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The AIH Transcript for June 15, 2021

Hosts: Carol Off and Chris Howden

Prologue

CAROL OFF: Hello, I’m Carol Off.

CHRIS HOWDEN: Good evening, I'm Chris Howden. This is “As It Happens”.

[music: theme]

CH: Tonight:

CH: Case finally closed. A Montana detective solves a pair of murders committed 65 years ago — and says the emerging practice of "forensic genealogy" means we'll see more cold cases cleared from the books.

CO: Home truths. The third wave of COVID hits the Kashechewan First Nation — where overcrowding due to a housing shortage means entire households are testing positive.

CH: Whole new ball game. As of today, the go-to site for baseball stats has a lot more of them — thanks to an infusion of data from black athletes that many fans say was long overdue.

CO: A farewell to arms. NASA sends dozens of cute little bobtail squid to the International Space Station for study — a job they probably didn't want, but just couldn't wiggle their way out of.

CH: And… some lake it hot. But a Chicago man decided the best way to cope with his anxiety over the past year was to go jump in a lake every single day — no matter what the thermometer said.

CH: “As It Happens”, the Tuesday edition. Radio that knows: freeze your mind and the rest will follow

[Music: Theme]

Part 1: Belarus Press Conference, Baseball Reference Negro Leagues Stats, Daily Lake Michigan Swim

Belarus Press Conference

Guest: Jonah Fisher

CH: At a press conference in Belarus yesterday, jailed blogger Roman Protasevich sat next to some decorated generals and told reporters he was in good health and good spirits. But members of the Belarusian opposition say the press conference felt like a scene out of a George Orwell book — and that Mr. Protasevich was speaking under duress. A few weeks ago, he was on board a Ryanair flight to Lithuania when it was suddenly diverted to Minsk, supposedly because of a bomb threat. Ryanair's CEO later called it a "state-sanctioned hijacking." When the plane landed, Mr. Protasevich was arrested by Belarusian security agents. One of the reporters at yesterday's press conference was the BBC's Jonah Fisher. He and his team walked out in protest. We reached Mr. Fisher in Minsk.

CO: Jonah, what were you expecting to see when you walked into this room for a press conference yesterday in Minsk?

JONAH FISHER: So we'd been invited to Minsk by the Belarus Foreign Ministry. And we had been told that it would be a briefing for journalists and foreign diplomats about the circumstances surrounding the Ryanair flight that was diverted last month to Minsk. You may remember that it was supposed to be flying from Athens to Vilnius, but just as he was about to cross into Lithuania, it was diverted. And on the ground here in Minsk, a prominent activist and journalist, Roman Protasevich, was detained. So we were expecting to hear a bit more from the Belarusians about their version of events, which has been throughout this, that there was a bomb threat that had been emailed to them, and that was why the plane was... was forced to make a landing in Minsk.

CO: So how much of a surprise was it that... that Mr. Protasevich was brought out and presented at this press conference?

JF: It was a complete surprise, and it was only at the very last minute after he was seated in the briefing room that the... the name label at the front was swapped. There were five Belarusian officials, and on the end, the name tag was flipped over, and Mr. Protasevich was brought in to sit at the end of this line-up of people to brief us about the flight. So a complete surprise for us. And it raised a lot of difficult issues for us as to what we were doing there? Because clearly, Mr. Protasevich is not a free man. He has been kept in the KGB detention facilities here in Minsk. So he was clearly being brought under instruction. We don't know how he's been treated. So immediately for us, we started wondering whether we should be really staying?

CO: At what point then did you decide to leave?

JF: Well, immediately, I initiated a few conversations through messaging with some of my BBC colleagues in London and in Moscow. Because obviously, it was quite a big decision for us to make to just get up and go. But very quickly, we were all in agreement that this was not something we wanted to be part of. We felt that we were being used by the Belarusian authorities to try and lend some credibility to this event. Ten minutes into the briefing, before Mr. Protasevich had even had a chance to... to say anything, my team and two of my... two of my colleagues, we got up and left.

CO: He did tell reporters that he was in good spirits, in good health, that he had not been abused while in detention. How did he appear to you?

JF: Well, he looked OK. He was wearing a lumberjack shirt. He was smiling. He appeared quite relaxed. This wasn't the first time that he'd been put in front of cameras. This is twice before we've seen video of Mr. Protasevich. In the first interview that he did after he'd been taken off that plane, it did appear that he had bruising on his face that had perhaps been concealed by some makeup. There were marks around his wrists, perhaps, where the handcuffs or ties around his arms had been. Going by the stories which we've heard of other people, protesters, for example, who've been detained by the authorities here over the last year or so, that would be very much in keeping with what happens in detention centres. I've seen pretty horrific marks on people's bodies. It would not be surprising in the least if Mr. Protasevich had been badly treated.

CO: He said in the press conference, I understand what kind of damage I have inflicted not only on the state but on the country. Today, I want to do everything to correct the situation. How does it compare with what he was saying before?

JF: It's… it's a complete reversal from what everything he stood for before. He was one of the founders of an organization which is known as Nexta. Effectively, it's a Telegram group, a social messaging group, which was effectively coordinating the protests that were taking place here... here last autumn. It was the one trusted information source that people were following as to what was happening, where people were protesting, pictures of what was happening and also, directions about where to gather and where to go. So he was part of... probably the key organizer behind the demonstrations, which is probably why the Belarus authorities were so keen to get him by whatever means. So, you know, if you speak to the friends of Mr. Protasevich, they say, look, there's no way he has just had this dramatic change of opinion. He is saying what he has to say to try and keep himself and his girlfriend alive.

CO: Does the Belarus regime really believe that that presser yesterday is to be believed? Did they really think that... that this will have the effect that they clearly want it to have?

JF: It's very hard to know how coherent the strategy is from the Belarus authorities. At the moment, it doesn't seem to make much sense. Because they are effectively trying to convince the world that this plane was diverted not because of Mr. Protasevich but because there was a genuine bomb threat. An email was sent, which meant that the plane absolutely had to be diverted to Minsk, even though it was much closer to Lithuania and to Vilnius. And yet, at the same time, they keep on parading Mr. Protasevich in front of television cameras and at this press conference to repeatedly tell everybody that, yes, he did commit these supposed crimes that he's being accused of, that he's being treated well. So, on one hand, they're saying it's nothing to do with Mr. Protasevich, while at the same time, they're effectively trying to say, well, we arrested someone who'd clearly done something wrong. Here he is, and he's admitted to his crime. It's a strange strategy.

CO: The fact that you walked out, and the BBC didn't cover that yesterday. Will that have an effect on your ability to cover events in Belarus?

JF: It's hard to say. Belarus is not an easy place to get visas to come to. It's very difficult for local people to work with us. For example, you know, the drivers who worked with us in the autumn of last year covering the protests. Now, the atmosphere has completely changed, and they simply don't feel comfortable working with us. So we're having to get around in taxis and that sort of thing. So there is a real sense here that the space for independent journalism that has completely shrunk. It's very difficult for any of those people to operate. We are still getting some access as foreign journalists to come... come here. But it has certainly become increasingly difficult to operate here.

CO: Jonah, I appreciate speaking with you. Thank you.

JF: Thank you very much.

CH: Jonah Fisher is a BBC correspondent currently reporting in Belarus. We reached him in Minsk.

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Baseball Reference Negro Leagues Stats

Guest: Bob Kendrick

CH: Hall-of-Famer Willie Mays had an incredible career as a Major League baseball player. He was Rookie of the Year in 1951. National League MVP in 1954. And led the league with 51 home runs in 1955. But today — at the age of 90 — Mr. Mays has added ten more hits to his career total at Baseball-Reference.com. That's because, for the first time, the preeminent baseball statistics site includes an accounting of his achievements as a player for the Negro Leagues team, the Birmingham Black Barons — along with many other Black players' stat lines. Bob Kendrick runs the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum. He helped Baseball-Reference.com incorporate the new data into the site. We reached him in Washington, D.C.

CO: Bob, what does it mean to you to see the words "the Negro Leagues are major leagues" splashed across Baseball-Reference.com today?

BOB KENDRICK: It's exciting. It makes us feel proud. It makes us feel like we've been part of a movement that has led to this date. I felt the same way in December when Major League Baseball made the initial announcement that it was recognizing the Negro Leagues as what we already knew it to be: a major league. And so, I guess today is still just yet another step in that. I guess for some, validating just how significant the Negro Leagues were both on and off the field.

CO: Now, the addition of this data, how does it change the landscape in terms of Major League Baseball statistics and record holders?

BK: Well, you know, I'm still trying to determine how this is all going to be integrated. And... but to at least have this information readily available, I think it helps those who clamour for this kind of information. You know, baseball is that beautiful game of comparisons and statistics. But I always caution people that the numbers are merely contextual. You can never reduce the Negro Leagues to just mere statistics. But for that group of individuals who need that to maybe help substantiate how good Josh Gibson, or Satchel Paige, or Cool Papa Bell, or the other legends of the Negro Leagues, then that is very important. But we also know that this story is so much bigger than the numbers. It's so much bigger than the game of baseball itself.

CO: Right. It's the story... it's legends, right? And who are the Black players who should have been household names like Babe Ruth or Barry Bonds? You mentioned some of them. Just tell us the stories of those men.

BK: Yeah. You should know about the great Cuban player, Martin Dihigo, nicknamed El Maestro — the master — because he could do it all, played all nine positions, played all nine of them well. He is the only baseball player in the history of our sport to be enshrined into five different countries' baseball halls of fame. He's in the Mexican, Cuban, Venezuelan, Dominican and in Cooperstown. You should know about Oscar Charleston, who, my dear friend and founder of the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum, and legendary Negro Leaguer in his own right, John "Buck" O'Neil, would say without hesitation, the greatest baseball player he ever saw. Yeah, he thought Willie Mays to be the greatest major leaguer, and most people concur because Willie Mays could beat you every way in which you could be beaten. He could beat you with his bat, with his arms, his legs, with his glove. And Willie Mays' illustrious professional baseball career began in these same Negro Leagues. But he thought Oscar Charleston, Carol, to be the greatest baseball player he ever saw. And again, he's not a household name, and he should be. Now, the names that I mentioned earlier, the Satchel Paiges, and the Cool Papa Bells, and Josh Gibsons, those are names that did transcend mainstreamly. Most baseball fans have at least heard those names, even if they don't know just completely how great they really were. Because I can tell you now, their greatness will defy whatever numbers are brought into play. Because what the numbers won't tell you is that in 1943, the Kansas City Monarchs owner, James Leslie Wilkerson, bought an airplane so that he could fly Satchel Paige to go play for other teams. He hired him out to go pitch for other teams and then fly him back for the Kansas City Monarchs. Well, those numbers are not going to tell you that.

CO: But I guess by including the numbers, I mean, just looking at a quote from Josh Gibson's great-grandson, Sean Gibson, who says that, you know, that you always knew that Josh Gibson was... was... he was known to be the greatest Black baseball player of all time. But now, he says, [chuckle] we can say Josh is considered one of the greatest baseball players of all time. That's the change, right?

BK: That is the big change. But, you know, that is what they were striving for the entire time. They didn't want to be seen as a Black baseball player. They just wanted to be baseball players, which is why when they went to the Spanish-speaking countries around the globe, that's how they were received. But that's the quest, I think, of Black people in this country by and large. And no matter what the endeavour is, is that you just want to be recognized for what you do, not the colour of your skin as you do it. But because of segregation, because it created this need for a separate league, that is now what we've gotten. But we have this mindset that this league was somehow inferior to the league that wouldn't let them play. And so, hopefully, now we're helping people understand that there is a kind of equal structure here, that this league, the Negro Leagues, really would not take a backseat to any league.

CO: And these Negro Leagues created out of segregation, hatred, racism, but also out of the love of the game, right. That was why they were born.

BK: Absolutely. And that's what reigned supreme about this story, and what we talk about it and the context in which we share the story of the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum. We understand the circumstances that created a need for a Negro Leagues. Segregation was a horrible chapter in America's history. But the story of the Negro Leagues themselves, there's nothing sorrowful about that story. It is triumph over that adversity, and it's based on one small, simple principle. You won't let me play with you. Then I'll create a league of my own. And that's the spirit that this country hails. And somehow, the Negro Leagues embodied that spirit, really unlike anything in the annals of American history. And that's where I am so triumphant in nature.

CO: Well, Bob, I really look forward to learning more of the legends of baseball that we have not heard in all these years. And thank you for the work you do.

BK: Oh, it is my pleasure. Thanks so much for having me.

CO: All right. Take care. Bye-bye.

BK: All right. Bye-bye.

CH: Bob Kendrick is the President of the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum. We reached him in Washington, D.C.

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Kashechewan COVID

CH: People in Kashechewan knew that if COVID hit their community, it would be tough to manage. The northern Ontario First Nation has a chronic housing shortage — meaning houses are often overcrowded, and the virus can easily spread. And now, that's exactly what's happening. The community currently has more than 200 active cases. Many of those are children. And the sickest had to be airlifted to a hospital in southern Ontario, hundreds of kilometres away. Now, anyone who has come in contact with a positive case has to stay in their home. Both of Celina Wynne's parents are in that hospital in Kingston, and her 10-year-old son has tested positive. She spoke with CBC Sudbury about how difficult it was to get help.

SOUNDCLIP

CELINA WYNNE: They waited until my dad got worse because of the clinic situation that we have in our community because of the lack of hot zone space that we have. There's only two beds where... where clients are taken in. And so, it's been quite busy with our community, with people getting sick. And we have over 222 cases now in our community. And I believe that there's like a hundred-and-something contacts, close contacts. I think that's the main concern is the overcrowded in our... in our community. Because there is no place that... where they can separate the negative and the positive, and once there's somebody positive in the home, they can't put them somewhere because of the living space. Because there's, like, for my mom's house, there's eight, nine, 10, probably 11 of them or 12 of them living in that house. And all of them are positive. The worst thing about it is my son is autism, and my mom was helping me raise him, and she's been... so my... my... my son always chooses to go stay there. And I can't go get him because he's positive and our home is negative. And I can't provide the certain things that I need for my children, my son. And this is where the government should step in to start working with our leaders. Our chief and council are working really hard. There's a lot of counsellors out there working 24/7. Even the health services staff they're... like, the ones that are COVID-free, they're doing their extra part. And everybody's working 12 hours a day. And it's very... and we need that extra help coming in. Because if we continue to do this, and we are having Rangers and... you know what I mean? But there is a lot of support that we need from the government to help us, and the funding also to prevent us... get this situation under control and what we're going through. This is a small community, and the virus that we have in our community, it's spreading like wildfire.

CH: That was Celina Wynne speaking with CBC Sudbury reporter Erik White about the outbreak of COVID-19 in Kashechewan First Nation. The federal government says it's sending 15 nurses and 16 Canadian Rangers to the community to help.

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Daily Lake Michigan Swim

Guest: Dan O'Conor

CH: A year ago, Dan O'Conor decided he was going to go jump in a lake. Not a tranquil, picturesque lake either. He was going to jump in Lake Michigan. Specifically, the Montrose Harbour in downtown Chicago — a popular spot for boaters, much less so for swimmers. But he loved it so much, he did it again the next day. And the next, and the next. And when the lake started freezing over, he still found a way to jump in. On Saturday, he marked his 365th consecutive day of taking the plunge. We reached Dan O'Conor in Chicago.

CO: Dan, how did it feel on Saturday when you marked one year of jumping in the lake every day?

DAN O'CONOR: You know, it felt fantastic. Just the support that I felt from the Chicago music community and just the Chicago community, in general, was amazing to see so many friendly faces out cheering me on.

CO: Let's go back to last June when you made your first plunge. What is it that made you decide to go jump in the lake?

DO: You know, I was hung over, and my wife suggested that I get out of the house. And I got on my bike and paddled about three miles to the lake, and looked at the beautiful clear water and the skyline of Chicago downtown, and jumped in, and the hangover was gone. [CO exclaims] I felt a lot better.

CO: What was going on a year ago? What was happening? That was just the middle of the pandemic stuff, right?

DO: Well, it wasn't just the pandemic. You know, it was the pandemic. The protests were raging. The politics in America, it was an election year. And it was just not a pleasant time.

CO: When you had that swim, what is it that made you want to do it every day?

DO: You know, I think it just evolved into something that was positive. I could go down there and clear my mind, just kind of start the day anew and start it fresh.

CO: And did it work?

DO: It worked wonders. You know, I felt, you know, mentally, I felt better. And, you know, as it started getting colder, I got so much feedback of, oh, you're a... you're a cold water therapy and cold water this, and cold water that. And I'm just a guy jumping in the lake to feel better. [CO laughs]

CO: All right. So, I can... it sounds like a great thing to do in June and July, August, maybe well into September, October. But then, what was it like when it started to get cold?

DO: You know, I think that's another thing. It was, you know, the mental preparation, you know, just being prepared that, OK, this is going to be cold, but let's get in and get out safely.

CO: Doesn't that harbour freeze over?

DO: It does. I was… well, I was bringing a shovel regularly and a hammer. And, at one point, I brought a ball and chain — 18-pound bowling ball attached to a bike chain — to smash through the ice, to clear the ice, to make a hole big enough for me to jump into. There were several days when it was about six to eight inches of ice, where I was only able to clear a little path, and I lowered myself in. So I basically was walking down the ladder to dunk myself.

CO: Were there times when you said, no, I can't do this?

DO: You know, there never was. I took on the can-do attitude when people told me I couldn't.

CO: What was the most difficult plunge you took?

DO: In the middle of February. It was minus one degree and 18 below windchill. And there was, I would say, approximately 16 inches of snow out there on the lakefront. I got out there, I was well-bundled, and I chopped a hole in the ice. And then we had a musician out there that day. And the music recording wasn't great because the winds were howling so much. But I got in. I got out. I just remembered that my hair turned into icicles almost right away.

CO: So you said, so musicians started to show up?

DO: Yeah. So in January, I started inviting musicians. My wife had this idea that, you know, you should have the local musicians serenade you in the water. I thought it was kind of a strange idea. But once it happened, in January 18th, I invited the first artist, and it was great. It was uplifting. It felt like there was a little more... there was more purpose. And so, not just some guy jumping in the lake. Now, it was some guy jumping in the lake and, you know, helping a musician who hasn't played for anyone in a long time.

CO: You attracted those some pretty big talent, right? You had Jeff Tweedy from Wilco came out.

DO: Yeah. You know, Jeff played. He... it was funny. On Saturday, he played the 365 celebration. And, you know, I was chatting with him, and he was like, I didn't know you were even going to ask me. I thought I wasn't going to get the chance. [CO cuckles] And which sounds so funny to me.

CO: You're a bus driver, right? Did you continue to go to work each day?

DO: I did. I did. You know, I was driving a limo in the morning, and then typically, I would jump in between 9:30 and 11:00 a.m. And then typically, my bus route would start about, you know, 1:00 p.m. So it was a full day.

CO: Do you think anybody that you were driving around, either in the limo or the bus, knew what you did for your lunch break?

DO: There was one gentleman who I pick up on a regular basis, who is deaf-mute. I went to pick him up one day, and he started making like he was going swimming — like he was diving in. And then, like, you know, he was trying to communicate that he saw me on TV.

CO: He knew you had two lives going?

DO: [chuckling] Right, right.

CO: Going forward, are you going to keep jumping in the lake?

DO: You know, I took Sunday off, and I went yesterday, and I'm going to go down today. It's beautiful out.

CO: This is an inspiration. You were going to... I think you're for sure going to have people who... who... who take your cue on this one, Dan.

DO: Yeah, well, it's been interesting just in the last few days. I mean, I've had a musician from Hawaii said, next time I'm in Chicago, can I play for you? I just had someone from Israel reach out and say when I'm in Chicago, can you jump in with me? A couple from San Francisco who are doing a cross-country trip, they want to jump in with me. So it's heartwarming to see that it reach worldwide.

CO: Dan, it's good to talk to you.

DO: Great to talk to you. Thank you very much for your time.

CO: Bye.

CH: Dan O'Conor just marked his 365th consecutive day of jumping into Chicago's Montrose Harbor, into Lake Michigan. We reached him in Chicago. And you can see videos of the self-declared Great Lake Jumper on our website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

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Part 2: Montana Cold Case Solved, Pekingese Best in Show

Montana Cold Case Solved

Guest: John Kadner

CH: The details were gruesome, and the leads were scarce. After a teenage couple was found dead in 1956, police in Great Falls, Montana, did everything they could to solve the double murder. Over the years, as many as 35 suspects came and went. Ruled out one by one — until none were left. And so the murders of Patricia Kalitzke and Lloyd Duane Bogle went unsolved. But now — 65 years later — Great Falls detective Sergeant John Kadner says he knows who killed the couple. Mr. Kadner took over the case in 2012. We reached him in Great Falls. And a warning, some details of this story are disturbing.

CO: Sergeant Kadner, how does it feel to have solved the 65-year-old murder case?

JOHN KADNER: Everybody's pretty excited. It definitely puts our office on the map. And these people have gone 65 years without having any answers. And to be able to give them some closure is definitely a benefit.

CO: Well, maybe you can tell us a bit about this case. This goes back to January the 2nd, 1956. Can you tell us what happened?

JK: Yes. So, Duane Bogle was in the Air Force. He was 18 years old. He was from Waco, Texas. He arrived in Great Falls on April 16th of 1955. And in December, Duane met Patty, who was a 16-year-old Great Falls High student. The two began to date, and they had even begun to talk about marriage. On January 2nd, 1956, Duane and Patty left the Kalitzke home, and drove to Pete's Drive-In, where they stayed until after 9:00 p.m. Near Wadsworth Park, three boys hiking along the Sun River found Duane facedown and deceased, with a bullet hole to his head. Investigators were summoned to the scene, where they found no valuables had been taken. While they were investigating or processing the scene, they would learn that Patty was with him the night before, and now they feared she had been kidnapped. And then, on January 4th, Patty was found about seven miles from the location of Duane, and she was also shot in the head.

CO: Poor woman. And they were both... he was bound, right? He was tied up in some way?

JK: He was. What they found is he had been tied with his hands behind his back, and his own belt was used.

CO: And what about Patty?

JK: Patty had some significant injuries, some blunt force injuries to her head, multiple... multiple scratches on her legs and on her torso, indicating there was a struggle or a sexual assault.

CO: So this was in the Great Falls, and these were, I guess, popular kids, right, these two teenagers? So what was the reaction? How did people in the area... how did they react to these brutal murders?

JK: The community was just stunned, and it's lasted four years. This story continues to come up. It's been featured in magazines. There's been TV shows about it. But at the time, just people could not believe that these two popular teenagers had been murdered.

CO: And what were the theories?

JK: There was theories that maybe drugs were involved or that Duane hung around the wrong people. What they did know in 2001 is they sent evidence off to the crime lab, and they were able to identify a DNA profile. That profile was uploaded, and there was never any hits on that DNA. But in 2018, the Golden State killer was arrested, and that basically put genetic genealogy on the map. So we sent our evidence back to the crime lab, and they were able to build a family tree and identify a potential suspect. And then, once we have that name, that's only a lead at that point. We cannot say for sure that that is our suspect until we are able to basically match up some DNA.

CO: So how did you finally figure out that it was this man, Kenneth Gould?

JK: So one of our first goals was to identify was this man still alive? We found that he was not. So we had to then see if there was any children that he may have had that we could request a DNA sample to compare to ours? And we were able to get swabs from two children. We told them, hey, here's what we have. Here's what we're investigating. Here's what we would like to do. We would like your DNA to essentially compare and either prove or disprove that he was involved. And they were both willing to give it, and they were a match.

CO: Wow! And so, how does the family of the victims of Patty and Dwayne, how do they... how do they react to your news?

JK: They... they were excited about the news. But at the same time, it did bring back a lot of bad memories from that time period. So there has been some struggle with this knowledge as well.

CO: And have you been able to tell them what motivated Kenneth Gould to kill these two people?

JK: We haven't. That's with... with him being deceased, that's one question that we'll never be able to answer. I have my own theory. I truly believe that she was the potential target that night, just based on the evidence found in her body, the injuries she sustained. She was kidnapped from the scene. Duane had very few injuries besides the gunshot. So, in my opinion, they got rid of him as quickly as possible and then kidnapped her from the scene.

CO: This whole... this forensic genealogy testing that... and, of course, people have registered there and wanted to find out their genealogy. So, so many people have voluntarily registered. What kind of… what kind of a breakthrough for... for investigation, for police work, does that represent?

JK: It's been a huge benefit and breakthrough for law enforcement. I mean, you can do a simple Google search and see the multiple cold cases that have been solved just from using this tool. I think it's great, especially to give the families some closure.

CO: All right, we'll leave it there. Sergeant Kadner, thank you.

JK: No problem. Thank you.

CH: Sergeant John Kadner recently solved a 65-year-old cold case in Great Falls, Montana. That's where we reached him.

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Alberta Métis

CH: The Métis Nation of Alberta is taking its provincial government to court. The Nation says it can't get the current UCP government to the table to discuss a Métis consultation policy. So it wants the courts to intervene — and reinstate those negotiations. That's how Audrey Poitras explained the case in an interview with CBC Edmonton this morning. She's the president of the Métis Nation of Alberta.

SOUNDCLIP

AUDREY POITRAS: When we're talking about resource development, they do no consultation with us. They do not advise us of anything. That's not to say that we don't work with other things with the ministry.

MARK CONNOLLY: Yeah.

AP: But on Native rights and consultation, which is a constitutional obligation, we do not get notified. And that's the issue.

MC: Now, your talks for a better consultation policy started back in 2014 with Jim Prentice, continued under the NDP government. How close were you to a deal before the UCP was elected?

AP: We believe we were very close to a deal. Of course, in my opinion, I believe we should have went forward with it. We... we didn't for reasons that there was the feeling that we needed to do a little more engagement, which was fine. And, of course, with the election coming on, it was determined to wait until after.

MC: And then the Minister of Indigenous Relations, Rick Wilson, cancelled that draft policy in September of 2019. So why is it necessary to take this to court?

AC: Well, we don't go to court just to go to court. We have annual meetings every year, and we get direction from our assembly. And they're very, very clear. Negotiations is the answer for us. We do believe in sitting down and talking through it. There's issues working it out. But they also very clearly say to us, if at the end of the day, we're going nowhere, then litigation is the answer.

MC: At a press conference yesterday, you called this lack of consultation systemic racism. Why did you choose those words to describe what's happening?

AC: You know what? If you... if you really look at the... at the big picture, Métis have fought very, very hard for recognition of who we are as Métis people. We're very proud of our European ancestry, and we're very proud of our First Nations ancestry. And there's been a lot of work that has gone into... into recognition. And when you look and see First Nations have a policy — a consultation policy — in Alberta, the Métis settlements have a consultation policy in Alberta. The Métis Nation of Alberta, which is recognized by the federal government as the Métis government within Alberta. We've also got a consultation agreement with the federal government. And we're left out of… out of… a consultation policy in our own province. I don't know what else to call it? After this long, that's exactly what it feels like. Why are we being left out?

CH: That was Métis Nation of Alberta president Audrey Poitras speaking this morning with Mark Connolly, the host of "Edmonton AM". During Question Period yesterday, Alberta's Indigenous Relations Minister, Rick Wilson, blamed the opposition for a lack of action. And while his press secretary said in a statement it would be inappropriate to comment on a matter before the courts, she pointed to a number of other projects the government has worked on with Alberta's Métis community.

[music: hip-hop beat]

Pekingese Best in Show

Guest: David Fitzpatrick

CH: He stood there like a lion — and it felt like he was 10 feet tall. Which he really, really is not. Nevertheless, that is how a judge at the Westminster Kennel Club Dog Show described Wasabi — this year's winner of "Best in Show". And, as I mentioned, while the champion had an enormous presence, he has a fascinatingly small actual body. Wasabi is a three-year-old Pekingese: a luxurious, bouncing ball of fur, with a small dog — apparently — hiding inside. David Fitzpatrick is Wasabi's co-owner and handler. He's in East Berlin, Pennsylvania.

CO: David, how is Wasabi reacting to his great achievement

DAVID FITZPATRICK: [laughing] He is taking it in his stride. He's, you know, got a great sense of self. So, you know, he kind of walks around like he's proud of himself, [CO chuckles] even if he didn't win the dog show.

CO: Just, I mean, for people who don't know what a Pekinese looks like, can you just describe Wasabi for us?

DF: Well, a Pekinese is a small dog with a flat face, with little, little short legs, kind of a wide pear-shaped body, and with a crown of, you know, a big, big, rough, you know, cape of fur and a tail that's a very proud tail, you know, lying over his back, big, dark, luminous eyes. Because of the short, bowed legs and the wide body, they have this distinctive, you know, characteristic rolling gait, which is, you know, accentuated by the coat moving from side to side. So, you know, it's just sort of like a little dog slowing around the ring with a little rolling gait. And it's very dignified and very distinctive and unique to the Pekinese.

CO: I've seen the pictures and some video of Wasabi. Does he have legs and feet? [laughing] I mean, you can't see them, can you?

DF: Yes, he does have legs and feet. [laughing] And he has, you know, nice, nice legs, you know, substantial bone, you know, but they just have short legs.

CO: But if there wasn't all that fur, what size would Wasabi actually be underneath all of that?

DF: Well, he's about 13 and a half pounds. You know, he still would be a nice-sized dog, even if he didn't have, you know, his beautiful coat. You know, there's a good, substantial dog under the coat.

CO: [chuckling] What do you think made him "Best In Show"?

DF: Well, what made him "Best In Show" really was... it's the judge's choice. As a judge, the judge evaluates the dog. They put them through their paces. They feel for their muscle tone. They check to make sure they have the correct coat for their individual breed, that they're moving for what's correct for their breed. You know, in the end, the dog that wins usually has charisma and has some kind of a connection where they... they take the day. But, you know, if you were an art critic or an art appraiser, you would be evaluating paintings as to their quality. You know, what an example of... of, you know, a Picasso this is. And this one is the very best. And, you know, a dog show judge is sort of the same. You know, they're all evaluating dogs, but there's different levels of quality that put some dogs, you know, up there in the stratosphere and other ones as good dogs. And they're all wonderful dogs. But, you know, some are just of a higher quality in that judge's opinion.

CO: Well, just a higher quality, or is there something kind of a certain spark with Wasabi that the judges noted?

DF: Well, he always has a bit of a spark. You know, he's, you know, for a little guy, you know, a Pekinese is... used to be called, and still... they still do on occasion, they're little lion dogs. And, you know, Wasabi sort of has the heart of a lion. You know, he just stands there and, you know, very confidently surveying his territory. [CO laughs] You know, he's a small dog with a... with a big heart, a big attitude. And, you know, really sparkles in the ring.

CO: The fight among the finalists... that Wasabi was the winner. But there was a Whippet named Bourbon; Matthew, the French bulldog; and the English sheepdog named Connor; Jade, a German short-haired Pointer; a West Highland white terrier named Boy. Lots of competition. What does it actually mean to be "Best In Show" in this contest?

DF: Well, you know, if you're a football player, you'd like to, you know, win the Super Bowl. If you race horses, you would like to win the Kentucky Derby or the Triple Crown. You know, and if you're a dog show breeder and exhibitor, you know, everybody would love to win the Westminster Kennel Club Dog Show. You know, it's the pinnacle of one's career, of your breeding career, of your handling career. It's the top. You know, it's very exciting. I mean, generally, it's held in Madison Square Garden, which, of course, is the most famous arena in the world. And it's just tremendously exciting to be there in the first place.

CO: Of course, people have seen the movie "Best In Show". And it was very dramatic. It's a very dramatic film. [chuckle] Is it just like that?

DF: Oh, there are small pockets of the movie "Best In Show" at every dog show, [chuckle] that's for sure. You know, we have a lot of characters at the dog shows and, you know, people that, you know, are eccentric. And, you know, we do have some "Best In Show" movie characters. [laughing] And we love them. They're so funny.

CO: How did Wasabi get his name?

DF: He actually got his name from a lady that lives in Canada. We... a friend of mine, Kathy Whitby, came down when Wasabi was a puppy. And she was looking for a puppy for herself. And I had Wasabi and his littermates. At that point, they didn't have a name. And Wasabi's mother is named Sushi. So Kathy said, why don't you call him Wasabi? And I thought, well, that's… that's a great name! And, you know, hence [chuckle] Wasabi, you know, son of Sushi.

CO: So when you finally do get around to having the celebration, what will you be giving Wasabi?

DF: I'm going to give him a little filet mignon, a little chicken, a little cheese. I mean, he can really have whatever he likes.

CO: And what about you?

DF: Me?! I'm... oh, my gosh, I'll be celebrating for probably the next year or two. Going to be getting together with some friends and having a little dinner celebrations. You know, have some champagne, and I'm game for any celebration. Every day should be a celebration, whether you win or not.

CO: Well, give Wasabi our best. And congratulations. And thanks for speaking with us, David.

DF: You're very welcome. Have a great day.

CO: You too. Bye-bye.

DF: Bye.

CH: That was David Fitzpatrick in East Berlin, Pennsylvania telling us about his champion dog Wasabi

[music: 80's groove]

Squids In Space

SOUNDCLIP

JEFF BEZOS: I want to go on this flight because it's the thing I wanted to do all my life. It's an adventure. It's a big deal for me.

CH: In a little over a month, Jeff Bezos is going to space. You heard him: it's a lifelong dream come true. He loves space. In fact, he's now free to marry it. And I know he's only going to be there for a few minutes — but still, why not study his microbes? But no. Instead, NASA is sending innocent little creatures that aren't trillionaires and don't want to go to space, to space. This time, in the form of 128 adorable little bobtail squid. The reason is: they glow. And they glow because of a symbiotic relationship with certain microbes. The squid allow the microbes to nest and multiply inside them, and in return, the microbes make the squid luminescent at night, which hides their silhouettes from predators. Two lifeforms, just helping each other. So, obviously, humans just helped themselves to dozens of the squid and sent them to the International Space Station. They want to know if being in space changes the way the microbes interact with the baby squid. Apparently, that will help humans in space in the future. And that's all fine. Science is important. Except that when they're finished with the squid, they'll be frozen and brought back to Earth for further study. Like, frozen to death. Very unfair to the squid. And the microbes. And, to a certain extent, to Jeff Bezos. But that's science for you. So: thanks for your help up there — and here's looking at you, squid.

[music: surf rock]

Part 3: Texas Power Grid Problems, In Flight Meal Cook

Texas Power Grid Problems

Guest: Daniel Cohan

CH: This past winter was brutal for Texas — and Texans. After a major storm, the state experienced a devastating power outage that left millions exposed to the cold. Now, with temperatures in the mid-30s Celsius — and mid-90s Fahrenheit — one of the state's main electricity suppliers is asking Texans to dial back their consumption — or risk a summer blackout. Daniel Cohan is a professor at Rice University. He specializes in energy consumption, and civil and environmental engineering. We reached him in Houston, Texas.

CO: Daniel, how is it possible that Texans are facing possible power outages once again,

DANIEL COHAN: Right, really unfortunate to be going through this just a few months after, of course, the disaster in February. And it's really a sign of a power system that's been cutting corners, that's been sort of doing things on the cheap and not investing enough in new power generation, not investing enough in transmission lines, not doing enough for efficiency. And put those all together, and it leaves us keeping right on the edge of... of not having enough power to go around.

CO: Just months ago, when we covered the horrible winter storms, and the effect it had were about more than 150 people across Texas lost their lives, and people were just freezing in the dark there, that it seemed that there were a lot... there was a lot of soul searching going on at the time and a lot of promises that this would be fixed. So what's happened since then?

DC: This is not anywhere near as severe as it was in February. It’s the risks we have now are that we might have rolling blackouts neighbourhood by neighbourhood for 15, 20 minutes at a time. We don't have millions of people at risk of not having power for days, which made for such a deadly event in February. So for those of us and our neighbours who are traumatized by what happened in February, we don't have to worry about the same things now. But here in a wealthy state, in a wealthy country, you know, we shouldn't be worrying about the power at all, especially not in June. When, sure, it's warm, but it's not record warm or as hot as Texas can get. So this isn't something we should be really having to think about at all, whether we'll be able to keep the lights on at times like this. And, yeah, it's unfortunate that both summer and winter, the Texas grid has been struggling.

CO: Now, before your winter storm, most of the world had never heard of the Electric Reliability Council of Texas, better known as ERCOT, but that's the same... all roads seem to lead back to them, too, right? So what lessons have they learned? What has... what's changed within that council?

DC: Right. It's really been too soon for a lot to change. Unfortunately, they’ve been earning that “r” of reliability. And when it comes to summer heatwaves, it really is a purely power issue. It really is within ERCOT’s control. This February, it was a different sort of challenge in that ERCOT struggled. But in part, that was because the natural gas supply systems collapsed on us. They weren't prepared for the cold. This time it's more of a pure electricity problem that we're facing. And ERCOT hasn't been up to the challenge.

CO: when it happened in February, the... your governor, Greg Abbott, he said that the problem was with all this green energy that wasn't producing as it should. So what's he saying now?

DC: Well, he signed a bill a week or two ago and said the bill would solve all the problems for electricity in Texas. And that was wildly overstating what was accomplished in legislative bills that addressed a little bit of the problem but didn't come anywhere close to doing enough to address our needs. You know, it's too soon since February to have much change. The big thing to point out in green energy now is the only reason that the lights are on in just about all of the state right now is because of solar power, is that Texas has been adding solar faster than almost any state ever has in history. And it's that amount of solar that's been added over the past two years that's been what's keeping the lights on over the past few days. And... and that will make things better a year or two from now.

CO: There is also the issue of the Texas grid is not connected to the national network, right? So is that going to change? Is that rethought at all?

DC: That is a... has really been a mistake, and shooting ourselves in the foot. And that really hurts us all times of year. It hurts us now. It hurts us in February when times are tight in Texas, and we would have been able to bring in power from neighbouring states. It hurts us the rest of the year when we're not able to export our power to other states when it's windy and sunny and mild in Texas. So it's been, you know, a quirk of Texas history that we're… we're the only state, at least in the continental U.S., to... to be so isolated, to not be connected to the two main grids that cover western U.S. and western Canada, eastern U.S. and eastern Canada.

CO: They were shivering in February. [chuckling] They're… they’re sweltering in... already in June. What we heard in the winter storm is that, well, the fallout was the power bills, what people had to pay in order to get the electricity. Is that happening again with these heatwaves?

DC: Well, what's happening is on the wholesale markets, so what companies pay and what the providers pay, those prices have... have shot up by a factor of 50 or 100. And it doesn't show up on most of our bills because most of us pay a fixed rate bill. So we don't really see it that much day-to-day or month-to-month. What has been happening, though, is that those costs are being born down the road. And what the legislature did is they passed a few bills so that costs from the February storm are being spread out over the next 20 or 30 years. And so, some customers are going to be seeing surcharges on their bills for decades to come simply to pay the costs of one week in February. I don't think this... this week isn't getting to the point where you would need to... to do that kind of surcharge. But whatever companies are being exposed to the prices on the open market right now, you know, they're... they're paying astronomical prices for electricity. And, you know, that one way or another is going to... to raise the cost of things or... or cause... cause problems when, you know, days like today, we should be having pretty moderate power prices right now.

CO: All right. Daniel, we'll leave it there. And thanks for giving us an update about electricity in Texas.

DC: Thanks, Carol. Appreciate your time.

CH: Daniel Cohan is a professor at Rice University who specializes in energy consumption and civil and environmental engineering. We reached him in Houston, Texas.

[music: indie rock]

FOA: Cihan Erdal

CH: Cihan Erdal is out of prison but not out of the woods. Mr. Erdal is a PhD student at Carleton University in Ottawa and a permanent resident of Canada. Last September, he was visiting family and conducting his doctoral field research when he was arrested and taken into custody in Ankara. He was part of mass arrests targeting elected officials, students and professors. Today, there's a glimmer of hope for Mr. Erdal: a Turkish court has decided to release him conditionally — but he's still unable to return to Canada. In February, Carol spoke to Omer Ongun, Cihan Erdal's partner — who spoke about the research Mr. Erdal was doing for his PhD.

SOUNDCLIP

OMER ONGUN: It's really interesting, I will say maybe in a sense shocking, to see that he has become the subject of his own research. He was really trying to understand peaceful protests, youth political participation of young people. Now, he's become that. He's behind the walls in prison. He's being criminally charged for fomenting disunity of the state. And this is really based on these two Facebook posts that he had on different dates. Those are just anti-war posts. His defence lawyers believe that actually Turkish authorities realize they could not directly connect him to any of these about the Kabbani protests in tweets and letters. So, therefore, they scoured his social media accounts for anything that could be viewed as subversive.

CO: Cihan is your partner, but he is not recognized as your partner in Turkey. And does that mean that you can't see him? You don't have the visiting rights as a family member?

OO: The last time that I spoke with him was on that night in September.

CO: Oh, my gosh! Has the Canadian government helped?

OO: Global Affairs Canada has been monitoring. But, you know, unfortunately, they haven't really condemned the arrest. We know they can do more. But as I also want to mention this, you know, some people also tell me, oh,. Cihan is not a Canadian, right? And then I say, Canada should not approach this only as a consular matter, but as a human rights issue. So we cannot say that this is outside of Canada's interest because it goes against Canadian values.

CH: That was Omer Ongun, speaking to Carol in February about his partner Cihan Erdal. Today, a Turkish court ruled Mr. Erdal be released from prison — but he is still not permitted to travel to Canada.

[music: industrial]

FOA: BC Cat Burglar

CH: Her people are law-abiding. But she is claw-abiding. When she sees something she wants, she takes it. And for reasons known only to the purloiner herself, what she wants are garden gloves. As many as possible. In matching pairs. Also, face masks. And some other things. Esme, the cat, has stolen so many things that the Oregon woman who owns her did what any good parent would do. Or, any really, really frustrated parent. She made a sign for her front lawn that reads "My Cat Is a Thief — Please Take These Items if They are Yours". Beside it is a small clothesline with a long row of stolen goods. Esme — no doubt — is chastened. Or she couldn't care less. It's the second one... because she is a cat. Her exploits reminded us of another chronic cat burglar with a love of gloves. And while Esme's owner believes her cat is fetching items she notices her family may need, the Burnaby B.C. woman who owns Sienna had another theory about what might be driving her feline friend to a life of crime. Carol spoke with Dawn Palmer in 2014. And here's part of their conversation, from our archives.

SOUNDCLIP

DAWN PALMER: Well, I have a feeling, and this is, unfortunately, I was quoted calling her fat, which isn't very nice. I know I'll have to apologize to her later. But Sienna has grown over the nine years that we've had her. And I have a feeling that she's just incapable of actually catching the mice and moles and birds that she used to bring home. And now, I guess the glove is not moving, and it's easy to pounce on. And I have no idea. [CO laughs] We just think it's so funny that she would all of a sudden start collecting gloves.

CO: But she used to bring home animals?

DP: Oh yes!

CO: And present them to you as her gifts?

DP: Yes, a regular basis. And my other cat, Beau, would do the same thing. We have a bit of a zoo at our house. And, in fact, it's quite disturbing when they bring home dead animals. But that's the way they like to present you with gifts.

CO: Now, it's... OK, it's pretty easy to pick up a glove. But it's finding gloves. Where is Sienna finding so many workman’s gloves? I mean, 50! That's a lot!

DP: It's a lot. And so, at first, they were doing some work at the house across the street. And I thought, OK, well, maybe she's just, you know, picking them up from there. I'm going to go and see and offer, you know, to give back the gloves. But then I realized there's too many of them. She must be picking them up at construction sites, or there's an elementary school nearby. I really have no idea. I... I just, as I said, every day, we would either get... you know, they're always single, and they're different. And we can only assume that it must be fairly close by in the neighbourhood. I don't think she's travelling too far. I mean, I don't think cats stray too far away from their home.

CO: But there are a lot of people who are… have turned around to get their gloves and found only one or none [both laughing] in the middle of doing whatever they were doing?

DP: That is very true! There is someone out there cursing, or they just think that they misplaced the glove, right? If you just lose one, you might not realize that someone actually swiped it.

CH: From 2014, Carol speaking with Dawn Palmer of Burnaby, BC, about her then-nine-year-old tortoiseshell, Sienna.

[music: electronica]

In Flight Meal Cook

Guest: Nik Sennhauser

CH: Nik Sennhauser loves to fly. Like a lot of people, he enjoys finding a good deal, jumping on a plane, and heading off on an adventure. Unlike a lot of people, Mr. Sennhauser particularly loves eating a meal above the clouds. So when the pandemic halted his high-flying dining, he decided to continue the tradition under the clouds at home. We reached Nik Sennhauser in Glasgow, Scotland.

CO: Nik, what did you make for dinner on Sunday night?

NIK SENNHAUSER: Oh, this Sunday? Well, as always, I make my husband eat off a plastic tray. And I served him a chicken in a tomato garlic basil sauce with some linguine. And as a side, we had potato salad with a slice of roast beef. And for dessert, I made a chocolate brownie.

CO: And what was the inspiration for that menu?

NS: This was a flight that I was on in 2019, on Lufthansa, the German airline, flying from Hong Kong to Munich.

CO: And you said you served it on a plastic tray?

NS: Yes.

CO: Why is that?

NS: Well, I recreate airline meals that I've had before. And every Sunday, I serve them up for my husband as Sunday dinner. And it's something that I started during lockdown because I got really, really bored at home on the weekends. It was so bad that I actually looked forward to going back to work on Monday. [CO chuckles] And... and then one Sunday morning, I made breakfast — had some sausages and some scrambled eggs. No, actually, I had an omelette and hash browns! And I just thought, oh, this looks like plane food! And I just took out my plates from a trolley and plated it up like that for my husband. I thought it was quite fun. [CO chuckles] And from there, I just started to recreate meals I've had. Because, yeah, I don't really like cooking. It's not something that I do. And.. and it was a challenge for me every week.

CO: But you're not... it's extraordinary what you're creating because it's not just those meals; it's how they look, how they're presented, how they're laid out. And then those elaborate little desserts that you'll often find, well, wrapped in plastic on a plane. So, you're actually making the identical pastry that would come with the... the meal?

NS: Yeah, I've... I've amazed myself, really! I did... Virgin-Atlantic, they do an afternoon tea with macaron, and éclair, and scone. And it was... I've never made any of these before. It was the first time. And I spent the whole weekend in the kitchen trying to make these. And, yeah, it turned out fine! So, I just looked at the picture, made it look the same.

CO: I would say that it doesn't look quite the same because yours looks so much better. And I think, in fact, you might be cooking for business class.

NS: [warm chuckle] Well, that's because I've got... I spent about six hours at the weekends on a Sunday, [CO chuckles] basically the whole day fiddling around with it to... to make it look presentable.

CO: Well, most of us look forward to these meals only because they break up the monotony of the flight. But you actually... you actually enjoy these meals, right?

NS: Yes, ever since I was a kid. I grew up in between Thailand and Austria. I spent a lot of my childhood on planes and in airports. I just always found it amazing when you would get on a plane in Bangkok at 2:00 in the morning, that at three a.m., one hour after take-off, somebody would come around and serve you a hot meal, just magical! [CO chuckles] And yeah, I almost love that, just thinking of it!

CO: You actually enjoy flying as well, don't you?

NS: Yes!

CO: And you'd actually go to the United States on a weekend?

NS: Yes. Oh, yes, before the pandemic, I would spend all my time online just looking for deals. And yeah, there was one time there was a really good deal, 150 pounds, flying to Providence from Edinburgh. Took the Friday off. And Thursday, hopped on a plane, flew over and had some lobster rolls and then came back. And you know, that's the kind of money that people just spent out at the pub on weekend.

CO: What.. now, when... when this is... when everything is lifted, all these restrictions are over, what's your... what are you thinking about? What flight are you thinking and what meal would you have on that flight if you could?

NS: Oh, well, on top of my bucket list is really to go to Japan again and fly on All Nippon Airways in the business class. Their food just looks amazing. I've only seen pictures, and it just looks fantastic.

CO: Wonderful, wonderful idea! And so, but meanwhile, Sunday night dinners [laughing] put on the little plastic tray, and the trolley, and the whole the little cutlery, what's... what's your best so far? What's been your biggest success?

NS: I would say the lobster thermidor. I made lobster thermidor a couple of days ago... a couple of weeks ago. And that was a meal that I had on Singapore Airlines. And it's one of the signature dishes. So it was a big deal at a time. I booked a flight in business class, and I got lobster thermidor with saffron rice. And I recreated that the other week, and it was fantastic. And so, I can now see that I actually made lobster thermidor myself.

CO: [chuckling] We are going to post pictures of your wonderful meals. I have to say that I… I would go... I would take a flight... flight anywhere to have those waffles that you served up one morning, I think.

NS: Oh, yes! Yeah, I bought a little waffle iron just for that. I made the… what was that — fried chicken and waffles?

CO: That's right! Yeah, that's... yeah. All right. We're going to let people share your flight fantasies [both chuckling] online. And Nik, it's great fun to talk to you. Thank you.

NS: Oh, thanks very much. Thanks for having me.

CO: Happy flying.

NS: Thank you.

CH: Nik Sennhauser has been re-creating airline meals at home during the pandemic. We reached him in Glasgow. You can see some photos of his airline meals on our website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

[music: Spanish guitar]

Vancouver Stanley Cup Riots

CH: Ten years ago today, the Vancouver Canucks lost to the Boston Bruins in Game 7 of the Stanley Cup Finals. For fans in Vancouver, that was bad. But the night would get much, much worse. Over five hours, rioters set garbage cans on fire, flipped cars, smashed windows and caused chaos in the city's downtown. More than a hundred people were injured, and hundreds more were arrested. It was reminiscent of the 1994 riots in Vancouver when the Canucks lost to the New York Rangers. But diehard Canucks fans like Mark Leiren-Young were convinced something like that could never happen again. From our archives, here is journalist Mark Leiren-Young speaking with Carol the day after the riots in 2011 about who he saw in the crowd.

SOUNDCLIP

MARK LEIREN-YOUNG: It was a weird mix because I get what the police chief was saying about there being, well, for lack of a better term, professional rioters. But there was also a very bizarre "Riot 2.0" Facebook element to what happened last night. There were reports that the truck that was torched in front of the post office kiddie corner of the CBC was brought to be torched. Because, I mean, I was there. I saw that truck explode. And I thought trucks only explode like that in the movies! And you have to have special effects people to get trucks to explode like that. And this wasn't just on fire. It exploded wave after wave.

CO: And people were communicating this through their... through Facebook, through their tweets, is that right?

MLY: Oh, Facebook, Twitter, Tumblr. It was quite astonishing. But, I mean, the thing that really hit me as I read the coverage from around the world of this... of this riot, almost every story I read was headlined "Angry Canucks Fans Riot", "Disappointed Canucks Fans Riot". I was in the arena. I saw disappointed Canucks fans. I saw the long faces. I've seen pictures of the people at CBC Plaza after the game. Those were just disappointed. Nobody was angry, except maybe with Luongo, maybe with the Canucks. But if you look at the actual photos, images, videos illustrating the disappointed or angry fans, not one of them looks disappointed or angry. These are people posing, mugging and grinning for the cameras. These are people who were there to set things on fire and to then put that up on their Facebook page.

CO: So now, the international reputation of Vancouver is that it's the world's biggest sore loser?

MLY: Yeah.

CO: Is that unfair?

MLY: [sigh] I wish it was. What... I mean, I guess the unfair part about it is it was pretty apparent that these people were going to do this win... win or lose. This wasn't about the outcome of the hockey game. I don't think anyone goes downtown with two... with two knapsacks full of Molotov cocktails with any intention of bringing them home.

CH: That was Mark Leiren-Young speaking with Carol in June of 2011. One of the most famous photos to come out of the riot is of a couple kissing on the ground amid the flames, tear gas, and riot police. Their names are Alex Thomas and Scott Jones. And a decade later, they are married with a child and living in Perth, Australia. They spoke with CBC News about the photo.

SOUNDCLIP

SCOTT JONES: It was one of my friends who had been at the party that that night that we were with who… who I worked with. She texted me in the morning. It was like, is that you in that photo? And she tagged me in it on Facebook. And, at that point, it was just one of the... one of the photos from the riot, right? It was just on the news. It wasn't anything like, oh, anything like, oh, who are these people? Who… it was just like a bunch of pictures of the riot, and then one of us. [chuckling] I was like, Alex, check this out. The photo, like every now and then, I point it out to people at the bar, and some people remember the photo. Other people have no idea.

ALEX THOMAS: Yeah, it'll come up at work. If somebody new starts, inevitably someone will bring it up a couple of weeks in and go, hey, funny story, just so we can have a laugh about it. But other than that, it's not... it's not something that you can really just bring up in conversation unless the topic turns to ice hockey, which in Australia, it doesn't very often. [both laughing]

CH: That was Alex Thomas and Scott Jones, the couple photographed kissing amid the 2011 Vancouver Stanley Cup Riot, which took place 10 years ago tonight.

[music: glassy guitar]

Cape Breton Little League Returns To Stolen Gear

CH: It's Little League season in Cape Breton. For Scott Lecky — who's with the Sydney and District Little League baseball program — that meant heading down to the clubhouse to dust off the gear for his under-10s. But when he and his son arrived at the field they found the door of the equipment room ajar. Here's how he described what they found inside.

SOUNDCLIP

SCOTT LECKY: There was nothing left. They took the hooks that we hang our gear on.

BOB MURPHY: But what other gear are we talking about?

SL: Most of the gear was catcher's gear for our younger kids. Some chalker, some balls, a field liner, just your regular everyday equipment, like rakes, and shovels, and all our maintenance equipment to keep the field up to par. So it was really a kick in the pants, for sure.

BM: And all to fit kids 10 and under. I mean, who would want this gear?

SL: That's really what baffles me is the fact that none of the equipment stolen was really useful to anybody besides Sydney and District Little League. Like, we're talking eight year olds catcher's equipment, and old chalk machine for a baseball field to line the field. The most expensive thing was probably our new in-place rubber bases. I mean, it's a five hundred dollars set of bases. But just... if you don't have a baseball field to put them in, then they're not really that much good to you.

BM: And so when does the league season begin? Is it already underway?

SLWe didn't want to let a couple of thieves stop the kids from having fun. So we... we bowled through and got our program and going last night. And we had a really successful first night. So it was really nice to see after the... after all the damage and upset on Sunday, to have all the kids smiling on the field last night really paid off, so.

BM: Well, tell me a little bit more about some of the help you are receiving? Because it's not just local help. You're getting calls from across the country, I understand?

SL: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, teams that we go to bat against every year from Sydney Mines to Glace Bay been reaching in. And then, every day since, I've received phone calls from Alberta, British Columbia, Ontario, from either gear reps or people who have played in Sydney and District Little League or any little league across the country and understand what it's like to be on a budget crunch with equipment. And they're chipping in anywhere from $200, to $250, $500 each. Some people are throwing $20s towards us. Like, it's been absolutely amazing. Gear reps are sending us a couple new bags, a catcher's gear, and it's just... it's been amazing.

CH: That was Sydney and District Little League coach Scott Lecky speaking to "Maritime Noon" host Bob Murphy.

June 15, 2021 Episode Transcript

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