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The AIH Transcript for July 31, 2020

Hosts: Susan Bonner and Chris Howden

Prologue

SUSAN BONNER: Hello, I'm Susan Bonner, sitting in for Carol Off.

CHRIS HOWDEN: Good evening. I'm Chris Howden. This is As It Happens.

[Music: Theme]

CH: Tonight:

SB: Missing the vote. Hong Kong's chief executive delays elections in the city, citing safety concerns around the pandemic. But our guest, recently banned from running in those elections, isn't buying that.

CH: Full Hajj. After pandemic travel restrictions prevented her from making it to Mecca, a Maryland woman brought the spirit of the pilgrimage to her community by making it a drive-through.

SB: Indoor dining is a go in Canada's biggest city. But some restaurants respond with a hard "no." One restaurant owner tells us she isn't going to do it because the extra money isn't worth risking lives.

CH: New jersey. Ethan Bear of the Edmonton Oilers took to the ice this week wearing a special jersey stitched with his name in Cree syllabics. And now it's flying off the shelves.

SB: No speed limit. As coronavirus vaccines charge ahead, Dr. Anthony Fauci takes questions about whether the rapid pace means cutting corners.

CH: And that's not going to fly. Two pre-historically terrifying looking emus made themselves at home in our guest's pub. He says it was their fetid feces that finally led him to ban them. As It Happens. The Friday Edition. Radio that's easily emused.

[Music: Theme]

Part 1: Emus Carol and Kevin 'banned for life' from Australian outback pub

Hong Kong election delayed

Guest: Alvin Yeung

CH: Donald Trump has suggested postponing his country's election. Carrie Lam has actually done it. Today, the chief executive of Hong Kong announced that the city's legislative election, which had been set for September, would be delayed for one year. Ms. Lam cited concerns about the coronavirus pandemic and insists the postponement is necessary to protect fairness, safety and public health.

CARRIE LAM: We are going to invoke emergency regulations and ordinance effecting the delay of the elections. And certainly, of course, the main content of the relevant bill and these checks for justice will give you some details later. And finally, we have the support of the central government in making this decision.

CH: The postponement follows a series of recent blows to the pro-democracy movement, including the arrests of four young activists accused of promoting separatism online and the disqualification of a dozen pro-democracy candidates from running for office. Alvin Yeung is a legislator and the leader of the Hong Kong Civic Party. He is also one of the disqualified candidates. We reached Mr. Yeung in Hong Kong.

SB: Mr. Yeung, Carrie Lam says this election must be postponed to keep people safe during this pandemic. Why do you think she postponed the elections?

ALVIN YEUNG: Well, first of all, she has not demonstrated that she has done her best to do all possible measures to prevent people from infecting from the pandemic. Look at the world over the past six months. There are a number of countries that have conducted an election even during the pandemic, without any infections or any outbreak. And so she is simply saying that, oh, sorry, I cannot get things done so I have to postpone the election. We are talking about two stories here.

SB: Do you think it's safe enough to hold an election?

AY: There are measures that we can learn from other jurisdictions, including Singapore. There are things that a government can do to prevent people from infecting. And when you have not tried anything, you have no authority to tell the people that you have to postpone the election.

SB: So then why do you believe she is doing it? If you don't believe safety is the issue, what is the issue?

AY: Well, over the past year, Hong Kong people have been having this anti-extradition movement. And judging from last November when we had our district council election, the opposition democrats won a landslide. So those who are in power probably predict that if the election goes ahead, they are going to face a defeat and the opposition camp will have a majority at the legislative council. So they have to put up some excuses so that the election could be postponed for one year.

SB: Now, when it comes to the election, you had already been disqualified. You and 11 other pro-democracy candidates, including Joshua Wong, were disqualified from running for a new term. What reasons were you given?

AY: Well, basically, the returning officer on behalf of the government said that dozen people, including myself are unfit to stand in the election because the returning officer fails to believe that I would be genuinely upholding the basic law. This is the excuse. For any candidates who want to stand in the election, we have to make a declaration that we would be upholding the basic law that is the constitution of Hong Kong. And they said by doing what we had done, they do not believe that we would be genuinely upholding the basic law.

SB: Is there any truth to that?

AY: Well, of course, we did not agree to that. And in fact, we say these accusations are all ungrounded and unsound.

SB: So this is, I understand, linked to the new national security law, which officials said would not be retroactive. What do you make of that?

AY: I would say criminally, yes -- retrospect is a fact. But politically, they are using the elements under the national security law to scrutinize candidates in a retrospective way to trace back to what we have said or what we have done and said hang on you can't stand for the election because you breach this and that, although we are not using this piece of legislation to go against you criminally.

SB: What effect will all of this have on the pro-democracy movement?

AY: Disqualifying a dozen candidates will not make Hong Kong people give up on our beliefs. Now the election is postponed for one year, we do not know what would've happen in the coming year. But I still have faith in Hong Kong people that when it comes to polling day, when they cast their votes, they would still vote for someone who would stand on behalf of Hong Kong people.

SB: And the national security law went into effect at the beginning of the month. Critics such as yourself have said it was designed to stop, control pro-democracy protests. What have you seen in the city over the past month? Has it worked?

AY: Oh, in fact, together with the pandemic, basically the city has seen no protests, at least not approved ones. And since the law requires organizers to seek prior approval from the police before any protests or demonstrations, the pandemic becomes the best excuse for the authorities to reject any marches or protests or demonstrations.

SB: So how can you be so confident that pro-democracy support is as strong as you say it is and would be, were an election to be held at the regular date?

AY: I trust Hong Kong people and I have faith in our people that regardless of what's happening right now, people still share the values that we have been upholding -- that is freedom and democracy, human rights, and the rule of law. I am sure and confident that when we have a chance to cast our vote Hong Kong people will make the right decision.

SB: Mr. Yeung thank you for your time.

AY: Thank you very much.

CH: Alvin Yeung is a legislator and the leader of the Hong Kong Civic Party. We reached him in Hong Kong.

[Music]

Stage 3 restaurants

Guest: Jen Agg

CH: In Toronto today, the tape is coming off the playgrounds, movie theaters are opening their doors, gyms are back, and bars and restaurants can open their dining rooms. The city has officially joined stage three of Ontario's reopening plan. But not everyone is ready to take the plunge. Jen Agg owns four restaurants and a bar in downtown Toronto. And while some of her outdoor patios have been open, she doesn't plan on letting patrons eat inside anytime soon. We reached her in Toronto.

SB: Ms. Agg, beginning tonight, there are going to be a lot of bars and restaurants letting customers dine indoors. Why won't you be doing the same?

JEN AGG: Well, I just don't feel totally comfortable and safe with the idea of my staff being guinea pigs for this. And that's really what it is. And, you know, we're very much staff oriented company, and that's how every company should operate. But of course, they don't. And, you know, everything good that happens in the restaurant follows treating your staff well. So if you treat your staff well, they in turn often treat the customers well too. And it's just a really good decision for sleeping well at night as well as a good business decision.

SB: How did the staff feel about it?

JA: I think they're pretty happy that, you know, we're being so thoughtful and responsible. That's been the response so far. I'm not saying it's definitely not safe to dine in restaurants at half capacity, I really don't know. And that's the problem is that I really don't know.

SB: For the restaurants that are opening tonight, they're only allowed to operate at half capacity. And a lot of these restaurants will be making sure their staff are wearing all kinds of PPE. There's going to be all kinds of sanitation of the space going on. Why didn't you think that was enough?

JA: Well, because I just don't think we totally know that it is yet. And I think a lot of mistakes have been made in leadership from the beginning. Like, I don't understand why masking wasn't enforced right from the start. To me, I want to see, like, what it looks like in three weeks. Is there an uptick? Has this been a big problem? If it turns out that, yeah, people are being really smart, people are being really safe, then great. I'll think about it again. But I'm not sure that that's what's going to happen. And I also think when you throw drinking into the mix, it's another level of irresponsibility. Drinking and social distancing aren't friends.

SB: Well, it's an industry that has just been hit so hard by the economic fallout from COVID-19. And this is an opportunity to bring some more revenue in. Do you sympathize with owners who are reopening?

JA: Of course I do. You know, I understand that I'm also making a somewhat privileged decision. Not that I necessarily can afford to do this, but I understand that there are some people who absolutely cannot afford to do this. And I mean, in terms of our businesses, that's where we are. The industry has been totally devastated. We're no exception. Nobody's operating with six months of money in the bank to run their businesses. It's just not how the industry works. So, yeah, I mean, we have nothing really, except what we're making now from the patios that basically all proceeds go to the landlord, you know?

SB: All proceeds go to the landlords, what do you mean?

JA: We're working for our landlords right now, which is grossly unfair. I mean, CECRA is the rent subsidy...

SB: The federal government's program that helps commercial tenants pay their rent.

JA: Exactly. So we end up having to pay a quarter of our rent. They get 60 percent subsidized, so they end up with 75 percent, which to me is really fair. I mean, I've said it a million times, why should landlords be the only ones immune from market forces? So, yeah, the fact that it's being extended is a really good thing. It should be mandatory. That's a really disappointing thing, that it's not mandatory because not all our landlords are choosing to participate. So we have varying levels of help there. And really, when we're going to need the help is in the winter. You can't enclose and heat a patio and have it still be considered outside.

SB: Aren't there some restaurants that are just in the situation that you're worried about in the winter right now because they don't have patios?

JA: Absolutely. And I think the fact that we're able to get by has more to do than just that we have patios. You know, it's about profile. It's about that we can use my social media to promote the restaurants and reach a pretty large audience. Lots of restaurants don't have that. And I absolutely feel for them. I think our industry is going to be literally decimated. I would expect more than 50 percent by the end of the year to be gone. And I think the government doesn't understand the restaurant business. And I think that's a big part of the problem too. They don't really even know how to help.

SB: If 50 percent of restaurants were to go under because of COVID and everything that's happened in the last few months, how would that change the food industry?

JA: Oh my god, you know, that's something that's so scary. And I think it's almost impossible to predict the changes that will happen in terms of a new normal. I do think that if cities are responsible and smart about this and get their numbers down and get contact tracing -- once that stuff starts to happen in a real way that feels like we're getting our number super, super, super low, that changes things, you know. And I think that will allow for an industry to sort of come back to something different. But it is very scary to think that it's just gone forever. I mean, it's an industry I've grown up and it's an industry I've created in. And to think that kind of pulsing heartbeat, vibrancy that you feel when your restaurant is bouncing and booming with life, that that's just a feeling that will never happen again, that is terrifying to me.

SB: I can hear the energy and the frustration in your voice. How would you sum up how you feel about your business looking forward?

JA: I have sort of a strange answer for you. In some ways, it's very nice to be terrified about my businesses again because my husband had a stroke at the end of April. So that was my complete focus for the last few months. So for me, in a strange way, it's kind of nice to be petrified about losing all my businesses because it means my husband's getting better and I can look away from that long enough to be scared. That's my answer.

SB: I'm glad your husband's getting better.

JA: Me too.

SB: And I hope that your business improves. And thank you for talking to us.

JA: You too. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you.

SB: Goodbye.

CH: Jen Agg owns four restaurants and a bar in downtown Toronto. That's where we reached her.

[Music]

COVID vaccine

CH: Scientists have done in six months what usually happens in five years. That's what a Houston doctor said in an interview on this program on Monday following the news that the first phase-three coronavirus vaccine trial had launched in the U.S.. The country's top infectious diseases doctor, Anthony Fauci, spoke about that trial and others during a hearing in Washington today. And he assured politicians that despite the speed of the research, safety was not being compromised.

ANTHONY FAUCI: There's never a guarantee that you're going to get a safe and effective vaccine. But from everything we've seen now in the animal data, as well as the early human data, we feel cautiously optimistic that we will have a vaccine by the end of this year and as we go into 2021. So I don't think it's dreaming, congresswoman, I believe it's a reality and will be shown to be a reality.

CAROLYN MALONEY: That's very good news. The second step is: how do we distribute it? And also reports are that China and Russia are involved in their tests and that they have advanced tests across the world. They are testing in Brazil and Indonesia for their vaccines. Should they develop one earlier, would we manufacture it here? When we develop it, how do we plan to distribute it? We also have to think about the world, because if we don't cure it in the world, then we haven't cured it too. So the steps forward after the vaccines developed.

ANTHONY FAUCI: Sure. There are a couple of questions there. I'll try to answer them quickly, congresswoman. So the first thing is, I do hope that the Chinese and the Russians are actually testing the vaccine before they are administering the vaccine to anyone because claims of having a vaccine ready to distribute before you do testing, I think, is problematic at best. We are going very quickly. I do not believe that there will be vaccines so far ahead of us that we will have to depend on other countries to get us vaccines. I believe the program that is being sponsored by us right now and being directed and implemented by us is going at a very rapid speed. Prudent but rapid. Now, with regard to distribution already right now there are plans, as was mentioned, I believe, by ranking member Scalise, that we're taking at risk, financial risk, not safety risk, but financial risk, the development of doses of vaccine right now as we speak, so that they will be ready by the time we do show safety and efficacy, we'll be able to distribute it.

CH: That was Dr. Anthony Fauci answering questions from Democratic Representative Carolyn Maloney in Washington earlier today. Dr. Fauci is the director of the U.S. National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases.

[Music]

Pub emus

Guest: Chris Gimblett

CH: The Yaraka Hotel and Pub in Queensland, Australia, has a couple of regulars who've been getting out of hand lately -- well, out of wing. Kevin and Carol just can't seem to follow the rules. They grew up in the area and are frequent visitors to the hotel grounds. But last week, they learned to walk up the steps of the hotel itself and right into the pub where upon they exhibited some pretty bad behaviour. So bad, in fact, that they've been banned from entering the establishment. Now, we couldn't get Kevin and Carol on the line because they are emus -- giant, smelly, two metre tall emus. So we called a human instead. Chris Gimblett is the owner of the Yaraka Hotel and Pub. We reached Mr. Gimblett in Queensland.

SB: Chris, how have the emus been taking the news (that) they're no longer welcome in your pub?

CHRIS GIMBLETT: They've taken it pretty well, actually. They do hang around at the bottom of the steps, peering up into the dining room. But we've got them totally and completely bluffed at the moment with this plastic chain, which is sort of hanging between the two posts. Probably about half a metre off the ground with a sign hanging from the chain, just saying that they are banned. So it's working pretty effectively at the moment.

SB: Well, clearly, they can't read the sign, but they obey the barrier, is that it?

CG: That's exactly right. And emus are not a particularly intelligent creature. They're at the lower end of the scale of IQ. And they are just basically eating machines -- that's all they're interested in doing is eating. And so consequently, at the moment, because of the publicity that they have had, people tend to sort of carry a biscuit in their pocket or a bit of bread in their pockets, so they are getting fed much better than they normally are at the moment. I'd say they've put on a bit of weight over the last four or five days.

SB: So they're not suffering.

CG: They are definitely not suffering. No, they are extremely happy at the moment. And we get a lot of travellers here and we've got even more travellers now as a result of the emus going viral. [Chuckles] As a consequence, they're getting fed even more because every morning they go up to the caravan park, the trailer park, where everybody's having their breakfast and if they are not hand fed, they'll help themselves to toast down the toaster. They will drink from a mug of coffee, mug of tea -- a bit like a vacuum cleaner. They put their beak in and it is just gone. They don't knock the mug over. And if anybody has to be cooking a barbecue, you don't get between the barbecue and the emu and what's on the barbecue plate. They've got an amazing capacity to eat.

SB: Let me take you back to why you made the decision to ban these two. What were Kevin and Carol, as I understand they are named, what were they doing in the pub?

CG: Well, what happened is that they learned to walk up the three steps from the main street here onto the veranda. From the veranda, they had the choice of going straight into the dining room or into the bar. Now, that became a concern because I've expressed, you know, the desire of an emu is just to eat. So we have a full dining room full of people with meals in front of them, and the emus happen to walk up the steps, which they'd learned to do, they would make a beeline for the dining room. And you can imagine the disaster that would happen as they started eating all the meals off people's plates. But as I say, they're not the sharpest chisel in the rack. They're not terribly high IQ. And the other thing, too, of course, is that because they're eating all the time, this is going to be a bit difficult to translate politely I guess, their toileting habits happen fairly frequently. And something that resembles a sort of a sloppy bowl of porridge which is upturned from a height of one metre and lands on the ground and it spreads in sort of the splatter effect. I think you get the general idea of what I'm trying to say.

SB: I read you loud and clear on that. [Laughter] What were the favourites of Kevin and Carol? What did they aim for when they saw those plates in the pub?

SB: We had a breach, this must be about last year, and they had not learned to walk up the steps at that time, but someone had left the gate open at the back and we have got access to the pub from the hotel without any steps. So anyway, they got in and they went into the bar. One went behind the bar and one went in front of the bar. We had a tourist in the dining room who took a photograph of the emu, one behind the bar, one in front of the bar. We happened to put the photograph on Facebook, it caused a lot of amusement around the place.

SB: They sound, these emus, like they were working in tandem. They were co-conspirators.

CG: Absolutely. They normally sort of join together, walk together, do things together, eat together. Fortunately, they don't sort of toilet together, which is rather a relief.

SB: How did they come to be named Kevin and Carol?

CG: What happened was that we found eight abandoned eggs. So they were brought into town here. And there's a lovely lady in town who's called Leigh Ann, and she's a wildlife carer. So she took the eggs, she wrapped them up an electric blanket and put them in a cardboard cut and put them in the bedroom. Sometime later, she heard some tweaking noises and thereby we had 8 little emus wandering around the place -- well most of the time they wandered around behind Leigh Ann. And as they grew older, now got two left here, and that's how, that came. They are about probably a couple of years old now. They're delightful.

SB: They're delightful. So you imagine a future when you may let Kevin and Carol back into the pub if they learn how to behave themselves.

CG: They have been banned for life, I'm afraid. With this chain that we've got -- it is a plastic chain preventing them from coming up. Now we're hoping for the best, but we are planning for the worst. We may have to put something a bit more secure up there, but at this stage, it's got them totally bluffed and they're not coming up.

SB: So do they stand at this barrier and look at you with their sad emu eyes?

CG: They do stand at the bottom of the steps, peering around the place. We have a lot of people who gather on the veranda each and every morning with cups of tea and cups of coffee and this sort of thing, and the occasional one has a biscuit. And that's why they congregate in front of the hotel again. But they have certainly changed the dynamics of this little outback town in the last few days. Never before have we had camera crews setting up their equipment in the streets and journalists around the place and telephones ringing madly. And it's been quite an extraordinary event.

SB: Well, thank you for telling us about your celebrity emus.

CG: Thank you so much for your interest. Bye bye.

CH: Chris Gimblett is the owner of the Yaraka Hotel and Pub in Queensland, Australia. That's where we reached him.

[Music]

Part 2: Maryland Hajj

Maryland Hajj

Guest: Mona Eldadah

CH: If you'd asked her at the start of this year, Mona Eldadah would have told you that she was planning to go to Saudi Arabia for this year's Hajj. It would have been her first time attending the annual Muslim pilgrimage to Mecca. But, of course, she had to cancel her trip. The coronavirus has drastically reduced the number of people able to take part this year. Ms. Eldadah started brainstorming about what could be done at home in Maryland, and this past weekend she helped organize a drive-through Hajj. Hundreds of people showed up. Mona Eldadah is the creative director of the Next Wave Muslim Initiative in Maryland. We reached her in Silver Spring.

SB: Ms. Eldadah, what was it like for you when you realized you would not be able to travel to Saudi Arabia for this year's pilgrimage?

MONA ELDADAH: Very disappointing. It was very heartbreaking. The pilgrimage is something that Muslims look forward to experiencing once in their lifetime. It's actually an obligation for Muslims as long as you are physically, mentally, and financially able to do so. And so this year, I thought my four children have gotten older and this is now my opportunity, god willing, to make this pilgrimage. And then the stars just didn't align. It seemed to be not my time. But just like many things that change with the pandemic. I think it led to a bit of heartbreak, disappointment, but also understanding and creativity on how we could create something different, you know, when things don't go exactly as we planned.

SB: How did you come up with the idea for a drive-through Hajj?

ME: The drive through hedge came about when the team at our non-profit organization, Next Wave Muslim Initiative, was brainstorming on how we could make our rituals something that is really meaningful, particularly for the next generation to serve as an inspiration for them to have something to look forward to when they get older. In Mecca, where the pilgrimage takes place at the Kaaba, is the direction in which Muslims pray towards five times a day. So we wondered how can we create something that the children would be inspired by and to be encouraged by, especially at this time when the celebration in the mosques that would usually take place in the mosque was unavailable because of the pandemic. So oftentimes at at Muslim schools, they'll will have kind of reenactments where they build a small Kaaba and children are able to go through the the pilgrimage on a small scale. But we decided, is it possible for us to do such a thing and have cars drive through? And the way that we thought of it was almost like Christmas light shows -- that we have many in our area, when it's too cold for people to get out and walk around, but there's some way that you drive through and experience and you leave with your heart full, even though you weren't able to actually physically connect with someone. So that was our intention.

SB: So describe the scene for us, what it looked like at the school where you set this up.

ME: Yes. So the event was held at a private school. It's a small Quaker school. But the Quaker school is on a beautiful 140-acre campus and it's kind of a bit in the country. It's a little bit of a distance. But we had drivers come in and we built an eight foot by eight foot Kaaba that was built actually out of pvc pipe and black flannel cloth. My husband built the pvc pipe with my kids and I sewed twenty five yards of black flannel fabric. And we constructed it and put it in the centre of a traffic circle where typically parents would pick up their kids. At the actual pilgrimage site, the pilgrims, they walk, they circum ambulant the Kaaba's structure. In this case, the drivers drove around the traffic circle and were able to go multiple times. From there, they continued on the journey and we had actually given them a map at the beginning where they saw all the different rites of the pilgrimage and they were able to follow the map of the campus along to different stations. So some of the other stations, for example, after that was traversing between the hills of Safa and Marwa, which is something that pilgrims do in Mecca, which is a re-enactment of Hajar. And she was travelling, as the story goes, between the two hills in search of water for her baby. And so drivers in this case went and swerved their car in between two hills that we had created out of pieces of wood that was cut with a jigsaw and they swerved around safety cones. And I think the kids really enjoyed that. In the end, Hajar is rewarded with a spring of water and that water still as a spring until today, known as Zamzam Water. And the people who participated in our event got a bottle of water at the end and the bottle of water was relabeled to say almost like Zamzam Water. [Chuckles]

SB: Tell me some of the reaction of people who took part in this.

ME: Yes. So as the families drove through, they would often stop and just show so much gratitude and appreciation. Several people actually told me that it brought them tears and they were so happy to have a place to bring their children. Right now, with the pandemic, people are struggling in isolation and the stress of it, I think, is something that's of faith really helps to provide peace. And I think the event really allowed that for people where they could come together, where our values were shared and feel as though they were carried by this experience.

SB: Did you have any reaction from people who thought a drive-through Hajj might not have been a good idea?

ME: Prior to the event, no, absolutely not. Everybody was incredibly excited. But we did also hear that some people were confused and some Muslims were confused and concerned that perhaps this was going to be a recreation of the actual experience, as though we would be worshiping and praying towards this new small Kaaba that we had built, which certainly was not the case. This was clearly just an inspiration to Muslims to actually make the real pilgrimage, which is an incredible spiritual and awe-inspiring experience.

SB: Well, Ms. Eldadah thank you so much and Happy Eid.

ME: Thank you so much. I appreciate you sharing our story.

CH: Mona Eldadah is the creative director of the Next Wave Muslim Initiative. We reached her in Silver Spring, Maryland.

[Music]

Fire truck

CH: As a child, Edward Oke loved trucks, well one truck: a shiny red 1960s mercury M250 firetruck, not a toy one, a real one, which his dad drove for the volunteer fire brigade in Harbour Grace, Newfoundland. Some of his favourite memories are of Sunday mornings trucking around with his late father in that old timey pickup that does actually look like an enormous Tonka truck. His father loved to drive it -- And later, so did Edward. In 1988, the brigade sold that truck. And Edward Oke has missed it ever since. So much so that he's looked for it for years -- scrolling through Kijiji and classic car sites on the off chance that he'd find it. He knew, of course, that chance was exceedingly off. He did find an article once about a guy named Scott from Calgary who was refurbishing another 1960 Mercury M250. But that was the closest he'd ever come...until a few days ago. Edward Oke told the CBC's 'On The Go' all about it.

EDWARD OKE: I was dumbfounded. I actually think I skipped a few breaths. My wife wondered if I was okay when she saw me so white in the face.

MARTIN JONES: So Edward, is this the exact same truck, or is this just another model of the same type of truck?

EDWARD OKE: No, this is the exact truck. So it was actually sold at auction to a man from New Brunswick in 1988. He kept it for a long number of years. Scott told me that he had kept it mostly for hunting and just around in New Brunswick, and parked it in his barn. The man died a few years ago. And his son was selling it along with his estate. And Scott in Calgary, who had refinished the first one, was looking for another one. And so he contacted the man in Brunswick, bought it, and had it shipped out from the Brunswick to Calgary with the intent to refurbish it. And he started to refurbish it. He's put a lot of work into it already. But he knew it was a fire truck, he just didn't know much about it till he got it. And when he got it in the back of the fire truck, there was a sign that came with the truck originally. And it was a sign that said Harbour Grace Fire Department Anniversary -- 100th anniversary when they got the truck in 1960. And that's how he knew. That's how he knew the history. He ended up contacting some guys in Harbour Grace, friends of the family that I still know and trying to research it and get some information on.

MARTIN JONES: Wow. My mind is blown here. This is the exact same truck. I hope you ran out and bought a lottery ticket the same day.

EDWARD OKE: [Laughs] Well, the funniest the funniest part of the story is I called Scott right away in the morning and Scott and I talked for over an hour and he's very interested in the history of the truck. But when we talked, you know, it was such a connection for me. My wife, god bless her, said you've got to do it. You know, you can't pass this up. You'll never had the chance again to acquire that truck. So when Scott and I were talking later that day to negotiate a deal for the truck, my wife was actually -- we're on vacation. And as I said she was walking on the beach, just picking up some garbage on the beach. And she came back and she said you're never going to believe what I found. And I said, well, what did you find? She said that they found a red dinky fire truck on the beach. She said divine providence you need to buy this truck.

CH: Edward Oke speaking with the CBC's Martin Jones earlier this week.

[Music]

Cree Oilers jersey

Guest: Jack Cookson

CH: When Edmonton Oilers defenceman Ethan Bear took to the ice earlier this week, he was wearing a jersey with his name on it. But not written out "Bear" on the back. Written in Cree syllabics. Mr. Bear is from Ochapowace Nation in southern Saskatchewan. In a statement on the NHL website, he said wearing the new jersey is an honour. And the whole thing is bigger than just a big shirt. Jack Cookson is the owner of Pro Am Sports, which designed Mr. Bear's custom jersey nameplate. We reached Mr. Cookson in Edmonton.

SB: Jack, what was it like to see that jersey with the Cree nameplate worn on the ice this week?

JACK COOKSON: It was pretty exciting. Even more than exciting for us, it was exciting for Ethan, his family, and a great number of his fans worldwide.

SB: Well, what was Ethan Bear's reaction when he first saw the Cree name plate?

JC: Well, he was in training camp when we started working on this project initially with his girlfriend, who passed us on to his dad, who passed this on to his uncle who was the expert in the Cree syllabics. And once they signed off, we did up the artwork. And apparently she showed it to him last weekend and he was pretty fired up about it and was showing off the image in the dressing room to his teammates and his coaches. And obviously, somebody at the Oilers thought it was a good idea and good on them because, you know, at the end of the day, it's called an NHL uniform so they don't usually do this kind of thing. But for the exhibition game the other night against the Calgary Flames, they had him wear it. And it was pretty cool.

SB: So that wasn't a given. What do you think, was it a response to his excitement that the team decided to do it?

JC: That's a question for the Oilers. We work with Ethan throughout the hockey season, but we don't bug him, obviously on game days or while he was in training camp. And this is obviously a unique situation with them being in the NHL bubble.

SB: Why did you want to make this jersey?

JC: Well, how it all started was about a month ago, we had a guest come into the shop and ask if we could do a Kailer Yamamoto jersey with the Japanese Kanji characters. And we said we'll look into it. We figured it out. We tested to see if we could get it done on the jersey and we could do it. He signed off on it -- and not he, as in Kailer Yamamoto, but the customer. And we did one for him and we thought, well, why don't we do one for the shop just to see what people think. Got them back, and they looked really cool. And so we've done a lot with Ethan this winter. As I said, we worked with him many many times. And I said to my brother, who's my partner here, and he actually did all the research with Ethan's family and should get the credit for the hard work because there's a lot of twists and turns in the in the Cree syllabics from what I know.

SB: Right. I was going to ask you how challenging it was to get the Cree syllabics right.

JC: Well, we obviously don't speak the language, don't read and write the language. So we wanted to make sure that we didn't do something that was going to offend anybody. And of course, we wanted to get it right. So anyway, we'd worked with Ethan's family and they said, yep, you got it right. So, again, we did the artwork, tested it, and then put it on a jersey and last Wednesday made it available. And it was the following Saturday that he saw it for the first time, I guess. And then it's been a whirlwind week and a half.

SB: Yeah. And as you point out, he wore it in an exhibition game. Do you know if we'll be seeing the jersey in regular season of NHL?

JC: I think it would be fun and it was certainly well-received. And I will tell you this Susan, the thing that doesn't surprise me but seems to be surprising to so many others is that this is so universally interesting to not just the the Cree community. We've got orders from all over the world. We sent some to Dubai yesterday. And a lot of our guests have ordered both Yamamoto j ersey and the Bear jersey and have asked about can we do Athanasiou, another Oilers player, in Greek? Can we do Jujhar Khaira in Punjabi? So they're intrigued by it. But as far as will they ever do it again in an NHL game? That's a question for the Oilers and the National Hockey League.

SB: Well, when it comes to the Cree jersey, why do you think it's so special for so many people?

JC: Ethan has always made it very clear when we've worked with him in the past like he wants to give back to the community. And he even said in his statement when they announced that he was going to wear this, you know, he wants to inspire the next generation of Indigenous athletes, not just hockey players. And I think that's commendable.

SB: Have you heard from anyone who maybe isn't happy with a business profiting off this Cree nameplate?

JC: Well, I think you're going to find negative feedback with just about everything these days, especially with social media. So I've seen a couple of responses that we should be donating our our money to the Indigenous community. I'll put it to you this way, we use licensed products, we're a business that makes donations. I do have charities that I donate to, including one here in Edmonton called Sports Central that does sports equipment to kids of all cultures. You know, we don't give a portion of our profits to the German community when we sell a Leon Draisaitl jersey. I understand why it's being asked. But it's just not something that I'm overly concerned with. Because to be quite honest, the response that we've been receiving from the community has been incredible, overwhelmingly incredible. Lots of thank you emails. You know, instead of us thanking them for their business, which we obviously do, especially in these times, we're getting responses from many many of our guests to say thank you for doing this. Thank you for working with this family to get it right. Quite frankly, Susan, it's the most rewarding thing that we've ever done in my 30 years in this business.

SB: There seems to be a bit of a moment happening in sports right now with teams like Edmonton and Washington's football team looking at changing their names. What's it like to be part of that conversation?

JC: Personally, I'm for it. I think the time has come that change needs to be made. You know, the Cleveland baseball team, the Washington football team and obviously the Edmonton football team are well on their way to making those necessary changes. What worked in 1978 or 75 just doesn't work in 2020. And that's a good thing. Times change and progress is made. And I think this is tremendous progress.

SB: What is it about it that makes you so proud?

JC: The response from the guests. I just liked that, you know, we got it right. People are pleased with it. And it's got a lot bigger than we thought it would. When we planned this or started this, it was just some jerseys for Edmonton Oilers fans who wanted something different. And it's gotten a lot bigger. And maybe to your point, Susan, that's kind of what 2020 has become -- something bigger. I mean, this is a year none of us will ever forget.

SB: You can say that again. Thanks for your time today.

JC: Thank you.

CH: Jack Cookson is the owner of Pro Am Sports, which designed the Cree nameplate on Ethan Bear's Edmonton Oilers jersey. We reached Mr. Cookson in Edmonton.

[Music]

Red flag

CH: There's a word for people who are experts on flags, and here's a story that will vex all those vexillologists. Greg and Kjersten Offbecker are the owners of a bed and breakfast called the Nordic Pineapple in St. John's, Michigan. The pineapple part is just standard B and B whimsy. But the Nordic part isn't just quaint. Ms. Offbecker grandfather was born in Norway, which is why the Offbeckers had two flags flying on the giant pillars of their giant 19th century mansion. The Stars and Stripes and the flag of Norway, which is red with a blue cross on top of a white cross. Now they've taken both flags down. Not that they wanted to. In fact, they resented. As Greg Offbecker told the Lansing Street Journal, quote, "It bugs me as far as the stupidity of people. Even if the flag is blowing in the wind or lying limp, there are no stars on it. They look nothing alike." Now, what he means is the Norwegian flag looks nothing like the Confederate flag. But judging by a stream of angry emails and comments the Offbeckers endured, people thought they were proudly celebrating the antebellum American South instead of a Scandinavian place in the north. So now the flags are gone. The only flag they are waving now reluctantly, is a white flag of surrender, even though the red flag they raised should never have raised a red flag.

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July 31, 2020 Episode Transcript

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