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The AIH Transcript for September 1, 2020

Hosts: Helen Mann and Chris Howden

Prologue

HELEN MANN: Hello. I'm Helen Mann, sitting in for Carol Off.

CHRIS HOWDEN: Good evening. I'm Chris Howden. This is As It Happens.

[Music: Theme]

CH: Tonight:

HM: School teacher. Most residential schools across Canada have been demolished. But one survivor in Manitoba has been fighting to keep his standing. Today, he got his wish.

CH: Banksy transfer. We reach a crew member involved in the rescue of hundreds of migrants in the Mediterranean. He says support from the British street artist Banksy is helping to put Europe's refugee crisis back in the spotlight.

HM: Steering clear. Donald Trump visited Kenosha, Wisconsin today despite requests that he stay away. One activist explains why he first planned to protest against the U.S. president's visit, but then changed his mind.

CH: Fair warning. The woman behind a new Indigenous led alert system in Nova Scotia says it will save precious time in emergencies from missing children to boil water advisories without having to meet the RCMP criteria.

HM: Right before your eyes. For years, most prospective buyers wanted to tear it down, but now a group has paid millions to preserve a Frank Lloyd Wright house in Arizona.

CH: And pop science. Researchers have made an important advance in fish first aid. And it boils down to this: you can't help an injured fish by pouring pop on it. As It Happens. The Tuesday Edition. Radio that understands the lure of fishful thinking.

[Music: Theme]

Part 1: Why this residential school survivor is glad the building is now a national historic site

Residential School Sites

Guest: Ernie Daniels

CH: Parks Canada often designates historic sites because they're symbols of national pride. Like the Halifax Citadel or Fort Henry in Kingston, Ontario. But today, two new sites were added to the list and they are symbols of national shame. Two residential schools -- one in Portage la Prairie, Manitoba -- the other in Shubenacadie, Nova Scotia, are being preserved as national historic sites by the federal government. Ernie Daniels has waited decades for this announcement. He attended Portage la Prairie Residential School in the 1950s. We reached him in Portage la Prairie.

HM: Mr. Daniels, this residential school was a source of immense pain for you and for so many other Indigenous children. Why did you want to see it protected as a national historic site?

ERNIE DANIELS: Well as I said this morning, you cannot erase history by destroying a building. So when I acquired this land and building in1981 as a young chief at that time, I wanted to destroy it. I wanted to demolish it. But our elders told me "No. You've got to keep it for a testimony to the world at large to tell what happened to us." So I kept it as a testament of our past. Canada's policy on discrimination, assimilation, eradication, decimation of our people.

HM: Why did you initially want to destroy it?

ED: Well there's a lot of hurt and pain, sexual abuse, physical abuse, mental abuse suffered by our young children. We turn a negative, into a positive. There have been many groups that have used this building, very functional, very solid, beautiful grounds. It's a headquarters for a First Nations police force. It's a office building for our lands department. Capacity building, training department for the youth -- they take training here all year around.

HM: You were six years old when you were sent to the school. What are your earliest memories, personal memories, of the experience?

ED: The first thing is it was very traumatic and I didn't understand why, because I was taken, I think, by the Indian agent who brought me here -- me and my sister. First thing I remember, is being dragged and put in the bathtub full of chlorine. To this day, I still smell that chlorine when I walk into this office here, into this building because of the strong odor and memories. And they put DDT on our heads to get rid of lice and bugs, which we didn't have -- that was part of, I guess, assimilation.

HM: You're inside that building now. So over time, I mean, you've been going in there, as you say, for many years. Do memories still arise? Do those feelings still come to the surface often?

ED: Yes. I mean, over the years, I've tried my best to take healing programs to deal with what happened to me because I went to four residential schools in Portage which is Roman Gothic, Pine Falls, Roman Catholic, and I end up in Manitoba so I went to four residential schools over the years. And the memory of not having my parents, my siblings, my community, my grandparents, that hurt a lot.

HM: I understand that parts of the building are associated by you and others with isolation and punishment.

ED: There are certain parts of this building I have a hard time talking about because they were isolation rooms or detention rooms. And they're still here. We still have a corner of the building where we have the whips and belts that were used by the authorities. We still have those. That's going to be on display when we have our museum.

HM: How many people did you have to deal with who would have really been more satisfied with seeing this thing destroyed?

ED: I think a number of survivors would have loved to have it destroyed. But also I had a lot of survivors who told me, you've got to keep it going so that we can tell our history. You know, you've got to look at perspective here. Not only did we acquire the building, we also acquired about 50 acres of land. And you should see what's happening now. We got a brand new hotel. We got a gaming centre. We got office buildings. We got 50 brand new homes. So from the days when we had nothing here except the building. This building was shambles. It's taken 40 years to develop it the way it is right now -- it is a beautiful place now.

HM: How much satisfaction do you get from turning a place that's filled with so much pain and tragedy into a place that is serving your community in such a positive way?

ED: We can't dwell in our misery. We need to move on as a nation, as a people. We've put our efforts together as a community to move ahead.

HM: The federal government today also designated the residential school program as an event of national significance. Why is that so important to you? Because I guess it sounds in some ways like a small gesture that maybe should have been done before.

ED: We are resilient people, we are patient. We've been waiting for this acknowledgment and announcement for 40 years and it has finally happened. And we did it. We did it. And this building, this museum now is of national important, and that is a national museum now, it's not a local museum anymore. It's owned by the survivors across Canada. That's their ownership.

HM: This past weekend, we saw protesters in Montreal pulled down the statue of Canada's first prime minister, John A. MacDonald, for his role in establishing residential schools and also in enacting other policies that led to many Indigenous deaths in this country. What is your view of that? Should those statues come down?

ED: First, you cannot erase history by destroying a statue or a building. There are different ways of expressing in negotiating that. I understand the emotions. And I also condemn the policies of John A. MacDonald and his subsequent the deputy minister, Duncan Campbell Scott, who coined the word [inaudible] Indian and the Indian child. Sure, I like to have them, like, you know, get rid of the statues, symbols of oppression, suppression of our peoples -- but that's just a symbol. And there are different ways of negotiating the right way forward.

HM: Mr. Daniels, congratulations on seeing all your hard work come to fruition with the declaration of this historic site.

ED: It's been my pleasure.

HM: All right. Good to talk to you. Thank you.

ED: Take care.

CH: Ernie Daniels is a residential school survivor who was forced to attend four different schools, including Portage la Prairie Residential School in the 1950s. Today, it was recognized by Parks Canada as a national historic site, along with the Shubenacadie Residential School in Nova Scotia. And you can find more on this story on our website: cbc.ca/aih.

[Music]

Trump Kenosha Visit

Guest: Isaac Wallner

CH: Some people were happy to see U.S. President Donald Trump today in Kenosha. His supporters lined the streets during the president's tour of the Wisconsin city. He came with a message of support for law enforcement. Here's part of what he had to say.

DONALD TRUMP: You have some bad apples -- we all know that -- and those will be taken care of through the system. And nobody is going to be easy on them. And you have people that choke. They're under tremendous -- I said it yesterday, I said it last night -- they're under tremendous pressure. And they may be there for 15 years and have a spotless record, and all of a sudden they're faced with a decision. They have a quarter of a second, quarter of a second, to make a decision and if they make a wrong decision one way or the other they're either dead or they're in big trouble. And people have to understand that.

CH: Donald Trump speaking during his visit to Kenosha, Wisconsin, this afternoon. The mayor didn't want him in the city, neither did the governor. And Jacob Blake's family made it perfectly clear they were not welcoming the president. As Mr. Blake recovers in the hospital after police shot him multiple times in the back, his family hosted a community event away from the president's tour with a bouncy castle and a voter registration booth. Here is Jacob Blake's uncle, Justin Blake, speaking to the media this afternoon.

JUSTIN BLAKE: We don't have any words for the orange man. All I ask is that he keep his disrespect, his foul language, far away from our family. We need a president that's going to unite our country and take us in a different direction. [Crowd cheers] It's a free country, we can go anywhere we want. We want the same rights he got and we want to able to get our children home safely because they should be able to go anywhere in this nation and come back home safe and not get shot seven times.

CH: Justin Blake is the uncle of Jacob Blake, speaking earlier today in Kenosha, Wisconsin. Isaac Wallner is a police reform activist. He founded the group Human Trust Project after the death of George Floyd. We reached Mr. Wallner in Kenosha earlier today.

HM: Mr. Wallner, how did you decide whether or not to protest against President Trump's visit to Kenosha?

ISAAC WALLNER: I truly feel that he feeds off of attention, whether it's negative or positive. And so this is very very political for him to come to Kenosha, have his photo op, have his moment. And I also feel having people who are there that are against him on the ground or supporters in a very emotional time, he wants that feeling, he wants that fire to push his law and order message to help boost his campaign and its election chances.

HM: So did you at some point weigh really whether you would go or did you decide right away that this was not going to be for you?

IW: I originally wanted to. Then in talking to my mother and a couple of people are like, 'well, think about what you already know and what experienced before about what I just told you.' And I was like, you're right. So I sat there. I was like, well, it's not worth it to go there in A) potentially get into a fight with his supporters when we are what he says we are. Unfortunately, that does boost his election year. And I feel like a no-show is a lot better than that. And that we don't have to go down there and get into fights with supporters to let people know that we're not going to stand for who he is and what he's done to this nation.

HM: What have you seen so far that leads you to believe the president wants to see clashes between his supporters and those who are protesting police violence?

IW: The fact that he's here. There's absolutely no reason for him to be here at all. The off-colour remarks he's made and the decision he has made with those remarks between African-Americans and just people in the United States, he does then come to a city where an African-American male is shot in the back seven times -- it's wrong. And that right there shows that he's looking to incite some kind of unrest, whether it be minor -- it doesn't matter. But he's looking to be that. People always talk about outside agitators coming into your city -- I truly feel as of right now, him coming in here, yes, it's a free country, but it's definitely outside agitator.

HM: President Trump claims that the conflict in Kenosha ended within an hour -- I think that was his words -- after he said he would be sending in forces. What do you think of the fact that he's taking credit for the streets of Kenosha being more peaceful the last few days?

IW: I was on the ground when the shooting happened with Kyle Rittenhouse when he took two lives, shot another. That was the last night of a very strong type protest and riot. When the sheriff departed had responded heavily to disperse the crowd and for him to take credit for something that he had nothing to do with. There were plenty of people here in Kenosha, myself included, and a coalition I'm in that were on the ground trying to keep the peace for the few days prior to that incident as well as that night. And for him to step up and take credit, people who saw the most that night were dispersing the crowd was the sheriff's departments from around the state, not the National Guard. So for him to take that credit, it's wrong.

HM: After touring the city today, the president said that he had come to support law enforcement and he blamed what he says, and I'm quoting, "violent mobs" for acts of what he called "domestic terrorism." What is that characterization of what's been happening in your city mean to you?

IW: To say violent mobs and domestic terrorism, I mean, is the destruction of property needed? No. Yes, a lot of people who were arrested over the past few days, majority of them were not from Kenosha. They came from the outside. They came here. They did what they had to do. But I truly feel, though, that these things wouldn't happen if we had tighter scrutiny and a tighter process on our police officers and making sure that they're not shooting people in the back seven times. They're not attacking African-Americans. So to me, the true you're going to call it domestic terrorism is the attack on African-Americans of my race and my brothers and sisters.

HM: Well, rather than the response that you've seen from the president, how do you think you could address those issues? I mean, what kind of oversight could be applied to the police that would be perhaps affect change?

IW: First and foremost, the police departments have to culturally represent the city that they're in. Kenosha it's a mixed city. It's Black, White, Hispanics -- we're mixed. The Kenosha Police Department is primarily White. Now, in speaking to the chief and talking, I spoke to him personally, I talked and having a sit down with him and asked him, well, why? He said well, I never really thought about that -- I guess I haven't really gotten out there, we try to push, but we don't say. It's like well, if you don't make it a priority to push for more culture, a culturally diverse police department, then you're part of the problem.

HM: President Trump pledged today to spend several million dollars to help Kenosha rebuild from the damage that it suffered. Also, tens of millions on law enforcement in the state. What would you prefer to see from politicians in terms of helping Kenosha?

IW: Rebuilding Kenosha when it comes to poverty stricken areas. You can spend all this money on law enforcement, that's fine. But until you rebuild these poverty stricken areas, give the people that live in these areas hope and a better tomorrow, then unfortunately, crime tends to follow. So if you give them hope, build them up, give money to education, better schools, to educate our children, to give them hope, give them a future -- that's where the money needs to go to. Not into law and order.

HM: Well, Mr. Wallner, good luck in your efforts to quell the potential violence and to bring people together in your community. Thank you for talking to us.

IW: Thank you for having me.

CH: Isaac Wallner is a police reform activist. We reached him in Kenosha, Wisconsin, earlier today.

[Music]

Met Hotdog Vendor

Guest: Danny Rossi

CH: Even a pandemic couldn't dethrone New York's 'hotdog king.' In a sign that the city is waking up from its COVID-19 lockdown, New York's most famous hotdog vendor, Danny Rossi has reopened his cart outside the Metropolitan Museum of Art. But even with the museum open, it seems New Yorkers' appetite for street meat is not what it used to be. We reached Danny Rossi in New York.

HM: Danny, after five months being closed, how did it feel to finally reopen your card outside the Met?

DANNY ROSSI: Well, great. [Chuckles] To be able to go back to work and start seeing some activity outside the Met was great.

HM: Give us some numbers. How many hotdogs did you sell yesterday?

DR: Nothing. Nothing.

HM: Nothing?

DR: Nah. What they did was they opened up the first two days for just members. And then Saturday, Sunday, Monday to the general public. So Saturday was okay. Sunday was well. Yesterday was almost nobody.

HM: Wow. You know, that's such a busy spot -- the steps outside the Met. How many hotdogs do you normally sell?

DR: On a normal day, if this was last year at this time, I would say maybe at least 40 pounds -- maybe more. 400-500 hotdogs.

HM: How has it been, I mean, to go through all those months of lost sales?

DR: How's it been? I'm a working guy. Not to be able to work was the hard part. As far as the money coming in, you know, if there was any kind of work we could have done, we would have done it. We tried opening a few times and it just wasn't there. We even parked, just nothing was there. The city's dead, you know. So that was very depressing. We just couldn't see where this thing was going to happen. And I don't see it getting better between now and maybe March. But if it doesn't get worse, we're going to be okay.

HM: What kind of expectations did you have? Because I can imagine, you know, all this time you've been anticipating that reopening.

DR: Yeah, but we understand our business. Our business is the tourists. And without any flights coming in, we didn't expect a mob of people. All I was hoping for was let's pay the bills. And my wife and I are on social securities and those cheques we just pulled everything together, that's what we're doing today -- getting ready to pay the rent and we'll get by. We're going to do what we have to do.

HM: And I understand you're former service members so you have a military pension too.

DR: Yeah, it's a small pension. I was in the Marines. Yeah.

HM: Right. Have you ever considered over the last few months packing it in and quitting the hotdog business?

DR: Every day. [Chuckles] Every day.

HM: Why didn't you?

DR: I'll tell you the truth, there was a time in my life where I put everything in place. I had an annuity plan set aside. We owned a house. We lost all that. And when I lost it, I never was able to rebuild it. And I said, you know what? I'm the type of guy that retirement is ridiculous -- I don't believe in my whole life I\ve had more than two vacations. So I'm just going to keep working. That's what I am. I just work. So, you know, if it's not this, I'll find something else.

HM: Do you have, like, regular locals that aren't just tourists that you usually see?

DR: Sure. But they don't even buy -- they just come by to chat. [Chuckles] We know everyone. It's funny where we are, across from the Met you have all these beautiful buildings. Now when I sleep there at night, there's only one or two lights in each building. Meaning that nobody is in these buildings. These are all very very wealthy people. And these apartments that they buy are just investment properties. So you got all these beautiful buildings, but you don't have any people who live there.

HM: I have to roll back. You said when you sleep there.

DR: When I sleep, I sleep there at night.

HM: In the cart?

DR: Well, they won't let me sleep in a cart anymore. I sleep in my van.

HM: Why?

DR: Because I have to hold the location.

HM: So it's like squatter's rights kind of thing.

DR: Well, in New York City, probably over 90 percent of all the parts are run by a criminal organization, it's the only way I can say it. And the way they get locations is they muscle people out. So you have to kind of dig in. So I'm pretty well known in the city and not that they haven't tried to take the location, but it'll bring a lot less stress if I just stay there.

HM: I'm wondering about the nature of a hotdog cart, though, you know, whether that maybe gives people pause, because normally you'd hand me a hotdog and then I would use the little spoons to put whatever I wanted on: relish, peppers, whatever.

DR: You know, we've always done the right thing. We wear masks. We sanitize the cart constantly. We have the gloves on and everything. And there's never any contact between even the gloves and the food. There's always napkins involved. So they're New Yorkers, you know, and New Yorkers don't worry too much. You know, if you're the type of person who worries too much, you wouldn't buy a hotdog even if there wasn't a pandemic. So most people they're used to it. You know, they are New Yorkers, different kind of people.

HM: So you think they're not spooked because of the pandemic related to how you're handling the food that sort of thing?

DR: No. The ones that are spooked are the people who never bought a hotdog in their life anyway.

HM: Given that there's, you know, not the tourist traffic that you're used to, can you persuade New Yorkers to come out and buy a hotdog from you? Like what would you say to them directly?

DR: Every week I see more and more activity. People are coming out and saying, okay, let's just be smart but let's come out. And that's what's going to bring it. That's what's going to bring the people out. A few months ago, the streets were deserted. Now I'm getting traffic jams.

HM: In this negative time, has anything good come from the quieter times for you?

DR: [Chuckles] Yeah, I got to sleep at home a little bit more since there was no activity going and, you know, I didn't have to be there constantly. So I got a little time to be with my family. I got a new granddaughter. That was great. Good. Life is good.

HM: Well, congratulations on the new baby. I sure hope the sales go up. Thank you for talking to us.

DR: Bye now.

CH: We reached Danny Rossi in New York. And for more on this story and see some pictures of the hot dog king, go to our website: cbc.ca/aih.

[Music]

Frank Lloyd Wright

CH: Sometimes when you step onto a property, you know, right away, it's a tear down. Now, in my case, I ask a few simple questions: how are the bones? Are they good or bad? Also, I consider its esthetic qualities like, is it nice or like weird? And would I rather see eight townhouses there? The thing is, I obviously know nothing about how to assess a house, but I know this much: you don't tear down one made by Frank Lloyd Wright. The group that just bought the David and Gladys Wright House in Phoenix, Arizona, knows that. Which is why they paid about nine and a half million dollars Canadian for the home and will pay more to preserve and restore it. Unlike the developers who saw it as a ripper downer instead of a fixer upper, and not just because of the bones, whatever those are. Sotheby's, which sold the property, says we had several offers over the past few years but the buyers always wanted to only tear down the house and build all new ones. Well, okay to be frank, this particular work of Frank's is a little goofy looking. It has a spiral motif. The whole place is round with a round living room, round fireplaces and a spiral wrap around the whole place. But it fits perfectly into the desert environment and it's a way better than a couple of prefab ranch style houses. So luckily, those developers didn't prevail and the new buyers are in the right place at the right time.

[Music]

Part 2: Banksy Boat

Banksy Boat

Guest: Chris Grodotzki

CH: The Sea Watch 4 was already full to bursting. But that didn't stop the rescue vessel from turning around to help another rescue boat that was in trouble. It's a familiar scene in the Mediterranean, but this particular rescue has been making headlines partly because of the involvement of the U.K. based street artist Banksy. His art decorates the sides of the Louise Michel, the boat that called for help and he helps to fund its work. Chris Grodotzki is a member of the crew onboard the Sea Watch 4 which is now carrying more than 350 people seeking safety. We reached him off the coast of Sicily en route to Palermo, Italy. And a warning: some details in his interview are disturbing.

HM: Chris Grodotzki, what is it like onboard the Sea Watch 4 right now?

CHRIS GRODOTZKI: Well, the situation on board is so far stable, speaking from a medical or physical situation of our 353 guests that we have onboard. It's still very crowded, like all the decks are filled with people. We've had three rescues of boats in distress in between the 22nd and the 24th of August and then a couple of days later, when we were already on our way north and had already requested a port of safety in EU. Then we had to take another 152 people from another rescue ship that entered into a little state of emergency due to non-assistance of the European authorities.

HM: Right. So let me ask you -- you already had these hundreds of rescued refugees on the Sea Watch 4 when you then went back to help the Banksy backed Louise Michel this weekend. What was it that made you turn back?

CG: Yeah. So we already had 201 people on board by then. One had already been evacuated for medical reasons a couple of days before. And the Louise Michel had also already 89 people onboard. And on the 29th they were called to another boat and they were already shoving water out of this rubber boat. And the European authorities who were alerted, they didn't react. So the Louise Michel told them that they cannot take the people but would still go to assist the boat in distress, of course, because that's what we're here for. But the boat was set in such a desperate situation that they still decided to try and take all the people. It didn't completely work out. So they had to deploy life rafts alongside their ship. And in that situation, they were not able to move anymore anywhere. And the authorities still showed no signs of going and intervening.

HM: So you went back to try and help the Louise Michel, in this situation. You, as we said, already had all of these refugees onboard your ship. What was that moment like when you had to turn back?

CG: Well, first of all, the main problem, of course, is we were already heading north and we had to tell the people why we were heading back south. Many of the people have experienced pullbacks by the so-called Libyan Coast Guard, which is funded by the European Union as kind of the balances of Europe to forcefully to return these people. And many people have been forcefully returned by them. And in that situation, it's of utmost importance to explain the people very well why we are heading back and that we are not heading back to return them to Libya. But the people took it very well and actually were quite in favour of going back and helping, showing quite some solidarity and were quite positive about going back there.

HM: Can you give us a sense of what some of these 353 passengers you have on board have been through? You speak with them -- what kind of stories stand out for you?

CG: So many many of these people have experienced forced returns when they tried to escape Libya. They have been forcibly returned to illegal detention in Libya. So all the people who are returned by the so-called Libyan Coast Guard are brought back to detention centres where the circumstances are just inhumane. Like we've been hearing stories of systematic torture, to blackmail their families at home so they would torture people and let them call their families so they can hear how their relatives are screaming in torture to blackmail them to send money. We've been hearing stories of systematic rape. We've been hearing stories of infinite detention and even slavery. One of the people I spoke to actually put it in really nice words, connecting the situation to the Black Lives Matter movement and how Europe and many European politicians are positioning themselves. He said if Black lives really matter, they also have to matter in the central Mediterranean Sea. And they also have to matter in Libya. And the EU still has to prove that this is the case.

HM: The Louise Michel has the very public backing of the street artist Banksy. It's even covered in his artwork. Does that kind of support change the equation in any way?

CG: I think it supports bringing the situation back to light, because in the last half year, despite tremendous developments in a very bad direction, like, for example, Malta, completely illegally against every international and humanitarian law returning people to Libya -- there has been almost no spotlight on the Mediterranean, except for a few shipwrecks. And the crew of this boat and the support of Banksy bring back another spotlight. But the problem is also that these are only spotlights. While it is a systematic problem that we're facing here, it is a systematic policy of exclusion. It is a systematic policy of forcing these people on the boats by not allowing them to enter Europe by legal and safe passage ways. And this is something that we're lacking a lot, that the light that shines on the Mediterranean the media lightest often only in terms of single events. But it is a systematic problem and this needs to be addressed by policy changes.

HM: Now that you've finally been assigned to safe harbour in Palermo, what happens next?

CG: Well, we will arrive in Palermo tomorrow. And then the people, the 353 people, we have on board will be transshipped to yet another boat. This time an even bigger ferry ship where they will be quarantined for probably two weeks and then tested for COVID-19. Ourselves, we will probably also be forced to do a quarantine in Italian waters. And then we expect they will send so-called port state control, which will then find or make up some technical irregularities, for example, in the Sea Watch 3 after the last mission, they found the irregularity that they had too many life vests onboard, which is quite a weird safety concern to keep these ships detained in Italian ports for at least a couple of weeks.

HM: Mr. Grodotzki it does seem to be an endless problem. Thank you very much for talking to us.

CG: Yeah. Thank you for having me. And have a nice evening.

CH: Chris Grodotzki is on board the Sea Watch 4 which helped rescue passengers who had already been rescued by the Louise Michel in the Mediterranean this weekend. We reached him in the Mediterranean Sea en route to Palermo, Italy. And one final note on this story, besides support from the Sea Watch 4 -- the Italian Coast Guard also allowed some of the most vulnerable passengers from the Louise Michel onto its vessels after finally responding to calls for help on the weekend.

[Music]

Berry Picking

CH: She went for jam, now she's in one. Laura Sutherst, east of Whitehorse, was looking for a plentiful blueberry patch recently, and she found one. The only problem was that the berries were on the wrong side of the U.S. border. And especially in this time of COVID-19 that is a major problem. She told her story to Philippe Morin host of the CBC Yukon Morning.

LAURA SUTHERST: Well, I went down picking up as I usually do. It's my super super spot. And some of those happened to be -- there in between that kind of what everyone refers to as the 'no man's land.' It's 25 kilometres between the customs. And I guess I took it for granted that I could just be in there. I had several friends who said they'd been picking and it was fine. And I've been going there since I was a little kid. So I just didn't, you know, I guess my common sense wasn't working, that I couldn't go past the "Welcome to Alaska" sign. And I went in and got some berries and on my return was held for several hours. The long and short of it is they put me on 14 days self-isolation.

PHILIPPE MORIN: It's a long way to go and a high cost to pay for some berries. How many did you end up getting?

LAURA SUTHERST: Well, you know, it's not a great berry season cause we haven't had sun. But I'll tell you, it was the most peaceful trip I've ever had because no one was on that road. And you know what? For me, any time on the land, I love that area -- it is completely worth it. So I love my time there. I'd like to get out there again, not pass the Alaska sign. But I can't right now. So yeah. And I spent a couple days camping at Conrad because I had no idea that I was supposed to be quarantined. So it's worth it. It's always worth it. I love that land there.

PHILIPPE MORIN: You mind telling us what you're going to be doing with them? It sounds like you've got some time.

LAURA SUTHERST: Well, I've made some pies and hopefully I get some more and put some more in for pot lunch. I'm adopted into a family and we have some pot lunches to get ready for. And I'm famous for my pies. So I think now I'm going to be infamous for my pies. So, yeah, so I'm trying to stockpile for the pot lunch.

CH: That was berry picker, Laura Sutherst talking to Yukon Morning host Philippe Morin. Ms. Sutherst is self-isolating after accidentally crossing the Canada U.S. border while berry picking.

[Music]

Mi'kmaw Emergency Alert

Guest: Jennifer Jesty

CH: With the click of a button, chiefs from five Mi'kmaw communities can send out important alerts without dealing with the RCMP. Today, a new Indigenous led emergency alert system goes live in Nova Scotia. It's the brainchild of Jennifer Jesty. She is the emergency management coordinator with the Union of Nova Scotia Magma. We reached her in Membertou, Nova Scotia.

HM: Ms. Jesty, why is it important for these five Mi'kmaw communities to have their own emergency alert system?

JENNIFER JESTY: So there are a lot of things that take place in our communities that are priorities to us but may not affect the rest of the province. So such things as missing children or severe weather alerts or even a boil water order, can now be in control by our chiefs and also just go to our community members when it's something that just directly affects that individual community.

HM: Why could you not use the provincial alert system in that way though?

JJ: The provincial alert system, I did speak with them when in the beginning when I was beginning to develop the system. And it turns out that the only way that those alerts could be broadcast were kind of over cell phone and over the television. But one of the really important features of that was that it's not able to ring a home telephone. And for most of our elders in our community, that's really their only form of communication. So that's really the major difference between our system and the provincial alert system.

HM: There's also a language component. Tell me about that.

JJ: This is one thing too that I'm very excited about is when the chief is going to send out the message, he can record his own voice so it can both be in Mi'kmaw and English, which I feel is going to just gap the bridge between the language barrier when it comes to something that's as serious as any of these events could possibly be.

HM: So tell me how it actually works. You say the chief would record a message. What's the protocol? How is the system operate?

JJ: So in developing this system, it's called Everbridge. And while working with them, I was very specific as to what our communities needed. Our communities are unique. And being a band member from Eskasoni myself, I felt like I was in a pretty good position to know and understand what our communities need the most. So there's a few things. It had to be easy most importantly, both in the sign up and the delivery of the message. So I was able to work with Everbridge and I went ahead and set up accounts for each individual chief and all they need to do is put in their username and password on any device, they go in and they title the message, they type it out, and then that will convert from text to speech. Or they could delve a little bit further and they click another little tab there and it says, record your message. So they are able to record their own voice and that can both be in both Mi'kmaw and English.

HM: How did you come up with this idea?

JJ: I'm new into this position and there wasn't anybody in this position prior to me. So my director told me, you know, you can kind of take this position any way you want to go. So when I started to think about what would I like to make a priority, and I thought, well, the most important component of any emergency is communication. So let's say, God forbid there's an active shooter in Eskasoni -- how are we telling everybody? And so I said, well, there's got to be a way. Something must exist out there that we can communicate to our community members all at once. And then I made the connection with Everbridge. And here we are.

HM: You mentioned a mass shooting. And, of course, people will remember in April that Nova Scotia police did not issue an alert during that two day manhunt after 22 people were killed. How concerning was that for your community?

JJ: Well, fortunately, our communities were quite a distance away from where that tragedy took place. However, I feel the whole entire incident really brought to light the importance of communication within our communities. Again, I come from a background of boots on the ground and not so much the planning phases. I'm usually the person putting out the fire or saving a life. So I'm used to being in the middle of the emergency and can fully appreciate the chaos that must have been going on then. And I guess I can kind of understand from that perspective how it may have been overlooked. Hopefully now moving forward, we'll be able to understand a little bit better when those alerts should and shouldn't go out.

HM: There's also a real life example involving the missing child senario or missing young person scenario -- the 14 year old girl from one of these communities who went missing and an alert wasn't issued for over a week. We now see a 47 year old man charged with child abduction. I know you created this before this incident, but how vital is it that you won't have to wait for the RCMP to make a determination about whether an alert should be issued?

JJ: Well, you know, we didn't develop this system in spite of them or, you know, to be able to kind of shine a dark light on the RCMP and the decisions that they have to make. I'm sure they have their own specific criteria to meet in order to send out that alert. But now with our communities being able to have that information and this alert system available to them, maybe that alert could have gone out sooner. It's hard to say. Each individual case, I'm sure, is going to be different. However, this alert could be sent out within minutes. So we hope to not exactly work against the RCMP when it comes to missing children, but we hope that this may be able to bridge a gap where their provincial system has certain criteria. But ours is a little bit different. So now maybe this particular missing child doesn't meet the criteria for the province, but maybe we'd be able to send out the alert through our new system.

HM: As far as you know, are there any other alert systems like this in Canada?

JJ: Not to my knowledge. I know Everbridge itself is a global entity and they do service many different areas. As a matter of fact, the town of Truro has just recently used Everbridge and watches in their community. I'm hoping going forward that lots of communities are going to see the benefit of having their own emergency alert system, maybe even contacting me to help them along the way, because I'd be more than willing to help anybody who would like to set this up.

HM: Ms. Jesty, it's very nice to talk with you. Thank you so much.

JJ: Thank you very much.

CH: Jennifer Jesty is the emergency management coordinator with the Union of Nova Scotia Mi'kmaw. We reached her in Membertou, which is south of Sydney.

[Music]

Pop Science

CH: Let me start with a gentle warning: if you've ever port of fizzy sugary drink on a fish to save its life, well, prepare to have your bubble burst. Researchers at Carleton University have made an important advance in fish first aid. And it boils down to this: stop pouring pop on fish. I know we've all done it. But on the off chance that you haven't, it turns out a powerful belief has permeated the angling community of late, as if by osmosis but in reality, by Facebook. The idea is that if a fish is wounded, presumably by having been fished, the carbon dioxide in a can of pop can slow the bleeding by doing a science thing to it. And so began the apparently growing practice of catch ginger ale and release among those who love fish enough to catch them with a hook and enough to attempt to counteract said hook catching with carbonation. It's a beautiful, complicated relationship to test this extremely plausible theory for some reason, researchers caught 156 Northern Pike. They then inflicted a minor gill injury via a pair of pliers. Then the researchers proceeded to apply Coca-Cola, Mountain Dew or carbonated lake water to the wound. They determined that in each case, the treatment had absolutely no effect. It's nothing more than pop science. So let's put an end to the whole coke and dagger operation.

[Music]

Singing Dog

CH: And finally tonight, a bit of good news in these challenging times -- if a little difficult to hear. [Dogs singing] Yeah, so I'm not sure if you can hear me over the singing dogs, but those are singing dogs. Pardon me. They are special singing dogs because we've heard lots of your talented pets singing Happy Birthday or the As It Happens theme song. But these haunting ballads are performed by a type of singing dog thought to be extinct in the wild. But now scientists have shown that they are not extinct. According to new research, the New Guinea Singing Dog continues to roam the island shared by Papua New Guinea and Indonesia. Picture a large Shiba Inu with perhaps a dash of dingo because that is exactly what they are. A kind of missing link between the dingoes of Australia and domesticated breeds from Asia. They were last seen in the wild sometime in the 1950s and presumably last heard then too, or I don't imagine they would have been that hard to find. But the dogs seem to keep to the rocky terrain of the forbiddingly steep highlands, which hampered efforts to track them. Now, thanks to some sure-footed researchers with a song in their hearts we have DNA evidence that your own crooning canine may have descended from the newly not extinct New Guinea singing dog.

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September 1, 2020 Episode Transcript

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