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The AIH Transcript for May 24, 2019

Hosts: Carol Off and Jeff Douglas

Prologue

CAROL OFF: Hello I'm Carol Off.

JEFF DOUGLAS: Good evening. I'm Jeff Douglas. This is As It Happens.

[Music: Theme]

JD: Tonight...

CO: Northern plights. Rising temperatures are disproportionately affecting Canada's north --now, one First Nation in Yukon has declared a "climate change state of emergency."

JD: We failed her. The Supreme Court of Canada orders a new manslaughter trial for the man accused in the 2011 killing of Cindy Gladue -- saying that the criminal justice system let her down.

CO: Makes-it. Unable to deliver a Brexit deal that would please the European Union, the opposition, or even her own party, British Prime Minister Theresa May announces her resignation.

JD: A shameful discovery. The wreck of the last slave ship that brought men, women, and children, from Africa to the United States is found in an Alabama River.

CO: A spoonful of medicine did not help this sugar poem go down. Redpath Sugar asks Toronto poet laureate to compose some verse for its anniversary, but finds the end result a little too spicy.

JD: And the letter perfect. When a much-loved Atlanta postal worker retires after 30 years, the people in his neighbourhood decide to treat him like an overdue birthday card and send him somewhere first-class. As It Happens. The Friday Edition. Radio that appreciates the comforts of mail bonding.

[Music: Theme]

Part 1: Old Crow Climate Emergency

Old Crow Climate Emergency

Guest: Dana Tizya-Tramm

JD: From floods to forest fires, the effects of climate change are being felt across the country. But they are especially pronounced in Canada's north, where temperatures are rising at roughly three times the global mean warming rate. The Vuntut Gwitchin First Nation is watching the effects of rising temperatures. And with that in mind, it has just declared a "climate change state of emergency." And its leaders are urging other communities to join them. Dana Tizya-Tramm is the Chief of the Vuntut Gwitchin First Nation. We reached him in Old Crow, Yukon -- a small community north of the Arctic Circle.

CO: Chief Tizya-Tramm first of all what does climate change actually look like in your community?

DANA TIZYA-TRAMM: Climate change represents itself in new birds showing up that we've never seen before that we don't have words for in our traditional language. Climate change means cliffs falling into our rivers. It means furs no longer priming the same for our trappers. It means that the animals are confused. The weather has changed. Our land is changing. And our elders continually say that I've never seen this before.

CO: What about the seasons?

DANA TIZYA-TRAMM: The seasons are also changing. So the month of May in the Gwitchin language translates to the "month of crusted snow." This is now happening in April. We're no longer getting -60 anymore, which the elders say is important to clean the land. All of our seasons are changing. Some are coming later and others are coming earlier.

CO: What are you hearing from other communities who are north of the Arctic Circle?

DANA TIZYA-TRAMM: Oh very much the same. Much to do with fish as well as a drop in bird populations. As one elder, in Alaska village -- Trimble Gilbert -- said is the birds are no longer singing to the Gwitchin people. We're also already seeing mercury leaching from permafrost and from the Richardson Mountains -- and we're finding it in our fish, in our waters. Also when the river systems and the water systems get occluded with particles, it seems to limit the bugs which limit the birds which goes all the way up the food chain.

CO: And so what you have done is you've declared a climate change a state of emergency. What will that do?

DANA TIZYA-TRAMM: Well the biggest part is to invite the rest of the world and especially Canadians into the Gwitchin view. Now this isn't engaging a municipal status for instance. Actually this form of declaration isn't much of a present day but a Gwitchin declaration of emergency because at the end of the century what my children and what my nieces and nephews are going to be seeing when they are elders is going to change the entire trajectory of our people in a few generations. And time and space for Gwitchin people are very different --as we have relationships with our great grandparents and their grandparents. And they have words and did things in their lives directly for us today and they spoke about it. And so for us to have all of this changed so quickly it is a Gwitchin state of emergency. And I feel it's very much our duty to invite the rest of the country and the world into what we're seeing because you know the International Panel on Climate Change's sixth report can be compartmentalized, objectified, and tucked in the back folds of your mind -- and especially for people in the cities where over the average temperature rise in Canada has been about 1.7 degrees, studies are showing from 1948 to 2016. Well in the Canadian north it's been 2.3 degrees. And as a people so close to the animals and lands we're seeing everything now. This is far more than just an inconvenience to the GDP economy or a way of life. This is a reality and we are on the frontlines and we really need to bring others past the science into the reality of what's coming for them because the north is [inaudible] and this weather it's only going to increase. And the important part about this is that industry, all leaders in governments, and the people are going to be the trinity that creates the solution to this and that's what this declaration does.

CO: You say that you feel and see yourselves as being on the frontlines of the issue of climate change. Other communities around the world are saying the same thing. There's small island nations in the Pacific that are about to disappear underwater. Coastal communities in Asia. People who live off the coast of the land -- and Indigenous people are setting up this cry everywhere. It doesn't seem to be that the power where powers are which are in big urban centres that there is much understanding or concern about that. How can you possibly get the Gwitchin message out?

DANA TIZYA-TRAMM: Well you touched on a very important point. We need to create a synergy between intelligence and between knowledge. If this is not the issue that doesn't permeate caste and creed, political stripes, and all walks of life, and bring us together around a solution then nothing will. This is the part in the movie where everybody starts working together in spite of the great challenges. But also we can never underestimate the power of the people. And I love William Burroughs writes that, artists are the true architects of change while politicians are the last to recognize it. We cannot pay attention to all of the blocks that are stopping us. Right now, we need to have conversations with each other. Yes, with leaders -- political leaders -- especially with industry, but also with each other. And the more awkward these conversations are, the more that they are needed. And there is a pathway forward.

CO: You're in your early 30s so what do you see for your grandchildren?

DANA TIZYA-TRAMM: I see a time of great adaptation and a time of great loss and innovation. We are going to lose many of our traditional areas. There's going to be a lot of change, but we can come out on top of them. The animals are going to change. We're going to lose some of our staunch populations, likely some fish as well. But we need to establish and find new ones. So although these times can be scary and although we are facing and looking at some great changes, nature has an incredible ability to rebound but we have to respect that and give nature the room to do that. If we keep creating these pressures and if we limit the areas for the animals and the waters to clean themselves then we've truly lost our way as a people that belong and come from the great lands that Canada is established in.

CO: I'm going to take from what you're saying that you do have some sense of optimism -- this is possible, and we'll hold onto that. Chief Tizya-Tramm thank you for speaking with us.

DANA TIZYA-TRAMM: I truly appreciate it. Massi Cho.

JD: Dana Tizya=Tramm is the chief of the Vuntut Gwitchin First Nation. We reached him in Old Crow, Yukon -- a small community north of the Arctic Circle.

[Music]

Theresa May Resignation

Guest: Tom Tugendhat

JD: Theresa May has had enough. The UK's Brexit-beleaguered Prime Minister endured round after fruitless round of negotiations with the EU, followed by defeats at the hands of her own Conservative MPs. And then at this morning, the usually cool Ms. May stood outside Number 10 Downing Street and made this emotional announcement.

SOUNDCLIP

THERESA MAY: I will shortly leave the job that it has been the honour of my life to hold. The second female prime minister, but certainly not the last. I do so with no ill will but with enormous and enduring gratitude to have had the opportunity to serve the country I love. [Chokes up]

JD: That was Theresa May announcing her plans to resign as the Prime Minister of the UK earlier today. Now it is up to Ms. May's Conservative Party to pick her successor. Tom Tugendhat is a Conservative MP, and the Chair of the UK's Foreign Affairs Committee. We reached Mr. Tugendhat in Tonbridge, England.

CO: Mr. Tugendhat what do you think finally convinced Theresa May that it was time to go?

TOM TUGENDHAT: Well I think the Prime Minister found out really that she'd run out of road which is hardly surprising. She's tried three times to bring her withdrawal agreement through Parliament -- and the fourth time it had become clear that it wasn't going to pass. And so the reality was obvious.

CO: But what has really accomplished with her resignation? Do you think somebody else could do the job?

TT: Well I think that we need to try -- and it's quite clear that we need somebody who can strike an agreement with European Union and sell it at home. And despite her enormous devotion to duty it became clear that was not one of the things that was going to happen.

CO: But is it possible that somebody else could do it? I mean she was dealt a rather bad hand, wasn't she? She became party leader just after the Brexit vote which was a bit of a surprise. And then you have an election where you become -- the Conservatives -- become a minority. Was it her or was it the hand she was dealt that's really at fault here?

TT: Well I think there's obviously a combination. Nobody is pretending that this was an easy time in UK political history. But it's also true that you know you need leaders who can take you through it. And sadly the Prime Minister's demonstrated over three years that she was unable to accomplish the task.

CO: A number of critics over this time have said that she played her cards too close to the vest -- that she didn't take people, and she didn't get good advice, and she didn't consult the public, she didn't keep people apprised of what she was doing. That there were a whole bunch of things that she could have done to at least have had more allies. Do you think that's true?

TT: Well I think it's always important to try and be inclusive in politics because that's the way you bring people with you and you share the journey and that makes it easier for people to make the compromises that become clear. So I mean I think that's certainly something that I would hope that the new leader would do.

CO: I mean we talk about these compromises -- I mean Theresa May has bounced between an unwilling Europe. There's no evidence that Europe is going to change its position at this point. And then you have the hardline Brexit-ers in your own party who are unwilling to change. So what are these compromises that somebody else is going to be able to make?

TT: Well let's see what the new leaders come back with. I'm not going to pre-empt them. But certainly one of my jobs as Chair of Foreign Affairs Committee is to go around Europe and indeed around the country too -- and I do hear that there is possibility of discussing various elements but I'm not going to pre-empt it now.

CO: I'm sorry, but to whatever degree you can tell us. You're hearing that there was wiggle room. There were possibilities to maneuver that Theresa May didn't know about or didn't take?

TT: I think a lot of negotiation is down to individuals and down to personalities. And sometimes it's hard for people who have found themselves in long protracted negotiations to vary some of the starting positions long long after. And I think that's the situation we find ourselves in. And we're about to have a new prime minister in the United Kingdom, and very shortly we're going to have a new president of the European Council, a new president of the European Commission, and almost certainly a new president of the European Parliament. And given that those are all very big changes I think that we'll have to think again about how we structure ourselves and how we structure the talks going forward.

CO: Well to continue with all of our mixed metaphors -- you're saying basically that they're going to be fresh horses, they're going to be change in that regard, and that is actually going to be able to get things back on the road?

TT: Well look I'm not going to go down the amount of police metaphors [laughter] and talk about that. But you know I do strongly suspect that eventually the Mountie will get his man.

CO: And so when you say Mountie will get his man -- what does that mean? What do you think will be accomplished ultimately?

TT: Well the truth is that we're talking about 3000 years of history coming to now in during which we've had a very mixed relationship with our nearest neighbours and partners. Sometimes we have got along very well and sometimes we go on very badly. And the job that we've really got to do now is not to be theological about the European Union but to be pragmatic about how do we work together, how do we communicate, share responsibilities, and build a future that looks more like the last 70 years of peace than any other period of 70 years that one could care to mention.

CO: Can I just ask you about successor-ship? Because who looks most likely -- the talk is around Boris Johnson is that what we're looking at?

TT: So it's quite clear that he's the front runner at the moment. But you know the history of front runners isn't always glorious. So let's see what happens. I think the most important thing is that we need a debate because we need to discuss the ideas and we need to see whether the candidates can present them. And that's something we'll have to see what happens.

CO: But how much damage has this done to the Conservative Party do you think?

TT: It's hard to say. I mean at the moment it's clearly not one of our best moments. But we'll have to see how this goes forward.

CO: But whoever gets chosen as the leader is someone that has no mandate from the country and no majority in the House of Commons. So how desirable do you think is that job -- would you take it?

TT: [Chuckles] Well I've already said I'm not running. But the mandate in our system -- very much like yours -- is achieved through the majority you're able to command in the parliament. So let's see where that gets to. I'm really sorry I'm going to have to go.

CO: Just finally, how soon will we see an election do you think in the UK?

TT: It's very hard to say. I think it's unlikely that there'll be one this year, but it's eminently possible.

CO: All right we'll be watching. Mr. Tugendhat thank you.

TT: Okay. Cheers. Bye.

JD: Tom Tugendhat is a British Conservative MP, and Chair of the UK's Foreign Affairs Committee. We reached him in Tonbridge, England.

[Music]

Retiring Mailman

Guest: Floyd Martin

JD: To the people along his route in Marietta, Georgia, Floyd Martin is more than just a mail carrier. After nearly 30 years, he has become like family. And so when Mr. Martin announced that he was retiring, the neighbourhood knew it had to do something special. Yesterday, on his last day they threw a massive block party -- and hundreds of people showed up. We reached Floyd Martin at his home in Atlanta, Georgia.

CO: Floyd how is retirement treating you so far?

FLOYD MARTIN: Well it's been busy and hectic with everything that's coming to me right now.

CO: When did you first get a sense that you were going to be feted -- that there were people aware that you were retiring and they were going to respond? What was your first clue that your customers were going to respond like this?

FM: When one of my co-workers told me that I had customers come up to the office and they were telling them what they wanted to do. The reason she told me is because she was trying to make sure I was going to be at work because I had sick leave that I could have used before I retired and I had used some of it. But she wanted to make sure that I wouldn't miss out on all of this goodness.

CO: Because the neighbourhood where you deliver mail was going to throw you a giant party.

FM: Yes.

CO: And what was that party like?

FM: It was amazing. It was epic. It was full of love. It just filled my heart so full of joy. It was amazing. I thought about it all day. I have been thinking about it all day. It was unbelievable.

CO: That's not the only thing, right, as you did your last route of delivering the mail in that neighbourhood what did people do to celebrate you?

FM: They decorated their boxes with balloons and the Hawaiian leis, they wrote messages, they had pictures of me from Facebook, pictures of me when I was in high school. The whole route did that and I have close to 500 stops. I was in tears when I first started. It was so hard heartwarming that I just couldn't believe what I was seeing. It was so beautiful.

CO: People came out with their memories with something that you had done that had touched them. And that's why they were responding that way. What were some of the things that people were remembering about your relationship with that neighbourhood?

FM: One of my customers remembered how I took care of her mother. She said I made her feel safe. I think she has early either dementia or something going on but she knows who I am and I make her feel safe. Another customer was telling me that she was going through a rough time and I was there for -- you know I listened to her, I helped her through it. You know I don't have children, so the children on my route I felt like they were mine. The animals on my route I loved. I took out cat food and milk bones every day to give to their fur-babies. [Chuckles]

CO: And you didn't have any of the traditional postman encounters with dogs?

FM: No. My dog's looked for me. They were happy to see me. [Laughs] They came by wagging their tail when they saw me coming. They knew I had some goodies.

CO: How did you have time to do that? You have 500 people in your route. How are you able to connect with so many different members?

FM: I took time. I took time you know. I don't know that the post office would have agreed with what I was doing, but that was me. You know? When my customers talked, I listened. I could have been the last person or the only person they saw that day. I was just being me.

CO: The post office didn't know -- your employer -- didn't know you were doing that.

FM: I doubt it. I doubt it. I don't think they would encourage feeding animals. [Chuckles] I think they would tell us not to feed the animals -- but you know I did. I did what was in my heart, you know.

CO: You had not just this party and not just the mailboxes and the stories -- something else happened. You had a dream of going on a trip and I understand that now...

FM: Oh my God yes.

CO: What's happened there?

FM: And that's come into light -- Delta saw this story and offered to fly me to Hawaii.

CO: And if you're going there you need a fair bit of cash. You got to go on that trip because it was a GoFundMe campaign.

FM: I know. And I didn't know about it. I mean the news knew about it before I did it. [Laughs] Because you know they're following twitter or whatever -- it's giving out all the information. Because a friend of mine told me, yeah Delta is sending you to Hawaii. I'm like, huh? I discovered by looking on Facebook. I mean it has been wild and crazy. Oh my...I'm so mind boggled. I'm just trying to take all of this in. I don't know what to say.

CO: I know what to say to you which is that: Have a great retirement and bon voyage on your trip. And thank you so much for speaking with us.

FM: Thank you for wanting to speak to me. Thank you. I appreciate that.

JD: Floyd Martin is a newly-retired mail carrier. We reached Mr. Martin in Atlanta.

[Music]

Part 2: Last slave ship to bring people to the U.S. discovered in Alabama

Cindy Gladue Decision

Guest: Jean Teillet

JD: The criminal justice system let down Cindy Glaude -- "indeed, it let all of us down." That is the message from the Supreme Court of Canada which today ordered a new manslaughter trial for the man accused in M. Gladue's 2011 death. Bradley Barton was acquitted of murder and manslaughter in a 2015 trial that repeatedly saw Ms. Gladue -- a Metis sex worker, referred to as a "native" or a prostitute. According to the court, the trial judge failed to respect Ms. Gladue's privacy and dignity and to uphold so-called "rape shield" laws. Jean Teillet is a lawyer for Women of the Metis Nation, one of the interveners in this case. We reached her in Ottawa. And a warning: the details of this case are graphic and disturbing.

CO: Ms. Teillet what is the importance of this decision today?

JEAN TEILLET: I think there are big messages that are being sent to women in Canada and Indigenous women in Canada from this court case. And so I think that the idea that the Supreme Court will make sure that there is justice available I think that's the biggest message that comes out of this. Although I must say it's a mixed message.

CO: Because the system as Justice Michael Moldaver said in this decision -- he said that the system failed to give Cindy Gladue the full protection of the law. In what way did it fail her?

JT: How did it fail her? Let me count the ways. Virtually every myth and inappropriate way of bringing forward a sexual assault case happened in this trial. All the ideas that we have developed for the last I'd say 30 years trying to deal with violence against women, the rape shield law, all of these things are setting out principles to try and combat the myth that you consent or that you consent because you're native or you consent to violence or that you asked for it -- all of those myths and ideas permeated this trial. From the opening comments of the Crown who referred to Cindy Gladue as a prostitute and native. Now you would say well what's wrong with calling her native? Well the fact is that it had absolutely nothing to do with this trial. Nothing. So why raise it?

CO: More than just raise it -- she was described or called a native or a prostitute more than 50 times in the course of this trial.

JT: Yeah absolutely. So I mean the issue of her being called a prostitute is one thing but calling her native, why? The only reason is to raise an inference that somehow she was more likely to consent: because of course she would...because she's a native girl, or who cares about -- she has less human dignity, she's not worth your trouble, right? And then if you go into the issue that they called her a prostitute -- the idea that a prostitute would consent to such violent sex that killed her is absolutely another thing that our law has spoken to decades ago. There should be no reason that this case stumbled along on all these issues. And every single thing the Crown got it wrong, the defense got it wrong, and the judge got it wrong.

CO: As you say let me count the ways -- I mean the Supreme Court did count the ways, didn't it? Again pointing out the trial judges failed to hold a rape shield hearing in the absence of a jury on Cindy Gladue's sexual activity. What's the significance of that?

JT: The point is that you're supposed to try and filter out any evidence that tends to suggest the jury would assume she consented or that she's not capable of belief. And that whole rape shield hearing is supposed to filter that stuff out but they didn't do it. Nobody did it. The Crown didn't do it. The defense has no interest in doing it of course. And the judge didn't insist on it. So that's the significance here in what Justice Moldaver said here very strongly is it's the buck stops with the judge -- the judge is making reversible error if he or she doesn't insist on having a hearing because otherwise this evidence permeates the trial and taints it and then it's going to go back for trial. And that's exactly what happened here.

CO: Cindy Gladue bled to death after she was found to have a 11 centimeter long wound inside her vagina. Probably the most egregious part of this -- let me count the ways list is they actually brought the tissue of her genitals into the court. In the course of this trial that was absolute shocking. Had you ever seen anything like that before?

JT: I don't think it's ever happened before. And I would say it's even more shocking Carol... Cindy's mother was in the court that day and no one told her that this was going to happen. I invite all your listeners to imagine what that would be like. It's another one of those egregious things that happened in this trial. And the worst part of it for me out of the Supreme Court of Canada's judgment that came down today is that not one of those seven judges even mentioned that the state cut up Cindy Gladue's body and served it up in court as a piece of evidence -- called it tissue and the specimen. Everything you could do to dehumanize her. And I think all women in Canada should be justly horrified and I am appalled at the deafening silence of the court on this issue. They said not one word. And I think we should all raise our voices in protest about it.

CO: Just want to close with what Justice Michael Moldaver wrote about Cindy Gladue which is quite important. This is the quote, "Her life mattered. She was valued. She was important. She was loved. Her status as an Indigenous woman who performed sex work did not change any of that in the slightest." And then he went on to say how she had been failed. How important was it for you to hear that?

JT: I actually was very moved by that and I remain moved by it. I think it was a very big indication of how much he and the court care about this and I value that very much. So I think it's important. And I made sure that those words were read to Cindy's mother this morning because I thought she needed to hear that the court cared about Cindy as well and honored her as a mother and a daughter and a friend and somebody who was valued -- that her life had meaning. And I thought it was very important.

CO: How is the family dealing with the news though that they will now be facing another trial?

JT: You know there was no good message here for them. You know if anything can be said to be good out of this Carol you know either way it goes back down to trial and they have to relive what was a horror show before or they don't send it back and then there would be no justice. They want justice. Cindy's mom wants justice for her daughter and her daughters want justice for their mother. But it will mean having to go through this all over again and that will be something that I wouldn't wish on anyone. It's a terrible thing to have to put a family through and to have to put them through it twice. It's almost inconceivable. But I think those words from Justice Moldaver did mean something to Cindy's mom.

CO: Ms. Teillet I really appreciate speaking with you. Thank you.

JT: Okay. Thanks Carol.

JD: Jean Teillet is a lawyer for Women of the Metis Nation. We reached Ms. Teillet in Ottawa.

[Music]

A. F. Moritz

JD: When Redpath Sugar asked Toronto's poet laureate to write a poem about sugar, they most likely assumed that he'd write a sweet little ditty. But A.F. Mortiz's poem made no mention of layer cakes or lollipops or anything of the sort. He ended up writing a poem about the sugar industry's history of slavery and industrialization. That was not quite what Redpath had in mind. The company is set to celebrate its 60th anniversary this weekend at an event where Mr. Moritz was planning to read the poem. But yesterday, he got an email from the organizers who told him it was not celebratory enough and that he would no longer be invited to read it. Well Redpath's loss is our gain. We invited Al Moritz to the studio to read "The Current of the Sugar." The poetic form is known as a "glosa" where a poet takes four lines from an admired poem and integrates each of those lines into a new poem. Mr. Moritz used a poem by John Redpath -- the founder of Redpath Sugar as his inspiration. Written in 1858, it reads as follows [Reading].

SOUNDCLIP

JD: "The Lord gave us a beauteous flower

To cherish for a day

And in the morn his angel sent.

To take our flower away."

JD: Now here is A.F. Moritz reading his poem.

SOUNDCLIP

A.F. MORITZ: Down a shady lane through the sugar cane, the good

old song tells us, a burly bum came hiking,

singing of the land of honey. In the sun,

the canes were arrowing far above his head,

the white-shining flags, proud horsetails, each one made

of thousands of flowers, each flower with its single seed,

preparing the sugar of next year—our dower

we never earned. Given for no reason from the earth,

and beautiful. So that the cane could never be

only a grass for humans to see and devour,

wisely the lord gave us a beautiful flower.

Soon the cutters would have to come to the fields,

bent, with heavy knives felling the shade,

cutting stems into even lengths, bundling, stacking,

discarding the flowers, then in the sweat of their brows

returning from the brutal beautiful sun

in the cooler evening, the greatening dark, their children

seeming to merge into night. And in this way,

the old life in forests and on shores almost gone,

the people lived, in mighty despair could laugh and pray,

and the earth still had them to cherish for a day.

I’ve seen the sugar in port before the lading

being washed to exorcise the impure, the molasses

that otherwise would settle to wormwood tar.

We’ve seen the great bulk carrier in glassy or heavy seas,

stolidly coming. In Youngstown once in the furnace

we saw iron for her hull still only liquid fire.

Our daughters were born and died, and in our mourning

we went back to the office or the line,

to the mill, now our whole world, our blessing, our warning.

The lord saw, and sent his angel in the morning.

One day by Sugar Beach the Solina docked—

home port Nassau, under flag of the Bahamas, the heaven

of the sugar cane. Was she the angel?—Solina,

sunlight in the eastern wind, floating castle of steel.

A towering loader stabbed its green beak down her hold,

swivelled...into the factory bays poured torrents

of raw grains. The whole current of the sugar lay

there in our seeing, from sunburst panicle to marzipan rosette,

the world-stream where all will drink health every day ….

if the lord is not to take our flower away.

JD: That was A.F. Moritz, Toronto's poet laureate, reading his poem entitled, "The Current of the Sugar" here in the As It Happens studio.

[Music]

Slave Ship Found

Guest: Mary Elliott

JD: The Clotilda was a slave ship. It is known to have carried men, women, and children from Benin, Africa, to Alabama, to be sold as slaves. It was the last known ship to smuggle people from Africa to the United States. And though experts knew it existed, they did not know where the wrecked ship was. And then an announcement this week, the remains of the wreck of the Clotilda had been identified in the Mobile River in Alabama. Mary Elliott studies slave ship wrecks, and works at the Smithsonian's National Museum of African-American History and Culture. That is where we reached her.

CO: Mary as you know people have been looking for this slave ship or its remains for years -- what's been the reaction since it was confirmed that the Clotilda has been discovered?

MARY ELLIOTT: The reaction since it's been confirmed that the Clotilda was discovered has been absolutely amazing. For me, not surprising. But very very happy to see the response that we've received. The community is over the moon because this is a sense of knowing about this history for so long and to be able to have this history in a tangible form means the world to them.

CO: And what made it so difficult to track down?

ME: It is because once they actually brought the ship in to Mobile, the folks who were involved -- the Meaher family -- they actually did this during the period of the illegal slave trade. And so when they brought that ship in and they offloaded all of the human cargo for lack of a better word these African men, women, and children they intentionally burned the ship to hide any evidence of their involvement in this illegal trade.

CO: They went to great lengths, didn't they, to try and destroy and hide that ship and have it sunk to the bottom of the channel.

ME: And the irony of it is by burning this ship it gave us a marker to really identify whether it was the ship.

CO: The people who owned the Clotilda and who were involved in this trade -- this illegal trade -- they considered it a kind of a challenge, didn't they? I mean the idea that they could continue to bring in slaves right under the noses of customs and under the noses of the authorities was kind of a challenge to them wasn't it?

ME: That is the understanding that this was part of a bet. That is one of the things that's very unfortunate about this story that the lives of these folks -- you know we're used to contextualizing it in terms of economics and politics and power -- but this literally apparently was a venture to just prove a point at the cost of human lives.

CO: And who were they? Tell us a bit about those who were on that ship.

ME: You had about 109 who came over. The majority of them landed in the area that became Africatown but somewhere dispersed throughout Alabama. But you have this group that are offloaded in that area where the ship came in and then they survive this brutality of slavery even though it's 1860 there were still five more years that slavery went on until the Civil War ended in 1865. So it's real interesting -- makes to think of people who were brought over directly from Africa and now we're situated in an environment where you have African-Americans who have lived through generations of enslavement. But in that human story you see people still have this sense of resistance and resilience and survival. I say that all the time because we can linger on the human suffering, but you have to talk about the strength of the human spirit because they survived through this and went on to create what became Africatown -- that community comprised of the various neighbourhoods.

CO: There are descendants of the people who were on that ship, is that right? And have you spoken with them?

ME: I actually spoke with some folks last night. There was a gentleman -- he is a descendant of Africantown. He has not traced his descendants directly to some of the folks who came off the Clotilda but he said this moment for him was like the moment when Martin Luther King marched across the Selma Bridge. He said because it's this opportunity for the world who's looking and watching to see how important this history is, how important it is for us to make a change, and to reconcile, and to confront this history directly. And when he told me that last night, I literally was brought to tears. The young lady who is a direct descendant said that she couldn't really put it in words. But in the moment, her excitement is to be able to continue to pass the story down to the next generation and to do it in an even more powerful way knowing that this ship has been found and it really straight speaks about the truth of this experience and the strength of her ancestors. So very very moving.

CO: It's interesting that all the efforts to try and conceal and to destroy this ship so that no one would see the evidence and yet somehow the spirit of that boat wasn't going to let them get away with it. There was just too much that had happened. Too many lives had been affected by that it seems.

ME: I think so. And like I said that's why I use the word this sense of knowing. And also it's important because some people try to refute this history and there it is tangible. And so I think it's important that we shine a spotlight on that -- that people are thinking about this history.

CO: What will become now of the remains of this boat?

ME: That's for us to see -- in terms of what Alabama Historical Commission in conjunction with the community members what they decide collectively. Our interest is to have an opportunity to tell that story here in the National Museum, but definitely in support of keeping materials in Alabama as well because it has to be told locally and nationally to contextualize it in those two areas. So again that is to be determined by the Alabama Historical Commission and the community members. They are very adamant about staying in conversation with the community and helping the community -- guide them in their next step.

CO: All right. We'll leave it there. Mary thank you.

ME: Thank you so much. My pleasure.

JD: Mary Elliott is the curator of slavery and freedom at the Smithsonian's National Museum of African-American History and Culture. We reached Ms. Elliott in Washington D.C. And we do have more on this story on our website: cbc.ca/aih.

[Music]

David Eby

JD: British Columbia just lost another battle against the Trans Mountain pipeline project. In a decision today, the B.C. Appeal Court ruled that the province cannot impose an environmental law that would block heavy oil -- or diluted bitumen -- from coming into the province. That law could have killed the pipeline extension. Now, the decision is expected to go to the Supreme Court of Canada. Here is the Attorney General of British Columbia, David Eby, speaking with reporters after the decision was announced.

SOUNDCLIP

DAVID EBY: So the aim of this regulation is to protect our coast and local jobs and wildlife from the catastrophic effects of the diluted bitumen spill. And that is what it is aimed at. We believe that we have the right and authority to regulate substances that are brought in including through inter-provincial pipelines which is where the court and our position parted company in this decision. We would like clarification from the Supreme Court of Canada on that question. And we think it's critically important as elected officials in British Columbia elected to protect British Columbians interests especially economic interests to ensure that we have the protections in place to prevent a catastrophic spill.

REPORTER: This has been a unanimous decision by the Court of Appeal. And many of the constitutional lawyers -- experts -- have said that there was no chance this government is going to win. Other than yourself believing it. So how much money we have spent on this and where is a stop to using tax payers money to do a David versus Goliath kind of legal battle?

DAVID EBY: Well there are a number of points within your question that I disagree with. And for starters there is certainly authority for the proposition we were arguing in front of the court which is that British Columbia has the ability to regulate harmful substances brought into our province including through railways or inter-provincial pipelines. The court disagreed with us. But I don't agree with your suggestion that the only people saying that we had this authority were the B.C. government -- that's not the case. Simply not true. But what I would like to say is that in terms of the financial cost of going to court to clarify this question, to clarify the extent of our jurisdiction, it is a fraction of a fraction of the costs of a catastrophic diluted bitumen spill in terms of the impacts on the economy, on jobs, and just cleaning up the mess. So we think it's worthwhile in terms of clarifying our ability to protect British Columbians from this catastrophic outcome.

JD: That was B.C. Attorney General David Eby speaking to reporters today.

[Music]

Part 3: Audible hockey puck could revolutionize the sport for blind players, say researchers

Al Qaeda Fighter

Guest: Graeme Wood

JD: John Walker Lindh is now a free man. In 2001, a few months after the 9/11 attacks Mr. Lindh was found in Afghanistan where he had been training and fighting in an al-Qaeda camp. At the time of the U.S. "War on Terror" Americans were shocked to learn that a young and privileged man from California had taken up arms with al-Qaeda. Well this week, Mr. Lindh was released early from federal prison in Indiana where he had been serving a 20 year sentence. Graeme Wood is not convinced Mr. Lindh is a changed man. Mr. Wood is a staff writer for The Atlantic, and he corresponded with Mr. Lindh while he was in prison. We reached Graeme Wood in New Haven, Connecticut.

CO: Graeme, this man John Walker Lindh was the first American to face charges during the War on Terror after 9/11. This is just after 9/11. What do you make of the fact that he is now a free man?

GRAEME WOOD: Well he's served his time. He was sentenced to 20 years -- and gets 15 percent off for good behaviour. And good behaviour in his case is unsurprising. He didn't join any prison gangs, didn't shiv anyone, seems to have spent most of his time in study and reading. Unfortunately the study and reading seems to have brought him possibly closer to jihadism rather than further away from it.

CO: Why are people so distressed -- so many Americans and right up to the president's office -- why are they so upset that he's been released if he has served his time?

GW: Well you have to remember that this guy got pulled from the rubble in December 2001 at a time when I think most Americans thought that al-Qaeda was a bunch of Arabs. And no, it turned out at least one of them was one of us. And so the feeling of betrayal was very acute then and of course we now think of him as just the first in a long line of westerners who have gone to the path of jihad.

CO: You mentioned how he was pulled from the rubble of this prison Qala-i-Jangi in northern Afghanistan. There was a battle in fact inside that prison between the al-Qaeda and Taliban prisoners and the Americans and the other allies -- Northern Alliance. What happened? Because this was also the first U.S. casualty that was inside that prison. Can you describe what happened in there?

GW: That's right. I've been to that prison about a year after they pulled him from the rubble. And it's a fort in the middle of northern Afghanistan. And the Northern Alliance which had allied with the United States in fighting against the Taliban were facing off against Taliban. And then this other group which were Arabs, Pakistanis, some Bengalis, who were fighting on the side of the Taliban but were actually al-Qaeda -- and John Walker Lindh was part of the Arab group. And after the captives were being interrogated it turned out that some from John Walker Lindh's group still had weapons with them -- they had hidden them. And minutes after John Walker Lindh was interrogated by a CIA operative Mike Spann some of Lindh's colleagues jumped out with their grenades blew up Spann and started a prison uprising that then ended up having to be put down by airstrikes and really every kind of violence available to the Northern Alliance and their American allies in the air.

CO: And almost all of those prisoners -- about 500 of them -- were killed, weren't they?

GW: Yeah it was an absolute bloodbath. And it was just by a miracle that John Walker Lindh was one of the survivors.

CO: There is some extraordinary footage, isn't there, of John Walker Lindh being pulled from that rubble. And some journalists were able to speak with him when it was determined that this American was amongst all of these other men. What condition was he in when he was actually taken into custody?

GW: Half dead. He had been in a cellar overnight and the Northern Alliance had decided all right if anyone still in there we're going to drown them. They just put garden hoses in and froze them. Remember it's December in northern Afghanistan -- it is quite cold. And so when he was taken out, he had shrapnel in one of his legs, he was hypothermic. And yeah there was a CNN journalist Robert Pelton who was there who put him on camera and asked him what he was doing there and got a pretty full answer.

CO: That he was doing what?

GW: He was there with al-Qaeda. He was there with a brigade that was financed, sponsored, by Osama bin Laden. That he had come there because he wanted to die as a martyr in the service of Islam. That he loved it. It was exactly what he was looking for. And that he fully expected at that moment to be dead and kind of wished that he was.

CO: You tried to explore some of his motives. You wrote to him when he was in prison. What did you learn as to why he was involved in al-Qaeda?

GW: Well when he was in prison of course he wasn't entirely free to speak to me. He had all of his communications monitored and so he was a bit cagey about what he believed. That said it was very easy to read between the lines. I wanted to know from him about the people who had come afterward. The many Canadians, Americans who traveled to Syria and tried to join ISIS. And I wanted to see what his view of this group was. And very quickly it became clear that he had positive views of the Islamic State. I would say he'd gone from being an al-Qaeda member to being an ISIS sympathizer at the very least. And he had every opportunity to say, no they've got it wrong. No! Sex slavery is not a good thing. No! There are ways that Muslims can live in Western countries and non-caliphates. And he pretty much declined to say that. He said instead, Oh go to the Islamic State and ask them these questions because they have the answers.

CO: And even when you said well I don't want to go and be beheaded and he didn't say you're not going to be beheaded he just said well if you do it properly you won't be beheaded. So he understands that this is what happens to people who are traveling to even interview members of al-Qaeda?

GW: Yeah. And you have to remember when this was. It wasn't when there was some doubt about what ISIS was. ISIS had been beheading journalists on camera for many months at that point. And he said to me very clearly, look if you go there and you ask nicely and you go through the proper channels -- you have very little risk of being beheaded or enslaved. So you should just go do that.

CO: So John Walker Lindh is free. Do you have any sense, any concerns, that he might reoffend?

GW: I don't know that he'll reoffend. He surely knows that he is the most watched jihadist on the loose right now in the United States. What he is certainly free to do especially after his three years of probation are up is to continue propagating the ideology of ISIS or al-Qaeda. And I think that's likely what he'll do -- probably on the down low. And he gives every sign of being completely convinced and obstinate about embracing this very intolerant version of his faith.

CO: Do you know anything about John Walker Lindh's family? Will they help him? Will he live with them? Will they embrace him?

GW: His father is Franklin who's an attorney in the San Francisco Bay area and has been a tireless advocate for his son -- has claimed kind of in-defensively actually that his son is just a political prisoner, that he didn't have the kind of ill will that's attributed to him. But what I can't say in his favour though is that he certainly loves his son and I'm sure will do anything he can to hasten his son's peaceful reintegration into society.

CO: All right Graeme we will leave it there. But thank you.

GW: Thank you so much.

JD: Graeme Wood is a staff writer for The Atlantic. We reached him in New Haven, Connecticut. Now you just heard Mr. Wood mentioned Frank Lindh -- John Walker Lindh's father. In 2002, U.S. government lawyers dropped several terrorism charges against John Walker Lindh, finding him guilty instead of two lesser charges. Here is what his father, Frank, told reporters in 2002.

SOUNDCLIP

FRANK WALKER: I'm John's father and I stand here as John's father today. I think any father who knew John would be proud to claim him for a son, and I mean that. President Bush, Mrs. Bush, anyone who knew John would be proud to have him as a son. He's a really good kid. I'm really gratified that the government -- my former employer the Department of Justice -- has decided to drop all, all, of the terrorism charges against my son. Those were not proper charges in the first place. And I'm really gratified that the government has backed down from those charges. But I have mixed feelings because my son is going to be incarcerated for up to 20 years. I told John when he came back from Afghanistan when I first met him that Nelson Mandela served 26 years in prison. He's a good man like John. And I told John he needed to be prepared for something along those lines. Someday I hope -- I hope -- that that the government will come around even further and say that even 20 years is wrong for this boy. He's a good boy. He can do a lot for America and for America's relationship with the world where Muslim people live -- 1.3 billion Muslim people. John ought to be working with the United States. One final thing, let me say this, John has no bitterness. He has never expressed the slightest bitterness about any of the treatment that he suffered. He never in all the interrogations that were going to be the subject of the suppression hearing, never once did John ever say anything against the United States. Never once. Not one word. John loves America and we love America. God bless America. Thank you.

JD: That was Frank Lindh speaking in 2002 after his son John Walker Lindh was convicted on two felony charges.

[Music]

Casey Plett

JD: "Little Fish" is a novel about a trans woman in Winnipeg who uncovers a secret about her staunch Mennonite grandfather. And this week, it won the Amazon Canada First Novel Award. The 60-thousand dollar prize is awarded to the year's best debut novel in Canada of course. And Casey Plett -- the author of Little Fish -- could not be more thrilled or shocked. Ms. Plett appeared on CBC's Windsor Morning today. And host Tony Doucette began by asking how she felt when her name was announced.

SOUNDCLIP

CASEY PLETT: Oh goodness I can't even put words to it. You know I just remember kind of screaming and shrieking. And the fellow who is right next to me -- Tyler Hellard -- who was a finalist along with me and wrote an amazing book called "Searching for Terry Punchout" he told me later, you made a sound that I don't think I've heard come out of a human before. [Laughter] So that's...

TONY DOUCETTE: And you didn't even go to the trouble to prepare an acceptance speech.

CASEY PLETT: You know what -- it's silly, I mean I should know better. You know I've been blessed enough to be up for a couple of awards before but I really didn't think I was going to win. I thought the rest of the finalists were so good and their books were amazing. You know I just...

TONY DOUCETTE: The novel is "Little Fish." What's it about?

CASEY PLETT: It is about a young transsexual woman who comes from a Mennonite background, she lives in Winnipeg, and she is kind of dealing with a lot of issues. She's dealing with poverty, with alcohol addiction, with mental health. And she discovers that her Mennonite grandfather -- who has long since passed -- she discovers that there is a really good chance that he also was secretly a transgender woman. You know it's a dark book and there's some heavy stuff in it. But I'll tell you what I told my family when it came out, I said okay I'm willing to tell you one fact about how much of this is based on my own life. I don't think either of my grandfathers were transgender.

TONY DOUCETTE: Why do you think this has resonated with readers and with critics?

CASEY PLETT: You know that's a wonderful question because I had thought you know years ago when I first started writing it, I thought well you know how will people react to this protagonist that I've created, you know? I mean she's a lot of things that society doesn't always look too kindly on. You know she is transgender. She deals with addiction. She's also a sex worker. And I am astounded by the amount of love that people have had for this woman for Wendy Reimer. You know it's been extraordinarily touching.

JD: That was Windsor, Ontario, based author Casey Plett speaking to Tony Doucette on CBC's Windsor Morning. Ms, Plett's novel "Little Fish" has just won the Amazon Canada First Novel Award.

[Music]

Blind Hockey

Guest: Francois Beauregard

JD: If you are a blind or partially sighted hockey player you need a puck that you can hear. And for years, players have had to improvise with juice cans or steel containers -- with noisy rattling objects inside. Which work great, if the puck is moving. But if the puck is not moving, you get no sound. Well now researchers at the Universite de Quebec a Montreal have come up with a prototype for an electronic puck that beeps to tell you where it is. Here's what it sounds like on the ice.

SOUNDCLIP

[Beeping, skates on ice, and hockey stick sounds]

JD: That is the sound of a hockey game being played with a new audible puck for blind players. Francois Beauregard helped come up with the idea for the puck prototype. He is one of the captains of the blind hockey team Les Hiboux de Montreal, and he is a director of the charity Canadian Blind Hockey. We reach Francois Beauregard in Montreal.

CO: Francois how does this puck work?

FRANCOIS BEAUREGARD: Well this puck is very simple -- it's a little buzzer, a power supply, a lithium ion battery, and an accelerometer. An accelerometer is the device you'll find let's say in your cell phone that helps track the movement of the device itself.

CO: So aside from the sound, is it in all other respects like a regular puck?

FB: No it is not. It is twice as large as a regular puck and it weighs about twice as much.

CO: So how did this idea come about?

FB: Blind hockey started in Canada about 40 years ago. But for the first 30 years blind hockey developed in different cities with different rules playing different objects to replace the regular puck and nobody talked to each other much. In 2010, we standardized the game and we're using a metal puck right now -- steel puck and there's a few ball bearings inside to rattle and make noise.

CO: But a steel puck to the head must hurt.

FB: Well yes obviously it could be lethal. No. It is obviously painful to get one in the chin pad. But there's also the playability of a metal object -- it is not the same as something which is rubbery or plastic. And the steel puck with its bearings doesn't make sound when it's idle on the ice, and it also doesn't make much noise when it's in the air. So the goalies who are totally blind have a harder time picking up the puck when it's shot up in the air and it stops making noise. The project of the electronic puck is to create a puck that makes sounds even if it's idle on the ice and it's also better for the goalies if it makes noise directed to the net.

CO: How does it work? When it is actually being played, how does it change the dynamic of the game?

FB: Will it changes the dynamic of the game because players with lesser visions will track that electronic puck with more ease so there's a better flow to the game. For stick handling though, skilled players with a bit more residual visions will rather have something rubbery on their stick that reproduce the feel of a regular hockey puck.

CO: Is it fun? Is it more fun to play...

FB: Is it fun to play in blind hockey?

CO: No. Was it fun to play with these pucks?

FB: While it is fun. Obviously like anything new in your life, you need to adapt. Instead of being you know aware of the rattling sound and try to track it, you have to be aware of the buzz. And we also took a lot of time to be able to develop the right acoustics. So there was a lot of tries in different arenas trying to pin down the right pitch, the right sound, so people can attract the puck easily without being completely deafening sound. And the acoustic in arenas generally are bad. So one of the features of the electronic puck is that you can actually have an app on a smartphone where you can adjust the settings of pitch speed and volume and you can save the setting for one specific venue and move to another arena and according to the acoustic of that second arena you can adjust the settings and save them and go back to your home arena and then get the home arena settings back on the puck.

CO: This is developed at Universite du Quebec a Montreal -- how did they get the funding? Who's behind it? Who is helping with it?

FB: The way it all started is Gilles Ouellet, one of my teammates and co-captain of the Montreal blind hockey team, works at UQAM. A couple of years back we were playing sighted teachers and faculty members of UQAM and we played the regular metal puck but at the end of that we just share and chat and say well that puck is okay but it has limitations. And then the idea just took off that maybe we can help you develop one. So Steve Vezeau who's a teacher at UQAM in industrial design started to work on the project of doing the right shell or to right puck container. And Mounir Boukadoum and Frederic Nabki who are microelectronic engineer teacher started to work with the buzzer and the power supply and all that inside. So to that they were students coming in and out of the project. And all along Gilles Ouellet and I -- we were there to push them, prod them, give feedback, and with some of our teammates on the ice try all the pucks. The first try out of the pucks were kind of funny. The first few pucks just exploded...

CO: Oh no.

FB: ...on the board. So some of the tryouts remarkably short at the beginning. And later on we got the right type of plastics then it was more a matter of getting the right sound out of it you know.

CO: And I imagine so many changes and I was thinking mostly about kids who love hockey. And so kids who have limited sight or who are blind -- this would be big breakthrough for them I think.

FB: Well yes. Canadian blind hockey is running dozens of programs each year for blind kids and tryout sessions. And in GTA we have a youth program and we're starting youth programming in a couple of other cities and across the country. And for blind kids being able to play hockey and go back to school and talk to their friends and say yes I played hockey too last weekend, it's very important and it's very enjoyable. You should see the kids beaming a smile as they leave the rink after one of our youth tryout sessions and clinics. And players with lesser vision have more benefit from a beeping puck. So that will help expand the sport to people who might not enjoy it in its current form.

CO: It's just a great story Francois and I'm really pleased to hear that this is in the making. And thank you for telling us about it.

FB: All right. Thank you Carol.

JD: Francois Beauregard is the co-captain of the blind hockey team Les Hiboux de Montreal, and the director of Canadian Blind Hockey. He helped develop the idea for an audible electronic hockey puck. We reached him in Montreal. And we do have more on this story as well on our website: cbc.ca/aih.

[Music]

Haunting music

SOUNDCLIP

[Music playing]

JD: Ah yes of course, that time a mariachi band hit the halls of Centre Block in Ottawa. It was 1998, and the band was hired by Reform Party MPs to embarrass an absentee senator who was spending too many days down in Mexico way. But did anyone show them the way out? Or has that band since haunted the chambers of Parliament? Weird questions. But they did come up yesterday when CTV Parliament Hill reporter Glen McGregor spotted a funny thing on Google Maps. An image captured inside the House of Commons showed three mystery figures dressed in black and white, brandishing instruments, in the otherwise empty chamber. On Twitter, Mr. McGregor wondered if he was seeing a mariachi band. But people pointed out they were not wearing hats. So who could this band be? It could be Montreal violinist Mark Djokic and guitarist Jerome Ducharme and Louis Trepanier. It was in fact.

SOUNDCLIP

[Music playing]

JD: Yes, Mr. Djokic, Mr. Ducharme, and Mr. Trepanier were filming performances across the country for a Canada 150 project and were obviously in Centre Block when the Google cameras came by.

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May 24, 2019 Episode Transcript

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