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The AIH Transcript for August 27, 2020

Hosts: Helen Mann and Chris Howden

HELEN MANN: Hello, I’m Helen Mann, sitting in for Carol Off.

CHRIS HOWDEN: Good evening, I’m Chris Howden. This is As It Happens.

[Music: Theme]

Prologue

CH: Tonight:

HM: Strings attached. Canada's foreign affairs minister says the millions in Canadian aid for Lebanon must go to people, not politicians. He explains from Beirut how he plans to make sure that happens.

CH: The man who killed 51 people at a New Zealand mosque and Islamic centre gets life in prison with no chance of parole. One of the survivors tells us about life since that horrific attack.

HM: Full court press. WNBA star Renee Montgomery says by refusing to play basketball, players are demanding to be heard. And since she opted out of the season after the killing of George Floyd, people are listening.

CH: Monumental change. This week, Central Park got its first-ever statue of nonfictional women. And the sculptor says it's about time.

HM: Drawing a line in the sandwich. One data geek has spent the pandemic optimizing the design of the peanut butter banana sandwich. And now he's got it down to a science.

CH: And... pipe down or cough up. The estate of Sir Arthur Conan Doyle sues Netflix over a new movie featuring his meerschaum smoking detective hero, saying it holds the copyright on a Sherlock Holmes with emotions.

CH: As It Happens, the Thursday edition. Radio thinks that sounds like a Holmes stretch.

Part one: Minister Champagne: Lebanon, NBA boycott, banana slices sandwich

Minister Champagne: Lebanon

Guest: Francois-Philippe Champagne

CH: Canada's foreign affairs minister says aid to Lebanon comes with conditions. Francois-Philippe Champagne was in Beirut today, visiting the site of the port explosion that killed nearly 200 people, injured more than 6-thousand, and left the capital city in ruins earlier this month. Minister Champagne also sat down with Lebanon's President, Michel Aoun, the only leader left after the rest of the government resigned in disgrace this month, for its failure to prevent the explosion. Canada has pledged up to 30-million in humanitarian and recovery aid, along with matching donations that Canadians have made, up to eight-million dollars. We reached Minister Francois-Philippe Champagne in Beirut.

HM: Minister Champagne, the French foreign minister, said today that Lebanon is in such a deep crisis, the entire country is at risk of collapse. On the ground there today, do you share that view?

FRANCOIS-PHILIPPE CHAMPAGNE: Well, definitely, this country is at a crossroads. And, you know, when I went to the site, I mean, I've never seen anything like that. I think very few people would have ever seen.. I mean, you still see the smell of destruction, you the destruction. They even gave me binoculars, because they said, Minister, there's no way you can see it all. This is the tragedy of all tragedies for Lebanon. And my message to the authorities today was that the international assistance that's going to come must be accompanied by real reforms, that impunity must cease, and that the streets have spoken, and the way forward is clear. You just have to listen to the youth, to these women who have been disproportionately impacted by this crisis, civil society, the volunteers that I've met. People are just fed up.

HM: Does that conversation with the Lebanese leadership matter at this point below? Because there's no elected government beneath them right now, having seen them resign after the outcry over the explosion?

FPC: Well, I think it was important for me to carry that message to the only remaining figure, which is the president of Lebanon, President Aoun. I was loud and clear in my message. I said, President, you've heard it from many. We will be happy to work in the plan forward to assist you with technical assistance. This is tough power. This is what Canada can do best. But these reforms need to be meaningful. They need to be overreaching. And they need to happen soon. And this is the same thing with the investigation of the crime. I said, yes, the RCMP would be willing to participate, but under conditions. We will not participate in an investigation if it's not credible, independent and impartial.

HM: How do you, though, ensure that the aid gets to those who need it most? You mentioned accountability. How do you make that happen?

FPC: Well, we make sure that no taxpayer dollar and no dollars that were given by Canadians would go anywhere but to trusted organizations that provide services directly on the ground. I met today with the director general of the Lebanese Red Cross. The volunteers, they were telling me, Minister, we don't have any intermediary. We go door-by-door. We provide assistance directly to the families who need it most. Those are the type of organization with whom we're working.

HM: I'd like to read you a tweet from a Lebanese Canadian, who says — directing this to you — that the Lebanese government controls the banks, factories and construction firms. Relief and aid will be used as backdoor dealing to keep their interest afloat. Our politicians cannot be trusted even to pick up the trash. Cannot be trusted to help people who need help. What do you say?

FPC: You know, that's why we're going to work with international organizations like the Red Cross. I mean, what's the alternative? You have people here who have lost everything. I met with the families of the victims, the two Canadians. People are crushed by what's going on. So I don't think that the infinitive is not to be helping people in times like that. Quite the opposite. I think we need to help them in a structured, responsible way. One the other hand, I am very aware that whilst we're providing assistance, this needs to come with reforms. I mean, there was a conference in France in 2018 where they were talking about reforming the electricity sector, the water sector, the infrastructure sector, all type of sectors where Canada could provide technical assistance —as long as the reforms are credible, wide-ranging, and that there's an end to corruption.

HM: We saw the government of technocrats that was trying to do that in January. As we've discussed, they've since resigned. There's such urgency. Winter is coming. We want reform before our money goes to people who need it because we want to make sure it gets to them. But in the meantime, there has to be a great sense of urgency?

FPC: Definitely. And that's why I said, listen to the streets. People are fed up. They're fed up of the institution. They're fed up of the corruption. They're fed up of the negligence that led to the loss of life. If you were to look at their press, I think the headline in the number of papers is that stop corruption, that was the message from the Canadian foreign minister. Those are probably some of the strongest words you can use when you visit a foreign country.

HM: I'd like to ask you about China. You were in Rome meeting with your Chinese counterpart, Wang Yi. And it appears you came no closer to breaking the impasse on the issue of the two detained Canadians. Michael Kovrig and Michael Spavor, or what did that meeting achieve?

FPC: Well, we had a robust discussion. We spoke for more than an hour-and-a-half. Whenever I have the opportunity to raise and ask and demand and push for the release of Michael Kovrig and Michael Spavor, I do it. I learned as I was traveling, Helen, that the foreign minister of China would be in Rome at the same time. And then, I reached out to my Italian counterpart to cause that to happen. Because I believe in diplomacy. I believe the only way to make progress is engagement, is talking to people, so that allowed me to repeat our message to say that arbitrary detention, coercive diplomacy is not acceptable.

HM: But you say you repeated the message. I mean, that diplomacy has been the course you've been pursuing for so long, many times over. Is there a point at which Canada needs to change its strategy when we see that China is not budging and these two men remain imprisoned?

FPC: What I would say, Helen, the only way to achieve anything is through diplomacy. You know, we have two Canadians which are currently detained in China. The way forward is for us not only to put that message out to the Chinese leadership, but I've also been talking to the international community, to my colleagues around the world. And I've been very clear that I've been even talking about a protocol against arbitrary detention because I say those are not two Canadians. Those are two citizen of the liberal democracy. This is not the only concern in Canada.

HM: How long are you willing to wait for diplomacy to work, sir?

FPC: The way to get that resolved is to make the case, make sure that we push for consular assistance. That's what I've been doing. I've been very firm in saying that China currently does not respect the spirit or the letter of the Vienna Convention. We need to restore consular access. And making sure also that we talk human rights. This is a core element of our foreign policy, and it's certainly going to continue under my leadership.

HM: Mr. Champagne, I know you've had a long day. Thank you very much for making time for us.

FPC: Thank you very much. Thanks for inviting me.

HM: OK, goodbye.

FPC: Thank you.

CH: Francois-Philippe Champagne is Canada's Minister of Foreign Affairs. We reached him in Beirut. For more on this, go to our website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

[Music: Bright piano]

NBA boycott

Guest: Renee Montgomery

CH: Athletes are taking a stand, by sitting games out. Last night, the Milwaukee Bucks refused to take the floor — to protest against racial injustice, and particularly the shooting of Jacob Blake in their state. Soon, other teams followed. The NBA playoffs are set to continue tomorrow, but there will be no games tonight. That goes for some baseball games, hockey games — and WNBA games. Renee Montgomery was already sitting this season out in protest. She plays for the WNBA team Atlanta Dream. We reached her in Atlanta.

HM: Ms. Montgomery, what has it been like for you to watch the world of sports over the last 24 hours?

RENEE MONTGOMERY: It's been emotional. You know, we all watched another tragedy happening. And everyone, of course, can hope that George Floyd would be the last one. And it's hopeful. But now, we see that it's probably not likely. And so that's a difficult realization because then as a parent, you wonder, how can you protect your kids?

HM: A lot of people focusing, of course, on the NBA teams’ decisions not to proceed with playoff games last night. But the WNBA also made a very strong statement, the players taking a stand. Describe what they did?

RM: You know, they actually had a candlelight ceremony. They did a lot of different things, in a sense. They didn't play as well, you know? Well, let's just say the MLB, the MLS, the NBA and the WNBA, they all decided that they're going to protest. And so I would say what the WNBA did is they stood with their brothers in the NBA, and they boycotted.

HM: You mentioned all the leagues that did not proceed with games last night. The NHL was not one of them. What do you make of that?

RM: You know, I also saw talks that the NHL were thinking about actually boycotting some games. So, you know, that's what was so impressive with what happened yesterday. This wasn't a coordinated thing. This wasn't the NBA called the WNBA and then they called the MLB and then they called MLS. That's not how it happened. It was players saw it and reacted quickly. But you can't fault another league for not acting as quickly. I've heard that they are thinking about boycotting. But, you know, I just always focus on who did boycott. And that's what you should be talking about, because it's exciting to see four different leagues all stand in solidarity and unity and boycott social injustice. I mean, that's something that will be in the history books forever.

HM: What kind of message are these strikes sending to the world?

RM: That this topic is bigger than sport. You know, a lot of people can't believe that this is the playoff in the NBA, and there's a boycott. People just can't even fathom that the players would do this. And I think that's why it's important that they did it during this time because this is bigger than sport. And now I think by opting out, at least that message is starting to be received.

HM: The Milwaukee Bucks were actually trying to get the attorney general for Wisconsin on the phone last night. Do you think the people in power at the state and federal level are looking at this and listening?

RM: Absolutely. And the fact that we know who they're trying to get on the line, those people know too, you know?[laughing] and whether or not they got through, you know, that's to be determined. But the pressure is being applied.

HM: We saw President Trump's son-in-law, Jared Kushner, today downplaying the protests. He said, and I'm quoting, the NBA players are very fortunate that they have the financial position where they're able to take a night off from work without having to have the consequences to themselves financially. What is your response to that statement?

RM: Yeah, you know, people are going to have different ways of looking at it. No, I think what everyone needs to realize is that players are affected. Players are not robots. Players are human beings that have feelings. And right now, the players are feeling a lot of feelings, so much so that they don't feel that it's important enough to suit up. So that's my only statement about that.

HM: You had already chosen to sit out this season. What made you take that decision?

RM: Just a string of tragedies, you know? And people can say that police brutality has been a part of our history for a long time. But for me, just witnessing it in my adult phase and just really seeing it for what it is, it alarmed me. And I wanted to do something about it. And it wasn't just police brutality. It was just social injustice in general. So I started to think of what I wanted to do, and I ended up, you know, deciding to go into the education space because I think that's how you really change people's mindset and you really change people's way of thinking is when you educate them. So that's where I want to live.

HM: The NBA has said that it will continue with the playoffs in the next few days. Do you think that that's the right call?

RM: Yeah, I think whatever the players decide is the right call. The players have decided that they wanted to boycott these two days and continue tomorrow. And so that's what they're going to do. The thing that I think about is a lot of people are asking basically, well, what did the two days do? Well, it brought attention. It shed a huge light on what's going on in America. You know, police brutality is breaking down the Black communities. And so for me, when I see them sit out, it makes me more proud of the initiative that I have going on. And it's called Moments Equal Momentum, where it's to build up the Black community, starting with HBCU. So I want to just say, you know, I just launched a whole initiative. It's on https://reneemontgomeryfoundation.org/ that’s to specifically try to build up a community that's been broken down.

HM: And I should say, that’s Historical Black Colleges that you're talking about.

RM: Yeah, Historically Black Colleges and Universities, because, you know, when we say the statement Black Lives Matter, you know, people had a hard time understanding that. I'm glad they do. So now when I say the statements HBCUs matter, it means the same thing. So I'm trying while America is still figuring it out, I'm trying to still build on the back end.

HM: You speak of momentum. You know, there've been protests in sports in the past, but nothing really this big. So, I mean, four years after Colin Kaepernick took a knee, do you think these protests have real potential to affect change?

RM: I do. You know, I do. The fact that you can have a Republican National Convention going on and the only thing that people are talking about is the NBA, that's a big deal. Because as we know, what the media is talking about controls the culture. So for everyone to be not talking about the political campaign going on or not be talking about sports, they're only talking about justice for Jacob Blake. That is a big deal.

HM: Do you plan to return to the game next season?

RM: Yeah. You know, I made it very clear that I'm only opting out for the 2020 season because I think right now, this is a moment in time. And, you know, it's been two months and change since I opted out. And a lot of people thought, five months isn't a long time. You, why can't you just play? Look what's happened in the two months since I opted out. This moment is now becoming a lifestyle. As LeBron James said, you know, this isn't a movement anymore. This is going to be a new lifestyle. There's a lot of eyes and ears on this moment.

HM: Well, best of luck with the work that you're doing. And thank you very much for speaking with us.

RM: Thank you.

HM: OK. Bye.

RM: Bye.

CH: Renee Montgomery plays for the WNBA team Atlanta Dream. We reached her in Atlanta, earlier today.

[Music: Ambient]

Banana slices sandwich

Guest: Ethan Rosenthal

CH: Since the lockdown began in March, Ethan Rosenthal has been stuck mostly inside, like the rest of us. And he's making the most of the limited space. Not just in his home, but also on bread. Mr. Rosenthal is a data scientist, who also happens to have a PhD in physics. And with extra time on his hands, he got to work on a complex problem that's been bothering him for years: how best to optimize the construction of his favourite sandwich. This week, he finished that important work, and published it on his blog. We reached Ethan Rosenthal in New York City.

HM: Ethan, first of all, tell me about your favourite sandwich. What is it?

ETHAN ROSENTHAL: My favorite sandwich is a peanut butter and banana sandwich.

HM: And why is that? What's so special about a P.B. and B?

ER: A P.B. and B? Well, I frankly love the flavour. It gives me fond memories of my grandfather, who introduced it to me. And also, I guess visually and mathematically, it's very pleasing to see all of the slices of bananas placed onto the bread.

HM: Okay, that's new one for me. [laughing] How do you go from liking the sandwich, appreciating the way it looks, to trying to apply science to it?

ER: So basically, you need to have a lot of free time on your hands. This is something that I kind of always wanted to do. But when COVID hit, I found myself with a lot of free time. And I also, you know, kind of wanted something to escape from everything going on in the world. And so I wanted to work on something almost meaningless, but something that would take me a lot of time. And so this seemed like the perfect project to dedicate myself to.

HM: Exactly what did you set out to discover?

ER: So, I set out to discover the optimal arrangement of slices of banana on a peanut butter and banana sandwich, such that one maximizes the banana coverage on the bread.

HM: Is there a name for that?

ER: So I did end up creating a software package and blog post about this, and I call it Nannar Nest because you are nesting slices of bananas.

HM: OK, so is this anything different than something called a packing fraction?

ER: So the packing fraction is actually how you would measure how well you have packed the slices on the bread. And that term packing fraction actually comes from the physics and material science world because similar to how you might want to pack slices on bread atoms arrange themselves in crystals in kind of an organized manner. And you can measure their packing fraction there.

HM: And how does that differ then from what you did?

ER: Maybe I would call this a new application. [both laughing]

HM: A new application. How long did this take you?

ER: So I started in maybe the end of March, beginning of April, and I just recently finished this week. So maybe a little over five months.

HM: What kind of formula did you use? What kind of physics and math were needed to be applied?

ER: So there was actually a number of areas because of the way that this algorithm works is that you take a picture of your banana and your bread, and then I produce an image telling you where to slice the banana and where to place the slices on the bread. And so there's computer vision involved in order to detect where the banana and the bread are. There's various kind of just straightforward math for fitting curves and things like that. And then there's computer science involved with the algorithm for packing the slices onto the bread.

HM: So when I take the photograph of the banana, I'm taking the banana pre-sliced, but post peeled?

ER: It's actually pre-peeled.

HM: Ah!

ER: Yes, because typically as I slice, I use the peel as the backing for the knife. And so I didn't want to have to peel the whole thing first.

HM: OK. So people are probably dying to know what were your conclusions?

ER: My conclusion is that if you spend five months on it, it is possible to do this. [HM laughs] And in the end, the arrangements of the slices were fairly different to what I had been doing by hand before.

HM: Can I just ask why you wouldn't maybe slice the banana vertically and put the slices across the bread like that?

ER: I think that's a great idea. In fact, when I first told my wife about this, that was her initial reaction. Amusingly, that had never crossed my mind that this could even be possible to do it like that. And, in fact, I think that would be the optimal way to do this. But, you know, I've been eating these sandwiches, the circular slices, for decades and, you know, couldn't really change a habit now.

HM: So if people want to use your method and optimize their own peanut butter banana sandwich, how did they do it?

ER: So it requires a little bit of computer knowhow in order to install the library that I created. But I have a GitHub page. If you search for my name, Ethan Rosenthal, on GitHub-dot-com, you will see Nanner Nest, which is the free software library. And basically, once you install it, you take a picture, a top-down picture of your band and your bread. You feed this picture into the software library, and it will spit back out a picture telling you where to slice and where to place.

HM: Now, last week, I made myself a very delicious peanut butter and cucumber sandwich. Would it work if I put the picture of the cucumber in?

ER: I think it might. It depends on how banan-y your cucumber looks. The algorithm that picks out the banana, it's looking for a banana. But it might end up thinking that the cucumber is close enough.

HM: OK. Does a peanut butter banana sandwich taste better to you when the slices are optimized on the bread?

ER: I think it does. You know, you have a more uniform bite every time. But also, you know, there's all that… It's a labour of love in order to perfectly slice and place. And so food often tastes better when you do that.

HM: What do you think your grandpa would think?

ER: I think he would be slightly proud and maybe slightly puzzled tat why I spent so much time doing this. [both chuckling]

HM: Maybe he'd be honoured by the tribute.

ER: Yes, I think so.

HM: Ethan, it's fun to talk with you. Thank you so much.

ER: Thank you.

HM: OK, bye.

ER: Bye.

CH: Depends on how banana-y your cucumber is. Ethan Rosenthal has figured out exactly how to optimize the number of banana slices on a peanut butter and banana sandwich. We reached him in New York City. And you can see diagrams of his methodology on our website: www.cbc.ca/asithappens.

[Music: Scary carnival music]

Holmes versus Netflix

CH: "'My dear Watson,' said Sherlock Holmes, 'we must deduce that this was murder — and the weapon was the victim's own banjo!'" Now, if I understand correctly, that passage, which I made up, is legally fine. Whereas this one would violate copyright: [clears throat] “'My dear Watson,' said Sherlock Holmes, 'we must deduce that this was murder — which makes me angry — and the weapon was the victim's own banjo! Which makes me sad. Also, Watson, I love you.'" See, in that second version, Sherlock Holmes has emotions. And the Estate of Sir Arthur Conan Doyle has strong feelings about those strong feelings. Now, all of Conan Doyle's Sherlock Holmes stories written before 1923 are in the public domain. Only 10 Holmes stories are still under copyright — those written after 1923. So, if you're making a film or TV adaptation, you should be fine if you avoid those stories. But no. Because the Doyle Estate claims that Holmes only "develop[ed] human connection and empathy" in the post-1923 stories. Therefore, it still holds the copyright on a Sherlock Holmes with emotions. Which is why the estate is suing Netflix, over a movie that features Mr. Holmes...changing facial expressions, I guess. My emotional response is: that's silly. But in the meantime, if I'm going to keep writing Sherlock-related fanfiction, I guess Holmes can't be where the heart is.

Part two: New Zealand mosque attack sentencing, women's rights statues

New Zealand mosque attack sentencing

Guest: Wasseim Alsati

CH: The man who killed 51 people and injured scores more at the Al Noor Mosque and Linwood Islamic Centre in New Zealand last year will never go free. Australian-born Brenton Tarrant was sentenced today — yesterday in New Zealand — to life in prison with no possibility of parole. It's the first time a New Zealand court has ever handed down such a sentence. And Judge Cameron Mander made it clear he had no qualms about issuing it.

CAMERON MANDER: It is difficult to look beyond the wicked nature of each murder and the pain and suffering you have caused to individual victims, to their families and loved ones. However, you are not only a murderer but a terrorist. Your actions go further, demonstrating contempt for the sanctity of life. In the name of a political or ideological cause, you sought to violently intimidate the community and coerce the country's peaceable form of government and social order, essentially to attack New Zealand's way of life. Your crimes were met by an unprecedented public outpouring of love and support for the people you targeted and the wider Muslim community. Your design was to divide. But the public's response was to stand with the people of their community, with their fellow New Zealanders, to demonstrate their unqualified repudiation of your hateful agenda. You failed, but the individual and personal cost of the lives lost and the grievous wounds inflicted are immense.

CH: Judge Cameron Mander, speaking in a New Zealand court. That sentence was heard by victims of the Christchurch shooting inside the court and out. And Wasseim Alsati was among them. He's a father who was shot outside the Al Noor Mosque last year, along with his then four-year-old daughter. They both survived, and Mr. Alsati spoke with Carol on the show last year about their recoveries. We reached him again today in Christchurch.

HM: Mr. Alsati, what is your reaction to this sentence?

WASSEIM ALSATI: Very relieved. Very relieved. Yes. Someone who done this kind of crime, he should get the maximum punishment. And that's what happened, the maximum punishment. And, yeah, I'm very glad that he will never see the daylight again in his life.

HM: We last spoke with you on this program over a year ago. At the time, both you and your daughter were still very much in recovery. How are you both doing now?

WA: We're still going through the recovery time, so the damage that we've got, it was really big damage. The bullet that has been used, it's an explodable bullet. So it’s done a big damage by breaking the hips and damage to the scar tissues. And then the muscles keep rebuilding again and get the more strength, especially my daughter, when she's wake up from her coma after three months with severe injuries.

HM: She suffered vision loss. I mean, she was just four years old. How are her eyes doing now?

WA: She got about 35 per cent from her sight back, which is great. We're very grateful for this. She got all his healing back. She talks normally, but the site hasn't come back completely.

HM: What about you yourself? As I understand it, you have bullet fragments still lodged in your body?

WA: Yeah, yeah, it's both of us, me and my daughter. We both have bullet fragments and lead poison in the blood because of the fragments. So that's making your body weak very quickly. And that's make you kidney trouble they normal job for cleaning the blood.

HM: You were off work for so long that you ended up losing your job and almost lost your home. Tell me about that and how difficult that was?

WA: I had help. I have got help from other sources such as Christchurch Foundation, such as a few bits and pieces have helped us a lot. But this is the second time. The home I was in before, a year ago, I have lost it, yes. I had one or the other to pay — either the family expenses or the house. So, I couldn't afford the house.

HM: You know, given everything that your family and your community have been through, what has it been like for you this past week to go through this sentencing and hear the victim impact statements? And, of course, you had your own.

WA: Yes, I had my own. Yes, we was told the victim impact statement is to tell the judge how he infected you and what's happened to you. But we haven't been told that we will read it front of him. So after Waziri and Nathan and my statement, because we all have changed our victim impact statement, we all have decided to read to say something completely else. The last victim impact statement, the one before, it was telling the judge how that infect us, how I lost my home, how I cannot go back to work. And that's going to please him because that's what he'd done, this boy. He want us to suffer. So we decided not to give him this happy moment and tell him that we are suffering. So we decided just to tell him that he didn't succeed with his ideology. And I didn't say anything about the pain at all. I even asked, I said to him that you don't know how to use a weapon from a distance. I was 30 metres away from you, and you couldn't kill me and kill my daughter. He laughed. He thought it's funny.

HM: He laughed?

WA: Yes, he laughed and he thought, it's funny. I understand that he's really, really weak, and he was squeezing his hands. He tried to make himself look like he is holding on tight and he is really arrogant, but he isn't.

HM: What kind of response have you had from the public throughout all of this?

WA: It was great response from the public because we have seen how tight we are altogether. Different colour, different religion, people have opened their mind for us and they now understand that we're not the bad people. We're not the Muslim Arab terrorist. We just like them. We just have to deal with the others that are using the religion as an agenda for them.

HM: Has this changed at all how you feel about your life in New Zealand?

WA: No, haven't. No. No, no, because we had a lot of love and care from the people. When my daughter, Alen, was in the hospital, she had received a thousand of gift. And we had to end up to buy bags and put them in a bag and ship them down from Auckland to Christchurch. And she kept everything. And that was very privilege. We've got letters for everyone, what they send, and then we write the names of everyone. And the gifts that they have is a lot of teddy bears, a lot of plants.

HM: What does Alen, your daughter, know of what happened?

WA: Now, she know everything. She remember everything. Two months ago, she had remember everything. And she just asked me, why did he done that? Why he was wearing black? And we are going through psychology treatment for Alen to make sure that she is coping very well with it.

HM: And you?

WA: I think by the strength that I have to keep my family tight, it's given me more strength. It’s given me more to hold on to something that cannot be broke.

HM: I'm so sorry that you're still suffering from all of this. That's, of course, understandable. But I very much appreciate that you're willing to talk to us about what happened.

WA: Thank you so much. God bless you all.

HM: Ok. Goodbye.

HM: All right. The best to you. Bye-bye.

WA: Bye.

CH: Wasseim Alsati is a survivor of last year's mosque shooting in Christchurch, New Zealand. The shooter has now been sentenced to life without parole. We reached Mr. Alsati in Christchurch.

[Music: Ambient]

Alberta lieutenant-governor

CH: Yesterday, Canadian history was made in Alberta. Salma Lakhani became the province's 19th lieutenant-governor — and the first Muslim in that position anywhere in the country. Ms. Lakhani was born and raised in Uganda, and has lived in Edmonton for more than 40 years, where she opened an early childhood education centre. She has long been recognized as a successful business owner and community advocate, championing health care and human rights causes. Here is Salma Lakhani speaking after her swearing-in ceremony at the Alberta legislature yesterday.

SALMA LAKHANI: We landed in Edmonton at midnight, exhausted and alone. There were few street lights and far fewer people than where we had just come from. What we promised ourselves would be no more than two years in Alberta has turned into a 43-year stay in a province we have grown to love deeply and are so grateful to call home. Every long and cold winter, we remind ourselves that we are not here for the weather, [crowd laughs], but we are here for everything else. I am incredibly proud to call myself a Canadian because Canada is the only place in the world where I am not required to be a person with only a single identity or a single story. I am the product of all of my chapters, an ex-Ugandan Canadian, Ismaili Muslim of South Asian descent, who came here with no country to call home. Mine is the story of a person whose presence before you in this capacity today is made possible, even probable, by a single fact: that it happened in Canada, a place where the realization of unlikely stories occurs not by accident, but by design. While my story may sound unique, it is also the story of Alberta, a place where individual stories are woven into our collective tapestry. A province whose narrative is defined by the generations of stories of hope.

CH: That was Alberta's new lieutenant governor, Salma Lakhani, the first Muslim to hold that position in Canada.

Women’s rights statues

Guest: Meredith Bergmann

CH: Over the course of this past few months, a lot of statues have come down. But now, in New York, three shiny, new figures have gone up. The massive monument of Susan B. Anthony, Sojourner Truth and Elizabeth Cady Stanton in Central Park was unveiled this week. And the timing isn't arbitrary: it's the 100th anniversary of the ratification of the 19th Amendment in the U.S. — which gave women the right to vote. Meredith Bergmann is the sculptor of the piece. She worked with a non-profit called Monumental Women. We reached Ms. Bergmann at her home in Ridgefield, Connecticut.

HM: Ms. Burgmann, how does it feel for you to finally see your wor, Monumental Women, unveiled in Central Park?

MEREDITH BERGMANN: Well, it's breathtaking [laughing] because I know and love the park very well. And I've been thinking of this day and seeing the sculpture there for two-and-a-half years. But to actually finally see it safely installed, unveiled with passers-by, is amazing. It's still not quite real.

HM: Describe the piece for us. If I was standing in front of it, what would I see?

MB: The monument is 14-feet high. The first five feet are a granite pedestal that says women's rights pioneers. And then the names of the three women are above that. And then there is a bronze oval pedestal on which are Sojourner Truth, seated at a small table with Elizabeth Cady Stanton and Susan B. Anthony, between them, having just arrived, and she is standing. Anthony, the tallest one in bronze, stands nine feet high.

HM: These are all women who are pivotal to getting women the vote. Central Park is full of statues. Tell me about the meaning of this particular work?

MB: Well, Central Park has 20-something statues of great men celebrating their great achievements. And before this monument, had none of women — except fantastical or fictional women like Mother Goose and Alice in Wonderland. And although for many years no one really noticed this, it draws attention to the invisibility of women, and to the fact that women's achievements were not considered worthy of statues, certainly not in the 19th century. And I tried to create the monument that should have been erected to these women with a contemporary flavour.

HM: Tell me about the three women and why they were included? I gather that Sojourner Truth was added later?

MB: The monument was supposed to consist of statues of Stanton and Anthony and somehow to include as many other women who worked for suffrage and women's rights as possible. It took Monumental Women six years to get this site in Central Park, and the Parks Department didn't want a group of statues on a humongous pedestal when every other sculpture or statue in the park is one man, one pedestal basically.

HM: I think for a lot of people, they may think about Susan B. Anthony and they might think of Elizabeth Cady Stanton as these pioneers of the women's rights movement, Sojourner Truth, being added to this. This is a woman of colour. So it adds another dimension to the statue as well.

MB: Within the walls of Central Park, she is the first African-American. There are monuments to Duke Ellington and Frederick Douglass up at the northern end of the park, but they're out on traffic islands. They're not really within this beautiful green heart of Central Park. And she was a contemporary of Stanton and Anthony. They knew each other. They corresponded. They showed each other respect. She was a houseguest at Stanton's house. And because she was illiterate, Stanton's daughter read the morning papers to her, which people did everywhere. Sojourner Truth was very well-informed, very savvy, a brilliant speaker, and overcame her illiteracy by forming a community.

HM: The statue, as I understand it, describes the three pillars of activism. What are they?

MB: To the extent that these are allegorical figures as well as portraits of real women, they represent aspects of the movement. Sojourner Truth is speaking. Susan B. Anthony is organizing. And Elizabeth Cady Stanton is about to write. She was the writer and philosopher of the movement.

HM: Tell me about the unveiling yesterday. Who was there? What was it like?

MB: There was a beautiful unveiling yesterday. It was a whole program. The unveiling was organized by Brenda Berkman, who I believe was the first female fire captain in New York City. I know she went to court over various issues involving women in the fire department. And there were a variety of speakers, including Hillary Clinton, who gave a really lovely speech about the need to take seriously these rights that the three women, and many others, won for us and to participate in our democracy and to vote.

HM: What did you hear from the people who saw the statue as it was unveiled? What what did they say about it?

MB: [laughing] Very nice things. They said it was beautiful and powerful, that it was about time, that their daughters would be inspired by it, or if their daughters were there, they said, wow. And Girl Scouts from the several troops in Manhattan who were out on Central Park West with picket signs saying, where are the women? They worked with Monumental Women. And they donated money from their cookie sales. I think over 10-thousand dollars to the statue fund.

HM: Wow! This is a time when we have been seeing statues torn down, those that represent darker periods in U.S. history. People with very checkered pasts. Is there still a place do you think for monuments of individual people in public spaces in the U.S.?

MB: Oh, yes. I think that statues have tremendous power in almost a kind of magical power because they are and are not the person. They are and are not a human being. They're like a human being. They're not alive. They transcend the body and they confer a kind of immortality and a durability and they present ideas as well as people.

HM: What is it like to think that this piece that you worked so hard on is going to be there for so many years to come?

MB: I am delighted. I'm a great student of art history and of statuary from the 19th century, and I know the pieces in Central Park very well. I've been looking at them for years. I pushed my son around in his stroller and we'd stop and look at things. But I'm just delighted that it's here and that is here to stay.

HM: And that it's here now at a pivotal time.

MB: Yes, yes. I hope there will be many more statues, especially of the Black suffragists.

HM: Congratulations to you. It's very exciting. I look forward to seeing it whenever I get to New York next.

MB: Thank you. Thanks for the interview. Bye-bye.

CH: That was Meredith Bergmann, sculptor of the new Women's Rights Pioneers Monument in Central Park. We reached Ms. Bergmann in Ridgefield, Connecticut.

[Music: Electronic]

Emu pronouncer

CH: It all started with this:

STU RUSHFIELD: My wife was scrolling through Facebook last week, when she saw that a friend needed help finding her lost emu.

CASSANDRA REDDING: This is the sound of what he has figured out how to do.

Cassandra Redding says her emu learned to open the gate with his beak.

CH: I know! NPR reporter Stu Rushfield this past weekend, talking about a lost, flightless bird who goes by the name of Winston Featherbill. That report sparked an international incident, of sorts. A true war of word. That word being "e-moo" — as Mr. Rushfield and owner Cassandra Redding refer to Winston Featherbill. Or "e-mew" — the correct way to pronounce the name of the ostrich's scrappy cousin. Australians were outraged, or slightly miffed — pronouncing the pronunciation disrespectful and wrong. And before long, the offending parties were summoned by the Australian Broadcasting Corporation's morning show "News Breakfast", and asked to explain themselves. But then, a twist. It turns out that in America, anyway, both pronunciations are considered standard. And the ABC's own language czar said, quote: "I can unreservedly say that Americans are free to pronounce 'emu' with or without a palatal consonant." Admirably open-minded, I guess. But he quickly clarified he was giving his permission to Americans only. The palatal consonant is still mandatory for Australians. We can freely admit that the e-mooers have the right to say it however they want. We can also freely admit that — unlike the emu itself — they technically don't have a weird, scaly leg to stand on. So by all means, you can support their freedom of pronunciation — but we recommend you don't emu-late it.

August 27, 2020 Episode Transcript

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