you don't, we can't talk to each other underwater. We can't, we, there's no expression. Like, we can't really pick up on any of those cues. So, we didn't know if he was joking or anything like that, so.

HM: I didn't even know that there would be a signal for a shark in the Alberni Inlet.

ME: [chuckle] Well, it's a generic signal for a shark. It's just your open hand to your forehead, straight up and down. It looks like a shark fin.

HM: Wow. So, your friend Garret swims over. There's nothing there. What happens next?

ME: We carried on with our dive arround the wreck. We went down to about 100 feet, and we were started working our way back up to shallower water. And it was around 80 feet that Danton actually signalled to all of us with his light that there was a shark. So, we turned around, and that's when we all saw it. So, I know in my my video you can just kind of see it coming out of the dark. And that's the perspective that I'm going to forever remember in my head.

HM: Is there a signal for I told you so? Did Connor do that?

ME: [laughing] No, but he, he told us on the surface when we got out of the water. [laughing some more]

HM: Tell me what this moment was like for you when you actually saw it? What went through you?

ME: We were just in awe of what we were seeing. I know myself and Garrett were ecstatic. And we just thought, we need to get this on film or on, in pictures and any format we can to prove that we actually saw what we saw because no one's going to believe us. Yeah, there was a lot of celebration. [chuckling] There still is.

HM: So, tell me what this shark looked like.

ME: It was about six feet long, and it's obviously got six gills. A unique feature about this shark is that it doesn't really have a dorsal fin. It's got, like, a secondary dorsal fin closer to the tail. So, it's very different from most other sharks that, you know, you see in tropical waters. The other thing that's very unique about the shark is its tail. It looks kind of like a thresher shark. It's got a very long angular tail.

HM: So, did you know right away that it was a bluntnose sixgill?

ME: Yes. Yeah, I think we all did. [chuckling]

HM: Now, that's unusual, right? Because I'm assuming it, you thought it was out of place. These things usually live, as I understand it, at depths greater than 90 metres, up to 2,500 metres deep. What do you think it was doing where you were?

ME: There's a lot of theories. Some say they come up through the shallows to feed. They normally eat squid or octopus or, like, crustaceans like crabs. But, yeah, we've reached out to DFO to ask around. And, I mean, we saw this at 4 in the afternoon. So, it wasn't Nighttime. And, obviously, we have longer days right now, so there was lots of daylight.

HM: You mentioned how excited you were. I know we have some tape of that, from that video that you shot. Let's just listen to that for a second.

SOUNDCLIP

[the sounds of shaky video footage. Cheering and whooping]

HM: What's going on there?

ME: A lot of cheering, a lot of fist bumping. Garrett and I were, at that moment, right next to each other, just kind of dancing underwater. Yeah, the excitement was through the roof at that point.

HM: I know that shark encounters aren't necessarily dangerous, but were you concerned at all at any point?

ME: No, the sixgill, bluntnose sixgill shark, is very, it's known as a docile shark. It's not a violent shark. I've read somewhere that there hasn't been an attack by one of these sharks ever. There was one, I think, in the 1500s.

HM: Wow!

ME: That's a long time ago. So, and whether it's true or not, I don't know. [chuckling]

HM: Have you decided to go back and look for it again?

ME: Amongst the four of us, we're talking a lot about going back, yeah.

HM: Right. So now you've had some time to reflect, just how special were those moments? Do you think you'll ever have that kind of thrill again when you're diving?

ME: Well, I hope so. [laughing] It kind of keeps me driving. That's the drive, right? Just to come across unique things in our ocean. I, my personal outlook on diving is you never know what you're going to see when you get in the water, but you have to get in the water to see it.

HM: Other than this shark, what else have you seen in the Alberni Inlet?

ME: Lots of schools of rockfish. We've seen chimaera or ratfish, which is also a deep water fish. Yeah, it's a very unique thing. And there's not many places to dive on the west coast of the island other than the Alberni Inlet and maybe North Island. So, to see things that we wouldn't see in the straight between here in the mainland is very unique. So, that's the drive for us to go out.

HM: Yeah, I can understand how exciting this was, especially since it was so unexpected. Thank you so much for telling us the story.

ME: Thank you very much.

HM: Okay, Take care. Bye

ME: Bye.

CH: Matteo Endrizzi is a divemaster and underwater photographer, who recently encountered a bluntnose sixgill shark. We reached him in Nanaimo, B.C.

[instrumental]

Kamloops Creator Awarded

CH: In honour of National Indigenous History Month, TikTok Canada has released its first-ever Indigenous Visionary Voices list. And among the creators who've been recognized is Ashley Michel, a Secwepemc entrepreneur and seamstress. She's known for videos that educate the public on Indigenous issues and that share her story as a small business owner. This week, she told the CBC's Stephen Quinn that it feels surreal to be honoured alongside other Indigenous TikTokers.

SOUNDCLIP

ASHLEY MICHAEL: Yeah, I started posting about my business actually during COVID. So, yeah, I was just able to share my story. Actually, one of my first viral videos that went, that got a lot of traction was about my first Indigenous sticker collection. It gained a lot of traction. And, actually, from that TikTok video, I was able to sell out of my first collection of Indigenous stickers and invest that back into my business, and just keep creating more and more for my business. So, yeah, TikTok's been a really great asset for my business.

STEPHEN QUINN: That's amazing. [AM chuckles] And tell me more about Four Generations Creations, then.

AM: Yeah, so my business -- Four Generations Creations -- I started out with just sewing. Like you mentioned, I'm a self-taught seamstress. And then, I started sewing. Actually, COVID happened, so I wasn't able to attend powwows or gatherings, things like that. So, during COVID is actually when I started creating my own designs. I bought a tablet. I put those designs on apparel, totes, stickers, like I mentioned. And I just kind of continued from there and built, built up from my business from there. I create items for Indigenous people, but also non-Indigenous people as well.

SQ: And where did you learn to sew or how did you learn to sew?

AM: How did I learn to sew? Yeah, I am totally self-taught. I had my daughter in 2013, and I wanted to bring us to powwows and gatherings. And, to me, that meant, you know, wearing the traditional attire. So, as a mom, I couldn't afford to purchase regalia or ribbon script from another artist. So I decided to teach myself. And everything's been self-taught since 2014. And yeah, I just kind of worked on my technique every time I began to sew, and then it just got up from there. So.

SQ: You know, it's so good to hear something so positive, you know, come from, come from Kamloops, and from Tk'emlúps te Secwépemc, because, of course, we all know what has happened over the past few years.

AM: Yeah.

SQ: And Secwépemc seems to be almost synonymous with, you know, an unbelievable tragedy. And here you are bringing a whole new meaning to the name through your work.

AM: Yeah, it's it's really amazing. I, I really, I guess, I just have a lot of my grandmothers are residential school survivors. So, I really just want to, I guess, have the authentic representation for my daughter. Because as a, as a, as a child growing up, I didn't have that, right? So, you know, trying to change the, I guess, change the, change the way that I was raised and my grandmothers were raised versus how my daughter's being raised, and future generations to come.

CH: That was Ashley Michelle, the Tk'emlúps te Secwépemc creator featured on TikTok's first-ever Indigenous Visionary Voices list, speaking with Stephen Quinn, host of The Early Edition in Vancouver.

['90s toy store music]

Lawn Bowling Changes

Guest: Anna Mees

CH: The numbers aren't looking good for lawn bowling, even if the lawns still look amazing. Fewer and fewer new players are taking to the sport, which has a reputation for being a bit old-timey and maybe a bit old timer-y, too. It has been around for centuries, but some aficionados worry that without drastic measures, it might not be around for much longer. So, in the hopes of attracting new blood, clubs around the world are making some changes. Anna Mees is the CEO of Bowls Canada. We reached her in Ottawa.

HM: Anna, does lawn bowling have an image problem?

ANNA MEES: Lawn Bowling has a bad rap in Canada. So, I would say it has an image problem at the moment.

HM: What are the assumptions you encounter when you mention lawn bowling?

AM: I think most people get this vision of very elderly, not active people, all dressed in white. And, honestly, nothing could be further from the truth.

HM: I start thinking of people like playing in Downton Abbey kind of clothes and that sort of thing. Is that part of the image? [chuckling]

AM: That is part of the image. And that, you know, to be fair, that was the image back when Downton Abbey was actually happening. [chuckling].

HM: Yeah. So, it's a tough question. But are some of those assumptions actually accurate?

AM: I would say that lawn bowling is a sport that's accessible for all ages. And so, do we have elderly people who participate? One hundred per cent. But where the image is not correct is that those individuals are active, they're fun, they're, they're enjoying colours. And so, we're not seeing that static image of people all dressed in white anymore.

HM: Tell me about the Bowls Bash. This is an innovation from your British counterpart. Explain it for us.

AM: So, Bowls Bash is actually an innovation that is being spread across the world. We have our own version in Canada. And the idea is, really, a shortened game that is fun, where we're looking at instead of that typical competitive element that might last as long as 3 hours, when we're looking at in Canada called Tribals, the average game would be anywhere between 45 minutes to 60 minutes. And it's a quick game. It's very fun, lots of turnover. And we hear a lot of music in the background. And it's a really social event.

HM: It sounds like the way they've kind of sped up baseball with a little change in the rules.

AM: Yeah, a little change in the rules, a little change in the format. And, you know, what's kind of fun about it is that we were already playing this game. We just weren't letting everybody know about it. And so, Bowls Bash -- and In Canada, Tribals -- is a great opportunity to spread the word about how much fun this game actually is.

HM: Are you also trying to create a bit more of a party vibe, I understand?

AM: Well, I think it's really about sharing the party vibe. Because the party vibe actually already exists at almost all of the clubs across Canada. So, it's, it's not, you know, you, you might be familiar with watching golf on TV. And there was a time when you watched golf that you had the golf clap. Very quiet, and everybody expressed appreciation for a good shot with a very quiet approach. And that used to be how lawn bowls was played, you know, 30 years ago. And, these days, it's really about turning up the volume, and enjoying and expressing yourself and, you know, lots of high fives and cheering. And sometimes, there's dancing, even.

HM: So, when we talk about a party vibe, we're not talking about people drinking cocktails on the green while they bowl.

AM: Well, that really depends on your definition of a party. So, I would, I would absolutely say that beverages and snacks tend to be part of a good social evening at a lawn bowls club. Not all clubs are licensed, but all clubs encourage, you know, coming out and enjoying a beverage, whether that is non-alcoholic or if you're licensed, an alcoholic cocktail.

HM: Are some of the sort of old-time players, are the purists out there, pushing back, perhaps, on, on the changes?

AM: I think that every sport, when it evolves, is always going to have those purists who really have grown up in the game for many decades. And that pure form of all sport is absolutely worth preserving. We really honour the traditional game of bowls. And that is your pure competitive format. But what we're really trying to recognize is that this recreational component that is welcoming to all, we've, we, this is a great opportunity for everybody to play.

HM: How did you get into lawn bowling?

AM: It was a fun challenge that I saw about 10 years ago. And it just really intrigued me as a sport that was really had so much potential that so many more people needed to know about.

HM: And what what is it about the game that particularly delights you, that's made you kind of a devoted champion of the sport?

AM: I think it's really the fact that it is so accessible for everybody. I don't know of another activity where a grandchild can play on a competitive field with their grandparent. Where husbands and wives, or spouses, can play together competitively. And everybody has fun. And, and I think that's beautiful in this game.

HM: This is the game that goes back centuries, right? So, it'd be a shame to see it die.

AM: Absolutely. And, honestly, it is so much fun. And it's, it's really a gift that has always been here. And now what we want is to have all Canadians give them the opportunity to unwrap that gift.

HM: Make a pitch to me. If I want to come out, say, this weekend, tell me why?

AM: You want to come out, because it's going to be the most fun you've ever had. It's a target game, a strategic game. You can play with all your friends and family. And you are going to, once hooked, you're never going to want to stop.

HM: Anna, thank you so much for telling us about your sport and your enthusiasm for it. I appreciate it.

AM: All right. Thank you so much, Helen.

HM: Okay. Bye.

AM: Bye-bye.

CH: Anna Mees is the CEO of Bowls Canada. She's an Ottawa.

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Austrian Pol Party Wrong Leader

CH: Nobody wants to go after the wrong guy. But regrettably, Austrian politician Andreas Babler had no choice This weekend, in Austria, Hans Peter Doskozil was declared the winner of the centre-left Social Democratic Party's leadership race. And, I mean, you know, Hans. He was just over the moon about it. As he said in his acceptance speech, It's overwhelming. He called it a lifelong dream to lead the party. Unfortunately, his dream ended abruptly two days later, when party officials shook him awake violently, by announcing that Mr. Doskozil had actually lost the leadership race to the aforementioned Andreas Babler. Now, they blamed the mistake on a technical error. But let me put it in terms that will make some of you say, oh, well, of course, by telling you someone messed up the Microsoft Excel file. Yeah, it's relatable. It is hard to excel at Excel. And the Social Democrats didn't even catch their own Excel error. It was discovered by a keen-eyed journalist who noticed something just wasn't adding up on the spreadsheet, that is, and advised party officials to take a closer look. Now, the party's new actual leader, Andreas Babler, is calling the whole process painful, which is doubly true for Hans Peter Doskozil, who's run for the leadership and whose belated loss seemed to have been a miscalculation.

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CH: You've been listening to As It Happens on the CBC Listen app. Our show can be heard Monday to Friday on CBC Radio one after the World at Six.

HM: You can read more about the stories and conversations featured on As It Happens on our website: www.cbc.ca/aih. I'm Helen Mann. Thanks for listening.

CH: And I'm Chris Howden.

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June 7, 2023 Episode Transcript

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