Three albums in, will we ever learn anything about Dua Lipa?

On her third studio album Radical Optimism, British-Albanian pop star Dua Lipa has returned with 11 more big, made-for-the-club bangers — but is she giving us anything new?

Today on Commotion, host Elamin Abdelmahmoud sits down with culture writers Suzy Exposito, Kathleen Newman-Bremang and Jennifer Wilson to talk about how much Dua Lipa reveals about herself in her music, and whether it matters that she's managed to become so famous while remaining such a mystery.

We've included some highlights below, edited for length and clarity. For the full discussion, listen and follow the Commotion with Elamin Abdelmahmoud podcast, on your favourite podcast player.

Elamin: Kathleen, there is a mismatch between how famous Dua Lipa is and the kind of music that she makes. Dua Lipa's new album is an event, and I'm surprised by the way that it's an event because to me, it's a larger event than other people in the same class of fame, let's say…. She's sort of in the same conversation, to me, as Ariana Grande, for example — at least in the same kind of fame stratosphere. But I'm used to those stars revealing something about themselves.

I've listened to this album twice this morning. I don't think I learned anything new about Dua Lipa, and I think that's what's surprising to me. I'm someone who likes her music, but she's not someone who trades a lot on self-revelation. Does that surprise you at all, that she's as famous as she is, given that she doesn't tell us a lot about who Dua Lipa is?

Kathleen: I do think that surprises me. I don't completely disagree with you; I would disagree, maybe, that this is an event.

Elamin: I think it's an event.

Kathleen: I only listened to this album this morning because I was contractually obligated to by the CBC for this podcast. So I wouldn't say it's an event in the same way. But it is interesting when you talk about the current pop landscape.… It's interesting because she does feel like an outlier, but I don't know in a good way, you know? I know her music. I know she's a Grammy Award-winner. I know that she maybe dated Trevor Noah, that she's dating Callum Turner. I know her stance on some social and political issues. But again, that's not really coming through in the music — which, I guess you wouldn't expect from this kind of music.

I don't seek her out in my spare time, and the music is not bad; I had a nice time. But I don't think her success aligns with a cultural impact or a cultural moment, and a lot of the big figures in pop music right now elicit such strong reactions, like Drake, Taylor, Beyoncé. You either love them or you hate them. And I think because Dua Lipa's music isn't super personal in an obvious way like Taylor, which I think, unfairly actually, we've come to expect now from artists…. Also the album I don't think is conceptually that new from what we've heard from her. So unlike a Beyoncé, you're not getting something super conceptually new. Dua Lipa is just kind of there, and reliable, and I think that's okay.

Elamin: Reliable is a good word for this because Jen, when I think about Dua Lipa, I think very competent, very capable of delivering decent vocals on a song. But the difference between Dua and everyone else is that there is a meta narrative attached to other stars…. With Dua Lipa, to me the way that she got catapulted to stardom was Future Nostalgia dropped in March of 2020, a moment where we were like, "This is the lady that makes me want to go to the club in a moment when I can't go to the club," and that is an idea. But I'm not sure that idea is sustainable. Is it unfair to expect a metanarrative of a superstar, do you think, Jen?

Jennifer: I think, Kathleen, you just said you don't seek out Dua Lipa. It's funny you say that because I feel the same way: Dua Lipa is someone I hear in the Uber. Like, she comes to me.

Elamin: Okay.

Kathleen: Yes.

Jennifer: I'd been feeling like this is a lot of dance music. I'm not getting a lot of interiority. Maybe I don't need to? And I was sort of interrogating my own expectation of that, but I thought that this idea that she comes out of this Eastern Europe context where clubbing is really just part of daily life for people of all ages in a way that maybe it isn't here in the U.S.

I used to live in Russia for a time; it's the only time in my life where I regularly went to dance clubs, because it just was so much more humane. It was not too expensive. You didn't have to pay $500 to sit down. So it made me wonder if part of her love of dancing, of going out, of feeling like this kind of socializing should be for everyone — if that isn't her telling us something about her cultural background.

You can listen to the full discussion from today's show on CBC Listen or on our podcast, Commotion with Elamin Abdelmahmoud, available wherever you get your podcasts.

Panel produced by Jean Kim.