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The AIH Transcript For January 03, 2021

[hosts]Helen Mann, Chris Howden[/hosts]

HELEN MANN: Hello, I'm Dave Seglins, sitting in for Carol Off.

CHRIS HOWDEN: Good evening, I'm Chris Howden, this is As It Happens.

[music: theme]

Prologue

AH: Tonight:

HM: Class action. An Ontario parent says she's feeling a combination of rage and relief, after the province announces students will not return to in-person learning this week after all.

CH: Army fatigue. Sudan's prime minister steps down, leaving the military in control -- but pro-democracy protesters say they're not going anyway, despite the violence they face.

HM: Cosmic relief. Amid an ongoing series of finicky adjustments, an astrophysicist overseeing the James Webb Space Telescope says she expects it to deliver galactic views that will leave us all star-struck.

CH: Cover story. In the face of a seemingly never-ending pandemic, one art exhibit's take on the omnipresent mask uncovers new ways of thinking about the virus that unites us all.

HM: Tick, Tick, Boom. An astronomer in Pittsburgh tells us about a huge explosion she heard on New Years Day -- and why she's certain it came from outer space.

CH: And… like water under troubled bridge. After 14 years of pedestrian wipe-outs on its slippery surface, the city of Venice decides a beautiful glass bridge has become a clear and present danger.

CH: As It Happens, the Monday edition. Radio that calls this a Cinderella story because of all the glass slippers.

Part 1: Ontario COVID Schools, James Webb Telescope Update, NWT Mask Exhibit, Venice Glass Bridge

Ontario COVID Schools

Guest: Ariel Troster

CH: Ontario has reversed its plan to get students back into classrooms. Last week, parents were told that it would be safe for students to return to schools in person this Wednesday. But this morning, Ontario Premier Doug Ford walked that back. Premier Ford announced a series of new public health measures that he said were necessary to protect the health care system from a, quote, "tsunami" of COVID-19.

SOUNDCLIP

DOUG FORD: We need to prioritize the continued health and safety of our kids and our school staff. As a result, we’ll be delaying the return to in-class learning for the next two weeks, and continue with virtual learning for the duration of the time away. I know this isn't the news anyone wants to hear. But with the new variant, the ground is shifting every single day. These two weeks will provide much-needed time for more vaccines, more boosters. It's more time for additional public health measures to blunt the rapid rise in cases.

CH: Ontario Premier Doug Ford speaking today. Ariel Troster's daughter was due back in her Grade 4 classroom in Ottawa this Wednesday. Now, that won’t be happening. We reached Ms. Troster in Ottawa.

HM: Ms. Troster, how are you feeling after Premier Ford's announcement this morning?

ARIEL TROSTER: I'm feeling a very strange combination of rage and relief, but mostly rage.

HM: Why is that? What's… what's causing the rage?

AT: Well, once again, children are being left out in the cold, with their education interrupted yet again. And for so many parent-advocates and health care workers, we've been begging for weeks for the government to do something as we saw the rapid spread of COVID happening in our communities. And entering into the Christmas holidays, we could see the writing on the wall, and cases have just ramped up higher and higher. And now, I do admit a little bit of relief because the case counts are so high. The thought of sending my daughter to school seems so dangerous. But all I have to say is I sure hope that the government listens to all of us who are advocating and actually does implement the measures we've been asking for during this two-week closure so kids can return to school.

HM: How would things have been different if… if Premier Ford and his cabinet had made the decision sooner?

AT: Well, I would have hoped that a whole bunch of other decisions would have been made before closing schools. So all of the other congregate settings that are now being closed at the same time, like gyms and bars. And, you know, there were 10,000 people at a Raptors game last week. All of those things should have been closed before school. Many of us also for months were begging for the Ontario government to release rapid tests so that we could test our children regularly before they were fully vaccinated. That didn't happen. And then also, I'm hearing from so many teachers who are terrified to go back to the classroom, especially if they haven't had a chance to have the booster shot yet. So a lot of these things could have been done weeks ago. And now, here we are with the scramble and with kids missing out on their education again.

HM: You’re in the Ottawa area. Among the people who say -- have said -- that schools need to stay open for the well-being of children is Ottawa's medical officer of health. What do you feel about that position?

AT: Well, I agree with her that schools should stay open. But at this point, I do think a couple of weeks of a circuit breaker could be very helpful. But only if in this two-week period, the government accelerates and prioritizes booster shots for teachers. Really, make sure that there is a HEPA filter in every classroom. And also, advertises the fact that parents can accelerate the second dose of the vaccine for kids. And also, really consider something like a vaccine mandate for schools, for actual students. That hasn't even been on the table at all. And then also, whatever rapid tests are still sitting in fridges or in cupboards [chuckling] to release them so we can have a better sense of what's going on in the schools in terms of COVID.

HM: Your daughter is in the 4th Grade. And this is now going to be a third school year that she's had part of the year at least interrupted. How is she taking the news today?

AT: So she's initially a little excited because she likes the idea of staying home with her two moms, but she doesn't realize that in a few days, [chuckling] that things are definitely going to change. The last couple of times that school was interrupted were really difficult. My wife and I are lucky enough to work from home, but we're working all day, and she often requires assistance with her schoolwork because she doesn't have the teacher physically there. And so that could be tough to manage. It was tough to get her outside for any physical activity because, again, we're in the middle of our own workdays, and it was also very lonely for her as an only child not being around other kids. So we noticed a significant dip in her mental health and her coping skills throughout the various school shutdowns over the last two years. So I'm definitely concerned, certainly if this goes beyond the two weeks. But I also understand that right now, the situation is so precarious. And I certainly hope that some of the safety measures can be brought in as soon as possible.

HM: It sounds like you're able to make this work, at least in part by working from home. What do you say to parents who simply can't do that, who can't supervise their child and hold down their jobs?

AT: Yeah, what I would say to them is that their government is failing them. This is what we're all feeling. That it's completely unacceptable. And it's mostly women who are having to make this choice. The statistics show women are leaving the workforce in droves because of COVID, becoming primary caregivers of their kids. It's truly an impossible situation to have to choose between your own livelihood and your child's education. And to not know whether it's safe to send your child into a school building. It's really, really unconscionable, and every parent I know feels abandoned, whether they work at home and are able to sort of semi-manage and patch things together, or whether this has a huge economic impact on their family because it can't take shifts at work where they have to leave the house. It's… unfortunately, it's led to a lot of debate among parents, and a lot of hard feelings among parents because people are saying schools need to stay open no matter what. And other people are concerned and say they should be closed because they're unsafe. We would not be in this situation right now if the government had taken proactive measures earlier.

HM: You have listed those measures for us, what you would like to see from the government in terms of getting the schools ready in the next two weeks. How confident are you that… that those measures are going to be implemented?

AT: I am not particularly confident because these days, you know, when somebody shows you who they are the first time, believe them. It's been almost two years of this pandemic, and advocates and parents and health care workers, we all feel like we've had to fight for scraps when it comes to safety in schools. So today, Premier Ford didn't announce any of those measures. He said we need two weeks to get more boosters into people. He did not announce any specific prioritization or acceleration for kids or for teachers and other educational workers. I heard a vague promise about HEPA filters in classrooms. Well, I'd like to see that happen. I sure hope it does. And then, the other piece of the puzzle here is so many people don't have paid sick leave. So if they have to isolate, if their child has to isolate, or if their child is stuck doing online schooling, they just don't have the ability to take that time off. And that has been incredibly difficult and needs to be fixed.

HM: Ms. Troster, I really appreciate you taking time to talk with us today. Thank you very much.

AT: Thank you.

CH: Ariel Troster is the mother of a Grade 4 student in Ottawa. We reached her in Ottawa. You can find more on that story on our website. That's: www.cbc.ca/aih.

[Music: Vocalization]

James Webb Telescope Update

Guest: Jane Rigby

CH: Out beyond the moon, the James Webb Space Telescope has spread its wings. Figuratively. Literally, it has spread its sun shield. It was launched on Christmas Day. And now, the massive observatory has positioned itself 1.5 million kilometres away from Earth. Where it has unfolded a shield that will block solar rays. This week, it's all about what's called "tensioning" the shield -- one of hundreds of steps that need to happen flawlessly before the telescope can deliver its first pictures of the cosmos. Jane Rigby is an astrophysicist and the Operations Project Scientist for the James Webb Space Telescope. We reached her in Silver Spring, Maryland.

HM: Jane Rigby, tell us what is involved today in tensioning the sun shield on this massive space telescope?

JANE RIGBY: Sure. So, it's only taking five very thin layers of metal plastic that are together the size of a tennis court, and are currently spread out and… but loose. And then, tightening them up with motors pulling cables so that each layer is tight -- is taut -- and is held in space separate from the layer below it.

HM: Tell us why the sun shield is so important.

JR: So the Webb Telescope, it has the top part, which is the telescope, which needs to be incredibly cold, right? The telescope and the science instruments need to get chilled to about 40 degrees above absolute zero. Below them, we have the spacecraft, which operates at room temperature to almost boiling. And in between them, the sun shield is what separates those two zones. It takes… the sun shield takes almost all the sunlight that hits it and sends it out back into space, and lets only one part in a million of that energy up to the telescope.

HM: This is the telescope that is now, you know, beyond the Moon. If something goes wrong, is there anything that can be done to fix it?

JR: So, we have practiced lots of contingency scenarios when things don't go right. There are, as you would expect, thick binders of if stuff doesn't look right, here's what we do. And one of the things about this process is that deploying this telescope is a process of a month. And it's very, very different. If you think about the Mars landings, right? The Mars landings happen where we put a robot on Mars, and because of the time difference -- the light travel time to Mars -- the robot needs to control everything on its own as it's coming down. This is a really different process. Humans are in the loop. The light travel time to our telescope is only about a second. So we're getting tons of information back, watching it as it goes to see how it's going.

HM: So many of us have watched over the years the incredible images that were produced by the Hubble Space Telescope over the years. Should we expect similar wonders from the James Webb?

JR: You should totally expect that Webb produces images that have that same, you know, jaw-dropping, visceral sense of wonder. For a couple of reasons. The universe is amazing. And Webb has the same… to take beautiful images, you need a big telescope and you need a lot of pixels, right? You need to take sharp images, and you need to go really deep. So Webb has amazing detectors that can take really good images. And the Webb Telescope is far… will be far more sensitive than Hubble, about 100 times more sensitive. So I think the way to think about it, the way in my head is if you think of those beautiful images from Hubble, you know, of beautiful galaxies and then the blackness of space between them, there really are galaxies in that blackness that are just too faint and too red for Hubble, and Webb should pull them out of the darkness.

HM: What are you personally most excited about seeing from the Webb?

JR: Oh my gosh! [chuckling] So I, you know, selfishly, I have a bunch of programs that my scientific collaborators and I have… have dreamed up. We're going to be looking at some gravitationally-lensed galaxies, so galaxies that are behind natural telescopes. We want to look at those background galaxies because they've already been magnified by these cosmic telescopes to be much brighter than… than they really are. And so, we want to look at them with the Webb Telescope and really try to understand where their stars are forming. So selfishly, that's what I'm really interested in. But as sort of a bigger picture, I'm really excited for the science that I'm not at all a part of. We're going to be doing everything from asteroids in our own solar system to the most distant quasars and galaxies that it is possible to find.

HM: And just to be clear, a lot of what we will see is what was transmitted from billions of years ago?

JR: Yeah, this is this whole telescopes are time machines thing -- that, you know, as we look out into space, we're looking back into time because the speed of light is… is not that fast. And so, you know, that in our normal lives doesn't matter. You know, the Sun's eight light minutes away. Who cares that the sunlight on our backs is eight minutes old? The Sun's doing the same thing it was eight minutes ago. But when we get light from all the way across the observation… the observable universe, that's light that's been travelling for 13 billion years. And so, we're seeing galaxies as they looked less than a billion years after the Big Bang. So, it really is true that telescopes are… act like time machines. And the Webb Telescope was designed to find that first generation of galaxies that formed after the Big Bang, whose light has been travelling to us, you know, through space for almost the entire history of the universe.

HM: When will we all see these images?

JR: Yeah! So, the first data will be public about six months after launch. And I know that seems like a really long time, but we have a lot we have to do. [chuckling] We have a one-week-old telescope. It is not yet a working telescope because we're still deploying it. We have to deploy the telescope. We have to cool it. And then we have to over the course of several months, get those mirrors to all work together. And so, at the end of all of that, we spend about 50 hours taking some really gorgeous data and then we do a big press release to show the world what… what Webb can do.

HM: Thank you very much, Jane. I really appreciate it. It’s nice to talk to you.

JR: Take care. Happy New Year!

HM: Bye-bye. You, too.

CH: Jane Rigby is an astrophysicist and the Operations Project Scientist for the James Webb Space Telescope. We reached her in Silver Spring, Maryland.

[Music: Ambient]

NWT Mask Exhibit

Guest: Nathalie Bertin

CH: If one thing symbolizes the past two years, it's the mask. Blue surgical masks. The increasingly common N95s. The handmade cloth masks that so many sewed in the early days. The mask on top of another mask. Or the dreaded, baffling not-covering-the-nose mask. You probably think you're tired of seeing any kind of mask by this point. But an art exhibition on display in Yellowknife is breathing new life into the object -- and all it represents. The project began with a Facebook group, co-founded by Métis, Anishinaabe, and Algonquin artist Nathalie Bertin. We reached Ms. Bertin in Bonfield, Ontario -- just outside North Bay.

HM: Nathalie, if I was to walk into this exhibition at the Prince of Wales Northern Heritage Centre in Yellowknife, what would I see?

NATHALIE BERTIN: You would see a collection of handcrafted masks that record a history and time for humans from across Canada. You know, of all nationalities, of all… of all nations and heritage, etc.

HM: There are, as I understand it, 45 masks. Are there some in particular that… that stand out to you? That really touch something for you?

NB: There are so many stories in each of these masks. Some of them, you know, talk about life, death, hopes, dreams, fears. The ones that do stand out in particular, are the ones that are talking about… they’re… you know, they’re simple masks, powerful imagery such as Don Kwan’s, who is an Asian-Canadian who lost both of his parents from COVID, and made his masks out of Chinese food bags. So, it speaks really clearly and loudly and profoundly to the racism that Asians faced, but also speaks to, you know, his connection to the Chinese food restaurant industry and losing his parents. And Christine King, who is actually from the North, submitted a mask made from seal skin, which was beautifully decorated and adorned as well with more modern materials and beads and things like that. And, you know, we were so thrilled to see that so many Indigenous artists participated. And, you know, brought forth their authentic creations as well, from beadwork to quill work to… you name it.

HM: Take me back to when you and your fellow artist Lisa Shepard first launched the Facebook group that started all of this. What inspired you?

NB: Well, you know, it's funny. When… when the… when the pandemic was first declared, I thought to myself, well, you know, at least now I have time to do the things that I couldn't do before. So I had plans, but it became quickly apparent to me that there was no art being produced. It seemed to me that the pandemic was the time to produce art. And I didn't see very much production at all happening. And I thought that was curious, especially from the Metis community, from which both Lisa and I belong. And we just thought, you know, it just seems odd that there aren't any beaded masks out there. So I posted about that on Facebook, and we had a discussion. And, you know, I learned that a lot of artists were actually blocked. I think the fear had frozen a lot of people and blocked a lot of people. So we… you know, through discussion, we came up with the idea to create the Breathe page on Facebook. And we simply invited artists to create masks as a means to put their emotions and thoughts into an art project. And then, hopefully, that way, they can move through those emotions and then move forward.

HM: And what kind of response did you get?

NB: Well, [chuckling] within the first couple of weeks, we had over 2,000 members from all over the world. It was incredible.

HM: Wow!

NB: Pretty floored. And then, we started noticing that museums like the Smithsonian were starting to buy the masks. So that's when the idea came around, well, we have to… we have to do something and see if we can get these exhibited somehow.

HM: Have any of the artists expressed to you that they found the process healing or cathartic given your initial impetus to do this?

NB: Yeah. For a lot of the artists, Lisa included, and myself. Initially, I didn't think that I was going to create a mask. I thought, Okay, well, I'm just going to keep doing it. I'll do this, manage this Facebook group, and then I'll keep doing what I wanted to do. But working through the process was actually very therapeutic because beading in itself or doing art can be very meditative. And so, for a lot of these artists who were putting personal stories into these masks and putting themselves into it in their own authentic way, really provided a kind of catharsis. And they were able to move through. And then, the artists who haven't up to that point been able to create were then able to do something else afterwards.

HM: And you told us that you are Metis. What in your background do you think kind of made this so important? Why was it so significant for you to have Indigenous artists play a major role in all of this?

NB: You know, for me, it was through a discussion with my mom at the beginning of the pandemic that… when she told me that my great grandmother had died of tuberculosis. She's buried in a mass grave somewhere in North Bay. And I didn't know this story, but the sense of loss became really palpable. And I started to think about all the different people who were going to lose somebody, and all of the Indigenous people who had already experienced -- not that long ago -- a pandemic, and tuberculosis, and all those different diseases. So really, it's not about Indigenous and settler and whoever. It's just about people, and humans coming together and sharing stories.

HM: What kind of response have you had from those who've been fortunate enough to see the exhibit?

NB: You know, it's overwhelming. A lot of people are really amazed. And it really sits with them for a while. One of the things that we built in with the project from the very beginning was that it was meant to be educational and that any venue that wanted to exhibit and had to involve the community somehow. And in the case of the Prince of Wales Northern Heritage Centre, they’re going to be involving community by creating a video of the exhibition so that they can take it to the more remote areas. They’re also going to invite school groups when it's safe to do so. They're going to have vaccine clinics alongside. So it's not just an exhibition, it's also about community, and bringing them together.

HM: Nathalie, thank you so much. It's a pleasure to talk to you.

NB: Thank you so much, Helen.

HM: Okay, bye-bye.

NB: Bye.

CH: Nathalie Bertin is a multi-disciplinary artist of Métis, French, Anishinaabe, and Algonquin ancestry. We reached her in Bonfield, Ontario.

[Music: Folk]

Venice Glass Bridge

CH: When it's windy, San Francisco's Golden Gate Bridge makes this eerie sound.

SOUNDCLIP

[Sound: This minor key whistling sound haunts my nightmares. Rent-free, of course]

CH: In extreme weather, New York's Verrazano Bridge groans like an angry kraken.

SOUNDCLIP

[Sound: I hear a fog horn… or maybe it’s Godzilla!]

CH: And in extreme weather -- also extremely unextreme weather -- a bridge in Venice, Italy makes this unfortunate sound.

SOUNDCLIP

MAN: Woah! Woah! Woah! Woah!

[Sound: A pennywhistle hums while the man falls and goes bonk. There’s also a gong]

CH: That last one was more of an artist's rendering. But it's a decent approximation of a sound heard every wet day on the Ponte Della Costituzione in Venice. Now, the glass bridge is certainly beautiful to behold. But it's dangerous to bewalk, due to the risk of befalling. As any layperson might guess, wet glass is slippery. Ever since the 1.5 million euro bridge opened in 2008, countless people who crossed it have been double-crossed by it. And if they're injured in a fall, the city often has to pay them. Well, Venice has decided it can't let things slide any longer. Yes, the bridge is stunning -- but it can't keep leaving people literally stunned. As Venice's public works official, Francesca Zaccariotto, told the New York Times, "We can't always do poetry. We must give security." To that end, the city has proposed replacing the poetic glass with prosaic stone. Which means that bridge may no longer be the pride of Venice. But in this case, pride cameth before a really alarming number of falls.

[Music: Indie pop]

Part 2: Sudan PM Gone, Pittsburgh Explosion

Sudan PM Gone

Guest: Ahmed

CH: Sudan's prime minister has resigned. Abdalla Hamdok had been clinging to office since an October coup by the army -- hoping to preserve a power-sharing agreement between the Sudanese military and civilian leaders. But in the face of continuing protests, he stepped down. Those protests have called for the army to step aside completely. And, since the coup, protesters have been met with violence from authorities. According to media reports and doctors in Sudan, dozens have been killed. The United Nations human rights office has also reported sexual violence against women and girls. Ahmed is one of the pro-democracy demonstrators. We're not using his last name because he fears for his safety. We reached him in Khartoum.

HM: Ahmed, what has it been like on the streets of Khartoum today and the last few days?

AHMED: The streets of Khartoum has been full of blood, violence and every bad thing you can imagine is happening from the military, the paramilitary, the militias, even the police. They’re killing, they're raping and they're kidnapping the non-violent protesters going out asking for freedom, justice and peace.

HM: How many people have been killed and injured?

A: From the beginning of this coup, which started on the 25th of October, so far, we've lost more than 52 lives, and we have more than 2,000 person injured.

HM: How many people have died in these protests in the last day or so?

A: We've lost four souls. Two passed yesterday, and the other two were injured and they were in the ICU, and they just passed today.

HM: I'm sorry. Tell me about the protests themselves. What are people saying? How many people are showing up? What is the sense of… of how people are reacting?

A: Actually, all Sudan is going out, refusing and rejecting this military dictatorship. This revolution had… had overthrown the dictatorship of Omar al-Bashir after 30 years.

[tape jumps]

HM: Up on that. What was your sense of… of whether he should stay or go?

A: We don't have a problem with Hamdok himself. Our problem is with the military, and their ways of dealing with the things. It's totally not acceptable to have military in politics. There is no partnership with the military. They cannot rule.

HM: So are things worse or better today, now that the prime minister has gone?

A: After the deal of Hamdok with the military back on the 21st of November, Hamdok lost his popularity. He's not supported anymore from the streets… or, let's say, the majority of the street. So him leaving, yes, this is going to complicate the things more. But at least it's leaving us with the direct, let's say, confront with the military.

HM: A confrontation?

A: With the people that did the… yes, a confrontation.

HM: Now, Hamdok said in the speech that he was trying to hold the country together. He gave this televised address. He said Sudan is at a dangerous turning point that threatens its whole survival. Do you agree with that? Do you fear what happens now?

A: I totally agree with him. But there is no way out, unless the military to step down. I mean, nowadays, the moment that we're speaking now, we have more than eight armies -- eight different armies -- inside Khartoum, like they're holding guns to each other. Now… Now, all of them, they agreed together just to kill the civilians, the unarmed civilians. This is the only thing that they agreed on. For the rest of the things, they will not agree.

HM: So how likely do you think it is that your country will fall into civil war?

A: This is exactly what we are afraid of. Unless the military steps down, this country is going down to a civil war.

HM: The leader of the coup, General Abdel Fattah al-Burhan, has promised to hold elections next year. Do you have faith in that pledge that he will allow a transition to civilian rule?

A: Of course not. Already, they are copying the Egyptian model. Everybody had witnessed what happened in Egypt. Egypt is ruled now by General Sisi himself, who already did a coup before. So this is exactly what's happening now.

HM: You plan to go back to the protests tomorrow. What is keeping you going?

A: We want a democratic country. Our demands were clear from the beginning: it was freedom, justice and peace. This is all that we are asking for. We need a decent country that we will be proud to… to be part of this country. This country cannot stay under the dictatorship of those military and paramilitary groups that are serving their own purposes.

HM: What do you think it will take to get what you want?

A: Whatever it takes. Even if it's going to take our lives.

HM: Ahmed, thank you very much for speaking with us. And please take care of yourself.

A: I will. Thank you, Helen.

HM: Okay. Goodbye.

A: Bye.

CH: Ahmed is a Sudanese pro-democracy protester. We witheld his full name because he fears for his safety. He was in Khartoum.

[Music: Indie rock]

FOA: Richard Leakey Obit

CH: Richard Leakey found himself an international celebrity because of what he himself found. His fossil discoveries in his home country of Kenya changed our understanding of human evolution. They also landed him on the cover of Time magazine, and a starring role in a BBC series. Richard Leakey died yesterday at his home near Nairobi. He was 77. Mr. Leakey and his colleagues made key discoveries in Kenya's Rift Valley -- including "Turkana Boy," a 1.6 million-year-old skeleton of a young Homo erectus. Turkana Boy and other fossils are housed in Kenya's national museum. In 2006, when evangelical Christians in Kenya were pushing the museum to hide the fossils away in a back room, Richard Leakey spoke with Carol.

SOUNDCLIP

RICHARD LEAKEY: Well, there are a tremendous number of fossils, many of which my wife and I collected, other people have collected as well. Basically, they represent a span of the human story from the present time back to the point where it's really hard to discern whether it's human or ancestral human or simply ape. And what I think the museum is proposing is to show some of the more important specimens, not in any attempt using them to try to prove evolution, but simply to establish that we have in Kenya some of the finest fossils of early stages of human ancestry, and you can interpret them as you will. The fossils are real. They're not a theory. The fossils are on the table. You can pick them up and measure them.

CAROL OFF: But as I understand, the… this bishop, he is saying that evolution is only a theory and that the national museum should not give these fossils a prominence of display. Is that what you understand?

RL: Well, at this point, I understand that I think the museum will do what is right. The museum is a scientific institution, and I don't think anyone from the museum would go to the Pentecostal church and tell them not to preach about Genesis. And I think he should keep off the museum. It's science, and let scientists put forward the facts. And let the audience judge for themselves. And I have a feeling that the fundamentalist Christians, like fundamentalists in any religion, are rather nervous because their… their arguments and their explanations are pretty thin. And if you start looking at the evidence, you start asking questions, it falls away. And just… then they’re out of business. You can interpret the fossils as having being put together by God on a fundamentalist interpretation. But the problem these God people have is that the fossils, the further back you go back in time look less and less like us. And, I guess, that's what they're worried about. But there's… there's no question that the fossils exist, and there's no question that over the last 200,000 years, they're very like us. The last 400,000 or 500,000 years, they're less like us. And if you go back to several million, they're not at all like us. Now, you can interpret it any way you like. And Bishop Odoyo can say this is a special creation, lots of experiments, but only one worked. God knows if that makes sense to some. But you can't stop the museum putting original fossils on display.

CH: From our archives, internationally renowned Kenyan fossil hunter Richard Leakey speaking with Carol in 2006. Mr. Leakey died yesterday. He was 77.

CH: Richard Leakey found himself an international celebrity because of what he himself found. His fossil discoveries in his home country of Kenya changed our understanding of human evolution. They also landed him on the cover of Time magazine, and a starring role in a BBC series. Richard Leakey died yesterday at his home near Nairobi. He was 77. Mr. Leakey and his colleagues made key discoveries in Kenya's Rift Valley -- including "Turkana Boy," a 1.6 million-year-old skeleton of a young Homo erectus. Turkana Boy and other fossils are housed in Kenya's national museum. In 2006, when evangelical Christians in Kenya were pushing the museum to hide the fossils away in a back room, Richard Leakey spoke with Carol.

SOUNDCLIP

RICHARD LEAKEY: Well, there are a tremendous number of fossils, many of which my wife and I collected, other people have collected as well. Basically, they represent a span of the human story from the present time back to the point where it's really hard to discern whether it's human or ancestral human or simply ape. And what I think the museum is proposing is to show some of the more important specimens, not in any attempt using them to try to prove evolution, but simply to establish that we have in Kenya some of the finest fossils of early stages of human ancestry, and you can interpret them as you will. The fossils are real. They're not a theory. The fossils are on the table. You can pick them up and measure them.

CAROL OFF: But as I understand, the… this bishop, he is saying that evolution is only a theory and that the national museum should not give these fossils a prominence of display. Is that what you understand?

RL: Well, at this point, I understand that I think the museum will do what is right. The museum is a scientific institution, and I don't think anyone from the museum would go to the Pentecostal church and tell them not to preach about Genesis. And I think he should keep off the museum. It's science, and let scientists put forward the facts. And let the audience judge for themselves. And I have a feeling that the fundamentalist Christians, like fundamentalists in any religion, are rather nervous because their… their arguments and their explanations are pretty thin. And if you start looking at the evidence, you start asking questions, it falls away. And just… then they’re out of business. You can interpret the fossils as having being put together by God on a fundamentalist interpretation. But the problem these God people have is that the fossils, the further back you go back in time look less and less like us. And, I guess, that's what they're worried about. But there's… there's no question that the fossils exist, and there's no question that over the last 200,000 years, they're very like us. The last 400,000 or 500,000 years, they're less like us. And if you go back to several million, they're not at all like us. Now, you can interpret it any way you like. And Bishop Odoyo can say this is a special creation, lots of experiments, but only one worked. God knows if that makes sense to some. But you can't stop the museum putting original fossils on display.

CH: From our archives, internationally renowned Kenyan fossil hunter Richard Leakey speaking with Carol in 2006. Mr. Leakey died yesterday. He was 77.

[Music: Horns!!!]

Pittsburgh Explosion

Guest: Diane Turnshek

CH: In Pittsburgh, the New Year came in with a bang. On Saturday morning, residents were jolted by the sound of a huge explosion. Which was followed by a major boom in theories about its source. But it turns out the sounds may have been a massive meteor vaporizing over their heads. Diane Turnshek is an astronomer who heard the sound. We reached her in Pittsburgh.

HM: Diane describe for us what you heard and felt on New Year's Day?

DIANE TURNSHEK: On New Year's Day, I got up pretty early. I was in the kitchen. 11:26, I heard this immense crashing boom noise. And I immediately ran around the house just looking for what fell? What hit? And then, nothing. And the dog was just very upset. We went outside, looked to see if a tree hit the house. And, of course, I just went to Twitter and put up I just heard a loud boom. [both chuckle] Did anybody hear that? And I was really surprised that the first person to respond was miles and miles away.

HM: Wow! And did you feel vibrations as well?

DT: I have suncatchers in my windows and all of them rattled. Like all of the suncatchers just banged against the windows.

HM: What went through your mind, especially when you heard that someone that far away and heard what you heard?

DT: You know, as an astronomer, my immediate thought is it's something celestial. But I ruled out all the other things, any local explosions or train wreck or car accident or anything that had a close source. And then after that, I work at Allegheny Observatory, and we have a very sensitive seismograph. So I thought earthquake, but the seismograph didn't show anything whatsoever.

HM: Right. So… so as you said, [chuckle] given your field, your first instinct was a meteor, and then you ended up coming to the conclusion that that was indeed what this was?

DT: Pretty close. I'm looking at my Twitter feed, it's like within an hour, I was like, that was a meteor. [chuckling]

HM: And does it compare to the experience that you've heard of other people who… who've gone through this sort of thing, who've also witnessed meteors coming into the atmosphere?

DT: So if they are big, I've seen bolides before. At night, they do make a sizzley noise. And you can hear sometimes a repercussion in the air. But I didn't think that there could be one at large, that big, that noisy. I mean, it was terrifyingly loud.

HM: And you say that big. Obviously, you have a perspective on that. What would be the size of this thing?

DT: The Nasa meteor watch finally last night said something about it. And they said that it was about a yard in diameter with a mass close to half a ton.

HM: Is there any chance that any of the meteor could have hit the Earth? That there's some evidence out there?

DT: Oh, I'm sure that it did. But whether it hit as tiny little shards spread over a large area that we would never see, or whether there actually are some, you know, fair-sized chunks. That… that would be interesting. I want to go on a hunt. [chuckling] My four sons and I want to take off into I think it hit in Washington County from the different reports that we've seen. We have satellite data. And we have timestamps on people's security cameras with their location that we should be able to figure out a trajectory. But it was coming in so fast that I don't know if we'll be able to pinpoint it very well.

HM: A lot of people in Pittsburgh were pretty shocked by all of this. Can you describe some of the reactions that you've heard about?

DT: People who did hear it, they said their birds, their dogs, their cats went just crazy. And they immediately thought it was fireworks because we had just had so many loud booms the night before. The police scanner was clear, but a lot of people did call the police, called the radio stations. They didn't know who to turn to.

HM: Anybody referenced that movie? That climate change movie that's framed around a giant asteroid?

DT: Exactly. Yes, Don't Look Up was mentioned a lot. Like, I just watched the movie and then I'm terrified to hear this thing, you know, just booming overhead.

HM: If you were to find a piece of this meteor, what would you do with it? What would it mean to you?

DT: I wouldn't be doing the hunt for the price, the value of it. Because they are very expensive. If you found a nice chunk of meteorite, that… that's worth a lot of money. But that wouldn't be my point. I've bought and given away hundreds of meteorites to my students over the years. And I just think it's wonderful to have someone touch a piece of rock that was out in space. That's the value of it to me, is here's a… here's a celestial wonder right in your hand.

HM: Given what we've all been going through, what does it feel like to be starting 2022 with a giant meteor explosion?

DT: So 2022, starting with a bang! It's… it can only go uphill from here.

HM: Oh gosh, I hope so. [both laugh] Listen, thank you for telling us about it. I really appreciate it. I hope you find one of these meteorites. It’d be… it’d be really fun and we'd love to hear about it. So good luck with that.

DT: Thank you. There's one other thing that I think is important for the story.

HM: Yeah!

DT: So one of the things that I work on is light pollution mitigation. Pittsburgh has recently gone dark sky compliant. All the streetlights are about to be changed to shielded low wattage, low-temperature ones. And that really helps astronomers to see these kind of incoming asteroids, meteoroids, comets so that we can get a handle on it before we just get surprised like this.

HM: Um-hmm.

DT: If people would be more careful about how they light up the sky, it would certainly help keep us all safe.

HM: Also, give us all a nicer view of the stars, too.

DT: Right, yeah.

HM: Oh, good. Thank you, Diane. Nice to speak with you.

DT: Thank you. Appreciate it.

HM: Okay. Bye. Happy New Year!

CH: Diane Turnshek is an astronomer who heard the explosion over Pittsburgh on New Years' Day. And you can find more on this story on the As It Happens website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

[Music: Folk]

FOA: Mole Spotting

CH: A few months ago, The Seattle Kraken played their first-ever home game as an NHL team, against the Vancouver Canucks. But one fan was distracted that night. To the extreme relief of the guy who distracted her. Nadia Popovici works as a volunteer in a cancer clinic. She was sitting behind Canucks staffer Brian "Red" Hamilton, and noticed a suspicious mole on his neck. So she held up a message on her cell-phone advising him to get it checked out. Mr. Hamilton took her advice. Which is how doctors discovered a malignant melanoma that he's since had removed.

CH: The Vancouver Canucks and Seattle Kraken thanked Nadia Popovici this weekend with a 10,000-dollar contribution toward her medical school education. Now, that story brought to mind one from our archives. A few years ago, Dr. Erich Voigt spotted beachfront bargain hunter Nicole McGuinness on the TV show Beachfront Bargain Hunt. A growth on her neck caught the doctor's eye. He got word to Nicole about it -- and it turned out to be thyroid cancer. Nicole McGuiness and Dr. Erich Voigt spoke with Carol in 2018.

SOUNDCLIP

EV: I was really surprised that she was able to get the message. I felt really happy that she was able to get that information. And I know that you know the diagnosis of cancer is always frightening, and scary, and mine was just a presumption that there was something wrong. But I was thrilled that she was going to get it evaluated, worked up. And if you find something earlier then later, your prognosis can be much better.

CO: Nicole, how are you feeling about this now?

NM: I’m feeling blessed. I’m very thankful that Dr. Voigt was able to see that on the television.

I feel very encouraged and positive I think that I'm on the right track, and especially after being able to survive glioblastoma that I should be able to do the same for the thyroid cancer.

CO: What was it like to meet each other?

NM: I can say that it was amazing. There's not many times in a person's life that you can meet someone and say hey, thanks. You probably saved my life. There's not really many circumstances that you know that I know of. So it's inspiring. And I've said this before, and I'll continue to say it, I'm so grateful for him, and him being able to reach out and say hey, this doesn't look right, and someone needs to check this out. It was wonderful to meet him.

EV: From my perspective, very emotional, very heartfelt. I had to really hold back a lot of tears because it just felt very special. You know in life, I think the world needs positive messages. And I actually think the world got to meet Nicole and saw someone really strong and really amazing. Her strength is incredible.

CO: Do you want to say anything to each other?

NM: Thank you again, Dr. Voigt. You know how much you mean to me, and how grateful I am. And from the bottom my heart, I don’t think you’ll ever really know absolutely how much of an impact you’ve had on my life.

EV: Well, as I said, I think your message of strength, and perseverance, and positivity is amazing for everybody. And I certainly hope you are completely cured of this and live a great life.

CH: Nicole McGuiness and Dr Eric Voigt speaking with Carol in June, 2018.

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January 03, 2022 Episode Transcript

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