Note: Transcripts may contain errors. If you wish to re-use all, or part of, a transcript, please contact CBC for permission. Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print. Copyright © CBC 2020

The AIH Transcript for May 5, 2020

Hosts: Carol Off and Chris Howden

Prologue

CH: That home is run by the Salvation Army. One of their lieutenant colonels tells us the facility has had 42 Covid-related deaths to date — and defends its preparation for the outbreak.

CH: Changing the channel. The largest TV network in the Philippines just had its license revoked — and an editor at the station tells us she's done staying silent.

CH: And... Tapping out. Researchers at the Université de Montréal say they've struck gold -- with an artificial tongue made of ... actual gold. Its purpose? Helping maple syrup producers avoid a taste testing backlog.

[Music: Theme]

Part 1: Toronto long term care home, Philippines TV shutdown

CO: Ella, first of all, how is your grandmother doing today?

ELLA SOPER: Today, she's doing pretty well. She was up today. She was sitting up. She had had some breakfast, had some yogurt. She seems to be doing a little bit better than she was last week, for sure.

CO: But you and your relatives are still taking shifts monitoring her with the tablet, right?

ES: Yes. From 6:30 every morning till 11:30 at night. There are ten of us, and we take turns. She can't always hear us. She can generally hear us better if a health care worker is in the room and physically touches her and explains who is on the tablet. I think she can otherwise hear us but doesn't quite know how to process the disembodied voice.

CO: And the nursing home staff is aware that that tablet is there then?

ES: Yes.

CO: And that you're monitoring?

ES: Yes, they know we're monitoring. Ideally, it's a supportive tool that would help us to help them do their job. You know, she gets quite agitated sometimes when she is being bathed or changed. Sometimes she doesn't want to eat. And we will say to the staff member, ask her to take a bite for Theodore, and that will perk her up, and she will take a bite of her sandwich for Theodore. So it's a way of keeping up her care.

CO: Just briefly, who is Theodore?

ES: Theodore is one of her newest great-grandchild, [CO chuckles brightly] my cousin Patrick’s son.

CO: Lovely! But in the monitoring this, what have you seen that's concerned you most?

ES: Well, the most concerning thing is the video I took of her calling out for water. She was lying in her diaper and a shirt. She didn't have a sheet on her. She was calling out for water for over an hour and a half. I was unable to get any staff to come until I called a number of times. And I was told that they were short-staffed and that there was some very ill patients on the floor. And when they finally, you know, came into the room, it didn't appear to me as though, you know, any PPE had been changed. I know that takes time. It came to me as though they rushed in, they helped her and then they left again. So what's concerned us is lack of staffing. Certainly at nighttime, there seems to be fewer staff. I can't confirm that there is a shortage of PPE any longer. Early on, we were told by some nursing staff that they didn't have adequate access to PPE. We did learn that there were COVID-positive residents directly across the hall from my grandmother when she had tested negative. And it didn't look like staff were, you know, either disinfecting or were changing their PPE when they entered the room from the hallway. And we understood that her wing at that time was a “red wing”. That is it was sort of an outbreak area. So there hasn't been any effective quarantining or triaging of patients that we've seen. And that is profoundly disturbing because it suggests to me that the exposure rate may be as high as 100 per cent in that facility at this point. And it doesn't look like, to my mind, that it's the fault of any PSW or any worker, you know, in particular. It just seems to be a staffing issue.

CO: Right.

ES: And I appreciate that logistically, it must be a very difficult job. Emotionally, it must be a very difficult job as well.

CO: And PSW is a personal support worker, is that right?

ES: Yes.

CO: So you and other families have written a letter to the Salvation Army, which administers this home, telling them about your concerns. What is the message you wanted to convey to them?

ES: We want to convey to them that this was preventable. This tragedy has not unfolded at every long term care facility. It seems to be exclusive to those that did not plan adequately, that weren't adequately staffed, that didn't have sufficient PPE and perhaps didn't have strong networks with neighbouring hospitals. It could have been avoided. I think it could have been avoided with better planning, beter triaging, better protocol. And I think that what we need to do is thoroughly investigate how we've let a situation like this come to pass, how, you know, in a country where we really pride ourselves on a low infant mortality rate, we have one of the highest COVID-related long term deaths rates, according to a recent study. And we're requesting an inquiry into the systematic failures that have resulted in this situation.

CO: An inquiry from the government itself?

ES: From the government, yes.

CO: So something independent, not within the home itself or the Salvation Army?

ES: No, I think it needs to be larger than that. I don't think this is a problem exclusive to the Salvation Army. Unfortunately, it's played out in the Meighen Manor. I have a lot of respect for the work that the Salvation Army does. I have some issues with the way that the leadership admin has failed to communicate with families. But these problems are bigger than me and Manor. These problems, you know, they exist because we turn a blind eye to the treatment of our elderly.

CO: Your grandmother is also grandmother to the mayor, is that right?

ES: Yes.

CO: Mayor Patrick Brown. Now, if I'm if someone who is a grandmother for the mayor and in a home and you're looking for the support and can't get answers, do you wonder what it's like for people who don't have any connections, who have no voice? Do you wonder what’s going on with them?

ES: Absolutely. And that's why we're taking to the press. That's why we're going public. Because if my grandmother can't get this level of care, and we've cultivated relationships with the staff for years, then what happens to somebody who doesn't have family to advocate for them? What happens to patients with dementia or Parkinson's, who don't have the ability to speak for themselves in the same way that my grandmother has been able to, and we've been able to, you know, as her voice has faltered?

CO: Your grandma is turning 106 this month or later this month, is that right?

ES: Yes, on May 12th.

CO: Are you worried that she may not see that birthday? That's if this COVID-19 is in the ward where she is actually now living?

ES: Yes, we're planning both a birthday and the funeral, and we have to exist in both worlds. We plan to have a piper come. We plan to play “Danny Boy”, which is her favourite song, at Meighen Manor. And we really hope that she'll be able to enjoy that. But we have to be realistic as well. And appreciate that, you know, on the days when she's running a bit of a fever, or the days where she has a bit of a cough, that could be a sign of something to come.

CO: Ella, I appreciate speaking with you. We're going to be speaking with the Salvation Army, and put these questions to them as well. And I'll just say that I hope your grandmother gets to hear “Danny Boy”.

ES: Thank you. I do, too. I really appreciate your time.

CO: Bye, Ella.

ES: Take care.

CH: Ella Soper's grandmother, Teresa Brown, is a resident of the Arthur Meighen Manor care home in Toronto, Ontario. We reached Ms. Soper in Toronto.

Salvation Army

Guest: John Murray

CH: Lt-Col John Murray is a spokesperson for the Salvation Army, which runs the home. We reached him in Toronto.

CO: Lt-Col Murray, what is going on inside Meighen Manor?

JOHN MURRAY: Well, the Salvation Army Meighen health centre, of course, is a 168-bed facility located in midtown Toronto. And like many long term care facilities in Ontario right now, we've experienced challenges relative to the COVID-19 outbreak. But what I can tell you, Carol, is that the health, the safety, security of our patients, staff and their families is number one priority for us in these days.

CO: You have 37 deaths in your facility, is that right?

JM: Well, I can confirm for you, we've had 42 COVID-related deaths. We currently have 46 staff who have tested COVID-positive. And currently, we have 62 residents who are also COVID-19 positive as well. What that says to us is were no different in terms of facilities. And many of the 218 long term care homes across the province of Ontario, who right now are experiencing the results of this pandemic, which are unprecedented. And you'll appreciate also this has put an extraordinary strain on not only health care staff, but resources right across the health care system.

CO: We've just spoken with a woman whose grandmother is in Meighen Manor. And she would dispute that. She said that her sense is that, yes, long term care homes appear to be the hotspots for COVID-19 in Ontario, but not all of them. And that some were better prepared than others. And that yours was not prepared, that you were short-staffed and short-sighted about what was required as we headed into this pandemic. What do you say to Ella Soper?

JM: Well, I would say to you that there are 218 outbreaks in long term care facilities across the province. And sadly, more than a thousand people in long term care facilities have passed away. What I would say to you is the Salvation Army was prepared, worked hard and continues to work hard, not only with the Ministry of Health, the Ministry of Long Term Care, Toronto Public Health. It's an extraordinary response to an unprecedented situation. And it has been tremendous stress on those of our staff who have been required to do extraordinarily more in difficult situations. But the Salvation Army, as an example, brought in 27 Salvation Army officers, redeployed them from right across Ontario. We've worked with Sunnybrook Hospital. We've worked with the Toronto Central LHIN to recruit additional staff. So certainly we've worked very, very hard. We continue to do that. And we believe that we were prepared. And we continue to make adjustments day by day in response to the situation.

CO: Ella Soper, who we've just interviewed, her family is one of three. Who have written a letter to the Salvation Army to talk about things that they have observed. They report that one of their loved ones was in a bed all day in a diaper that hadn't been changed since the night before. That another man stayed in a darkened room with the curtains closed, calling out for water and food for hours, while his food actually sat close by in a Styrofoam container he couldn't open. Another woman reports her mother died. And that she stayed alone with her mother's body for about eight hours before anyone would come and assist her. And the woman we spoke with, her grandmother, lay exposed in only a diaper and a sheet to cover her, calling out for water for hours. When she finally lost hope, she says, she called out to God for help and begged him not to abandon her. What do you say to those families?

JM: Well, we say that our hearts certainly go out to all the families who have been affected by these situations, Carol. And not only are residents who are in the Meighen Manor now, but also those who have lost loved ones. [sigh] You know, the health and the safety of every one of our residents is of utmost importance to us. And certainly, we are responding to the questions raised. I can't get into the details, of course, because of privacy policy. But what I can tell you is that our staff are working, you know, virtually around the clock in support of our patients, providing extraordinary care, not only socialization, pastoral support, but literally feeding breakfast, lunch and dinner to our residents.

CO: In their letter, they also note that they have wonderful, caring people who are there, but they say that the numbers of people are inadequate, and the PPE that they have appears to be inadequate since they seem to be going from room to room wearing the same gloves in some cases. What do you say to that?

JM: Well certainly, we do have not only infection control policies in place, and that has been right from the outset in terms of PPE equipment. Our staff do have the required PPE in terms of what is required from place to place. I do know that gloves are disposed after visits in rooms, so we limit cross-contamination or anything like that. And we're doing our very best to respond to the situation at hand.

CO: Just one other system is the case of Sybil Dinsdale, who died, and whose daughter was with her for hours trying to get a staff person to help. When someone actually did come, they offered her a body bag and asked if she wanted to put her mother into it. How does something like that happen?

JM: Well, certainly, the Salvation Army is first, you know, is all about care and compassion. And that certainly is a situation that we would want to look into. That's not how we, as an organization, work or respond. And we will look into that as we are to the other questions raised, and we will be responding to the family members. But certainly, this is a heartbreaking time for many people, Carol.

CO: Just finally, if this case of someone who dies and is asked if she wants to put her mother in a body bag, someone who has seen their mother stay in a diaper for a day and a night, someone else who sees her mother calling out for water for hours, and begging God for help. If this was your mother or father, how would you feel?

JM: Well, what I can tell you, Carol, is that my mother did pass away from COVID-19, and she has passed away in recent days. And I can tell you that from personal experience that the care and compassion that was provided to my mother in those last moments of life was extraordinary. And we would expect nothing less as an organization when a loved one dies, that we would work with a family in a caring and compassionate way, and treat those remains with deep, deep respect. And that's certainly been my experience, our experience in the family. And that would be my expectation that we would treat everyone with dignity.

CO: I'm sorry to hear about your mother.

JM: Thank you.

CO: And was she in a home?

JM: Yes, she was. She was in a Salvation Army residence, yes.

CO: Lt-Col Murray, again, my condolences for your mother.

JM: Thank you.

CO: I appreciate you speaking with us. Thank you.

JM: Thank you for your time, Carol.

CH: Lt-Col John Murray is a spokesperson for the Salvation Army, which runs the Arthur Meighen Manor. He was in Toronto.

[Music: Ambient]

Philippines TV Shutdown

Guest: Ces Oreña-Drilon

CH: During the pandemic, residents in the Philippines have relied on ABS-CBN for news updates. But if you flip to that channel today, it's a black, empty screen. The country's telecommunications agency just revoked the channel's license. It was the largest news outlet in the Philippines — and has often been critical of President Rodrigo Duterte. Critics of President Duterte say it's the latest in a string of crackdowns on the media. And Ces Oreña-Drilon says she's tired of staying quiet. She's an executive editor at ABS-CBN. We reached her in Manila.

CO: Ces, on Twitter today, you wrote, “You can take us off the air, but you can't silence us.” What message do you want to send to the government in the Philippines today?

CES ORENA-DRILON: Well, this is definitely an assault on press freedom. It's a political reprisal for perceived wrongdoing by the president and his allies in the House of Congress. The House of Congress has sapped on the renewal of our franchise. It never held a hearing, and so it lapsed. But before that, there was a resolution given to the NTC for them to issue us a provisional permit to operate. But then on the eve of the lapse of the franchise, they issued a cease and desist order.

CO: And, Ces, does it seem as it came out of nowhere? Was there any warning, any sense, because the licence you thought was gonna be renewed, at least temporarily. Did anyone know before you had to shut down last night that this was going to happen?

COD: Well, the threat of closure has been hanging over our heads for three years now. But there were all these assurances that in time they would hear our franchise, our renewal of our franchise. And if Congress won't have time to do it, then the NTC, which is the regulatory body, could very well issue a provisional permit. So there were conflicting signals from political leaders, but it still came as a shock to us. We didn't think this would happen in a democracy.

CO: I know you're working from home these days, as so many people are during COVID-19, but your colleagues were in the newsroom last night for the last newscast before they had to shut down. What are the feelings? What are people saying about this shutting down your entire network right now?

COD: My colleagues were so shocked. There were tears shed in the newsroom. We're operating in the middle of a pandemic. We're covering the news at great risks to our health. We're performing a public service. And we didn't think that the government would do this to us. We're performing a public service. It comes at a time when people need information, they need verified information. They need reports from journalists, not from, you know, people who just give their opinions on social media. We're performing this important service at the time of a pandemic.

CO: And yet, the response from the government, they say that this is a bureaucratic decision on the part of the Telecommunications Commission. It's about licence renewal. Why are you convinced that President Duterte is behind the shutting down of your news network?

COD: He has time and time again said that he is not in favour of the renewal of our franchise. He controls Congress. The leader of the House of Representatives, the Speaker, is his ally. And he has not allowed the proper committee to help make us present our side. Our leaders, our CEO, was never able to testify before Congress. We were never called.

CO: What is it about, what kinds of news coverage has your network put on that President Duterte has disliked?

COD: In the beginning of his term, there was the drug war, where many judicial killings occurred in the country. You know, as a broadcasting network, you really have to hold these people in power accountable. It's not against the president. There's nothing personal. It's what we do in every administration. It's no different with President Duterte. But there was two occasions when he had just assumed power that he held against us. One was the airing of a political ad by the opposition. And one where his ad failed to air. And our failure to return some money that they had used to buy political ads. We acknowledge that there was an accounting delay. But then he held that against us. In many speeches that he made in the last three years, he had always attacked us and say that he didn't want our franchise renewed.

CO: You’re not the only agency, news agency, that has been affected by these kinds of decisions. We spoke with Maria Ressa, editor of Rappler in the Philippines, who had been arrested. She faces jail time. Repeatedly, she has been charged. What effect has all this had on journalism in the Philippines?

COD: What they did to Maria, and what they're doing to us, and what the threat of the non-renewal of our franchise, has you know, had a chilling effect on many journalists. You can just imagine how difficult it was to report if you work for ABS-CBN, for our network, when various a threat of closure hanging over your head. So without throwing people in jail the way Marcos did, or with the threat of jail time for Maria, he has succeeded in sowing fear among journalists, you know?

CO: I know that your network, ABS-CBN, is the largest in the Philippines. It's also the only one that goes into the regions, goes into smaller communities. What does it mean for people in the Philippines to lose your network at this time?

COD: When there is a threat of a pandemic, people would need information to guide them on how to conduct their lives. It will be difficult for them to make decisions without the right information. When to go out of your house, where to go to buy medicine, where to get government aid? So this type of public service that we perform will be gone.

CO: Ces, we have to leave it there. We will continue to follow the story of your network and also journalism in the Philippines. Thank you for speaking with us tonight.

COD: Thank you so much. I'd just like to say that it's so ironic that it comes just a few days after we celebrate World Press Freedom Day. This is the gift that the government is giving the Filipino people.

CO: All right. We hear you. Thank you.

COD: Thank you.

CO: Bye.

CH: Ces Oreña-Drilon is an executive editor at ABS-CBN in the Philippines. We reached her in Manila. And you can find more on that story on our webpage, at: www.cbc.ca/aih.

Syrup robot

BL: Well, there's two ways to look at it. Those plants, what they've done to basically eliminate the spread of a virus inside a plant is phenomenal. They’ve refitted the plants so people aren't standing next to each other. There's dividers between each worker on the line. They have their PPEs, the face masks and gloves and all that sort of stuff. And they've done this in the interest of their employees’ safety. And they've slowed down the lines so that people can stand a little bit further apart in those areas of the plants where they can't be divided. People's safety has to come first. But those plants have got to be about a safe a place as there is. Now, that doesn't say that the virus can't be spread outside the plant. But it would be really, really tough to spread that virus inside that plant. And we've got Alberta Health Services has approved the opening. Occupational Health and Safety has approved the opening. And there's another thing that needs to be considered here. When you're deemed an essential service, there is a certain responsibility that goes with that designation. If food wants to get to the table, you have to go through a processing plant.

CO: Okay. And if that's the case, there's another stage of that, isn't there? To rebuild confidence for people to go back to work. So it still looks as though those plants may be operating at reduced capacity for some time. So what happens to cattle producers like yourself if it does continue for months, either as a slowdown or more shutdowns?

BL: [dry chuckle] We need a lot more money. If it stays the way it is now, what happens is we have a feed yard operation as part of our operation. So the cattle in there are fed a high energy diet. When they get to a certain weight and certain finish, they go to the plant and turn into steaks and hamburgers. Back from that is the backgrounders, who on their farms and ranches all across Canada, take calves off their mother and just kind of bring them along at a lower energy diet. To such time as they can get into a feed yard. So if the feed yard can't get rid of the fat cattle, we call them, then they can't replace them with younger, smaller cattle. So those people aren't getting their paycheque because they can't sell their collars, there’s no place to put them. So in lots of cases, those paycheques go to plant the spring crop to do whatever needs to be done. You know, now's the time that seedings going, calving’s going, and people are making their plans for the year. So those cattle, something has to happen with that.

CO: Like what? What has to happen?

BL: They'll be fed longer. They're just kept. The point is, is they can't get sold because there's no buyers. So the people that have them, don't have the money they need to put in their grain crops or to do whatever they do.

CO: Okay, so you said that the only way to get through this is a lot more money. And Mr. Trudeau said the $125 million he announced today is a first step. So if he called you today and said, what would you like to see as a follow-up, what would you say to Mr. Trudeau?

BL: As all of agriculture, we asked for $2.6 billion. snd we got whatever is the announcement, $125 million just for cattle and hogs.

CO: That’s Agri recovery?

BL: Right.

CO: RIght.

BL: Right. Our ask, and I know our ask in the cattle industry, was about $350 million. And I believe the hogs were somewhere around $500 million. So basically, we got $125 million, as opposed to $800 million was the ask.

CO: Okay, so we'll get Mr. Trudeau to give you a call.

BL: [deeply laughing] Well, if you've got that kind of push, I'll certainly talk to him [chuckling].

CO: Otherwise, if this continues into the fall, will you be looking at some kind of a cull?

BL: in the chocolate industry, no. Cattle have a pretty long life span. Some industries, you know, chickens and hogs, they're forced to do that because of the short lifespan of those particular species. But in Cattle, I mean, we have never faced that. And I can't imagine a situation when we would.

CO: All right. Well, it's all right now a wait and see, isn't it, to see if things can move along and also if this disease can get under control. And Bob, I appreciate speaking with you. Thank you.

BL: Okay. Thank you.

CO: Bye.

BL: Bye.

CH: Bob Lowe is a beef producer and the president of the Canadian Cattlemen's Association. We reached him in Nanton, Alberta.

[Music: Soft rock]

New Brunswick online council meetings

CH: Like most city councils across the country, councillors in New Brunswick are learning to hold meetings online during the pandemic. And like most councils, they haven't quite figured it out yet. Whether it's technical difficulties, miscommunication or a pet disrupting the call — the meetings are riddled with plenty of hiccups. But somehow, at a time like this, there's something poetic about those minor mishaps. Here's a blooper reel the CBC's Shane Magee put together of some of the best moments from online council meetings in Sackville, Moncton, and Saint John.

[sc]

MAN: We should find a way to maintain the spirit and intent of the local governance acts while recognizing the exceptional times that we’re in. [papers shuffling] We have some people moving papers around. It really comes through hard on this end. If you could just hold that for a sec.

MAN #2: Thank you.

[phone ringing]

WOMAN: Deputy Mayor Boudreau, did you wish to second?

MAN #3: I don’t know how to turn on my mic.

WOMAN: Yeah, you’re on. Okay, great! You will have to unmute. We can’t hear you. Oh, Councilor Edgit, we can’t hear you. So let’s just get your microphone working first here.

WOMAN #2: It should be working now.

WOMAN: Here you go. You’re good now.

WOMAN #2: Can you hear me now?

WOMAN: Councilor Tario, do you have a specific question for Superintendent Critchlow? Oh, your microphone is not on.

WOMAN #3: No, it isn’t. Oh, now it is. Now it isn’t! Oh! [chuckling]

WOMAN: It is. You’re good now.

WOMAN #3: Okay.

WOMAN: Okay, back to you, Councilor Turner. Your microphone is off. Councilor Turner, your microphone is not on. There we go.

MAN #3: Sorry.

WOMAN: [with feedback] Okay, thank you. So the first… Here we go again.

MAN #4: Hey, Arnold, I think your mic is off, sorry.

WOMAN: Concilor Legere. No, we can’t hear you yet. Your microphone is still off.

MAN #5: I have it now.

WOMAN: There you go, yes.

MAN #5: It took me a while.

MAN #6: You’re muted, Deputy.

WOMAN #4: [totally distorted by feedback] I have no idea what that was?

[/sc]

CH: [laughing] Who among us? That was a blooper reel of some of the finest moments from online council meetings in Sackville, Moncton, and Saint John, New Brunswick — put together by the CBC's Shane Magee.

[Music: Bright piano]

Dr. Richard Friedman Obit

Guest: Andrew Solomon

CH: At a time when gay marriage was taboo, Richard Friedman didn't just push for tolerance. He made a psychoanalytical argument in support of it. In this 1988 book, "Male Homosexuality", Dr. Friedman challenged Freud's view that homosexuality was pathological. Instead, he argued, sexual orientation was largely biological — and not something to be cured. And his work didn't just have an impact on psychiatry — it also helped break down stigma against gay communities. Dr. Friedman died recently. He was 79 years old. Andrew Solomon is the author of a number of books, including "The Noonday Demon: An Atlas of Depression". And every Thursday for 25 years, he was also a patient of Dr. Friedman. We reached Andrew Solomon in Rhinebeck, New York.

CO: Andrew, how did you first come to meet Richard Friedman?

ANDREW SOLOMON: My psychoanalyst, whom I had seen for a while, retired, which was a very traumatic event for me. And my closest friend, and my most stable friend, said that she loved her psychiatrist. And her psychiatrist recommended that I go and see Doctor Friedman. So I was shopping around for therapist, and he was the one who won.

CO: What was it that convinced you to choose him as your therapist?

AS: In the beginning, I thought that he seemed incredibly intelligent, but I didn't immediately sense as much warmth as I wanted. And then I was going back and forth, and I finally had a sort of short list of people I was considering. And I walked in one day and I said to him, you know, I'm torn between you and one other person. And he said, you know, I'm quite a big deal in my field. And I know I can help you. And it sounds hubristic, but it was actually just so confident. And I was so moved by that profound confidence. And I thought, okay, if he really thinks he can help me, I want to give it a shot.

CO: And that began 25 years, every Thursday, of seeing, Dr. Friedman?

AS: Every Thursday, I was in New York for 90 minutes.

CO: What did he mean to you? First of all, as a doctor. I know you became friends. But what, first of all, as a doctor, did he signify for you?

AS: He had an enormous belief in the capacity in general of gay people to form relationships and families. And I wanted to form a relationship and a family. And he was I felt a really very deeply kind man. He was tough, but he was kind. He was enormously witty, which meant that our sessions were fun. I didn't think I'd have made it for 25 years otherwise. And he had really from the beginning, but kind of gradually becoming stronger, a great confidence in my skills and abilities that I didn't have at the time. And that was unbelievably nourishing.

CO: You were fortunate enough to be able to have him as your doctor. But what he was able to do was to help many, many people with his groundbreaking book from 1988 entitled “Male Homosexuality: A Contemporary Psychoanalytic Perspective”. How did that book reshape views on our sexuality?

AS: Even though the American Psychiatric Association had dropped homosexuality from its list of diagnoses in 1973, prejudice with in the establishment of psychiatry, and particularly of psychoanalysis, remained very homophobic. And that was the book in which someone who was straight, who was not, therefore, trying to justify his own existence, came out and said this is a gross civil rights violation. These are people responding to a natural and apparently biological inclination. They do not represent a greater degree of neurosis. In fact, he said often that they’re people who, despite having been tortured in various ways as they were growing up for being gender atypical, have emerged as powerful and strong and self-confident personalities. And he said the profession that we're in has held these prejudices for too long. And I think his belief in the genuine equality of gay people had a great deal to do with the advancement, directly or indirectly, of the gay rights movement and the movement toward where we are now with marriage and gay families as commonplace.

CO: But there are many people in the 1980s and 70s as well who are making that case as a civil rights case. But they weren't able to do what he did, which is to indicate through a science and medical argument that this is not a pathology, this is biology. This is not something that can be cured as though it was an illness, as Freudian analysts were saying the time. How significant was it that he was able to make that claim in the realm of science and medicine?

AS: He was very much a doctor. There are some psychiatrists who practice therapy who essentially leave behind whatever they learned in medical school. And he was not one of them. He was interested in the biological underpinnings of human behaviour. And he was interested in a much broader sense in what parts of someone's character are mutable and subject to change through therapy or through other processes. And what are the parts that are immutable? And he made very strong arguments for the idea that gayness, male homosexuality, which was what he was focussed on, was not something that anyone was going to change. And then having said it wasn't going to be changed, he said that actually, it has valuable roles to play in our society. But it was primarily saying it doesn't need to be changed. People who were gay can have lives that are just as good as people who are straight. That was an argument that was not popular among straight people in general in that era and certainly not among people in the medical profession.

CO: Richard Friedman was also your friend, wasn't he? What was he like?

AS: Well, he was my therapist, but we had glimpses of friendship. I remember that he came to my wedding. My husband and I got married in England, and he flew over for our wedding. He met a lot of my friends on that occasion. All of whom had, of course, heard about him for some years. He came to a party at my house once because I wanted him to come and see my house. And I wanted him to meet a couple of other people. So we crossed over into that a bit. He told me from time to time about his life at home, and his wife and his son, and latterly his grandchildren. I mean, he knew me in many ways better than anyone else on the planet knew me. And I often felt that he held my sanity in his hands, that he was the one who when I was having a difficult time in my life, I could think to myself. Now, how will I describe this when I see him next Thursday? And the boundaries broke down. And he was very sick two years ago with shingles. And when he came back, he seemed very frail. And in the course of one of our sessions, I said to him, you know, people always say that the therapeutic relationship is transactional. I said, but I said, do you think of this relationship as transactional? And he said, Oh, Andrew, he said, of course not. We love each other. He said, it's therapy, but we love each other. I would say that was a great moment for me, and a great relief. And I'm very glad in this moment of having lost him to be able to remember it.

CO: Andrew, thank you very much for sharing your memories of Richard Friedman with us.

AS: It's been a pleasure. Bye.

CH: Andrew Solomon is an author. We reached him in Rhinebeck, New York. Mr. Solomon is a patient and friend of Dr. Richard Friedman, who has died at the age of 79.

[Music: Instrumental]

B.C. care home walker

CH: If you call one retirement home in Oak Bay, B.C. and ask for John Hillman, chances are you'll be told "he's out walking." The 101-year-old has set a challenge for himself: to walk 101 laps of the courtyard at his home, to raise money for COVID-19 relief. And, in keeping with the theme, he's hoping to raise 101 thousand dollars. Mr. Hillman was inspired by another walker in the U.K. who raised money by walking laps of his garden. Except, in that case, the man doing the walking, Tom Moore, is only a hundred years old. Here is John Hillman's grand-daughter Marney McDiarmid talking to the CBC about her grandfather's challenge.

[sc]

MARNEY MCDIARMID: My grandfather was inspired by Captain Tom Moore in England, who is a person who decided, he’s turning 100, and decided to walk in his garden and raise money for the NHS. And I think my grandfather saw him and thought, oh, wait a minute, I could do that. And my grandfather is someone who my dad calls him our ever-ready bunny. So he's somebody who's very dynamic and gregarious and very capable. And so I think he just saw this as an opportunity for him to make a contribution. I kind of imagine each step that he takes, like his wife, they have been married so far for 78 years. And she has dementia. So she's in a long term care facility. And so now, of course, because of COVID, they can't see each other. And so I actually imagine each step that he's taking is being a step that he's taking as if he was able to walk to see her.

KATHRYN MARLOWE: That's so lovely.

MM: Yeah. Yep.

KM: How long have they been living apart?

MM: My grandmother's dementia and her sort of physical well-being so deteriorated last March. So it's not actually... Like, not this past March, but a year ago. So it's not that long that they've been living apart. Yeah. And, of course, he was going over and taking the handy dart by himself sometimes and going over to see her four times a week. And then because she has dementia, now that's an additional challenge in terms of him being able to communicate with her. So just the other day, I got a Skype call from him, and it was because he was trying to test out his Skype to make sure that it was up to par because he'd been talking to them at the facility and trying to arrange a way for him to actually see her, because, of course, she's not able to organize that herself.

[/sc]

CH: That was Marney McDiarmid talking to Kathryn Marlowe of CBC British Columbia's All Points West. Her grandfather John Hillman is walking 101 laps of his retirement home courtyard to raise money for COVID-19 relief efforts.

[Music: Jazz]

Part three: Hurricane lizard study, Paul Cary obit, Texas hats/string

Hurricane lizard study

Guest: Colin Donihue

CH: Extreme weather events like hurricanes often wreak immediate havoc on communities and ecosystems where they take place. But according to some new research, they might also have longer-lasting effects on the way that species in those ecoystems evolve. A new study has found that lizards in countries that have been hit repeatedly by hurricanes tend to be different from others — specifically, their toe pads change — and that might just give them an advantage in these harsh weather events. Colin Donihue is a postdoctoral research fellow at Washington University in St. Louis, and he's the lead researcher on this study. We reached him in St. Louis.

[sc]

CO: Colin, when did you start to suspect that some lizards survive hurricanes better than others?

COLIN DONIHUE: This was a bit of a surprise for us. Our way back in 2017, when we revisited Turks and Caicos, to check in on the populations after hurricanes, Irma and Maria had gone through the region. So we started measuring lizards. And once we started crunching the numbers, we realized that the surviving populations had these larger toe pads on average than the populations that we had measured just a month and a half earlier before the storms.

CO: Wow! What do you mean toe pads? Can you describe what you were looking at?

CD: Yeah. So lizards all throughout the neotropics have these specialized toe pads with little ridges on them. These ridges give the lizards a really tight grip on especially smooth surfaces. So they will work a lot like gecko toe pads that are maybe a little bit better known. So what we think is that surviving a hurricane comes down to being able to hold on during these hurricane-force winds and ride out the storm.

CO: Yeah, I would think so [laughing].

CD: Yeah. So what we found was that lizard survivors tended to have larger toe pads. These large toe pads increase grip strength. And that grip strength seems like it would be advantageous for holding on during hurricane-force winds.

CO: Does that mean that the ones who don't have the good toe pads with the ridges, they were wiped out? Or does it suggest to you that the lizards are actually evolving?

CD: Well, both, actually. So we think that the lizards that have smaller toe pads or weren't able to hold on were wiped out, either blown out to sea or blown off their perches into trees and thus died. And so these surviving lizards were actually able to pass on this trait, these larger toe pads, to the next generation. So we would say that the hurricanes had an evolutionary impact on these populations.

CO: Now, we have seen and known that animals are adapting to climate change or evolving to deal with prolonged droughts and things of that nature. Have you seen examples of animals evolving to deal with extreme weather events like these?

CD: Yeah. So this is one of only a few examples of animals adapting and evolving in response to extreme climate events. But we know that hurricanes are going to be getting more severe in the future. And so it suggests that maybe they're having a larger impact on the evolution of these populations and species that they are affecting than we previously understood.

CO: You tried to conduct this experiment with the lizards in the lab. How did that go?

CD: That's right. So when we returned to Turks and Caicos back in 2017, just talked to the hurricanes, we had a fundamental question about the behaviour of lizards in these hurricane-force winds. Now, it's possible the lizards would scamper down into tree roots, in which case, survival would be kind of random with regard to their morphology, their physical appearance. But on the other hand, if the lizards for holding on tight, then maybe traits, adaptations that helped them increase their grip would give some lizards a survival advantage. So we tested this by [chuckling] getting the biggest leaf blower we could find, bringing it with us down to Turks and Caicos and actually the video recording the behaviour of the lizards in these hurricane-force winds.

CO: Oh dear!

CD: [chuckling] And what we discovered was that the lizards would over and over reposition themselves to be basically behind the branch to protect themselves from the wind. And they would just stay there and hold on tight as long as they could. Now, I should specify, none of the lizards were harmed as part of the experiment, and they were all returned back to their habitat immediately afterwards.

CO: Okay, so you've tested it. You know this is what's happening with these lizards. And you suspect that you're going to see this in other species. Is this where you’re going to go with your research? You’re going to try and see if others are surviving better in these hurricanes than others?

CD: Exactly. So this newest study was really an extension of that first indication that hurricanes are causing natural selection in these populations. And we had two big questions. One was, what does this mean for the next generation on Turks and Caicos? And so we returned a year later, measured the lizard offspring and found that they had traits identical to the survivors. And that large toe pad had been maintained in the population relative to the pre-hurricane populations. And then our second question was, well, is this just a one-off for these Turks and Caicos animals or is this a broader pattern across lots of different populations and species? So the next part of this recent study was measuring the toe pads of 188 different species that are stretched all the way from Florida down to Brazil. What we found was that the species that had been hit by hurricanes more often tended to have larger toe pads, just as we would have predicted. And so this suggests to us that we have this very local scale phenomenon that is scaling up to this broad pattern across the whole range of this genus as a whole. Now, the next step is actually to, well, to dig deeper and really try to understand some of the causality behind these patterns. And yeah, work is ongoing to uncover those questions as well.

CO: Are you going to be able to find out of those big mammals called humans are going to evolve in order to cope with all these changes?

CD: [sigh] One can hope. I think some behavioural evolution would be the most advantageous first and foremost.

CO: [laughing]I agree with you there. Colin, thanks so much.

CD: It’s a pleasure talking with you. Thanks for having me on.

CH: Colin Donihue is a postdoctoral research fellow at Washington University in St. Louis. That's where we reached him.

[Music: Industrial]

New South Wales cruise inquiry

CH: Health officials in New South Wales were questioned today at a special inquiry into the COVID-19 outbreak on the Ruby Princess cruise ship. The Australian Broadcasting Corporation is reporting that the Ruby Princess was the largest single source of cases in Australia — after it docked in Sydney, and some passengers were allowed to get off. That ship has since been linked to more than 660 cases and 21 deaths. New South Wales senior epidemiologist Kelly-Anne Ressler coordinates the department's cruise ship health program. Here's how she responded to a question from the inquiry's commissioner, Bret Walker.

KELLY-ANNE RESSLER: I'm very sorry it turned out the way it did. It was not our intention. Myself and my colleagues at the public health unit were working very hard on this [breaking down]. We did what we could. And if we could do it again, it would be very different.

[/sc]

CH: Ms. Ressler then explained that she had no jurisdiction over the ship while it was at sea.

[sc]

KAR: It's difficult for me in my role as an epidemiologist in a local public health unit to insist on the practices of massive cruise ship companies myself.

BW: What I'm trying to find out is what lies behind this image you have just given us of little old New South Wales and great big cruise companies, which, if I may say so, sounds both unrealistic and offensive.

KAR: I'm not characterizing little old New South Wales. I guess it's more me and my role, and whether or not I've personally had the backing to impress on cruise ships that they needed to put into isolation somebody with a mild cough and cold.

[/sc]

CH: New South Wales senior epidemiologist Kelly-Anne Ressler, speaking today at a special inquiry into the coronavirus outbreak on the Ruby Princess cruise ship. The inquiry has found that the ship was assessed as "low risk" for infections, based on an outdated log of the health of its passengers.

[Music: Bright acoustic guitar]

Paul Cary Obit

Guest: Royce Davis

[sc]

[Sound: The lovely sound of “Amazing Grace” as played on bagpipes]

[/sc]

CH: That's what it sounded like at Newark Airport in New Jersey over the weekend. As bagpipers played, first responders stood on the tarmac and saluted. They watched as a coffin draped with an American flag was taken out of an ambulance and loaded on to a plane headed for Denver. They were there to honour Paul Cary. He was a longtime Colorado firefighter and paramedic. In March, working with a company called Ambulnz, he volunteered to go to New York to help with the coronavirus outbreak. But he contracted COVID-19. And late last month, Paul Cary died. He was 66. Royce Davis is a Colorado paramedic who was volunteering with Mr. Cary in New York. We reached him in Queens.

CO: Royce, first of all, I'm sorry for the loss of your friend.

ROYCE DAVIS: Thank you very much. Appreciate it.

CO: We've just heard a bit of what it sounded like on that tarmac in Newark, New York, where you were a pallbearer. Can you tell us what you were thinking about at that time?

RD: I was thinking [chuckling] about how amazing tribute they were paying to Paul with the Port Authority and the people at the airport and all the fire departments that were lined up at the procession that day and his fellow co-workers.

CO: It was quite a scene. Can you describe what was around you?

RD: Of course, we're on the tarmac of the airport, so security was pretty tight. But there was colour guard there, there was on pallbearers, fellow employees, people looking outside the aeroplanes, the windows that were on the plane. It was surreal, just really beautiful.

CO: And that wasn't the end, was it? The ceremony in honour of your friend continued when he arrived in Colorado. Do you know what happened there?

RD: I don't know firsthand since I was not there. I just saw, you know, what I saw on TV and what I was told from our company that was gonna happen. Just his fire department that he retired from was there. And fellow co-workers from Ambulnz were there to take him to the funeral home.

CO: You know, there's so many people who have volunteered to go to New York when they when the call went out. We've spoken with a number of them. Lots of people were engaged in that. What is it about Paul Cary, do you think that affected so many people? Why did they want to celebrate his life and his contribution so much, do you think?

RD: Well, I really want to celebrate Paul Cary, because his whole service and his career is dedicated to helping people. He did it for a long time, 32 years in a fire service, and then continue on to an ambulance service. It's amazing, you know? Not too many people do that. And Paul was one that did it. And they want to honour him for doing that.

CO: I think it was his contribution in New York that really got the national attention, didn't it? So what were the kinds of things that you had to do in New York to help people with the COVID-19?

RD: Well, we came out and we just helped transfer patients around. We drove out from Colorado. And Paul, like I said before, is a very humble man. So he didn't do anything to stand out. He just came to work. And we just came in to help the hospital system transport sick patients to other hospitals with available beds.

CO: But it was quite a job, wasn't it? You were risking at all times getting the disease itself, were you not?

RD: Oh, yes, there's always that risk. But we all have our personal protective equipment that we wear 100 per cent of the time. The job that we do, there's a risk at it every day, you know? But we make sure we take care of each other and take care of ourselves.

CO: How did you come to know Paul Cary?

RD: I got to know Paul Cary more on this trip since we drove out together, spent some time together, had dinners after work and hung out and talked.

CO: And why do you think it was so important to him to go to New York?

RD: Because it's Paul's life. It's just his service. There was a need for people to come and help the people in New York. And he saw the need. And he's going to do it. That's embedded in him. That's how he is.

CO: And he's 66. He had retired from his first career, and he was working for this company, Ambulnz. Did he pause at all? Did he stop to think about the risk at all? Or did he just think that he had to be there?

RD: No, I don't think Paul paused at all. Paul saw the need, and he was one of the first people to volunteer to come and do this.

CO: You mentioned the dinners you had at the end, getting together. You were with the other volunteers from Colorado at the end of the day. What was the chatter about? How did you kind of come down from the day when you'd gone through what you had as paramedics there?

RD: The group of us from Colorado, we made sure we kept in touch with each other, saw each other, had meals together all just chatted about our day, talked about our day. We didn't go to specifics and details because we don't do that as paramedics in general. We just talked and see how each other are. And that's the way to just calm down, relax. And you just debrief from what we've seen and done for the day.

CO: So how are you going to remember your friend, Paul Cary?

RD: I’m going to remember how Paul was, and his dedication to service, and how humble he was. And I'm going to try to give the rest of my life in that same way.

CO: Royce, I appreciate speaking with you. Thank you.

RD: Thank you very much. I do appreciate you.

CH: Royce Davis is a paramedic from Colorado. We reached him in Queens, New York. And we’ve got more on the life of Mr. Davis’ colleague, Paul Cary, on our webpage, at: www.cbc.ca/aih.

[Music: Fiddle!]

Texas hats/string

CH: In Texas, they have a saying: "a worm is the only animal that can't fall down." Not sure why they say it, but they do. And the gentlemen in tonight's interviews from the archives would probably agree. Both are born-and-bred Texans. And both had dreams as big as the Lone Star State itself. One dreamed that citified hippie types would buy his customized cowboy hats. The second, that his ball of twine was the biggest in the world. And that competing twine balls would be scarce as grass around a hog's trough [chuckling]. As they say in Texas. To begin with: in 1976, Ace Reid was fed up with long-hairs cutting corners to make their new cowboy hats look authentically worn-in. So he set out to make money off their cheatin' ways. From our archives, here's Ace Reid speaking with Barbara Frum and Alan Maitland.

[sc]

BARBRA FRUM: Hi, Ace?

ACE REID: Yes.

BF: I'm Barbara.

AR: And I’m Ace, Barbara.

BF: Tell us about these hats you've got for sale?

AR: These are called the Ace Reid Cowpoke Hat.

BF: And what do you offer?

AR: The hat is, I dreamed it up coming from Austin, Texas, the other day. All the hippies up and down the road are wearing western hats. And that just makes me real mad because I'm a cowboy. And I was having a hat made in Austin, Texas. And the hippies were coming in, buying these hats. And they’d take them outside and rub them on the ground, slap them up the side of the building, just anything to make ‘em look old and beat up. Well, I was raised with sweat on my hat. And it dawned on me that the hippies are the one buying these Levi's faded, and their shirts and faded. I was raised during the depression days in North Texas, and we dreamed of having some fresh looking pants. They cost $3, and these hippies pay $40 for their faded looking pants. Some of ‘em got patches on ‘em

BF: Something screwy.

AR: So on the way home, I thought, well, I’ll just come out with a hat that will suit those kids. Because old cowboys, they sweat their hats out, but a hippie’s not gonna sweat.

BF: [laughing] Why not?

AR: [laughing]I happen to have a Hollywood director as my house guest, and we happen to be making a movie on my ranch right at this time called “Pony Express Rider”. So I talked to the director, Bob Totten. And I said, show me how you people in Hollywood make sweat? And he showed it to me. So we started us a little company. Now, we're selling our hat to all the hippies joints across the country, and they're selling like wildfire.

BF: What do you use? What do you make your imitation sweat out?

AR: Well, I can’t tell you because then all our competitors would know what to do.

BF: Is it chemical or natural?

AR: Well, it ain’t natural sweat, of course not! Because that takes ten years to get natural sweat. But this is an artificial sweat. And the hippies are thrilled to death. Now they're asking for T-shirts with sweat under their arms that’s artificial.

BF: You're not kidding us?!

AR: That’s the damnedest thing that you ever heard of Barbra. And we've got it, we've gots a winner.

BF: Everyone wants instant experience!

AR: [laughing deeply] Instant experience and instant success, instant sweat. We've seen it all here from an old cowboy way down in Texas.

BF: Where could you go from here, Ace?

AR: Where do we go from here?

BF: Pre-sweated boots?

AR: They are talking to us now about artificial cow manure to put on boots. And we are working on it.

BF Do your sweaty hat smell like sweaty hats?

AR: They damn sure do!

BF: Ew!!

AR: Yup. And the boots, I don't know if we're going to come up with a cow manure smell or not, but we're going to try.

BF: How much does a dirty, used-looking hat sell for compared to a new one?

AR: This hat costs $26 . And it's made from 100 per cent wool.

BF: What does a normal cowboy hat go for?

AR: $100.

BF: So you can get a sweaty looking one cheaper.

AR: You can get it fort $26 and wear it out, compared to the $100 hat, and then just wait it out and it’ll take you ten years.

BF: Are you going to wear one yourself?

AR: Oh, you better wear myself.

BF: Well, Ace, you’re terrific.

AR: Well, we're real proud of it.

BF: Thanks a lot.

AR: And Barbara, thank you so much. And I hope to get to meet you someday.

BF: [chuckling] Thanks.

AR: If you’re ever in Texas, please come by and see us.

BF: Bye-bye.

AR: All right. Bye.

[/sc]

CH: From our archives, Barbara Frum and Al Maitland speaking with humorist and inventor Ace Reid of Kerrville, Texas, on April 23, 1976. Now, J.C. Payne of Mountain Springs, Texas, was more highly strung than Mr. Reid. By which I mean, he'd accumulated enough string to set a Guinness World Record that stands to this day: "largest ball of string/yarn/thread." He talked to Michael Enright about it in October 1992.

Back To Top »

Provide Transcript Feedback

CBC would like to acknowledge the support of the Broadcasting Accessibility Fund.

May 05, 2020 Episode Trancript

More Stories Like This